Football The 2020/2021 Season Thread

[Scouse]

Money does fundamentally change what happens on the pitch if you're not a big club. If it didn't, i'd be watching Sadio Mane and VVD every week, instead of Jan Bednarek and Moussa Djenepo

That's disingenuous and you know it. You understood the context of my post completely.

 

[Aoami]

That's disingenuous and you know it. You understood the context of my post completely.

I did understand it, but I also stand by my point. Money removes my enjoyment of the game ON THE FIELD much more than VAR does, because all our best players just get bought by Brand FC, making the game much less enjoyable to watch. It's like you're telling me how to think.

 

[Scouse]

I did understand it, but I also stand by my point.

I get your point. And it has merit. But it wasn't the subject under discussion.

it's like you're telling me how to think.

Not at all. I'm trying to keep you on-topic, because there's a desparate need from the VAR-lovers in this thread to not face up to the fact that a shitload of people, pros and pundits think it's a giant sack of wank.

Nobody wants to tell Gary Linkar - "sorry Gary, I know you played in the game, commentate on it and you've been steeped in football all your professional and personal life, and have a deep deep love of the game that us fans can only just begin to understand - but you're fucking wrong. VAR is great, so STFU."

 

[Gwadien]

Funny given my Gary Linkear argument above:

You're anti-Tory, but you'll suck business dick completely when it comes to our sport? Use business justification (money) as a reason for lessening the enjoyment of huge swathes of fans?

I've made this very argument myself @Gwadien - that if it makes them more profit, then they won't care if it ruins football for fans - in the cold hard business world, money is king.

If you're OK with that being applied to football - then what kind of person are you.

No, I'm telling you the reality of football in its current form, it doesn't mean that I support it.

Quite obviously...

And yes, I'm sure if the FA/FIFA/Prem told Gary Lineker to pack tweeting criticising about VAR like the BBC did over his political tweets then yes, he would pick the money over his 'love' any day of the week.

Your abusive husband analogy is quite good actually, people moan about football and the direction its going, but no-one seems to actively do anything about it.

I guess that isn't actually strictly true, there was that alternative Man U club I suppose.

'Football is nothing without the fans' Prove it.

 

[Raven]

I'd tell him that, from the passanger side of a yellow fiat

 

[Aoami]

I get your point. And it has merit. But it wasn't the subject under discussion.


Not at all. I'm trying to keep you on-topic, because there's a desparate need from the VAR-lovers in this thread to not face up to the fact that a shitload of people, pros and pundits think it's a giant sack of wank.

Nobody wants to tell Gary Linkar - "sorry Gary, I know you played in the game, commentate on it and you've been steeped in football all your professional and personal life, and have a deep deep love of the game that us fans can only just begin to understand - but you're fucking wrong. VAR is great, so STFU."

As far as I'm concerned I am on topic. VAR is just the next step in football as a business, rather than a sport. It's all part of the same package. You either live with it, or you stick by your principles and look elsewhere. I've found sticking to my principles hard to do, as much as I want to. I'll always be a Southampton fan first and foremost, but more and more i'm swayed towards lower league football and just supporting my local team wherever i'm living, because going to live games is how I personally get the most out of football, and it comes without all the bullshit and money of the premier league.

 

[Scouse]

it doesn't mean that I support it.

Quite obviously...

Nothing obvious about that at all - especially if you're using that in an argument to support VAR.

 

[Scouse]

You either live with it, or you stick by your principals and look elsewhere.

Another "please fuck off" argument - one you must be applying to the bigger number of fans that hate VAR.


Don't want to address any of those other points do you? You just carry on ignoring them, because facing them undermines your position. And you simply don't want to admit when you're wrong.

 

[Aoami]

Another "please fuck off" argument - one you must be applying to the bigger number of fans that hate VAR.


Don't want to address any of those other points do you? You just carry on ignoring them, because facing them undermines your position. And you simply don't want to admit when you're wrong.

I'm not ignoring them, I jut think they're completely redundant. Gary Lineker's and Jermain fucking Jenas' opinions do not matter in the big scheme of things, because football is already too far gone. I bet they'd both be pro players getting paid £200k a week, when the average football fan thinks that is completely unreasonable.

 

[Scouse]

I'm not ignoring them, I jut think they're completely redundant. Gary Lineker's and Jermain fucking Jenas' opinions do not matter in the big scheme of things

You're not just ignoring them. You're ignoring the fact that you're in the minority. Massively.

You can point at Linkear and Jenas and admit your jealousy of their money as a way to deflect the argument. But you can't point the finger at the massive number of fans who want to scrap it because VAR is a rubicon that shouldn't be crossed for them and is proving to be a complete shitshow from start to finish.

And all your whattaboutery (football is fucked here, so lets not fix VAR! (which is an easy fix)) doesn't wash.

Fuckloads of normally-earning not superstar fans want VAR gone because they hate it. Not small amounts of people, two or three percent, but huge amounts of people.

 

[Aoami]

You're not just ignoring them. You're ignoring the fact that you're in the minority. Massively.

You can point at Linkear and Jenas and admit your jealousy of their money as a way to deflect the argument. But you can't point the finger at the massive number of fans who want to scrap it because VAR is a rubicon that shouldn't be crossed for them and is proving to be a complete shitshow from start to finish.

And all your whattaboutery (football is fucked here, so lets not fix VAR! (which is an easy fix)) doesn't wash.

Fuckloads of normally-earning not superstar fans want VAR gone because they hate it. Not small amounts of people, two or three percent, but huge amounts of people.

