Thanes....

[Haroc]

If you havnt read the Thanes tl report and seen the paladin movie do so, this movie is the proff we all been waiting for, i mean paladins are wanted in groups have good dmg output and a godlike defense. thanes have low dmg output, poor defense and no group abilitys, so if you have a single doubt that mythic does not favor albion then you are just plain simple naive.
lets just hope, as we allways have when thane tl report to mythic, that they will make the game balanced and fun to play for all those thanes out there.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Ever since they gave paladins all those new wonderful chants (since SI), they've become the ultimate tank. 2 buffed Paladins can take down level 70+ creatures, it's sick, and yes, if you had to compare thanes on an even keel as paladins, then sure, thanes are supposedly "weaker".

However, Thanes do have AE and ranged attacks, granted, hugh resists make those crap...and AE is simply a mezz breaker that everyone hates.

Perhaps Thanes do need a little touch up.

-G

 

[Mills]

Originally posted by Haroc
i mean paladins are wanted in groups have good dmg output

ROFL .. Have you ever played a Paladin? Good defensive tanks we may be with the right spec yes.... but damage output.... lmao.... no no no youve got your wires crossed there...

Soloing level 70 mobs we may be able to yes... buffed tho.. 2 unbuffed Palas wont be able to do it unless there both rr7+ with 2 instas each .... and err lets not forget 2 buffed warriors can do exactly the same thing... and 2 rr7+ warriors can do exactly the same thing...

Yes this thread is about thanes and i do agree they need a little tweak.. only a little tho... Less resist chance on their spells maybe.... but i just thoght id set you straight about paladins, the right spec and your on to a winner just like warriors.... but we dont have the damage output and defensive capabilities combined like a warrior does ....

Anyway back to the original thing....Thanes compared to Paladins are crap yes... but im just stating that paladins dont have the best damage output if they are defensive spec.. which most are because its the paladins best role... A high rr paladin with a mixed spec is awesome because of the realm rank and abilities... like araudry *bows down* :lol:

But yes agreed Thanes maybe could use a little tweak, but Paladins dont do the damage you think they do

 

[Ardrias_Mid]

Warrior is a pure tank tho, while Paladin is a hybrid.

 

[Brannor McThife]

Re: Re: Thanes....

Originally posted by Mills
and 2 rr7+ warriors can do exactly the same thing...

This is where I am sorry...I just have to say it...you're talking utter crap.

Warriors cannot heal themselves with a lovely "double tick" heal chant. They don't have a damage add chant...they most certainly cannot regen their own endurance.

Sure, a warrior will most likely outdamage a paladin quite a bit, but the paladin can quite easily beat a warrior by just going passive and waiting for the warrior to run out of endurance.

-G

 

[Serbitar]

Re: Re: Re: Thanes....

Originally posted by Brannor McThife
Sure, a warrior will most likely outdamage a paladin quite a bit, but the paladin can quite easily beat a warrior by just going passive and waiting for the warrior to run out of endurance.

-G

Engage + End/heal Chant 4tehwin !

 

[painman]

Re: Re: Re: Thanes....

Originally posted by Brannor McThife
This is where I am sorry...I just have to say it...you're talking utter crap.

Warriors cannot heal themselves with a lovely "double tick" heal chant. They don't have a damage add chant...they most certainly cannot regen their own endurance.

Sure, a warrior will most likely outdamage a paladin quite a bit, but the paladin can quite easily beat a warrior by just going passive and waiting for the warrior to run out of endurance.

-G

paladins regen abilitys is very uber, but if im not mistaking-->warriors are more powerfull at defending and attacking?!, but i dont think that "little more power" they have make up for insta heals and regens !
but back to subject: thanes could use some love (in a none mezz brakeing kinda way)

 

[krill-nyd]

Thane's low wskill and hitpoints combined with little group-friendly abilities (and some serious anti-group abilities if you're messing enemies) seems to me the thane's weakness. A clear advantage of Pala's is they can solo, small group, full group and zerg. Thanes are (I find) perfectly good solo against all classes (roughly equal rr and roughly equal buffs assumed of course) and are fine in small groups, of course we also have reasonable zerging abilities but maybe class abilities don't matter so much in huge fights. It's fg or 2fg that it's hard for those who seek optimum abilities only to see a use for thanes in. And given that this kind of thinking discards about half or more of Midgard's classes it's not just a thane problem.

