The Great Duelling Event.... TGDE.. .-)

[Azal]

There was no 'diversion' so mids could raid anything. I started the mid raid off and at the time none of us were aware of the dueling going on in emain (or if some ppl were, they didn't share the info). It was only until we were already 1/2-3/4 of the way through the raid we realised what was going on in emain and the plan was stuck too (normal keeps then relic keep)

It's not like the fact that mids took 4 (5 maybe?) of the alb keeps in a row was ever going to be leading up to anything except some kind of attack on castle excal is it. The duelling was just good/bad timing (depending how you look at it) but it's not like it was a supprise sneak attack on the relic after all

If ppl wanna kill duellers that is their choice to do so, doesn't bother me in the slightest (that is the idea of rvr after all ). And complaining about it isn't gonna make em stop, so just hafta deal with it. Sometimes I kill duellers too, depends what kinda mood im in.

Anyway emain was fun last night until i started going ld every 20 seconds (sorry Luana, didn't feel like coming back again just to ld, again)

And Kaylin, shhhh

 

[old.Jadow]

<nod> I believe that azal. Just pissed me off that while people were tossing about in emain RP farming, they could have been of use defending or intercepting your modest force.

I also know that had you succeeded (and i'm starting to wish you had) that the majority of those taking part (to the best of my knowledge anyways) would have been the one's bitching about how 'uber' the mids are and how we always lose etc, but then refuse to do anything about it.

The Mids seem to work far more as a team. I went there and had to stop myself bumping off the hibs (i don't attack hibs unless provoked personally or unless they are fighting my guildmates, for purely roleplaying reasons too complicated for this debate) because there were so few mids there.

Kinda rattling my cage a bit, this whole thing. I may stop responding to these as it's bugging me.

Jadow
Lvl 45+ Infiltrator
The Order of The Knights Templar.

 

[old.Cyric]

You ever -seen- how much damage a full critical strike chain will do?

Originally posted by Solid in the general discussion boards, just wanted to point it out to those only read this board and missed it.

This is what a landed critical strike chain does to a yellow

 

[lofff]

I was on my way to Gorge when a l48 armsman asked me to taxi her to mid wall... did it and found that "great event"

I must say it was really unfair

1.- Duels are not to death, its not easy to avoid some accidental downs but on that place u all were killing each other freely, thats rp farming, thats ilegal, thats crap. I tried to duel an orange con thane and owned, when i was still at 30% he was at 1% but he keep whacking me altho i stopped so he forced me to kill, i left after that.

2.- There were peeps just whacking low cons for rps, then bowing and getting lost betwen tha crowd, shame on those lamers

But of course generalizing sooks and prolly there were lots a fair players doing fair duels etc etc, just unlucky me only was able to see tha worst part of tha event.

cya on battleground :sleeping:

 

[lakih]

I might not been clear about some things....

1. I dont think duals are against the "rules"
2. Im not against duals

Hope to see u on the battlefield... either dualing, skermishing(no, i dont know how to spell that word) och large scale chaothic battles.

 

[old.Jadow]

Heh nice picture Cyric.

By the way a couple of people asked me to clarify something. When I said a yellow con won't see me until it's dead I didn't mean I can one shot them. I can't. Well I've never yet anyways as far as I can remember.

However although they may be breathing, and standing upright after the first and second hit (albeit somewhat dizzy from a stun, nauseous from a poison, and wondering why their feet stopped working from a snare) they are definately dead. It's just a matter of time before they realise it <grin>

It works that way for us too against shadowblades and nightshades. I can't count the number of times when i've sat there just waiting to die - I know it's going to happen, but there's sod all you can do about it.

He who has the first PA lives to fight another day. If you don't PA before the other assassin (and I rarely do because the ones I meet all seem to be 49/50 with stealth to match their level), you're toast.

Nuff said.