The only evidence you've provided that people want to scrap VAR is a survey of 2100 people, where not even half of them said we should scrap it. That's why I'm not admitting I'm in a "Massive" minority lol. As a data guy, if I went to my boss and said "Look, i've polled 0.03% of he population, and less then half of them think this is a good idea - we should implement it" I'd be laughed out the room.

Who says I'm jealous of anyone's money? Why are you casting aspersions? I think it's a fucking disgrace that football clubs justify paying players upwards £200k by milking all the hard earned that they can from the working classes, because of something that is so intrinsically linked to their identity. This is not jealously - this is just something that goes against my principles.

I have agreed many times that I think the implementation of VAR is a shit-show. I however still hold the belief that it is not going anywhere, because that's the place we are in elite football, due to the above. I can honestly say it does not impact my enjoyment of watching football, because I don't get that much enjoyment out of watching football on TV anyway these days. I also believe it can add something to live games, and in m personal experience, has done so on a couple of occasions. This is my opinion, and I don't see why I should have to kowtow to you and say my opinion is wrong, because apparently the masses don't agree with it.

It's not whataboutery - What I, and others, are saying, is that VAR is the logical next step in what is now a business, because there is so much money involved. Whether you like this or not, it's not an opinion, it is fact. Clubs can't afford to lose £10m a season by dropping down a couple of places based off a shit refereeing decision. I don't think this is right, but it's the reality of the situation.

 

[Gwadien]

Nothing obvious about that at all - especially if you're using that in an argument to support VAR.

I'm not using that argument to support VAR.

Clearly.

We're talking about advertisement whilst using VAR, you're the one who's lumping together two separate arguments.

 

[Scouse]

Who says I'm jealous of anyone's money? Why are you casting aspersions? I think it's a fucking disgrace that football clubs justify paying players upwards £200k by milking all the hard earned that they can from the working classes, because of something that is so intrinsically linked to their identity.

But I should fuck a lifetime of Liverpool off for lower league football, right?

Consistency please. Not choose-an-opinion to justify your point-of-the-moment.

 

[Scouse]

Clearly.

/shrug

 

[Aoami]

But I should fuck a lifetime of Liverpool off for lower league football, right?

Consistency please. Not choose-an-opinion to justify your point-of-the-moment.

No? I said a few posts back that I am in the same boat and find it very hard to detach myself from my club despite it being against my principles.

 

[Scouse]

In that case @Aoami - why don't football fans show a bit more solidarity in the face of what significant swathes of them feel are ruinous game-changers.

We don't love the money - everyone is on pretty much the same page there.

But when it comes to VAR and half the people around you are going "we really don't like this - it's spoiling our enjoyment" instead of going "really that much? Perhaps we should be looking at other things? Fair enough m8" fans are going "fuck you - piss off to the lower leagues".

Meanwhile, the people who introduced it get another free ride.

 

[Aoami]

At the end of the day, football for the fans died the day the premier League was created. Clubs saw an opportunity to make more money, and jumped all over it, no matter what the fans thought about it. This is the reason the opinions of Lineker, Jenas et al do not matter, because the only ones that do are those 20 people who sit round a table and make the decisions. I don't like it, I don't agree with it, but I accept it cos I don't have a choice - it's not going to change because it's too lucrative, and the opinions are football fans have NEVER been valued. I attempt to vote with my wallet and do lower league as much as I can - but I am always pulled back in because Southampton as both a club and a city mean so much to me.

Anyway, enjoy your Euro Money League, I'm settling in for some proper football

 

[Scouse]

At the end of the day, football for the fans died the day the premier League was created.

Hyperbole.

Enjoyment was lessened is more accurate.

So, if enjoyment was lessened then, and you hated it - why are you so accepting of the same (I'd argue worse) happening again?

I can't believe it's spite.

Two wrongs don't make a right. VAR is just another kick in the teeth. And we don't have to accept it.

 

[Raven]

ole gunnar gone tomorrow, I reckon.

 

[Raven]

...He may have spoken too soon!

 

[Aoami]

Absolute smash and grab for the Hamlet tonight. 2-1 win, Dulwich keeper man of the match by a mile.

Can we have a moratorium on VAR chat in the thread?

 

[Ormorof]

Qatar are in euro qualification group for WC 2022 wut?

 

[Gwadien]

Qatar are in euro qualification group for WC 2022 wut?

Hosts automatically qualify iirc?

 

[Aoami]

Qatar are in euro qualification group for WC 2022 wut?

No?

 

[Aoami]

Poor Arsenal

 

[Ormorof]

Hosts automatically qualify iirc?

Im not crazy its just not as bad as i thought when i saw the groups

Qatar get guest spot in European World Cup qualifying group for friendlies

Qatar are to prepare for the first World Cup in the Arabian Gulf by taking part in a European qualifying campaign

www.theguardian.com

 

[Aoami]

" The European fixtures add to an ever-expanding roster for Qatar. They are set to take part in the Copa América next June, before heading north to play in the Concacaf Gold Cup in July. "

That's a lot of games to get absolutely dicked in.

 

[Gwadien]

Im not crazy its just not as bad as i thought when i saw the groups

Qatar get guest spot in European World Cup qualifying group for friendlies

Qatar are to prepare for the first World Cup in the Arabian Gulf by taking part in a European qualifying campaign

www.theguardian.com

They'll probably have a pro team of Indians that they abducted from their parents when they were babies.

 

[Raven]

Or they will just blackface a load of old pros.

I hear Gascoigne is up for it.

 

[Ormorof]

Is @Scouse running the guardians live feed? FC Midtjylland v Liverpool: Champions League – live!

Remember - if you ever complained at length about a referee, or a linesman, or demanded technology in the days before it arrived, you now have the game you wanted. This fiasco is on you.