TBH Prydwen wizards = lol

[Ilum]

WTF if u played a wizz u would think different. im a fire wizz i can kill a caster from a range of 2000 away in 1 hit, maybe 2. and im not very high RR. There could be some improvements made to wizzes but really wizz are just the same as scout. as in no hunter pet or duel weild (no stun or pet) but they can do a hell of alot of dmg some times. think the most dmg i ever did was a yellow con mob in toa at low RR3 i did 2300 dmg +.
most the time in rvr grp V grp ( i never get fotm grp. would if i could ) the mids will own my grp cause they are fotm. but before my grp gets wiped i can always get at least one kill. while all these tanks are doing shit dmg and running into pbaoes and mezzes etc, also i rarely get heals in a grp, even with 2 clerics. (sometimes theres exceptions) <looks around the room see's Xyliana and hugs> But thats most probley cause i have 800 hits without capped con or HP (still a n00b in epic).
in otherwords dont judge a book by its cover wizz can be uber and can be crap. just like all other classes. weak points and strong

I have played a Wizard. I have done lots of RvR groups with wizards. I used to make them, put a lot time into them, and they did "ok" eventually. Erodafira used to join my groups, until I stopped doing them. Then he started making wizard groups himself. Safe to say Wizard is one of DaoC's most gimped classes - PBAE is a great spell, so Icewizards are decent, thanks to that. However, they lack debuffing their nukes, intercepting pets, stat debuffs - stuff that help the Enchanter and Spiritmaster to become highly successful PBAE'rs. DD's and Roots is basically what a Wizard have.

 

[old.windforce]

WTF if u played a wizz u would think different. im a fire wizz i can kill a caster from a range of 2000 away in 1 hit, maybe 2. and im not very high RR. There could be some improvements made to wizzes but really wizz are just the same as scout. as in no hunter pet or duel weild (no stun or pet) but they can do a hell of alot of dmg some times. think the most dmg i ever did was a yellow con mob in toa at low RR3 i did 2300 dmg +.
most the time in rvr grp V grp ( i never get fotm grp. would if i could ) the mids will own my grp cause they are fotm. but before my grp gets wiped i can always get at least one kill. while all these tanks are doing shit dmg and running into pbaoes and mezzes etc, also i rarely get heals in a grp, even with 2 clerics. (sometimes theres exceptions) <looks around the room see's Xyliana and hugs> But thats most probley cause i have 800 hits without capped con or HP (still a n00b in epic).
in otherwords dont judge a book by its cover wizz can be uber and can be crap. just like all other classes. weak points and strong

play any class you like but wizzards are worst caster in any realm together with mentalist

only good thing they have (compared to other realms) is a semi decent RA

 

[Eroda]

As has been mentioned before, wizards are a reasonable class though do lack something when compared to the pbaoe classes of the other realms. The lack of any utility can be extremely irritating at times and wizards basically have a totally redundant 2nd line (some cases where aoe root is useful for interupts).

The main problem relates to the setup though. In comparison to hib\mid groups, an alb caster setup is just so damn fragile (3-5 casters) and so its often quite easy to just interupt the whole lot or kill the entire group in seconds if things go wrong.

Reason i stopped playing my wiz was cos i felt there wasn't much more that could be done with the set-up without getting all strict about it and running set groups. Might bring it out again at some point but i cant see anyway it could beat a high rr hib group, especially with toa items and ML's.

 

[Azurat]

Problem with alb caster group, is that they are so mezz fragile compared to hib pbaoe, which can just press gp atm. Mids don´t got gp, but at least sms can CM so have like 4-5 chars in the group that can cm so goes fast to unmezz. Although main reason mid pbaoe group is that aoe stunn still is ok, not as overpowered as it used to be, but works against noobs.

 

[Ilum]

If I went back to doing Icewiz groups (which I'm not) I would use this set-up:

Wizard (ice)
Wizard (ice)
Theurgist (ice)
Paladin
Cleric
Cleric
Minstrel
Sorcerer (44/31)

And I think it could do "ok". You need a theurgist to put pets on healers, druids, shamans etc so they wont interrupt you to fuck. Theurgist will do just as good job as wizards in assist DD'ing. With good ToA templates with high "resist pierce" (15-20%)the group might be able to perform "ok" in FG v FG RvR and such.