Jadow
Lvl 45+ Infiltrator
The Order of The Knights Templar

 

[Starkill]

Originally posted by Brannor McThife

Just because you don't see a glowing figure with KEMOR over his head means he isn't there?


Um...please don't tell me you're one of those that expect the patch to relieve this tedium...


Oh. That's so nice of you. I'll be sure to tell the rest of the team that "we suck".

/ignore Starkill

-G

As for point one it would be nice to know that there were quite a number of mods online at anytime as with other MMORPG's.

Point two I dont expect very much at all from the new patch but it might help if the speed of implementing them was improved.

Point 3 the comment wasn't aimed at the team itself I am sure they are doing everything they can within their power. There is a percieved lack of commitment on the part of GOA which seems to be reflected by the numbers of mods etc online on the American servers compared to the Euro ones.

 

[Azal]

Originally posted by Jadow
I also know that had you succeeded (and i'm starting to wish you had) that the majority of those taking part (to the best of my knowledge anyways) would have been the one's bitching about how 'uber' the mids are and how we always lose etc, but then refuse to do anything about it.

Aye, don't you hate it when stuff like that happens :/

 

[old.mili]

mids cant be that "uber" as i can get a red con (wearing chain) down to nearly quarter HP before they kill meuke: uke:

( how does it fell to nearly die off a blue con )

oh look how big my head is...

 

[old.k70]

Originally posted by mili
( how does it fell to nearly die off a blue con )

You get used to it. I do that all the time

 

[old.mili]

:wub:

 

[old.Zhildrua]

Also duelling isn't blatantly against the CoC, it would be in best case labelled as "shady". It is rp-farming, period. And since with new patches those RP's actually get more value, it's a form of cheating IMO. And the justification for it holds no water. In this thread I've seen the following reasons given pro duelling:

- It's not against the CoC
True, there's no paragraph in the CoC stating that duelling is a no-no. Let me take you older guys a bit down on memory lane:
When Sinister managed to stealth through the keep (and he walked right through the door, no walking through walls or some bug, AFAIK) and started killing ppl in Albion homeland, everybody yelled Bloody murder. Why? It was not against the CoC. Prove me wrong and show me the paragraph that said "Entering enemy realms except for the frontier zones is not allowed" or show me the "stealthing through keeps via normal means is not allowed" line. After that incident it was interpreted that stealthing through an enemy pk was not a designed feature and declared against the spirit of the game and a bug. And weren't most of the Albs complaining how many RP's Sinister got that day by killing grey-conning newbies in Camelot Hills (sic!)? And now you're belittling the gains from the duels? Double standards in my book. The CoC needs to be interpreted, because not even the most creative mind could come up with all possible ways to fuck around with game mechanics.

- It's not about the RP, it's about fun!

I bet Sinister had loads of fun in Albion...
If I found out that after teleporting to Emain a /dance /beckon /bang combo repeated three times puts me in some sort of god mode, rest assured I'll have a lot of fun this day.
Me, me, me. Welcome to the new millenium. It's my fun that counts, others can go to hell.
Pathetic.
Point is, just because you have fun, makes the whole thing neither right nor wrong, so no valid justification. Exploiting a bug is wrong, period, if I had fun doing it is irrelevant.

- It's a distraction of the boredom at higher levels
Sure, try duping gold or uber-weapons, might distract your boredom too. Sheesh, that argument is so lame, I won't even comment it further.

 

[Turamber]

Perhaps unsurprisingly I have to agree with Aethelstan and Jadow. These "duels" abuse the game and make a mockery of the Realm Point system. Just *how* does sitting around fighting pointless personal battles aid your Realm?

Realm Points should be won by fighting for a great cause -- to win the relics, or to successfully defend them. Not for sitting about fiddling while Rome burns.

I know some of the people who have fought in these duels and they've confessed to finding the game boring. I'd suggest that its not the game itself they find boring -- but the mockery they've made of it. The sooner you guys go find other games to play the better.

