Spiritmaster Pet - Intercept.. Some testing

[charmangle]

Hmm...you really have something to learn about the word balance...

If you root it, any capable SM will hug his pet, obviously. 1 intercept will set the root off the pet.



Oh - well unfortunaly that cant be tested in a duel, but Ive seen this happen quite alot in normal RvR. It aint coincidence the pet often dies BEFORE the Spiritmaster, even with a buffed pet. Says something, doesnt it.

Still, in the end 1 tank can quite easily dispose of any non-BG'ed caster, except a Bonedancer, a Warlock or a Spiritmaster. Reading your signature you're the one playing Midgard heavily. Well there's the 3 casters you see quite abit in RvR, rarely see Runies. You know why? Coz they're balanced compared to Hib/Alb-casters, but suck compared to the other Mid-casters.

Hey mate!

You really should study the word balance abit more.

If you call sorc 2062 range ae mess or 14 second baseline stun balanced compared to root.

The baseline stun you have on all the hib casters are WAAAAY overpowered in NF. So way of the charts that you just come out as rediculous with your comments about sms. No move no defence before death = Lol > No move no defence before hit = Good > no move casting able = crap. (well on this scale anyway)

Some points to make this clear even to you:

1. With TOA bonuses casters damage output was raised so much that the baselinestun got to be rediculous and should have been changed to mess or lowered duration by 70%. (The stun should be on a non damage dealer class)

2. With NF the baselinestun grew even better with changed typography/tower/keeps.

3. This combined with the fact that hibs/albs have more useful grapple/bg classes than mid makes necessary for mid to have some sort of protection on thier casters. The runemaster is changed in the set group more because we need another tank to have something able to move at all during the grapple fest of hib groups.

How many grapple/bg chars do hib/alb run with in general ? How many do mid run with ? (You should really try how fun it is to play 1 bg/grapple per group. That sm pet will be long gone before the bg arrives. Unless you stack up neatly for the slaughter.)

4. A runemaster doesnt get any kind of defenciveness except for a single root. What class except for firewiz has that crappy defencivness ? (Oh yea banshee and animists do...hmm...thats what that extra bg was for but what about runies they dont have the extra bg. Poor buggers I guess)


Hence the SM pet is definitly balanced as the game is designed atm (but by that Im not saying that they arent overpowered in my opinion. The pet intercept is. But for it to be counted in that category hibs need a serious overhall (read: Remove baselinestun, remove Shrooms, Degrade damage of Banshees) first. And albs need a seer boost. Seriously, you do guys!

/Charmangle

 

[Edlina]

Hibs run with 1 or 2 bg's usually, but just as often 1 (and no hero)

The baseline stun isn't 14 sec... it's 9 seconds and that's before resists (i.e. it's 4-5 seconds after decent resists, and no stoicism or other cc reducing ability)

Run with a BM svg if you absolutely need a second BG'er, not that it's very necessary as mid.

As for changing shrooms, giving hib casters root instead of stun (and giving another hib class castable baseline stun then) and lowering bainshee dmg that's all things that needs to be done as well, but that doesn't change the fact that the SM pet is still op'ed and as for balance casters inbetween there's hardly any doubt that SM's, BD's, and bainshee's are the name of the game atm (maybe theurgists too as they're just nasty!)

 

[Vermillon]

...

The baseline stun isn't 14 sec... it's 9 seconds and that's before resists (i.e. it's 4-5 seconds after decent resists, and no stoicism or other cc reducing ability)

...

9 + ToA spell duration. Still is not 14 but more than 9 without the resists ofc.

 

[Maeloch]

9 + ToA spell duration. Still is not 14 but more than 9 without the resists ofc.

Aye but nearly all decent caster templates only have +6% spell duration on em (ie what u get from jacinas). If you going for more +% duration, generally means you are sacrificing something else useful.

 

[Manisch Depressiv]

You're like a SM pet Puppet. Whenever some baseline stunning noob nuker is in deepshit you come along and "intercept".

 

[charmangle]

Sigh....

