Games Time to pop my cherry?

[ST^]

How do I get my pillows to stack 3ft high?

 

[old.user4556]

Who cares when you've got that to look at!

 

[Thadius]

360 cos you cant, nor will you probably be ever able to, chip a PS3.

And dont worry about getting banned from xbox live, its only the noobs who dont know how to hide the fact their console is chipped who get banned.

I refuse to chip a console/ buy/play copied games.

Would you walk into a shop, pick a game off the shelf, stick it up your tshirt and walk out the shop?

So why rob a gaming company?

 

[nath]

I refuse to chip a console/ buy/play copied games.

Would you walk into a shop, pick a game off the shelf, stick it up your tshirt and walk out the shop?

So why rob a gaming company?

Theft and copyright infringement are two different things, legally, morally, factually. This fact does not mean that copyright infringement is OK, but they're not the same thing.

 

[MYstIC G]

Would you walk into a shop, pick a game off the shelf, stick it up your tshirt and walk out the shop?

Oh for a youtube link to that IT Crowd video...

 

[ST^]

If you chip a console because you're too cheap to pay for games, there is no moral difference.

 

[Lethul]

Aada will soon switch to a sony fanboi as soon as there is a new PS3 exclusive that cost a whole lot more than any other game to develop.

 

[Aada]

Aada will soon switch to a sony fanboi as soon as there is a new PS3 exclusive that cost a whole lot more than any other game to develop.

I'll go where the games are i'm a gamer and always will be, i have a PS3 atm but no games for it.

 

[Marc]

I'll go where the games are i'm a gamer and always will be, i have a PS3 atm but no games for it.

So if you are a gamer, who goes where the games are, why do you have a PS3 with no games?

:S

 

[ST^]

360 has clearly had an abundance of exclusives this year and the PS3 didn't have a single one

 

[Sparx]

I refuse to chip a console/ buy/play copied games.

Would you walk into a shop, pick a game off the shelf, stick it up your tshirt and walk out the shop?

So why rob a gaming company?

 

[ST^]

I fucking would.

 

[Sparx]

too right i would too. To be fair if i could steal a car and get away with it as easy i would do that too

 

[nath]

If you chip a console because you're too cheap to pay for games, there is no moral difference.

Just to clarify, are you saying there's no moral difference between chipping a console to pirate games than *stealing* games from a retail store?

too right i would too. To be fair if i could steal a car and get away with it as easy i would do that too

So the only thing stopping you from being a car thief is that you'd worry about being caught?

 

[ST^]

Just to clarify, are you saying there's no moral difference between chipping a console to pirate games than *stealing* games from a retail store?

Yes.

 

[nath]

Yes.

So what would happen if everyone that pirated games stopped downloading them and actually went and stole the product from retail stores - there's no difference?

 

[ST^]

Do you think the cost of the box, disc and manual are significant compared to the cost of actually making the game? Because that's the only extra loss incurred if you decide to steal it the old fashioned way.

 

[Sparx]

So the only thing stopping you from being a car thief is that you'd worry about being caught?

depends, is it manual or automatic? i prefer manual

 

[nath]

Do you think the cost of the box, disc and manual are significant compared to the cost of actually making the game? Because that's the only extra loss incurred if you decide to steal it the old fashioned way.

The material cost isn't the issue, the issue is that if you steal a retail copy from a shop, they've already paid for it and therefore can no longer sell that copy. If I steal a dvd that you own, you can no longer watch it. Theft as an action deprives the owner of their property. If someone pirates a game they're not depriving anyone of anything. The games company has potentially lost a sale, though that's by no means guaranteed.

Think about it, imagine if all those people that pirated games were stealing actual products from HMV and HMV continue to restock them. They'd go bankrupt in a few days/hours, and the same could be said for any other retail store.

For this discussion to have any hope of continuing, you need to understand that I'm not condoning piracy, I'm not for a second saying that piracy has zero effect on the industry, that'd be madness. Despite that, calling it theft is incorrect and it really winds me up when people say it's the same thing.

 

[Marc]

No, you are arguing about who loses the money.

It is still theft which ever way you look at it.

 

[nath]

No, you are arguing about who loses the money.

It is still theft which ever way you look at it.

Not entirely, for one that makes the massive and totally bogus assumption that every pirated game is a lost sale. That's obviously not true, but to what degree that's untrue is something that's difficult to ascertain.

Beyond that, as you're not depriving the games developers of their property it's categorically *not* theft. If you pirate a game that you would have otherwise paid for then you're depriving them of a sale and it becomes quite similar to theft but still not the same thing. It's copyright infringement.

 

[Marc]

Not entirely, for one that makes the massive and totally bogus assumption that every pirated game is a lost sale. That's obviously not true, but to what degree that's untrue is something that's difficult to ascertain.

Beyond that, as you're not depriving the games developers of their property it's categorically *not* theft. If you pirate a game that you would have otherwise paid for then you're depriving them of a sale and it becomes quite similar to theft but still not the same thing. It's copyright infringement.

You are being a bit pedantic though mate. I think its better to just agree that its illegal

 

[nath]

I never suggested for a second that it's not illegal, and I'm absolutely being pedantic, but we've all gotta have a hobby. For some reason the implication that piracy is theft winds me up no end, just like the idea that every piracy download represents a lost sale when that's so clearly not true.

 

[ST^]

I never suggested for a second that it's not illegal, and I'm absolutely being pedantic, but we've all gotta have a hobby. For some reason the implication that piracy is theft winds me up no end, just like the idea that every piracy download represents a lost sale when that's so clearly not true.

Nobody cares if it is technically classed as theft or not. We all know that copyright law is a little more complicated.

About people losing money... with your example of the retailer losing money, you could also argue that the developer and publisher at least get paid their dues. So no, morally you're not better off downloading.

 

[Marc]

What about if your mate lends you the game after he has finished it with it. Is that as bad as downloading it from newsgroups. Its a moral hot potato, Nath, Catch....

 

[nath]

About people losing money... with your example of the retailer losing money, you could also argue that the developer and publisher at least get paid their dues. So no, morally you're not better off downloading.

Well if we assume that in this case the pirate would have otherwise purchased the game then they're similar. The key difference, when stolen from a retail outlet they can't sell that specific item to someone else. If you pirate the game, there's nothing stopping the developer from continuing to sell to others.

What about if your mate lends you the game after he has finished it with it. Is that as bad as downloading it from newsgroups. Its a moral hot potato, Nath, Catch....

I don't see much moral difference in downloading something from newsgroups and borrowing it from a mate, though (depending on the game) it may not be playable by the original mate while he's lent it. Of course if he lent the most recent Prince of Persia game he could quite happily continue playing it while his mate installed and played it on his. In that scenario it's no different to piracy.

 

[Marc]

Have you ever borrowed a game, film or music cd off a friend?

 

[ST^]

What if I steal something from someone that they forgot they had and will never miss it? Or lift 1 penny from 100 million different bank accounts? It isn't the effect, it's the act.

 

[nath]

Have you ever borrowed a game, film or music cd off a friend?

I must have done at some point, but its been a long while.

What if I steal something from someone that they forgot they had and will never miss it? Or lift 1 penny from 100 million different bank accounts? It isn't the effect, it's the act.

Both acts are theft, though morally speaking not on the same level as certain other thefts. I'd argue when it comes to morality, the effect is *all* that matters, though being aware of the far reaching effects ones actions has is not always as simple as you'd think.

 

[Marc]

Makes you wonder if Thadius has ever borrowed a game/cd/film from a top his high horse without actually owning it