Football The 2009/2010 Season Thread

[Ch3tan]

Ageing squad + 2 years of no signings, ouch!

I kind of agree though, I think this practise is common place in football and proving it is hard. You do need the same laws for all. I do not think the full ban will stand after appeal. I think they may simply be banned for this season. Then again FIFA may want to send a strong message to all the other big clubs and stick to their guns.

 

[cHodAX]

How is this worse than teams like real madrid telling the world they would get ronaldo and make him richest player in world and already had shirts with his name on ready last season. Thats just a craftyier way of convincing a player to break contract and leave

Ronaldo didn't break contract, thats the difference.

 

[cHodAX]

Doesnt seem as bad as the West ham/tevez thing or when Manutd illegally "signed" Mikel. Anyway not bothered about that.

Not really worried about this either. Our squad is massive and strong as it is and this will give our youth (who are actually promising for a change) a chance if need be. And then there's the fact that Roma appealed the same decision and won (took 2 appeals) and i expect the same to happen here, reducing it to a single window.

Eh? We agreed a deal with Lyn Oslo which was 100% legal, it was your lot that broke the fucking law which is why you bought United off with £12 million so we didn't persue the matter with FIFA.

 

[cHodAX]

That's a big difference though.

Manchester United should be in the same trouble regarding the signing of a player Pogba though, he was under contract in France (same laws) but him and his parents broke that contract because Utd offered him a load of money.

Again WRONG. Pogba broke NO contract with Le Harve, he was not under contract. United incentivised his parent's, that is something completely different and isn't not against FIFA rules.

 

[megadave]

100% legal? Er, no. You can't take a kid and offer him a contract on the spot, completely bypassing his agent and tell him to agree to it now or not at all. That is illegal.

Pogba had an agreement in place with his club that he'd stay with them until 09/10. ManUtd offered him a load of money and he decided to fuck his old club and accepted.

Or is what your saying, poaching is allowed but only under certain circumstances?

 

[Calaen]

Does that mean you retract your comment about Mikel? 12mill for a player that you have never even had a chance to play is a bargain in my books

 

[cHodAX]

100% legal? Er, no. You can't take a kid and offer him a contract on the spot, completely bypassing his agent and tell him to agree to it now or not at all. That is illegal.

Pogba had an agreement in place with his club that he'd stay with them until 09/10. ManUtd offered him a load of money and he decided to fuck his old club and accepted.

Or is what your saying, poaching is allowed but only under certain circumstances?

Nope, there was no contract. He was under the minimum age to sign a profressional contract in France, as such he was a free agent. You need to stop reading tabloids and look into the details, United were able to obtain his services by paying Le Harve a nominal fee to cover their costs in training him. He was not under a professional contract, hence United broke no UEFA or FIFA rules. You might not like it, hell even I think it is wrong that it can be allowed to happen but United did not encourage Pogba to break any contract.

Chelsea have been proven to have encouraged Gael Kakuta to break a professional contract and that is why the DRC have have ruled so heavily against them, if contract breaking is condoned is sets a predicdent that can be then repeated and challenged in court at a future date. FIFA have done a good job, I feel sorry for Chelsea but it was a stupid thing to do and they were never going to get away with it.

 

[cHodAX]

Oh and please note, Le Harve have complained to UEFA but no charges have been filed as no rules were broken. United exploited weaknesses in the system but they did not break the ruled. It is morally wrong but legally sound, that is why we haven't been punished as Chelsea have.

 

[cHodAX]

Pogba had an agreement in place with his club that he'd stay with them until 09/10.

An agreement? As in a legally binding contract? Nope, didn't happen bud. A verbal agreement is generally not legally enforceable as such unless there are extenuating circumstances and/or corroborating witnesses.

 

[Wonk]

Ailton is god.

 

[megadave]

Chelsea have been proven to have encouraged Gael Kakuta to break a professional contract and that is why the DRC have have ruled so heavily against them, if contract breaking is condoned is sets a predicdent that can be then repeated and challenged in court at a future date. FIFA have done a good job, I feel sorry for Chelsea but it was a stupid thing to do and they were never going to get away with it.

We haven't actually been proven guilty since there is no actual evidence.

"It shall be presumed, unless established to the contrary, that any club signing a professional who has terminated his contract without just cause has induced that professional to commit a breach."

They have just presumed (probably true) that we induced him. In a real court of law they wouldnt have a leg to stand on. But this is FIFA and apparently we are guilty until proven innocent.

 

[Marc]

They have just presumed (probably true) that we induced him. In a real court of law they wouldnt have a leg to stand on. But this is FIFA and apparently we are guilty until proven innocent.

I wonder what would have been the outcome if Platini's lovechild, Real madrid had done it.

 

[cHodAX]

We haven't actually been proven guilty since there is no actual evidence.

"It shall be presumed, unless established to the contrary, that any club signing a professional who has terminated his contract without just cause has induced that professional to commit a breach."