 

[Sycho]

Pfft ilum do not be so negative towards something which can be proven wrong in the right hands!xD

Magmatic who posted above is a good wizard i met on excal, his group was the best i faced from albion there, all rr6-rr8 casters they was when i fought them, albion ice wiz pbaoe group isn't that bad, i made 45k in 7-8 hours last time i played my wiz with phreakz/eroiv(marracus).

Good teamplay is needed A LOT to do very well in them, but with the ML's here now you can't underate them so much even though sm/chanters are better...afterall people prefer a challenge with fun and that's what the group offers.I do not care if chanter/sms are better...doesn't stop me from enjoying mine xD , then again i wonder what an ice wiz with 25% more debuff effectiveness would be like with ToA sc and doesn't wild arcana also effect the aoe debuff?Oo

 

[[NO]Subedai]

If I went back to doing Icewiz groups (which I'm not) I would use this set-up:

Wizard (ice)
Wizard (ice)
Theurgist (ice)
Paladin
Cleric
Cleric
Minstrel
Sorcerer (44/31)

And I think it could do "ok". You need a theurgist to put pets on healers, druids, shamans etc so they wont interrupt you to fuck. Theurgist will do just as good job as wizards in assist DD'ing. With good ToA templates with high "resist pierce" (15-20%)the group might be able to perform "ok" in FG v FG RvR and such.


we run pretty much that setup in our fixed grp (the magmatic grp as sycho puts it ),although sorc is body spec and we use arms instead of pally (det is good and the other stuff the pally brings to grp doesnt make up for this tbh)

ye chanters and sm's have more utility, but its just summin u gotta live with, but ice can sucseed with good teamplay as psyhoc said. we been running with pretty much same players for over 6months now in a fixed grp and the teamplay asepct certainly pays off.

 

[Konah]

rah, my alt made the list!

ice wiz is alot of fun, fg v fg if u land first mezz u can do just fine and 'mana bombing' works surprisingly often with 2-3 ice wiz. u need the element of surprise more than hib/mids do tho cos if they see it coming u can guarantee an insta-fest...

vs hi-rr hib/mid teams life is alot harder, should improve after frontiers when we get GP too tho

that 'worthless' 10% (~15% effective) debuff nuke is actually a rather nice opener for the spec snare or baseline nukes, meaning i always hit for 300+ with dd compared to ~250 with fire, despite fire dd's higher delve. just miss the fire spec bolt

 

[Linnet]

vs hi-rr hib/mid teams life is alot harder, should improve after frontiers when we get GP too tho

That's not currently planned to happen. Hibs/Mids will get SoS/BoF though.

 

[[NO]Magmatic]

Wizards as a class perhaps suffer in utility a bit, I can give you that... But as group, an Albion PBAoE group can do nearly just as well as the hib/mid counterpart... All have their advantages, mids have AE-stun, hibs have GP, albs have Theurgists...

Theurgists are so damned important in the group, they basicly make you lose or win... If the theurgist cant pet because he's interrupted, no one in the group can... If the theurgist starts to assist nuke... Then the other group has lost
But yes, albion needs a good group to pull this off... A good sorc is very important, and a good theurgist is very important... Oh, and good computers are important! (Subedai stop ld'ing when we meet +2fg ! )

 

[[NO]Magmatic]

That's not currently planned to happen. Hibs/Mids will get SoS/BoF though.

And SoS & BoF help against a PBAoE group, how?

Never understood how SoS helps an alb PBAoE group, what good is it? I can run around faster? Need to stand still to nuke....

 

[Kahland]

Hi m8is, icewiz grp is rly possible vs. mid grps, but hibs grp r vry hard.

