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[Embattle]

I guess you could also state that you can't prove the online racists were Irish any way.

 

[DaGaffer]

I guess you could also state that you can't prove the online racists were Irish any way.

Well one of them definitely was. Look, I'm not saying Ireland doesn't have racists, of course it does, there are cunts in every country on Earth, but its definitely not as overt as in the UK where the press are more than happy to stir the pot.

 

[Embattle]

Survey on Minorities and Discrimination in EU (2016)

 

[Scouse]

Survey on Minorities and Discrimination in EU (2016)

Yep, we're leaders in that respect. Absolutely.

That's never been up for debate, right?

 

[DaGaffer]

Survey on Minorities and Discrimination in EU (2016)

Weird survey. Did you read the methodology? It was a series of ethnicity-specific group interviews that varied by country, so Ireland had one group (sub-Saharan Africans) whilst the UK had three groups and other countries also had different groupings. How you can use that methodology for direct country comparisons of overall discrimination escapes me. NB. The Sub-Sarahan African population in Ireland is about sixty thousand people; and yes, they probably are the most discriminated against, but using them to infer an overall discrimination "score" for ireland is pretty dubious.

 

[Ormorof]

Survey on Minorities and Discrimination in EU (2016)

Doesn't surprise me much, outside big cities (especially in Nordics) its a very monochrome world.

 

[Embattle]

Oh I agree about the lack of data, but surely your earlier statement is little more than a feeling when it comes to Ireland Vs UK racism levels. Although I could well accept that racism/intolerance has probably increased in the UK since 2016.

 

[Gwadien]

/@Wij ON

Buh????

My issue with banks are wide ranging, but I fail to see the relevance here.

Having said that, it's topical - considering this is how they (my one) reacts to an 18.6% increase in pre-tax profits.

(I think it's shareholders (the rich) driving it)

I was talking about how if a bloke gets attacked for being in a photo campaign for aldi and you blame them for destroying the high street, yet you support an industry which is far more damaging.

 

[DaGaffer]

Oh I agree about the lack of data, but surely your earlier statement is little more than a feeling when it comes to Ireland Vs UK racism levels. Although I could well accept that racism/intolerance has probably increased in the UK since 2016.

That’s why I used far right parties as a comparison barometer; there’s not really an EDL equivalent over here beyond a couple of nutters. I’d say the press is another bellweather; while there are Irish editions of the Sun and Daily Mail they’re nothing like as bigoted in content as their UK equivalents and the local press are more on the Guardian end than the Telegraph.

 

[Scouse]

I was talking about how if a bloke gets attacked for being in a photo campaign for aldi and you blame them for destroying the high street, yet you support an industry which is far more damaging.

I guess you mean by being financial enablers?

Banks are just a symptom of our financial system tbh. They live under the rules set by the central banks - which allegedly are free from political interference. Though why we've allowed that to be the case (because it makes us all subject to an economic system we've no control over, rather than having an economic system work for us... yadda yadda)

But meh. Live in a capitalist society, gotta earn a wage. I would like to formally submit my objection to your assertion that I 'support' the industry - especially when it's quite clear I don't.

 

[Scouse]

Ah, now I see what you were getting at @Embattle

I wasn't particularly convinced by @DaGaffer's argument but I agree with the statements on methodology. However some data is better than no data.

 

[Gwadien]

I guess you mean by being financial enablers?

Banks are just a symptom of our financial system tbh. They live under the rules set by the central banks - which allegedly are free from political interference. Though why we've allowed that to be the case (because it makes us all subject to an economic system we've no control over, rather than having an economic system work for us... yadda yadda)

But meh. Live in a capitalist society, gotta earn a wage. I would like to formally submit my objection to your assertion that I 'support' the industry - especially when it's quite clear I don't.

You sell your labour to them, typically at a price which is lots less than its actually worth.

Therefore you're supporting it.

 

[Scouse]

You sell your labour to them, typically at a price which is lots less than its actually worth.

Therefore you're supporting it.

Are you bodhi in disguise?

Tell me about choice about selling labour in a capitalist society. What other rules can I "opt in" to work under? Do I have a choice in opting-out of the current ruleset?

Importantly: If I cut my nose off to spite my face, and end up out of work and significantly poorer for no reason (as the bank would replace me) - would that be a piece of advice you'd sell your kids as a sensible thing to do?

