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[Scouse]

if every soldier turned around tomorrow and quit ... you'd get a little letter through the door saying you've been conscripted

And you could refuse to fight, like many conscientious objectors have succesfully done in the past.

It's called having a spine and refusing to murder other people.

 

[BloodOmen]

And you could refuse to fight, like many conscientious objectors have succesfully done in the past.

It's called having a spine and refusing to murder other people.

Yes, you could and as a result you'd either end up in jail or dead. It all depends what sort of rules they introduced for conscription, depends how desperate they are. There will always be someone to take your place and as such the wheels just keep turning with or without you, so while you sit in your prison cell weeping to be let out some 17+ year old will likely be killing or dying in your place.... but you have the spine because you refused

 

[Scouse]

Yes, you could and as a result you'd either end up in jail or dead.

Or a murderous coward.

Either way - it doesn't absolve the idiots who volunteer for murder. If they were forced into it I'd have the slightest smidgen of respect - but they aren't. They're volunteers. And cunts.

 

[BloodOmen]

Or a murderous coward.

Oh, so all those people who died during WWII were murderous cowards were they? since you're clearly generalizing every soldier under the sky I'll assume you mean everyone without exception.

 

[Olgaline]

I though that had to be bullshit and while failing to prove you wrong I found this.



They hate animals.

Only when they brake up with them

 

[Raven]

They do.



Yes. Yes I do - and because we lack conscription in this country THEY DID SIGN UP. VOLUNTARILY.

And they knew beforehand that that would mean killing people they were told to kill.

I would rather people signed up to the military than sit around in some sink hole playing Xbox all day. Many soldiers see it as the only way out and the only way to learn a trade and see the world.

 

[Scouse]

Oh, so all those people who died during WWII were murderous cowards were they? since you're clearly generalizing every soldier under the sky I'll assume you mean everyone without exception.

My response of "murderous coward" was a direct rebuff in our discussion of conscientious objectors who are are forced into murder - lacking the courage of their convictions. There are thousands of examples of conscientious objectors who bravely gave their lives to stand by their principles - and the memorials that stand testiment to their noble non-violent sacrifice are worth more than the thousands praising the victorious or honourable dead.

I also note that you've not even attempted to rebuff the fact that the vast majority of our soldiers volunteer for a job that they know could well involve ordered murder.

But if I pretend that your post made logical sense I'll rebuff your "generalising every soldier under the sky" - yes. Every single volunteer soldier fits Albert Einstein's description perfectly.

I would rather people signed up to the military than sit around in some sink hole playing Xbox all day. Many soldiers see it as the only way out and the only way to learn a trade and see the world.

I think that viewpoint supports Gwadien's viewpoint that most soldiers tend to be thick - or at least woefully undereducated.

Volunteering for murder is the province of legions of thick people and small numbers of well-educated idiots. And if you look at the recruitment policy and makeup of armies the world over you'll see that borne out...

 

[old.Tohtori]

Quite the discussion to follow with Finlands forced army service

 

[BloodOmen]

Blah blah blah I hate soldiers because I'm a grumpy spineless cunt that has zero respect for people who have died for my entire family.

Shortened it for you. I guess you'd have been happier speaking German then? since you obviously detest all the people that stopped them taking over Europe so people like you could continue breeding.

Can't pick and mix Scouse, you either hate them all or respect them all, there is no "Well this % gets my respect because of ABC reason!", they all do the same job.

 

[Scouse]

Can't pick and mix Scouse

Not picking and mixing. The logic is completely consistent. Unlike yours.

As for "speaking German" - frankly, I couldn't give a fuck. I think we live in an increasingly facist system anyway so the sacrifices of previous generations is increasingly looking like pointless blood wasted.

Pretty much like all war.

 

[caLLous]

I want Woolworths back. I miss Pick n Mix.

 

[MYstIC G]

I want Woolworths back. I miss Pick n Mix.