They have just presumed (probably true) that we induced him. In a real court of law they wouldnt have a leg to stand on. But this is FIFA and apparently we are guilty until proven innocent.

Where is that quote from and how was it used in relation to this case? As I understand it the from the FIFA press release...

The DRC found that the player had indeed breached a contract signed with the French club. Equally, the DRC deemed it to be established that the English club induced the player to such a breach.

http://www.fifa.com/aboutfifa/feder...kuta+the+dispute+resolution+chambers+decision

Sounds awfully like casen proven to me. Note words 'deemed it to be established', that is pretty clear.

 

[Vladamir]

I wonder what would have been the outcome if Platini's lovechild, Real madrid had done it.

It would've been brushed under the carpet just like Tom Ovrebo's diabolical officiating.

 

[Aoami]

BBC SPORT | Football | Premier League | I'm an honest player, says Rooney

lolm8s

 

[Everz]

 

[megadave]

Where is that quote from and how was it used in relation to this case? As I understand it the from the FIFA press release...



FIFA.com - Kakuta: DRC decision reached

Sounds awfully like casen proven to me. Note words 'deemed it to be established', that is pretty clear.

FIFA rules.

Also note words "deemed it to be established" doesn't mean it's proven, rather just guessed. How can you actually ever prove a player has been induced? There is no hard evidence.

 

[Wonk]

Lol

 

[cHodAX]

BBC SPORT | Football | Premier League | I'm an honest player, says Rooney

lolm8s

Yeah I don't see many honest players anywhere these days to be honest, it is pretty fucking sad. Modern football is pretty much running along the lines of the famous Gordon Gecko line 'Greed is good'. I hate to think where the game will be in 20 years time.

 

[Wonk]

well, give us Rooney then - you guys can have Hjalte. We need some badass who can break a leg or 14 and dive all over the pitch. Our squad is too honest

 

[Aoami]

It's not the diving that bothers me that much, it's more the fact that players have the cheek to come out to face the public and lie through their teeth. Claim to be a 'honest player' when cameras have shown you've dive... you're lieing. Twice.

This is why I have a lot of respect for Drogba, he cheats, but at least he has the balls to admit it. I remember him diving once and being interviewed after he said 'yeah i dived, but everyone does it, so why shouldn't i?'. It's not right, but you can understand that point of view.

 

[leviathane]

BBC SPORT | Football | Premier League | I'm an honest player, says Rooney

lolm8s

nothing will come off this due to him playing for manu.

 

[cHodAX]

FIFA rules.

Also note words "deemed it to be established" doesn't mean it's proven, rather just guessed. How can you actually ever prove a player has been induced? There is no hard evidence.

It is all symantics bud, they are convinced Chelsea did it and so as the governing body they have acted. You might think they are innocent and you could be right but it doesn't change the the fact that they have been found guilty and punished.

 

[megadave]

Tbh i dont think we're innocent, loads of bigger clubs do this every summer and we're clearly no exception (Ashley Cole, anyone?)

I just think a two year transfer ban is a bit heavy, and i find it very curious that they waiting until just after the transfer window closes and we've submitted our player registration. Also this took place two years ago, why did it take so long? And how can they justify fining someone 750k for something they did as a 16 year old.

And my point before was that having a law allowing people to be guilty before being proven innocent is basically a load of shit.

 

[cHodAX]

Tbh i dont think we're innocent, loads of bigger clubs do this every summer and we're clearly no exception (Ashley Cole, anyone?)

I just think a two year transfer ban is a bit heavy, and i find it very curious that they waiting until just after the transfer window closes and we've submitted our player registration. Also this took place two years ago, why did it take so long? And how can they justify fining someone 750k for something they did as a 16 year old.

And my point before was that having a law allowing people to be guilty before being proven innocent is basically a load of shit.

Cole did not break contract though, that is what makes it different. He talked himself a move but he didn't break contract at any point. If people could just walk out on contracts when they pleased the business of football would be dead within 10 years.

 

[Lethul]

Yeah I don't see many honest players anywhere these days to be honest, it is pretty fucking sad. Modern football is pretty much running along the lines of the famous Gordon Gecko line 'Greed is good'. I hate to think where the game will be in 20 years time.

Gattusso!

 

[cHodAX]

Update...

Chelsea to appeal FIFA transfer ban to 2011 - Barclays Premier League - ESPN Soccernet

 

[Ch3tan]

Anyone see Dunne's first Villa press conference? Quality humour.

 

[Ch3tan]

This was posted in response to a blog on the beeb about the ruling:

In what way is this judgement landmark? Has Phil not heard of the almost identical judgements against FC Sion of Switzerland (April 2009), or against Roma (2005)?

For info, Roma appealed the judgement to the CAS and the two transfer window ban was reduced to one transfer window. I'd be surprised if Chelsea don't secure a similar outcome at the very least.

 

[Vladamir]

Chelsea appeal over Fifa transfer ban likely to be 'fast-tracked' | Chelsea - Times Online

Another bit of reading here