Sure you pay for the privilege of playing the game -- but you are far outnumbered by those who abide by the written and unwritten rules of the game. If you don't give a flying stuff for them then its time you went to find yourself a single player game.

------x------

On another point -- its not just Albion's that cheat. I have very limited experience of RvR but I've come across Vikings who have bows that shoot through walls, healers that hide in walls to heal their Lord and mages who cast void spells while hiding in walls and sitting on roofs.

Cheaters have no place in any multiplayer game, regardless of which realm they live in. If anyone knows the name of a cheater, report them -- lets clean the game up!

 

[VidX]

Oh! More of these please! In Emain too! And right by a mg please! And what? during peak play time?

Everyone come, will be great fun, all on-screen at once.

Then I will pbaoe all you idiots who are stupid enough to stand all bunched up. I think you will like my new level 48 spell.

Wise the F up guys. Jadow put things perfectly in his first post, Albs who were there while their relic keep was under attack?

roflmao

If I hear of this again, I will most certainly be organising a little group of AoE'ers and mezzers to pay the 'event' a little visit and most definitely 'farm' Rp's from all the silly 'cows' who are silly enough to stand all bunched up in a field.

And any Hibs in the middle when the nukes start flying... you better hope we kill the Mids/Albs before they realise they had best kill you.

 

[VidX]

Originally posted by Zhildrua

- It's not against the CoC
True, there's no paragraph in the CoC stating that duelling is a no-no. Let me take you older guys a bit down on memory lane:
When Sinister managed to stealth through the keep (and he walked right through the door, no walking through walls or some bug, AFAIK) and started killing ppl in Albion homeland, everybody yelled Bloody murder. Why? It was not against the CoC. Prove me wrong and show me the paragraph that said "Entering enemy realms except for the frontier zones is not allowed" or show me the "stealthing through keeps via normal means is not allowed" line. After that incident it was interpreted that stealthing through an enemy pk was not a designed feature and declared against the spirit of the game and a bug. And weren't most of the Albs complaining how many RP's Sinister got that day by killing grey-conning newbies in Camelot Hills (sic!)? And now you're belittling the gains from the duels? Double standards in my book. The CoC needs to be interpreted, because not even the most creative mind could come up with all possible ways to fuck around with game mechanics.

Ok, will do...

Players undertake not to make use of any bug, not to use any undocumented functions and not to exploit any possible design faults. Players also undertake to notify the presence of any bugs, undocumented functions or design faults they may discover to GOA personnel as soon as possible.

In this occasion, Sinister exploited a design fault that was documented in the patch notes for a later patch than was installed on the server, and in the later patch Mythic fixed the design fault by making border keep guards see through stealth 100% of the time.

Originally posted by Zhildrua

- It's not about the RP, it's about fun!
I bet Sinister had loads of fun in Albion...
If I found out that after teleporting to Emain a /dance /beckon /bang combo repeated three times puts me in some sort of god mode, rest assured I'll have a lot of fun this day.
Me, me, me. Welcome to the new millenium. It's my fun that counts, others can go to hell.
Pathetic.
Point is, just because you have fun, makes the whole thing neither right nor wrong, so no valid justification. Exploiting a bug is wrong, period, if I had fun doing it is irrelevant.

Not just wrong, but against the CoC, as I have pointed out above.

 

[Starkill]

Originally posted by Zhildrua
Also duelling isn't blatantly against the CoC, it would be in best case labelled as "shady". It is rp-farming, period. And since with new patches those RP's actually get more value, it's a form of cheating IMO. And the justification for it holds no water. In this thread I've seen the following reasons given pro duelling:

Yeah and so is PK camping etc in my opinion.