It was Candy King, you can get it plenty of other shops these days but I wouldn't, horror stories from days gone by would put you off for life.

 

[old.Tohtori]

I guess you'd have been happier speaking German then?

Well assuming the nazis would've won(and kept the power), anyone say under 50 years old would probably be just like we are now(living our lives and being as happy as circumstances allow, whining about #thirdreichtproblems) and the history we would be taught would be that it was a fine job by our troops to destroy those evil allied forces.

That question is always a flawed one since we would not have this world to compare to and would only know the glorious fatherland WIZ NO PROBLEMZ WHATZO EVAH!!

Ahem.

 

[soze]

Or a murderous coward.

Either way - it doesn't absolve the idiots who volunteer for murder. If they were forced into it I'd have the slightest smidgen of respect - but they aren't. They're volunteers. And cunts.

It is very rarely murder for foot soldiers. Murder would mean walking into a village and actively shooting unarmed people and Murder also implies intent. I do not believe your average grunt murders anyone the ROE does not let them shoot unless they are shot at. 99% of the stories not published are of a humanitarian nature out there. Again there are idiots and exceptions.

However some of the stuff about drones comes close to being a war crime. They do not seem to care who else is in the building when they want to hellfire a "target".

 

[Scouse]

I refer you @soze, to the Albert Einstein quote a couple of pages back.

 

[BloodOmen]

It is very rarely murder for foot soldiers. Murder would mean walking into a village and actively shooting unarmed people and Murder also implies intent. I do not believe your average grunt murders anyone the ROE does not let them shoot unless they are shot at. 99% of the stories not published are of a humanitarian nature out there. Again there are idiots and exceptions.

However some of the stuff about drones comes close to being a war crime. They do not seem to care who else is in the building when they want to hellfire a "target".

This pretty much, Scouse doesn't seem to be able to distinguish between the 2 tho, he has tunnel vision and thinks every single action soldiers take = murder.

Also

Not picking and mixing. The logic is completely consistent. Unlike yours.

You're wrong though, my logic is pretty sound, my logic in short is basically this

If its not broken - don't touch it, no need to be there

If its broken and requires urgent help - get the fuck in there and help where possible

Your logic however is basically this

If its not broken - don't touch it, no need to be there

If its broken and requires urgent help - fuck them, i'm not going to help them because murdering is bad! let the civilians die horribly to dictators and terrorist cells because I can't be arsed to go and help them, i'd rather sit on a forum quoting Einstein in a feeble attempt at looking clever

So wheres my logic flawed in that? as far as I can see its your logic that's flawed... because if said civilians were you and your family you'd be crying like a baby for help.... but because you don't need that help at the moment everyone is murdering scum, isn't that about the jist of it?

 

[BloodOmen]

In other news

https://uk.movies.yahoo.com/richard-donner-announces-goonies-sequel-110143217.html

 

[Scouse]

Help

The sort of "help" that we've given Iraq?

The sort of "help" that Afghanistan has received for the better part of 200 years from a number of different world powers?


Don't fool yourself that we go anywhere to give "help". We go there to further a political objective of who knows whom. Period.

As for the Einstein quote here's another:

One does not make wars less likely by formulating rules of warfare... War cannot be humanized. It can only be eliminated...

Rules of engagement. Justified killings. You're rationalising bullshit and coming up with more bullshit. War itself is the crime.

I think he was bob-on with this:

We shall require a substantially new manner of thinking if mankind is to survive

I happen to agree with him. If you think that's me attempting to look "clever" then I'm happy to continue in that way, thanks. Better than signing up to point guns at strangers like the legions of fucktards in the armed forces...

 

[BloodOmen]

The sort of "help" that we've given Iraq?

The sort of "help" that Afghanistan has received for the better part of 200 years from a number of different world powers?


Don't fool yourself that we go anywhere to give "help". We go there to further a political objective of who knows whom. Period.