Answer for thanes and fgs is I think is ae-groups. There should be some advantage somewhere in being able to melee (shield and 2-handed) and cast ae, in theory you can switch between ranged and close attack depending on who you're fighting. But even here a little help is needed and some is coming in 1.65 with lower pow consumption and increased ae damage. Against all this is the casting time of Mjollner 4 seconds, making it easy to interrupt.

Paladins are great hybrids (and I agree on the damage output, having fought some solo) and reavers look pretty good on paper too, champions, friars all pretty good. Seems clear to me if you compare directly to other hybrids (maybe other than skalds) Thanes need a boost and probably more than is coming in 1.65, but this has been known for a while and I doubt much more is coming. And class balance seems to me to have gotten so complex it's not altogether easy for Mythic to do something for Thanes without messing up another class (e.g. lots of people wanted thanes to have an end regen chant, but what would that do to shaman groupability?).

Damn I posted on Barrysworld, bound to be a mistake.

 

[Addlcove]

Originally posted by krill-nyd
(e.g. lots of people wanted thanes to have an end regen chant, but what would that do to shaman groupability?).

well according to shaman´s they hate their conc using end regen, so move that to thanes, shamans are still pretty useful without endregen (except maybe as buffbots which is just another +)

 

[scarffs]

Re: Re: Thanes....

Originally posted by Mills
ROFL .. Have you ever played a Paladin? Good defensive tanks we may be with the right spec yes.... but damage output.... lmao.... no no no youve got your wires crossed there...

Soloing level 70 mobs we may be able to yes... buffed tho.. 2 unbuffed Palas wont be able to do it unless there both rr7+ with 2 instas each .... and err lets not forget 2 buffed warriors can do exactly the same thing... and 2 rr7+ warriors can do exactly the same thing...

Yes this thread is about thanes and i do agree they need a little tweak.. only a little tho... Less resist chance on their spells maybe.... but i just thoght id set you straight about paladins, the right spec and your on to a winner just like warriors.... but we dont have the damage output and defensive capabilities combined like a warrior does ....

Anyway back to the original thing....Thanes compared to Paladins are crap yes... but im just stating that paladins dont have the best damage output if they are defensive spec.. which most are because its the paladins best role... A high rr paladin with a mixed spec is awesome because of the realm rank and abilities... like araudry *bows down* :lol:

But yes agreed Thanes maybe could use a little tweak, but Paladins dont do the damage you think they do

Two warriors cant take on what two paladins can ( pve ).
No big offense, correct, but a godlike defense.

 

[painman]

Originally posted by Addlcove
well according to shaman´s they hate their conc using end regen, so move that to thanes, shamans are still pretty useful without endregen (except maybe as buffbots which is just another +)

lol cant take end regen from shammys to put on thanes??

 

[old.Hardbein]

The need for a secondary form of CC and Disease is still there.

Fix the mending line for shamans
Give thanes end chant

Voila.....problem solved, and 2 classes fixed

 

[Addlcove]

Originally posted by painman
lol cant take end regen from shammys to put on thanes??

why not?

would make thanes wanted and shamans would stopcrying about having to use conc for end regen

 

[Brannor McThife]

Re: Re: Thanes....

Originally posted by Mills
ROFL .. Have you ever played a Paladin?

Missed this one...

But, yes, I believe I have. I played on in Beta, and I used one as my primary test character during the month long SI testing I did with GOA. I gained almost 2 dots of XP at level 50, and got the chance to comprehensively test ALL the RA's... some of you may remember some people (SotL) getting peeved and mocking the RR10L9 Dragon Knight siggy of mine.

-G

 

[Fafnir]

Thanes need evade aswell, ffs the Thane in DG has it.

 

[krill-nyd]

Originally posted by old.Hardbein
The need for a secondary form of CC and Disease is still there.

Fix the mending line for shamans
Give thanes end chant

Voila.....problem solved, and 2 classes fixed

This might work, I was just gesturing to the possibility shaman would be turned nearly totally into buffbots by allowing Thanes an end chant.

Not having evade is just silly, still it won't affect us much so I can't see it's worth worrying about.

 

[painman]

Originally posted by Addlcove
why not?

would make thanes wanted and shamans would stopcrying about having to use conc for end regen

the only reason they cry is becouse they dident use to cost conc!

 

[old.Hardbein]

Originally posted by krill-nyd
This might work, I was just gesturing to the possibility shaman would be turned nearly totally into buffbots by allowing Thanes an end chant.

Not having evade is just silly, still it won't affect us much so I can't see it's worth worrying about.

If they fixed Shaman-mending-line, then u wouldnt see mid grps with: 3x healers and a shaman, it would be: 2xhealer, Shaman and thane + dmg dealers.

