- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 36,056
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 36,056
Wow! To the tory voters - I made a joke about this a while back. Seems that Dave wants it in reality.
How do our resident tory-fatties feel about this?
How do our resident tory-fatties feel about this?
Gumbo
FH is my second home
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 2,361
If someone's only disability is being fat, or conditions directly attributable to being fat then. I think it's perfectly reasonable to encourage them to sort themselves out.
It does seem like its carrot and stick as well. Yes they'll take some of your benefits away, or we'll pay for your treatment so you can keep your £100 or you'll get sorted enough to work.
Seems sensible enough.
It does seem like its carrot and stick as well. Yes they'll take some of your benefits away, or we'll pay for your treatment so you can keep your £100 or you'll get sorted enough to work.
Seems sensible enough.
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2003
- Messages
- 44,644
Good idea. All people who are unable to work due to something that is fixable, or manageable should be helped back into work, if they refuse that help then they get a financial slap. Seems good to me.
Shame they don't extend it to the chronically lazy too.
Shame they don't extend it to the chronically lazy too.
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 36,056
@Gumbo, @Raven - what if the conservatives say "get cut - go under the knife - mandatory gastric bypass"...
Frankly - it's the other end of the scale that contains the big easy wins: Tax evader? We'll have *everything you own* and you can start from scratch again.
Then it wouldn't matter if 40,000 fatties weren't working. We'd have ample cash.
Frankly - it's the other end of the scale that contains the big easy wins: Tax evader? We'll have *everything you own* and you can start from scratch again.
Then it wouldn't matter if 40,000 fatties weren't working. We'd have ample cash.
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 36,056
They haven't ruled it out either.
Gumbo
FH is my second home
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 2,361
Heh, yes scouse, you're making a bit of a stretch there. When they make that proposal I'll give my reaction to it.
They are getting better at the tax casino thing and an awful lot better than the last lot, but I agree more effort should be made on that.
On that subject. I'm not as uppity as the papers and sheep who read them are. Many of those who get busted are avoiding prosecution by repaying the tax owed plus 200%. I'll take that over a massively expensive court case.
They are getting better at the tax casino thing and an awful lot better than the last lot, but I agree more effort should be made on that.
On that subject. I'm not as uppity as the papers and sheep who read them are. Many of those who get busted are avoiding prosecution by repaying the tax owed plus 200%. I'll take that over a massively expensive court case.
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 36,056
Not true. Our recovery rate is less than that of other countries who prosecute. If we're going to be all pragmatic and say "nice Mr Rich man - you've knowingly broken the law, but we won't prosecute you and put you in jail as long as you pay the tax" - then we HAVE to recover more tax than by not prosecuting. But we don't.
So, being rich means it's worth chancing your arm - because even if you get caught you won't be prosecuted and the gains to be made are stupendous.
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2003
- Messages
- 44,644
Most of the people who the media are getting themselves worked up about are doing it in a perfectly legal way. Such as the Milibands and Chuka Umunna. You avoid paying tax too don't you Scouse? In a perfectly legal way.
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 36,056
I do indeed. It's perfectly legal.
It's also wrong. So the law needs changing. Unless you're happy to pay double the percentage of tax that I do?
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 36,056
No. It just doesn't make me a mug. Make myself poor and harm my quality of life whilst my peers don't? Don't be fucking stupid. But I still argue for systemic change - which is against my own interests, yet in the interests of the majority. That makes me weak?
How about having a pop at the people who go "fuck no - tax is for the fucking legions of retards and knuckledraggers that are clearly too fucking dumb to avoid it."
You got a problem with them sort of people @Talivar?
It doesn't surprise me at all that tax avoidance is "vanilla" for many people. The plebs are too dumb to pick the correct targets.
DaGaffer
Down With That Sorta Thing
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 18,409
That would cost money, so not going to happen.
Gwadien
Uneducated Northern Cretin
- Joined
- Jul 15, 2006
- Messages
- 19,842
- Thread starter
- #112
I don't think that @Scouse is saying he's happy that he's dodging tax (which ever terminology is the legal one) it's more of a case that if he can, then why not?
But frankly, that should be removed, the tax dodging systems is a good system to be honest, because it encourages experienced people to start up businesses because they don't take as much as an income decrease as they would if the systems weren't in place.
People like @Scouse should be stopped from doing it, because it's being used for the wrong reasons, because he's not employing anyone, so therefore what he's doing is not bettering the economy because he's not employing people in return.
I think that there should be a system in place in which your tax decreases with the amount of people that you employ, and then you hit a cap of this system to stop the large businesses abusing it.
But obviously this would be a pretty naive approach since you could employ your mum as a cleaner your wife as your accountant and other silly roles just to lower your tax.
I agree that what Scouse is doing is wrong, morally, but economically, there still needs to be ALOT more pressure on the super-rich because you can bitch at defenceless Scouse for not paying the full whack that he should whilst Mr Stinkin' Rich has a army of lawyers and accountants to stop him paying his taxes, which needs to stop.
