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Raven

Raven

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A different question. Do you support the Kurd's right to have a self governed independent state, free from the government of Turkey?
 
Gwadien

Gwadien

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Raven said:
A different question. Do you support the Kurd's right to have a self governed independent state, free from the government of Turkey?
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Yes.

But this isn't really my point.

It was kinda obvious that Turkey was always going to do this - they've always had tanks pointing towards the Kurdish towns across the borders.

However, the way that the UK/America responds to this is probably pretty important for history, and most likely shows us that we don't learn by our mistakes.

We're happy for the kurds to be our cannon fodder because UK/American lives are more important than their lives, but as soon as a problem arises, which we could solve diplomatically, we seemingly allow Turkey to kill our supposed allies.

It's also fairly obvious that the Kurds were fighting for their freedom, not just to combat ISIS.

You can just picture Biden in Turkey saying 'Look, just make sure you stress that you're fighting ISIS, and we'll also let you kill off a few Kurds.'

If the Kurds (who already are known for their terrorism) begin to attack targets wider than Turkey, people will just out-right condemn them, and again, our lesson won't be learnt about trying to play multiple sides.
 
Raven

Raven

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Gwadien said:
Yes.
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How about the UK? Do you support the UK's right to have a self governed independent state, free from the government of Europe?

As for the rest. The town is held by IS and on the border of Turkey, not the Kurds, as was Kobane not so long ago. IS have already started shelling Turkey from within the town, what do you expect the Turks to do? Just accept it?

and, what happened last time the UK/US got involved in a land battle in a Middle Eastern region? We are actually trying something new this time, letting them sort out their own problems, but offering and providing both technical support and air support.
 
Gwadien

Gwadien

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Raven said:
How about the UK? Do you support the UK's right to have a self governed independent state, free from the government of Europe?

As for the rest. The town is held by IS and on the border of Turkey, not the Kurds, as was Kobane not so long ago. IS have already started shelling Turkey from within the town, what do you expect the Turks to do? Just accept it?

and, what happened last time the UK/US got involved in a land battle in a Middle Eastern region? We are actually trying something new this time, letting them sort out their own problems, but offering and providing both technical support and air support.
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LOL.

I think you've more or less lost your argument with your first sentence, that's kinda silly, doesn't even warrant a response.

As for the rest - the Turks could have done something about this a LOOOOOOOOOONG time ago, they could also wipe out the pockets of IS across their borders, and supported the Kurds in the process, but that's hard, because you can't support people that you consider to be sub-human. The Kurds aren't threatening Turkey on the border at the minute, in the slightest, there was a documentary on it recently where all those northern towns are full of women and children trying to rebuild cities for the Kurds to live in whilst the men are off fighting IS, so it's not even like there's a great deal of resistance from the Kurds, they're more or less shelling residential areas.

The problem is that we're not 'letting them sort out their own problems' - by offering one side air/technical support you're getting involved diplomatically, whether you like it or not - the sole reason we're not putting boots on the ground is because we don't want our superior lives getting lost, even though it IS a global problem, and I think we should put boots on the ground, and support the less bat-shit crazy side, however we should be prepared to invest in the long term, rather than having a war by proxy and picking sides like we are.

As I said before, it makes little difference if you have boots on the ground or not; if the Kurds are backed into a corner and we're not prepared to support them then how can we not expect them to lash out?
 
Raven

Raven

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Which side do you think is the right side? The one barrel bombing innocents, the ones chopping their heads off or the ones shelling them with conventional artillery?

Maybe we should start shooting down Russian jets while we are at it...or air striking their bases.

This entire mess was caused by us invading and toppling the leaders in countries we had no real understanding of, and you think the best option is to do it all over again? But this time in an even more complicated region.

No, the best option is to let them determine their own future, there is no right side where Syria and Turkey is concerned, as far as I can tell, they are all cunts. But IS, we should go to town on them.
 
DaGaffer

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Erdogan is playing the West like a banjo. Cuts a sweetheart deal with Merkel to keep refugees he was stuck with anyway, sweeps opposition off the board with a fake coup; makes a show of cozying up to Putin, goes to NATO and says "back me up when I go over the border or me and ol' Vlad will be playing more than footsie. And if I kill a few thousand Kurds you'll take it and smile". And we do, because we have no cards to play in the region at all, and can't afford Russia and Turkey to ever be on the same side (for every reason from gas supplies to military access to the middle east).

He's a horrible bastard, but he's fucking clever as well.
 
Job

Job

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With being flippant, it is without a doubt time to nuke it from orbit, just to be sure.
This shit will go on for centuries.
My personal preference would be to let Iran and Iraq arm themselves to the teeth and invade everyone, Saudi as well.
 
fettoken

fettoken

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Oh god. This has probably been around for long, but i'm starting to hear people who's babbling about 'investing' large amount of sums, some mention 5-6k euro and they mention receiving interest from this each month, and bonuses for having other people signing up. It turns out they buy into a 'starter pack' which i'd suppose probably isn't refundable, thus, not really making it an 'investment' per say. They are raving about bitcoins and Deutsche bank starting up something in the near future that will generate them large amount of cash.

What they probably aren't aware of is that this thing basically is a pyramid scheme/hedge fund investment, and their money might as well just disappear. *sigh*

Apparently they are receiving 'interest' each month, but it's a given, the interest fluctuates of course, so it isn't a given to receive interest i suppose.
 
Tom

Tom

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Greed is one thing, but greed combined with ignorance is quite another.
 
Job

Job

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Walked into PCworld of twats, Acer 216 intergrated PC, display model, no box 149 quid.
1TB drive, 4gb, 20 inch widescreen..nothing special processor, but easily plays 1080 youtube vids.
Loving it for that price, except win10...pile of shite.
 
Syri

Syri

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Windows 10 is far better than Windows 8, but if you're not getting along with it, I believe classic shell still works, so you can make it function more like Windows 7 most of the time.
 
old.user4556

old.user4556

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I've got used to Windows 10. It's solid and very quick, but it still looks like a shitly skinned Linux OS. The legacy design bits left behind looks even worse.

If I wasn't into gaming I'd have a Mac. Yeah I fucking said it.
 
DaGaffer

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caLLous said:
I feel like I don't even know you any more. :(
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My next work computer will be a Macbook. Amazingly when you include support, it works out cheaper than equivalent PCs. Especially as we've moved away from Office to Google (which I loathe, but c'est la vie).
 
Jupitus

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Big G said:
I've got used to Windows 10. It's solid and very quick, but it still looks like a shitly skinned Linux OS. The legacy design bits left behind looks even worse.

If I wasn't into gaming I'd have a Mac. Yeah I fucking said it.
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Isn't that a bannable offence??? :twak:
 
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