With the current resists/imunity timers - in the game, the need for a secondary CC form is absolutely there. Shamans wont become BB's if they loose END-buff. They will become the secondary healing/CC class in mid.

 

[Addlcove]

Originally posted by painman
the only reason they cry is becouse they dident use to cost conc!

yes well you still haven´t told me why it wouldn´t work.

Shamans as I see them has plenty to offer a group even without end regen, putting that on thanes would on the other hand improve thanes greatly without making them overpowered,
making it a chant like pallies that costs power would prevent that

 

[old.Hardbein]

Originally posted by Addlcove
making it a chant like pallies that costs power would prevent that

omg, I was just thinking...what stats that needs caping on a thane if he got this chant.

+11 Weapon
+11 Stormcalling (dunno if this will help tho)
+11 Sheild
+75 Str
+75 Con
+75 Dex
+75 Qui
+75 Pie
+200 hits
+26 pow
+26x9 resists

Thats pretty much impossible i think

 

[old.Jeriraa]

Errr, whoever started comparing Paladins to Warriors forgot one thing:

Warrior = Primary Tank
Paladin = Hybrid

If you want to compare a Warrior with an Albion class then compare him with an Armsman!

If you want to compare a Paladin with a Midgard class then compare him with a Thane.

Everything else is just bullshitting.

 

[painman]

Originally posted by Addlcove
yes well you still haven´t told me why it wouldn´t work.

Shamans as I see them has plenty to offer a group even without end regen, putting that on thanes would on the other hand improve thanes greatly without making them overpowered,
making it a chant like pallies that costs power would prevent that

well i dident say it couldent be done! and it probally would work to.

1st. u cant take regend away from the shaman 2 years after release date becouse of the thane.
2nd its the thane thats need power, not the shaman that needs nerfing! and if u asked me, taking away end from a shaman is serious nerfing.

 

[Ardrias_Mid]

Just let all thanes get a /respec savage, and similar equipment to what they had when they were thanes.

 

[old.Bubble]

Paladins don't have a godlike defence, RR7 Uberbuffed paladin will block loads yes.

I've lost to Armsmen in a duel but not paladins, i need to always use a Medium+ to hit style to even hit a Armsman.(Friars off Evade is a low to hit...)

 

[old.Bubble]

oh back on topic

Yes thanes need help
My suggestion would be-

More potent spells in Stormcalling Lines
Insta 100% End heal on a 15 minute timer
Thane RA made cheaper and better(not effected by resists?)
Elemental Resist chants that a paladin has?(Like 24% Heat/cold/matter and 24% energy/spirt/body)

 

[Fafnir]

Originally posted by painman
1st. u cant take regend away from the shaman 2 years after release date becouse of the thane.
2nd its the thane thats need power, not the shaman that needs nerfing! and if u asked me, taking away end from a shaman is serious nerfing.

Thought shamans got end regen with a patch not around SI release or something, then mytchic thought it was to powerfull so they nerfed mid again

 

[frogster]

I killed a thane once!
Post Smite Nerf.

Thats all the evidence Mythic needs to tweak the poor liddul bleeders :<

 

[ironhand]

Originally posted by old.Hardbein
omg, I was just thinking...what stats that needs caping on a thane if he got this chant.

+11 Weapon
+11 Stormcalling (dunno if this will help tho)
+11 Sheild
+75 Str
+75 Con
+75 Dex
+75 Qui
+75 Pie
+200 hits
+26 pow
+26x9 resists

Thats pretty much impossible i think

Swap Stormcalling for Parry and same as what a Paladin has to cap really, although the extra peity and power just give you more power overall.

FYI its not imposible either, on a 99% set u can cap all of that w/o peity + power and thats w/o any stat/resist gems over 19 & 9% respectively. so with an extra 4.5 imbue per item im sure its easily achievable.

 

[ironhand]

Dont forget all you Thanes out there Armsmen have had it crap since erm forever really, yes i know they are pure tanks but tbh compaired to what a paladin can do cheap RA's count for FA imo.

If u want Dmg roll a merc, if u want good PvE Roll a pally, Armsman is the somewhere inbetween slightly good at PvE and ok at RvR but nothing special like the other 2.

 

[Petronella]

Good Thread.
As Fafnir said, Evade I should be in our possesion but for some reason it isnt
Stormcalling needs something added in order to make us more groupfriendly, but I have a hard time seeing Thane having Endurance-regeneration. Maybe another type of buff or even debuff