- It's not against the CoC
True, there's no paragraph in the CoC stating that duelling is a no-no. Let me take you older guys a bit down on memory lane:
When Sinister managed to stealth through the keep (and he walked right through the door, no walking through walls or some bug, AFAIK) and started killing ppl in Albion homeland, everybody yelled Bloody murder. Why? It was not against the CoC. Prove me wrong and show me the paragraph that said "Entering enemy realms except for the frontier zones is not allowed" or show me the "stealthing through keeps via normal means is not allowed" line. After that incident it was interpreted that stealthing through an enemy pk was not a designed feature and declared against the spirit of the game and a bug. And weren't most of the Albs complaining how many RP's Sinister got that day by killing grey-conning newbies in Camelot Hills (sic!)? And now you're belittling the gains from the duels? Double standards in my book. The CoC needs to be interpreted, because not even the most creative mind could come up with all possible ways to fuck around with game mechanics.

Who cares its history not relevant to the current thread.

- It's not about the RP, it's about fun!

I bet Sinister had loads of fun in Albion...
If I found out that after teleporting to Emain a /dance /beckon /bang combo repeated three times puts me in some sort of god mode, rest assured I'll have a lot of fun this day.
Me, me, me. Welcome to the new millenium. It's my fun that counts, others can go to hell.
Pathetic.
Point is, just because you have fun, makes the whole thing neither right nor wrong, so no valid justification. Exploiting a bug is wrong, period, if I had fun doing it is irrelevant.

Bollox its not about RP at all it is about fun in case you forgot and people have different ways of expressing that.

- It's a distraction of the boredom at higher levels
Sure, try duping gold or uber-weapons, might distract your boredom too. Sheesh, that argument is so lame, I won't even comment it further.

No I am sure you wont because you cant form an argument, nice point of view but worthless. No real content but you are entitled to your opinion as is everyone else.

 

[old.Gaal]

Here is Mythic's official statement ragarding duels:

Dueling.
from Jeff Hickman
2002-01-09 17:20:54


Many people have been asking for the official Mythic position regarding inter-realm duels. Here it is:


We believe that large, organized and semi-organized duels between realms is a form of cross-teaming often used for realm point farming (though we know that this is not always the case). Therefore, anything that other players may do to disrupt said duels is neither harassment nor disruption. People from the other two realms are your enemies, and you are free to kill them whenever and wherever you may find them.

Our policy in the past has been fairly hands-off, kill them all and let the release button sort them out - and therefore we have given the appearance of condoning these events by posting the "duel events" and the "disrupt the duel events" equally on the Herald Calendar. Since we do not condone cross-teaming or realm point farming in any way, we will no longer post anything to do with duels on the calendar.

Note - we have heard your feedback requesting a dueling area (without Realm Points and their rewards), and we will consider such a thing in the future.

This was taken from the Camelot Herald.

And I know that it's GOA that's running the game here, but after all Mythic made the game and have the last word in any discussions regarding the game, so please just don't reply that this is just Mythic's statement and not GOA's and therefor have nothing to say for us EU players.
Mythic made the game and they decide how it shall be.


Maybe people should read more and get some facts on the table before acting like fools and start flaming and behave badly on these boards.

I used to enjoy posting and reading the Official Boards wich GOA hosted for us in the beginning, but I must say that after these forums became the "Official Forums" the posts and threads and even people have become of a very poor quality. You don't see many good posts any longer. Mostly it's just whining, flaming and making silly comments of everything.
Not the kind of forums that applies to everybody, so what you have here is just a very limited community of DAoC players, wich aren't very helpful at all for most people. It's just a Forum wich a limited amount of people use to talk crap and start acting like.. basically fools.. most of them..

I check these forums regulary, but I don't post very much because I don't like the community very much here.
I cheer everytime I see a useful post, and I get a big smile in my face when I see intelligent answers and not just the usual flaming, whining and crap many of the users tend to do.


Sure, have fun on these forums, after all that's what the game is all about, and we all have different opinions of what fun can be...

And yes, post what you like and have fun taunting your enemies in the RvR section and tell us some good stories etc..

but please think twice before pressing the Post Reply button, and please think some more time before pressing the Submit Reply button, and please do us all the favour and read through your post before you actual post it.