 

[Ilum]

Also, too many ice wizards want to 'pbaoe bomb' their enemies, what are you thinking? That you can pbaoe bomb rr7+ mids that have 50-60% cold resist? Or hibs with 45% ? If your gonna do that, be prepared to die (it works nicely on low-rr hibs/mids though)

Tell that to Sycho xD

 

[[NO]Magmatic]

Hi m8is, icewiz grp is rly possible vs. mid grps, but hibs grp r vry hard.

We beat hib groups just fine too, why would a hib group be harder then a mid group?

 

[Corran]

We beat hib groups just fine too, why would a hib group be harder then a mid group?

on pryd hibs run with 2 GP's. Due to the nature of our server they always have at least 1 up and therefore it hard to get the upper hand when they are mezz immune and you aint.

 

[[NO]Subedai]

Wizards as a class perhaps suffer in utility a bit, I can give you that... But as group, an Albion PBAoE group can do nearly just as well as the hib/mid counterpart... All have their advantages, mids have AE-stun, hibs have GP, albs have Theurgists...

Theurgists are so damned important in the group, they basicly make you lose or win... If the theurgist cant pet because he's interrupted, no one in the group can... If the theurgist starts to assist nuke... Then the other group has lost
But yes, albion needs a good group to pull this off... A good sorc is very important, and a good theurgist is very important... Oh, and good computers are important! (Subedai stop ld'ing when we meet +2fg ! )

its timed lag dammit!

 

[Equendil]

It's all about group setups, and at that game, hibs are way ahead.

Compare

Bard
Druid
Druid
Warden
Hero
Enchanter
Enchanter
Eldritch

With

Minstrel
Cleric
Cleric
Sorc
Wiz
Wiz
Wiz
Theurgist

Hibs get : Speed 5, AE mez, insta AE mez, insta amnesia, all resist buffs, 2x Group Purge, Thornweed Field, PBT, 2 druid pets, 2 enchanter pets, AE disease, AE str/con debuff, 2x spread heals, backup healing, debuff nuking, a shield tank for slam etc, 1x demez, confusion, castable stun on the casters, 3x PBAE.

Albs are lacking insta AE mez, insta amnesia, fire/matter/cold resists, GP, TWF, PBT, 3 pets, AE disease, backup healing, debuff nuking, a shield tank, and they have root instead of stun on casters, they are also more fragile overall due to having more cloth casters. Albs however have 2x BOF, SOS, and ablative song, all of pretty limited use when it comes to alb casters vs hib casters, they have bolt range mez, one more demez, fire & forget pets, spammable amnesia, minstrel stun, and more casters that can nuke (altho much weaker nuking).

Basically, albs lose the CC war against hibs no matter what, can't beat GP and the instas, and that alone is pretty bad when running a caster group. The interrupt war can go either way if the theurgist is playing good, but then, with all the stuns, ranged pets, TWF and insta amnesia, hibs are likely to have the upper hand there as well. Then there's nuking, albs don't have debuffs for their nukes, and they have to deal with 40-50% resists, can't kill ennemy casters before they are healed without assisting properly, unlike enchanters.

Yeah, you'd better have a fecking good theurgist against hibs ...

The saving grace for such an albion group would be Volcanic Pillar, another 14 points for the RA though, so RR6+ wizzies for MoC/MCL/VP/Purge.

Other group setups are possible, but basically it boils down to albion lacking slots to match the abilities of ennemy group setups, and GP making things pretty easy for hibs.

 

[Fedaykin]

It's all about group setups, and at that game, hibs are way ahead.

Compare

Bard
Druid
Druid
Warden
Hero
Enchanter
Enchanter
Eldritch

With

Minstrel
Cleric
Cleric
Sorc
Wiz
Wiz
Wiz
Theurgist

Hibs get : Speed 5, AE mez, insta AE mez, insta amnesia, all resist buffs, 2x Group Purge, Thornweed Field, PBT, 2 druid pets, 2 enchanter pets, AE disease, AE str/con debuff, 2x spread heals, backup healing, debuff nuking, a shield tank for slam etc, 1x demez, confusion, castable stun on the casters, 3x PBAE.