Although hypothetically speaking, because so many people are employed for tax dodging, would a clear cut simpler system without abuses mean that employment would decrease, since they're no longer required, and therefore would it mean that it won't do as much good as originally thought?
But frankly, that should be removed, the tax dodging systems is a good system to be honest, because it encourages experienced people to start up businesses because they don't take as much as an income decrease as they would if the systems weren't in place.
People like @Scouse should be stopped from doing it, because it's being used for the wrong reasons, because he's not employing anyone, so therefore what he's doing is not bettering the economy because he's not employing people in return.
I think that there should be a system in place in which your tax decreases with the amount of people that you employ, and then you hit a cap of this system to stop the large businesses abusing it.
But obviously this would be a pretty naive approach since you could employ your mum as a cleaner your wife as your accountant and other silly roles just to lower your tax.
I agree that what Scouse is doing is wrong, morally, but economically, there still needs to be ALOT more pressure on the super-rich because you can bitch at defenceless Scouse for not paying the full whack that he should whilst Mr Stinkin' Rich has a army of lawyers and accountants to stop him paying his taxes, which needs to stop.
Although hypothetically speaking, because so many people are employed for tax dodging, would a clear cut simpler system without abuses mean that employment would decrease, since they're no longer required, and therefore would it mean that it won't do as much good as originally thought?
Embattle
FH is my second home
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 13,214
I've said it before and I'll always say it, it is the primary reason I utterly ignore Scouse when he stands on his soap box.
Ironically I nearly couldn't even be arsed to say the above, that's just how much I tend to ignore him
The general population would probably find that nearly all the parties include people who get creative when it comes to paying tax, in the end all the various parties do on such issues is try and move the boundary line to suit themselves as to what is and isn't "fair".
Ironically I nearly couldn't even be arsed to say the above, that's just how much I tend to ignore him
The general population would probably find that nearly all the parties include people who get creative when it comes to paying tax, in the end all the various parties do on such issues is try and move the boundary line to suit themselves as to what is and isn't "fair".
Bodhi
Once agreed with Scouse and a LibDem at same time
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 9,283
Tax avoidance I don't actually have an issue with - in fact I think it is someone's duty to minimise tax as much as possible through legal methods.
Tax evasion is a completely different matter though, not declaring income, cash in hand jobs etc. That is deception and should be punished as such.
However I am still more concerned with the amount of money our government pisses up the wall, on foreign aid, ludicrous PFI contracts and civil servants getting paid more than the Prime Minister.
Tax evasion is a completely different matter though, not declaring income, cash in hand jobs etc. That is deception and should be punished as such.
However I am still more concerned with the amount of money our government pisses up the wall, on foreign aid, ludicrous PFI contracts and civil servants getting paid more than the Prime Minister.
Job
The Carl Pilkington of Freddyshouse
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 21,652
I will never support charging people for illnesses that could be construed as being their own fault, that is like the poster boy for the thin end of the wedge, that line of thinking ends up with people being charged just for getting old.
throdgrain
FH is my second home
- Joined
- Dec 22, 2003
- Messages
- 7,197
I agree with the above statement, but then I'd get rid of dole money after 6 months and social 6 months after that and you'd be in the workhouse soon after if you didn't sort your shit out
Gwadien
Uneducated Northern Cretin
- Joined
- Jul 15, 2006
- Messages
- 19,842
- Thread starter
- #117
So you're victorian in more than one aspectI agree with the above statement, but then I'd get rid of dole money after 6 months and social 6 months after that and you'd be in the workhouse soon after if you didn't sort your shit out
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2003
- Messages
- 44,644
I actually think it would be hilarious if UKIP did well, leaning towards watching it all burn and laughing my arse off. It would certainly lead to an earthquake in politics and maybe lead to changes that are drastically needed. Delivering on promises for a start.
The tired old establishment is desperate to paint them as racists and incompetents because they have no other answer. Like it or not, UKIP are representing a lot of peoples views (Like them or not) and under a democracy that is what is right.
The Tories and Labour don't really represent anything at all.
The tired old establishment is desperate to paint them as racists and incompetents because they have no other answer. Like it or not, UKIP are representing a lot of peoples views (Like them or not) and under a democracy that is what is right.
The Tories and Labour don't really represent anything at all.
- Joined
- Dec 27, 2003
- Messages
- 44,644
Yep but the establishment don't want a referendum on europe and the people do.
The tories are always promising one and never delivering one. Labour don't give a shit what the people want and flat out refuse to discuss it.
Europe in its current state is broken. It is not even remotely democratic. I would rather be out of it at the moment. But if they are willing to reform and become democratic then I would want to stay in. It could be something great but the way it's heading it wont be.
The tories are always promising one and never delivering one. Labour don't give a shit what the people want and flat out refuse to discuss it.
Europe in its current state is broken. It is not even remotely democratic. I would rather be out of it at the moment. But if they are willing to reform and become democratic then I would want to stay in. It could be something great but the way it's heading it wont be.