Thanks in advance..

 

[Farnis]

If I hear of this again, I will most certainly be organising a little group of AoE'ers and mezzers to pay the 'event' a little visit and most definitely 'farm' Rp's from all the silly 'cows' who are silly enough to stand all bunched up in a field.

Nobody is stopping you..please read the posts before getting emotional.

 

[old.Zhildrua]

@VidX
You proved my point. The stealthing in enemy realms is not covered literally in the CoC, but there are general rules that need to be interpreted. Which was done in the Sinister case and should be done in this duelling/lame rp-farming thingie.

@[UKD]Starkill
You think PK camping is against the CoC? Hmm, care to prove it? Just you disliking it makes it no crime. AFAIK you are encouraged to try to kill your enemies, be it with melee, magic, throwing daisies at them or PK camping. Haven't seen anything in CoC that even vaguely hints that pk camping is not allowed. Sure, it doesn't lead to entertaining RvR battles, but a cheat?

Who cares its history not relevant to the current thread.

Hello?? It was an example with the same pattern like the rp-farming. I tried to get a point across. Did you actually read it? Maybe next time I'll use more basic examples, since analogies seem a concept too complicated for you to grasp.

Bollox its not about RP at all it is about fun in case you forgot and people have different ways of expressing that.

Once again, did you actually bother to read it?? I'll repeat in a nutshell then: if you're using any cheat or exploit it is totally irrelevant if you had fun doing it or were bored to death while doing it, if you gained anything by doing it or not. Cheat is cheat. Period. It's simply not a logical argument in the discussion.
All that matters is the question: Is Duelling against the CoC, yes or no? If it's not, then there's no need for reasoning it.

No I am sure you wont because you cant form an argument, nice point of view but worthless. No real content but you are entitled to your opinion as is everyone else.

And that coming from someone who confuses statements with arguments? LOL! At least try to prove your points, so we can see if YOU are able to form an argument. The four assertions without substance you spew between my post suggest otherwise.

 

[Solid]

Think we should close this thread with Mythic's Quote, kindly provoded by Gaal a few posts earlier.

It basically sums up the whole thread and puts a nice official stance on it.

In Essence, Duels will be tolerated, Breaking up Deuls is encouraged, so let the duelers duel, and let us the anti duelers go keel the duelers, everyone has their fun

Dueling.
from Jeff Hickman
2002-01-09 17:20:54


Many people have been asking for the official Mythic position regarding inter-realm duels. Here it is:


We believe that large, organized and semi-organized duels between realms is a form of cross-teaming often used for realm point farming (though we know that this is not always the case). Therefore, anything that other players may do to disrupt said duels is neither harassment nor disruption. People from the other two realms are your enemies, and you are free to kill them whenever and wherever you may find them.

Our policy in the past has been fairly hands-off, kill them all and let the release button sort them out - and therefore we have given the appearance of condoning these events by posting the "duel events" and the "disrupt the duel events" equally on the Herald Calendar. Since we do not condone cross-teaming or realm point farming in any way, we will no longer post anything to do with duels on the calendar.

Note - we have heard your feedback requesting a dueling area (without Realm Points and their rewards), and we will consider such a thing in the future.

 

[old.Faye Arwen]

I'll say as me, Vuk, Puk and Blejs said last time after 20-30 min. KEEEEEEEEEEEEEL!

 

[old.Faye Arwen]

and who is BW calling old?! PFFFFFFFFFT ;p

 

[Starkill]

Firstly before we close the thread I would like to appologise particularly to Zhildrua for what was a very poor post.

It was made after a very long day of playing and whilst experiencing a number of problems with my browser. However I should have had more sense than to post while in that situation.

