Football The 2013 / 2014 Season Thread

[DaGaffer]

I'm not saying that the way teams finish in the league isn't dreadfully predictable right now because it's clearly a factual fallacy to suggest as much, however saying those leagues have 'a couple of decent clubs and the rest are rubbish' is absolutely fucking moronic. Yes, Bayern and to an extent Dortmund are miles ahead of some teams in the Bundesliga just as it is with Madrid and Barcelona, but those teams being so good is not an indicator that the rest of the teams are bad.

Since the inception of the Premier League, five different clubs have won the title. In that time, five different clubs (Barca, RM, Derportivo, Athletico, Valencia) have won La Liga and six different clubs have won the Bundesliga (Bayern, Dortmund, Wolfsburg, Werder Bremen, Stuttgart, Kaiserslautern). So if you want to say those leagues are 'broken' based on the tables, then so is the Premier League.

This debate has been had on here before. Choosing the start of the Prem is misleading because the Ferguson years are a statistical anomaly. There' a broader variety of league winners, CL (and European Cup) entrants from England than any other country. 65% of all La Ligas ever have been won by two clubs, 60% of Serie A by three clubs (in England its 60% across seven clubs) and Bayern have won more Bundesligas than any single English club has won the league (23). None of which is conclusive, but it does seem to me there's generally more of a performance drop-off in Spain and Italy than elsewhere.

However, probably the most effective measure of quality is the number of teams from each country that have gone out in the CL group stage; Spain 12, England 13, Italy 16, Germany 20...

 

[Scouse]

Germany 20

Just shows you that below Bayern (which are dodgy as fuck financially IMO considering the prez has just been banged up) the playing field is level.

TBH, if you remove Bayern from the picture then Germany is the league to watch. It's exciting when there's a level playing field. You know. Like football "used to be"

 

[ileks]

How does the relative spending power of clubs outside the top four in each league compare? That would be the decider for me.

 

[DaGaffer]

Just shows you that below Bayern (which are dodgy as fuck financially IMO considering the prez has just been banged up) the playing field is level.

TBH, if you remove Bayern from the picture then Germany is the league to watch. It's exciting when there's a level playing field. You know. Like football "used to be"

Level, but a lower level than other the other three big four countries, although if you look at the stats more closely its obvious Italy has just fallen apart in the last five years.

 

[DaGaffer]

How does the relative spending power of clubs outside the top four in each league compare? That would be the decider for me.

Really difficult to compare like with like. Its hard enough inside a league without trying to cross-compare, because there are tax and currency issues to consider as well; like the Beckham law stuff in Spain and the bonkers gross salaries paid in France. You can compare earnings (the DeLoitte ranking does that), but its actually not that meaningful.

 

[MrBic]

want an unpredictable league then watch the crappy swedish alsvenskan!

• 2000 – Halmstads BK
• 2001 – Hammarby IF
• 2002 – Djurgårdens IF
• 2003 – Djurgårdens IF
• 2004 – Malmö FF
• 2005 – Djurgårdens IF
• 2006 – IF Elfsborg
• 2007 – IFK Göteborg
• 2008 – Kalmar FF
• 2009 – AIK
• 2010 – Malmö FF
• 2011 – Helsingborgs IF
• 2012 – IF Elfsborg
• 2013 – Malmö FF

 

[Embattle]

To me it isn't solely unpredictability that matters but real competition that matters and although unscientific I usually looked at the points spread across various positions, so for example from 1-5 and so on.

 

[ileks]

Really difficult to compare like with like. Its hard enough inside a league without trying to cross-compare, because there are tax and currency issues to consider as well; like the Beckham law stuff in Spain and the bonkers gross salaries paid in France. You can compare earnings (the DeLoitte ranking does that), but its actually not that meaningful.

I'd probably just look at their post tax wage bills (in euros?) for simplicity. If they are paying their players more on average (and given the relative ease with which players can move across Europe) I think it's fair to say they are a "better" team. You could use this to compare the lesser teams in the top leagues who never meet each other in European competition.

To see how competitive a league is, I'd just compare wage bills again. Compare the average spend of the top four in each league with the average spend of the rest (or split the rest into different groups, you get the idea). Money doesn't always buy success in football but when you average it out it's probably your best metric for team quality.

 

[Embattle]

PSG for us away and Man Utd host Bayern.

 

[Raven]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26677907

Just deal with it, you acted like a massive penis (again) and have been sanctioned for it. Move on.

 

[Embattle]

He really seems to get under your skin

 

[Scouse]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/26677907

Just deal with it, you acted like a massive penis (again) and have been sanctioned for it. Move on.

He's keeping the media spotlight on him, rather than on the fact that Chelski lost...

 

[caLLous]

United vs. Bayern should be... interesting. And Chelsea vs. PSG interesting but in a different way (not so one-sided perhaps).

 

[Embattle]

I think all the games are going to be interesting.

 

[Raven]

He really seems to get under your skin

I actually quite like him. His petulant child side is a bit amusing sometimes. Its fun when he gets slapped down and cries about it.

 

[soze]

I still think he acts like someone who is parodying him now though. It is like he is taking his act too far because no one cares anymore.

 

[Raven]

So, battle of the tiny tantrums tomorrow. Put money on Arsenal 2.1

1000th game in charge for the creepy one.

 

[Vladamir]

Luiz, Matic, Schurrle, Oscar, Hazard - some energy in midfield there.

 

[Raven]

Heard a great quip about Sherwood on the radio in the car, "He looks more like a farmer who would shout at you to shut a gate than a manager in that gilet"

 

[Embattle]

So, battle of the tiny tantrums tomorrow. Put money on Arsenal 2.1

1000th game in charge for the creepy one.

You lost it within 7 minutes

Ouchy

 

[Billargh]

Chelsea man, wtf...

 

[caLLous]

Arsenlol.

Two exceptional breaks from Chelsea though, it has to be said.

 

[Shagrat]

Oh dear arsenal.

 

[Billargh]

My poor poor clean sheet bonus

 

[Ch3tan]

Hit hard on the counter. They have time to come back though.

 

[Raven]

You lost it within 7 minutes

Ouchy

Yeah, the £1 loss really hurts against the £700 I have won this season.

 

[Lethul]

Bah! Come on arsenal!

 

[Himse]

CAN YOU HEAR THE ARSENAL SING?

 

[Shagrat]

Oh dear oh dear.

 

[Billargh]

Mourinho trying to beat his best home win? What a catastrophe for Arsenal.

Ahahaha Gibbs sent off instead of The Ox, my word.