To Mr and Mrs Superior

[nath]

No, it would defeat my point to make a guess. The only way I could guess is using what I've seen in tabloids and news articles etc. That gives fuck all decent scale to judge it on.

And learn to read, I said I don't think they're all decent, but saying "most of them are just scrounging off the system" is bollocks.

 

[theriven]

surely you have some idea? i mean for someone with such a broad understanding of the plight of refugees, you must have some idea of the small scale of fraudulent cases?

or is it that ur just full of shit?

 

[nath]

You really are a fuckwit aren't you?

How in fucks name could I possibly know how many people are faking persecution? Think about it, HOW?

By reading the paper? Bullshit, they print the stuff that's interesting, i.e. the economic migrants. That gives a warped view of how bad the actual problem is. I have no idea how bad the problem is, my point is that everyone is saying "man they're all just scrounging" but how in fucks name do you know?

 

[theriven]

like i said
just guess

over 10%?
under?
make a fucking guess ffs
what is the acceptable amount?

you have the cheek to call me a fuckwit when u cant even think of a number between 0 and 100?

my god man .

 

[nath]

Do you not understand what I'm saying?

I could say a number, but it would be pointless as it wouldn't be an educated guess. Why do you want me to think of a number that's completely unrelated to anything whatsoever? I don't have an opinion on the % of asylum seekers who are here just to have things easier because I don't let the tabloids tar my opinion with their sensationalist bullshit.

 

[theriven]

Originally posted by nath
I have no idea

I think you summed it up a few posts back m8.
If you have no idea about the situation why the fuck are you posting that the problem isnt as bad as it is commonly held to be?

 

[nath]

I simply asked how the hell people knew how bad the problem was? On a grand scale, that is.

 

[theriven]

Personel experiance

As explained in some of the posts in this thread

 

[Nos-]

I find it hard to believe that your personal experience compounds the notion that most asylum are money scrounging wasters. So you've met a few, doesn't mean they're all the same!

 

[nath]

But how does personal experience give you an idea of the grand scheme of things?

I've run in to shit loads of immigrants, asylum seekers who are now in decent jobs, and seem like very decent people. Still, that's in north west london. I have no idea of the grand scale of the problem, and neither do you.

 

[Nos-]

By the way do you read the Daily Mail perchance?

 

[theriven]

Ok
So say ive met while living in west london 100 immagrants( and this is not the same as an asylum seeker), would you have the balls to say this figure is reasonable?
And now lets suggest that half that amount were refugess of one kind or another.

Thats 50 in total ( are you keeping up here?)

Now out of that 50 lets say that 4 out of that amount are faking it.

thats 4 in every 100

the total number being guessed by the goverment to be either legal or illigal immagrants in this country is at this time is 3 million.

How many freeloaders is that?
How many cunts sponging of the uk?

Now lets look take it one step further.

When is enough enough?

An adequate number or quantity: “The Gods above should give,/They have enough and we do poorly live” (Henry David Thoreau).

 

[theriven]

Originally posted by Nos-
By the way do you read the Daily Mail perchance?

cant say i do tbh
i just dont find that dog cartoon funny in the least

 

[theriven]

ohh and btw i grew up and lived all my life in shepherds bush, White city estate tbh.
finaly moved out of london when i got married and started a family.
i think im fairly qualifyed to say ive met a few refugees yes

 

[Mr Bungle]

Originally posted by Mellow-
You lot type so much, I don't want any immigrants in England, I want them out :|

I strongly suggest that you visit the SE of the USA for a reality check. I'm dead keen on Britain not repeating that exercise because, to put it bluntly, South Africa in 1990 was a nicer and more open minded place to be.

Cheers,
Bungle

 

[Tom]

Originally posted by theriven
Ok
So say ive met while living in west london 100 immagrants( and this is not the same as an asylum seeker),

snip

How many cunts sponging of the uk?

snip

Your entire argument is based on speculation. Speculation which is based on newspaper reports, newspapers which are there not to inform the public in an unbiased way, but to make money. You have to trust that the people who decide on asylum cases understand their jobs, and know a lot more about this problem than the general public.

From personal experience (I knew of the John Leslie stuff about a year before it was printed), I know that if the newspapers don't get the information they want, they make it up, and only retract when they're threatened by the courts. I seriously doubt that of those '3 million' people, such a large number are 'sponging'. I bet a large portion of those 3 million is comprised of:

• immigration from commonwealth states, and
• immigration from european countries

Without this descending into flame (which a certain person has tried to do), you're talking out of your arse m8. This country has seen immigration for the past 2000 years, from the Picts, the Romans, to the Angles, the Saxons, the Vikings, the Normans, etc etc. 10% of our population is ethnic minority.

One more thing - as far as the government is concerned, this 'problem' is fantastic PR - it enables them to get on with less palatable problems without the same fuss.

 

[Nos-]

Originally posted by theriven
Ok
So say ive met while living in west london 100 immagrants( and this is not the same as an asylum seeker), would you have the balls to say this figure is reasonable?

First question, why do balls come into it? Am I less of a man if I agree to a figure you've plucked out of the air?