Albs are lacking insta AE mez, insta amnesia, fire/matter/cold resists, GP, TWF, PBT, 3 pets, AE disease, backup healing, debuff nuking, a shield tank, and they have root instead of stun on casters, they are also more fragile overall due to having more cloth casters. Albs however have 2x BOF, SOS, and ablative song, all of pretty limited use when it comes to alb casters vs hib casters, they have bolt range mez, one more demez, fire & forget pets, spammable amnesia, minstrel stun, and more casters that can nuke (altho much weaker nuking).

Basically, albs lose the CC war against hibs no matter what, can't beat GP and the instas, and that alone is pretty bad when running a caster group. The interrupt war can go either way if the theurgist is playing good, but then, with all the stuns, ranged pets, TWF and insta amnesia, hibs are likely to have the upper hand there as well. Then there's nuking, albs don't have debuffs for their nukes, and they have to deal with 40-50% resists, can't kill ennemy casters before they are healed without assisting properly, unlike enchanters.

Yeah, you'd better have a fecking good theurgist against hibs ...

The saving grace for such an albion group would be Volcanic Pillar, another 14 points for the RA though, so RR6+ wizzies for MoC/MCL/VP/Purge.

Other group setups are possible, but basically it boils down to albion lacking slots to match the abilities of ennemy group setups, and GP making things pretty easy for hibs.

Not really

I much prefer fighting hibs to Mids - because i can interrupt chanters however i can't interrupt savages.

I am a body sorcerer and have a lot of tools at my disposal - i only use the level 24 AOE mezz which makes druids very reluctant to group purge - however we land first mezz most of time

The problem will be against Dem Hibbies when they return however so far most hib pbaoe groups havnt really presented much challenge.

I can still use my root after a group purge as well as my red dex/qui aoe debuff and my aoe amnesia -

If we land mezz our wizards usually run in for the pbaoe asap - by this time both druids and probably bard will be petting by our Theurgist as well as my lovely green con pet

I have my 50% ice debuff which can help against BAOD - however even with baod up we can still interrupt hibs, and if needed both wizzies can MoC or i can MoC lifetap and theurgist can MoC pet spam

A good hib group will group purge initial mezz and bard will try and land an aoe mezz - Minstrel stun on bard can be essential here, as well as clerics, sorc and theurgist splitting up to avoid being caught in one mezz

assist nuking is pretty high damage when we decide not to pbaoe - 2 wizards assisting on my 50% debuff and the theurgist if he wanted to will both have relativly high damage - and with my 9% extra damage, mom3, wp3 and 47+18 body my spec 45 DD packs quite a bit of a punch as well

Of course we lose fights, who doesn't but we can compete with anyone and everyone on the server

 

[Balbor]

all nukers should see a bit for fun gaming with the new keep LOS, and with soome nice anti Melee RAs avalible, alone with cheaper MOC things will improve, after all even if you are only nuking for 25% you are still gonna be interupting your target, forcing him you turn on MOC or do nothing.

 

[Clipse]

pointless post imo.. i play exc and i know how exc is. and zoyster aint a threat unless he has his usual 8fg+ by him. saying pryd wizzies are crapper is pretty much.. well.. daft? as mild as i can put it.. what are you trying to prove here u dingbat?

Im no 6 On the server, no 2 or 3 Icey in teh world. You are a PvE whore. Your word against mine. Don't go around spreading shit and tarnishing my good name, our I will rip you a new Asshole verbally. Ok. Cock ? Amd you will get it just like that bitch Herbal got it.

 

[Corran]

Im no 6 On the server, no 2 or 3 Icey in teh world. You are a PvE whore. Your word against mine. Don't go around spreading shit and tarnishing my good name, our I will rip you a new Asshole verbally. Ok. Cock ? Amd you will get it just like that bitch Herbal got it.

you aint got a good name. dont know you but your attitude gives the wrong impression if you want a good name!

 

[[NO]Magmatic]

Im no 6 On the server, no 2 or 3 Icey in teh world. You are a PvE whore. Your word against mine. Don't go around spreading shit and tarnishing my good name, our I will rip you a new Asshole verbally. Ok. Cock ? Amd you will get it just like that bitch Herbal got it.