Point 1. No I wasn't trying to say PK camping is against the CoC but in my view is a good example of something that can be labelled as "shady". Although many times it is used correctly it can and has been used to RP farm in the past. If it something that people find fun then so be it, but at the same time as long as duelling isn't being used to RP farm I see no problem with that either. It would be nice to have say an arena installed in the major cities of the realm where PvP could be permitted for those that would like to "test their skills" against other players and where RP's would not be awarded. It seems that there are quite a few who like the idea of duelling and I just feel that it shouldn't be overloooked if enough people want it. As for arranging it in a frontier location I dont see people having much choice in that at the moment.

Point 2. The comment was aimed at the example you gave involving Sinister. I appreciate fully why you included it but I am affriad that we are getting away a little from the simple question of arranging a duelling contest. Which as I have said if conducted in the correct way so it is not an RP farming exercise I see no problem with (personally I have no interest in Duelling).

Point 3. Yes exploiting a bug is wrong and I fully agree with you. However I still maintain the game is about fun not RP, sometimes it seems to be forgotten that certain players have no wish to get involved with RvR. RP's are a part of the game that can be persued if you wish it is not by anymeans the be all and end all of the game for everyone. Also by fun I dont mean being allowed to do whatever any indivdual feels like but if it doesn't break the CoC or the obvious spirit with which it was intended then fine.

Point 4. Yes I feel the content of the game is a bit weak after about lvl 35. Hopefully DF and other changes planned will help to address this in the future. In essence DAoC is a great game with a tremendous potential but it would be nice to have some other content (i.e. some longer storyline content epic quests etc.) for those that dont want to wholly immerse themselves in RvR.

Once again appologies for a terrible post but I hope this clears up some of the points.

 

[old.Zhildrua]

Starkill,

thanks for your explanation and apology. We all have those days It's also nice to see someone having the greatness of standing up and admitting a fault. Kudos.

In return I'd like to apologize for my somewhat aggressive reply. I came from a game which was also plagued with bug exploiters and cheaters, hence my zero tolerance stance on cheating.

Don't get me wrong: I have nothing against duelling per se - if it's done properly, like in your arena example. God knows the game could do with more depth. So if the arena comes in - wonderful. People can duel there all day long or never visit it. Each to his own. Just the current solution of duelling in the frontier is not right IMHO. And for the rest of your post - I can backup every point.
So, at the end of the day we found out our points of view aren't really that far apart - and it only took 3 posts to find that out.... hey, we're quite efficient

 

[Starkill]

Ah so nice to put stuff to rest and yeah 3 posts not bad going.

 

[Arlone]

*posted this after reading 10 or so post from the top*

I have participated in a few duels when I was a bit lower level, cause it was new, exciting, fun and ... well maybe thats it After being ganked by middies who did not like arranged duelling I decided not to do it again tho - it made me to angry to get ganked in the middle of a duel.

Point: I don't really see duelling as RP-farming but what jadow did was still very 'leagal' and there is no reason to whine about it. It's exactly the same whine as when someone gets exp-killed in the frontier or whatever - if you go to the frontiers be prepared to die .. yes, even if you are duelling or just having a smoke up some treetop.

Duel all ye want, but if I see Mr.X in the middle of a duel-event and I feel like killing some of Mr.X's duelling-partners (or Mr.X) I'll do it. Flaming a person (or several) for doing what this game is designed for is childish ... but even I have done it *yes I know it's very irritating but it's whats the game's about - simple*

If you can't tolorate getting killed while duelling, do like me and stop duelling. Cause whatever way you whine about it it's still the way it's gonna be *period*

 

[Coren]

Nice one to the Hibs for stopping the duels at amg yesterday. Were a bit too many for Derric and me to handle on our own anyway. Saved us some trouble there . And so typical to see the 'LAME HIBS!' comments on irc afterwards.

 

[old.Deadbeat]

Just a quick analogy.....

Try and join a quake 3 server full of people and 'duel' your friend in a quiet corner. Bet some people come along and kill you

 

[zedorf luribomb]

\o/

 

[old.Downanael]

Who won