Originally posted by theriven
And now lets suggest that half that amount were refugess of one kind or another.

Suggest? To be bluntly honest, how do you even know these people are immigrants in the first place? Are you guessing by the way they look or stopping them in the street and asking to see their papers? For gods sake man they're more liking my brethren!

 

[theriven]

I ask for there papers u stupid man

how the fuck do you think?

 

[Tom]

Originally posted by theriven
ohh and btw i grew up and lived all my life in shepherds bush, White city estate tbh.
finaly moved out of london when i got married and started a family.
i think im fairly qualifyed to say ive met a few refugees yes

Perhaps you should have lived in the 16th century. When King Henry VIII wanted some money for war, he confiscated the lands and properties of the Jews, and kicked them out. For no good reason. And the general public loved him, because they had been made scapegoats of for years.

 

[theriven]

WTF has that got to do with anything i have said?

 

[Scooba Da Bass]

Whee the idiots that Stu asked to keep out have invaded, bang goes another discussion!

 

[Tom]

Originally posted by theriven
WTF has that got to do with anything i have said?

Its an analogy, to expose your argument for what it is.

 

[theriven]

my argument was simply that there are false claiments and anyone who disagrees needs testing tbh

The amount of "real" claims cannot be judged even by the goverment correctly. hense the 175 million in legal aid being asked for by the goverment to cover the cost of going thrugh the courts to deside whether the aplication was judged fairly or not

also the fact that a lot of these people come thrugh other EU countrys before finaly settling in the UK sais a lot about why they are fleeing.

 

[stu]

Originally posted by Scooba Da Bass
Whee the idiots that Stu asked to keep out have invaded, bang goes another discussion!

:/

Ironically though, the very people the thread was targeted at haven't managed to contribute anything, yet are still wittering about how "this place has gone to shit". Ah well.

 

[Mellow-]

Originally posted by Mr Bungle
I strongly suggest that you visit the SE of the USA for a reality check. I'm dead keen on Britain not repeating that exercise because, to put it bluntly, South Africa in 1990 was a nicer and more open minded place to be.

Cheers,
Bungle

I don't know what the hell you're talking about.

 

[Durzel]

Saying that there is an "immigration problem" with regard to asylum seekers, etc is something that can be proven quite simply with statistics. That's not to say that any of us have access to such statistics, but they exist nonetheless.

Saying that asylum seekers are the root cause and largest contributor to benefit fraud etc. is an impossible argument to ... er... argue without empirical evidence. Simply saying "I've met 10 immigrants and they've all been on the take" doesn't really cut it to be honest. Besides which, as we all know, its the Pakistanis that are doing all the benefit fraud.

(The above is tongue-in-cheek, by the way)

But the point is, you cannot build a foundation for an argument over what is reported in the tabloids, or pretty much any mainstream media. This media, as has already been mentioned by others, are in the business of providing news. There's no story in saying "Abdar Rashid from Woking runs a highly successful corner shop which is of great benefit to the surrounding community". That's not to say that they all run corner shops of course, some of them run curry houses and sell knock-off replica sportswear on the side.*

* Tongue in cheek™

...There is however a story in reporting on how immigration policies are failing, how x immigrants are discovered on a lorry, how immigrant y cheated the Govt. out of millions in tax, etc.

If you base an opinion of a "breed" of people on reports here and there of transgressions by their "kind", then you are exactly the kind of audience that the likes of The Sun, The Mirror and The Daily Star love. Low IQ simpletons incapable of forming rational thought, who instead have to rely on the papers to tell them about how Liz Hurley kept 10 rugby men up all night with her rampant sexual demands.

At the end of the day, whilst an immigration problem obviously exists - without being in a direct position to avail oneself of immutable statistics, it is entirely pointless making sweeping generalisations about all immigrants. It's especially pointless since all crime is committed by scousers. And Asians. *

* Tongue in cheek™

 

[icemaiden]

This started off as a reasonably intelligent thread, and has progressed into a load of cobblers for the most part.

I moved to this country when i was 2 from Malta, but have British family etc so neither myself or my parents had to claim asylum or anything like that. However peoples attitudes are generally the same regardless of peoples situation. I spent many years at school being teased and abused because i hadn't been born here, a fact you wouldn't really know to look at me now. Peoples attitudes to skin colour and religion have more to do with the general attitude to asylum seekers than anything else.

I think that if people have a genuine problem living in their home country then they should be given a chance, regardless of what countries they passed through to get here, but i feel that they should be made to make a contribution and not left to collect handouts indefinately.

With such a discussion you will always get differing opinions, it would be better however if people worried more about their own lives instead of worrying about how much income support asylum seekers receive.

 

[GDW]

I can only pretend to understand why white anglo saxon protestant/catholic British people have been crying for the past 50 years for the influx of their imperial subjects into their country.

The English government was quite prepared to rape piliage and exploit every country they could get their hands on for hundreds of years at the expense of future generations. In hindsight it should have been all quite predictable to be honest.

What goes around comes around .

 

[Wij]

British Government.

And aristocracy.

As was most of Europe.

 

[Testin da Cable]

well it does show they're human. more or less.