Or are you just being a cunt?

 

[Gwadien]

Are you bodhi in disguise?

Tell me about choice about selling labour in a capitalist society. What other rules can I "opt in" to work under? Do I have a choice in opting-out of the current ruleset?

Importantly: If I cut my nose off to spite my face, and end up out of work and significantly poorer for no reason (as the bank would replace me) - would that be a piece of advice you'd sell your kids as a sensible thing to do?

Or are you just being a cunt?

No, you said that family deserves the shit they get because they did work for a company that shuts down local businesses, but you don't deserve shit for working for an even more sinister industry?

Again, you're blindly defending Freedom of Expression.

 

[Scouse]

No, you said that family deserves the shit they get because they did work for a company that shuts down local businesses, but you don't deserve shit for working for an even more sinister industry?

Again, you're blindly defending Freedom of Expression.

Go back and read all my sentences @Gwadien.

All of them. Not just the ones you are picking to make yourself feel outraged.

 

[Gwadien]

What did you expect when you put your family front and centre of an advert for a supermarket that's putting local shops out of business?

?

 

[Scouse]

?

All of the sentences.

 

[Gwadien]

Whilst it's not nice (at all) or in any way to be condoned:

I'm not racist but..

 

[Scouse]

Whilst it's not nice (at all) or in any way to be condoned

It ISN'T nice. I don't in any way condone racial abuse of any kind. Ever.

What did you expect when you put your family front and centre of an advert for a supermarket that's putting local shops out of business?

This is a comment about how I'm surprised that she was dumb enough to not think that abuse was going to happen when she put herself in the public eye. Nothing else. Which is why I fucking pre-empted it with a post saying I don't condone it - in case some massively whiny little bitch decided to take it the wrong way.

Seems I might as well have typed: "Fuck that bitch nigger" for all the comprehension you're currently showing.

 

[Gwadien]

It ISN'T nice. I don't in any way condone racial abuse of any kind. Ever.


This is a comment about how I'm surprised that she was dumb enough to not think that abuse was going to happen when she put herself in the public eye. Nothing else. Which is why I fucking pre-empted it with a post saying I don't condone it - in case some massively whiny little bitch decided to take it the wrong way.

Seems I might as well have typed: "Fuck that bitch nigger" for all the comprehension you're currently showing.

I just find it pretty impressive that you stand by your die hard belief in not reforming 18th century values in order to make it suitable in a changing world.

Maybe if we did reform the 'Freedoms' then maybe they wouldn't already be so trampled on already, simply because they're not possible in a modern world so they're largely ignored.

I mean in your ideal world, Policing would be a thing of the past, in terms of murder rates and such, because they'd be very difficult to prevent.

School kids would be committing suicide en mass due to cyber bullying because in your world kids would be able to say anything they wanted to each other and the police/schools would respond with 'lol, unlucky'.

I know you'll respond with something like 'Grandad Scouse thinks kids shouldn't be using phones and stuff!!!!!!!!!!!!' then you'll call me a retard or something.

 

[Scouse]

No. I just think that since you've left university you've stopped critically assessing things and have lost all sense of nuance.

You've just turned into "OMG! think of the kidzzzzzz!!!11!"

 

[Gwadien]

No. I just think that since you've left university you've stopped critically assessing things and have lost all sense of nuance.

You've just turned into "OMG! think of the kidzzzzzz!!!11!"

I am critically assessing things, and I have come to the conclusion that stick and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me is absolute horse shit, I've seen the damage words can do, and when people are in 24/7 communication with potentially millions of people constantly, it's amplified.

 

[Scouse]

stick and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me

Is what you tell children when you're trying to equip them with the emotional armour necessary to get them through a potentially savage childhood and on into adulthood - in a world where people cannot be policed 24/7.

It's not a basis for navigating the complex interrelations between adult speech, law, crime, punishment, human interaction, the corrosive effect on society when you force speech you don't like the sound of underground and the dangerous effect on minority viewpoints when you legislate based on what government thinks the majority of society might take offence from (or what government deems inconvenient).

Nobody is saying speech without consequences. But speech without criminal consequence for those who hold minority or unpopular views (why not be gay?) is supremely important. Which is why I continue to admire the american constitution and despair whilst watching the unfolding idiocy that's happening in the UK as our rights and freedoms are slowly eroded and progress seems stilted and slowed as 'offence' (that can't, by definition, be given (though it can easily be similarly experienced by a majority)) has become the prime driver of prohibition of social discourse, with all the concomitant knock-on.