No offense Zoyster, but you arent the 2nd or 3rd Icey in 'teh world', your the 3rd Wizard in the world... Of the 9.5M rps you have now, you've been Fire for 90% of the rps that you have gained...

Saying your the 3rd icey in the world would suggest that you've been Ice since the start...

But saying you should be feared because your the 3rd ice wiz in the world doesnt really make people fear you, beating them in battle will... :wub:

 

[Ilum]

Im no 6 On the server, no 2 or 3 Icey in teh world. You are a PvE whore. Your word against mine. Don't go around spreading shit and tarnishing my good name, our I will rip you a new Asshole verbally. Ok. Cock ? Amd you will get it just like that bitch Herbal got it.

Ahem. Dunno what you mean by your "good name" but seems to me you're doing a good job tarnishing it yourself

 

[old.windforce]

tbh he looks like a 13 year twat with to much time and to little manners

 

[DaggerElivager]

Im no 6 On the server, no 2 or 3 Icey in teh world. You are a PvE whore. Your word against mine. Don't go around spreading shit and tarnishing my good name, our I will rip you a new Asshole verbally. Ok. Cock ? Amd you will get it just like that bitch Herbal got it.

oooh handbags at dawn lol :touch:

you are damn ubah m8...i wish i was like you...

oh no wait from wot u seem i dont really wanna be a complete twat lol

and if your going to use that language and be abusive please at least get your english right mate its or not 'our'....also its and not 'amd'.

 

[nuky]

Im no 6 On the server, no 2 or 3 Icey in teh world. You are a PvE whore. Your word against mine. Don't go around spreading shit and tarnishing my good name, our I will rip you a new Asshole verbally. Ok. Cock ? Amd you will get it just like that bitch Herbal got it.

i want some of whatever u r on

did herbal likey?

 

[ilaya]

magmatic is one person who is truly feared in hib.. because we know the peeps who run about about with him work WITH him and use him to the best they can. might not have as many rp's as other peeps.. bu by god u know he's gonna get there in the current set up.

others though.. well.. its 1p to the person who gets the kill. no respect whatsoever..

dont often see magmatic running with a zerg. and i think that proves that wizzies CAN work in a decent grp, not just in a zerg. just need that balance and understanding...

killed zoyster/outlaw in thier zergs.. but aint ever killed magmatic.. says something?

less utility maybes.. but use what u got ffs.. aint just aobut YOUR skills.. its about the peeps around you.

 

[Clipse]

The way I look at it, I don't even play on this server, yet Mr Ilum, has dissed my name and my way of playing, and to compound the issue, its mostly bollox. Im not gonna bother defending myself, for the 7000th time, will well thought witty quips and one liners, and just tell em to FO these days.

If you know me in-game you know that I dont "try make peopel fear me". When someone disses you (Ilum) who doesn't know you, trust me he IS a cock and forum Sheep

and er fanks for the advice Mr Magmatic.

Ice Wizards have 0 utility, We have:

1. A PBOAE, but we r Slower than Hibbs at casting it, its weaker than Midds

2. A Snare, to balance Hibbers Stun.

3. We have a 10% debuff to counter-balance Hibbers Debuff.

As a stormlord, again 0 utility. I would hope that having 9.5 million RPs with this gimped class would do do the talking, but apparently not.

 

[Clipse]

Infact all 6 of you, read the thread again from the start, I posted a comment about out PBing Hibbers, then this Ilyama character starts with....

pointless post imo.. i play exc and i know how exc is. and zoyster aint a threat unless he has his usual 8fg+ by him. saying pryd wizzies are crapper is pretty much.. well.. daft? as mild as i can put it.. what are you trying to prove here u dingbat?

would you employ charm for him^^

 

[Clipse]

Me and Outlaw have been in GOL since day 1, and never left or set-up gank groups n such. We play the game for a laugh. And over the past year you c all these speacialist gank Groups set up all over the place, so don't let it go to your head, if you kill us, tbh I die every 5 seconds in emain, its like that as a wizzy when u r always target no1.