As for the Einstein quote here's another:


Rules of engagement. Justified killings. You're rationalising bullshit and coming up with more bullshit. War itself is the crime.

I think he was bob-on with this:


I happen to agree with him. If you think that's me attempting to look "clever" then I'm happy to continue in that way, thanks. Better than signing up to point guns at strangers like the legions of fucktards in the armed forces...

I noticed how you conveniently ignored the question about you and your family.

because if said civilians were you and your family you'd be crying like a baby for help.... but because you don't need that help at the moment everyone is murdering scum, isn't that about the jist of it?

Or are you actually going to claim you wouldn't want help for you and your family?

 

[Gwadien]

Victors write history..

Victors decide who the war criminals are.

because if said civilians were you and your family you'd be crying like a baby for help.... but because you don't need that help at the moment everyone is murdering scum, isn't that about the jist of it?

Then I expect the British Army to protect me in Britain.

 

[Scouse]

I noticed how you conveniently ignored the question about you and your family.

Or are you actually going to claim you wouldn't want help for you and your family?

I notice how you've ignored pretty much every salient point I've made.

But I'll still answer yours: Of course I'd cry for help. I'd take help from wherever it came. Any human being tortured or in danger would cry for help. Whether from a bully, a knifeman, an unruly gang or an army. It's an animal reaction to cry for help.

However, I'd still note that if we were under attack by armed forces that they'd be the same type of human fucktards that volunteered to kill under some other cunt's national flag.

I.E. An invading army is full of people of precicely the same retarded persuasion. Warmongers. Murderers-for-hire. The only difference between other armies and ours is the different types and levels of education they've received.

I'd accept help off any cunt if it'd save my life.

 

[BloodOmen]

'd accept help off any cunt if it'd save my life.

Enough said, now please shut up.

 

[Scouse]

Enough said, now please shut up.

What? Saying that I'd accept help if my was life was being threatened negates my argument now?

That's utterly fucking retarded. Period.


But knock yourself out. Pick a single sentence, take it out of context, ignore all other argument no matter the source, yadda yadda yadda. It's the sort of shit religious people pull to justify their retarded belief systems (it's not like they're known for the murder of millions in deplorable fashion through the ages) and it's the same stupid retarded ape-human act that people in the army do to justify murder to themselves.

 

[caLLous]

 

[old.Tohtori]

@Scouse how do you feel about the Finnish army(serious question btw)? While a defense military, it has Finnish education(one of the best) and is mandatory with a screeningprocess for murdering lunatics to be cut out.

Oh and i did notice you sayign "maybe a smidgen of respect", but i'm asking Finnish army in particular and how do you think Einstein applies there?

Oh and, ahem;

But knock yourself out. Pick a single sentence, take it out of context, ignore all other argument no matter the source, yadda yadda yadda.

Stop stealing my lines you f*ck

 

[soze]

I refer you @soze, to the Albert Einstein quote a couple of pages back.

I do not really care about his quote as he is a more murderous idiot than any solider. He took part in the atomic bomb and did not stop it being used.

I am ignoring everything else as it does not help my argument.

 

[Raven]

I know I am guilty of getting sucked in to these arguments sometimes but can we try and keep this thread as pictures of cats and Japanese game shows? The endless toing and froing between people who don't know what they are talking about is getting too much.

 

[old.Tohtori]

I know I am guilty of getting sucked in to these arguments sometimes but can we try and keep this thread as pictures of cats and Japanese game shows? The endless toing and froing between people who don't know what they are talking about is getting too much.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spQuIJnm3ag

 

[Vae]

The sort of "help" that we've given Iraq?

The sort of "help" that Afghanistan has received for the better part of 200 years from a number of different world powers?

Or counter-examples of Kosovo and Rwanda to give the other side of intervention.

 

[Zarjazz]

The endless toing and froing between people who don't know what they are talking about is getting too much.

We may as well turn off the internet then.
Or kill all politicians.
Or both.