The problem discussing it with you is you like to point at a thing and go "THIS! THIS SHOULD BE CRIMINALISED11!!1!" without thinking along the lines of principle, taking into account what it means for people who can no longer be challenged for holding these unpopular ideas in a public setting.

But more than that: I can't even make a fucking point on Freddyshouse - even when I caveat it heavily in the very sentence beforehand - without you getting your knickers in a twist and (it seems wilfully) misconstruing what is clearly being said. And I put that down to you growing up in a world where you've been so little exposed to "offensive ideas" - or actual racism - that you can't keep an emotional lid on it when people are talking about it.

But racism's not going away is it? It's right there. Bubbling away underlying the biggest political issue of our time. And nobody can discuss their feelings (and have them challenged) openly because to do so may land them in jail.

Fucking bravo, the left. Bravo. :slow clap:

 

[Scouse]

Personally, I'd kill them to ensure they can never enter the food chain.

This is the scariest thing about brexit. Deregulation and the abandonment of the precautionary principle.

 

[Wij]

Personally, I'd kill them to ensure they can never enter the food chain.

This is the scariest thing about brexit. Deregulation and the abandonment of the precautionary principle.

Personally I think the EU's rules on GMO are totally unscientific but I'd still rather keep them than leave.

 

[Lamp]

Obviously, the Weinberg-Salam lagrangian reorganises itself as the Higgs boson acquires a non vanishing vacuum expectation value dictated by the potential of the Yakuwa Interaction, the kinetic guage covariance derivative symmetry, and the field strength tensors for the weak isospin and weak hypercharge guage fields.

 

[Job]

Nice..does it come with chips?

 

[Job]

Is what you tell children when you're trying to equip them with the emotional armour necessary to get them through a potentially savage childhood and on into adulthood - in a world where people cannot be policed 24/7.

It's not a basis for navigating the complex interrelations between adult speech, law, crime, punishment, human interaction, the corrosive effect on society when you force speech you don't like the sound of underground and the dangerous effect on minority viewpoints when you legislate based on what government thinks the majority of society might take offence from (or what government deems inconvenient).

Nobody is saying speech without consequences. But speech without criminal consequence for those who hold minority or unpopular views (why not be gay?) is supremely important. Which is why I continue to admire the american constitution and despair whilst watching the unfolding idiocy that's happening in the UK as our rights and freedoms are slowly eroded and progress seems stilted and slowed as 'offence' (that can't, by definition, be given (though it can easily be similarly experienced by a majority)) has become the prime driver of prohibition of social discourse, with all the concomitant knock-on.



The problem discussing it with you is you like to point at a thing and go "THIS! THIS SHOULD BE CRIMINALISED11!!1!" without thinking along the lines of principle, taking into account what it means for people who can no longer be challenged for holding these unpopular ideas in a public setting.

But more than that: I can't even make a fucking point on Freddyshouse - even when I caveat it heavily in the very sentence beforehand - without you getting your knickers in a twist and (it seems wilfully) misconstruing what is clearly being said. And I put that down to you growing up in a world where you've been so little exposed to "offensive ideas" - or actual racism - that you can't keep an emotional lid on it when people are talking about it.

But racism's not going away is it? It's right there. Bubbling away underlying the biggest political issue of our time. And nobody can discuss their feelings (and have them challenged) openly because to do so may land them in jail.

Fucking bravo, the left. Bravo. :slow clap:

Listening to the liberal academic who has his book cancelled because he qouted far right commentators.

You can win an argument with facts or might.

These days they are all won by might.

 

[Scouse]

Personally I think the EU's rules on GMO are totally unscientific but I'd still rather keep them than leave.

Given the fact that the rest of the world is proceeding full steam ahead with GM, having one part of the world with a bias towards not GMing the shit out of everything in case we fuck things hard is probably wise.

 

[Wij]

Given the fact that the rest of the world is proceeding full steam ahead with GM, having one part of the world with a bias towards not GMing the shit out of everything in case we fuck things hard is probably wise.

I’m not worried. People have been eating GM for decades now. There’s no scientific reason to think it should be any different.