Hibs run with 1 or 2 bg's usually, but just as often 1 (and no hero)

The baseline stun isn't 14 sec... it's 9 seconds and that's before resists (i.e. it's 4-5 seconds after decent resists, and no stoicism or other cc reducing ability)

Run with a BM svg if you absolutely need a second BG'er, not that it's very necessary as mid.

As for changing shrooms, giving hib casters root instead of stun (and giving another hib class castable baseline stun then) and lowering bainshee dmg that's all things that needs to be done as well, but that doesn't change the fact that the SM pet is still op'ed and as for balance casters inbetween there's hardly any doubt that SM's, BD's, and bainshee's are the name of the game atm (maybe theurgists too as they're just nasty!)

90% of the time all the decent groups are running with 2 bg/grapplers. (hib that is. Or atleast thats my experience.)

14 sec = 9 sec + 25% duration.

After resists (50% ofc) = 7 sec = 5-6 nukes a' 500 damage = about 3k damage by by birdy!

/Charmangle

 

[Dallas]

sm pet isnt that bad, never heard whine when people ran supp sms.. its just the darkness lifetap combined with the pet thats so annoying..

 

[Puppet]

90% of the time all the decent groups are running with 2 bg/grapplers. (hib that is. Or atleast thats my experience.)

14 sec = 9 sec + 25% duration.

Very creative calculation, but if a caster has 25% duration (which is a rarity) it adds up in my book to 11.25 seconds, not 14 seconds.

After resists (50% ofc) = 7 sec = 5-6 nukes a' 500 damage = about 3k damage by by birdy!

5.6 secs after 50% resists and no Stoicism or Determination.

With Stoicism and Determination (the new one, next patch) baseline-stun is 100% USELESS against tanks (again). All it means then is free immunity + potential to spam snaring tendrils for banelord-tanks.

 

[Lethul]

bla bla bla.

It seems your fingers not only did your typing, but did your thinking too. Have you considered suing your brain for non-support? Are you always this ignorant, or are you making a special effort today? A long period of non-posting would be most welcome on your part. I suggest you need Mark Twain's advice; "It is better to be silent and be thought a fool, than to speak and remove all doubt."

 

[SoulFly]

Pet shout, slam, kill. Ah yeah, no one likes Warlord Armsmen and every SM has something else stuck to him anyway, be it a Majsan or a bot.

Good test.

when a paladin can go wl too ;>

 

[charmangle]

Well im pretty sure that the duration isnt % it only says so in the info...

Very creative calculation, but if a caster has 25% duration (which is a rarity) it adds up in my book to 11.25 seconds, not 14 seconds.



5.6 secs after 50% resists and no Stoicism or Determination.

With Stoicism and Determination (the new one, next patch) baseline-stun is 100% USELESS against tanks (again). All it means then is free immunity + potential to spam snaring tendrils for banelord-tanks.

Well got 14 secs from a test we made on the test server when NF came...but as with all empiric tests it could be wrong. But thats just 1 nuke less anyway.
Still by by birdy...

About the template rarity:
Hrm Hrm Hrm...

People snort at my roleplaying template, but..

Mael, 50th ment.

https://forums.freddyshouse.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1347

 

[charmangle]

Well im pretty sure that the duration isnt % it only says so in the info...

Very creative calculation, but if a caster has 25% duration (which is a rarity) it adds up in my book to 11.25 seconds, not 14 seconds.



5.6 secs after 50% resists and no Stoicism or Determination.

With Stoicism and Determination (the new one, next patch) baseline-stun is 100% USELESS against tanks (again). All it means then is free immunity + potential to spam snaring tendrils for banelord-tanks.

Agreed with the stoicism/det patch but that works as well on all cc (sm/sorc'es too). And in my opinion its a rediculous patch that hopefully wount live long (and in my opinion turns the fg vs fg fights way to much in mid favour (as with before NF. The bad old savage days.) as well as it makes casters mostly pointless (again as with before NF)). Thats just a bad way to handle the cc balancing. (unless you give the same cc immunity to casters too and then cc is just pointless)

Well got 14 secs from a test we made on the test server when NF came (I actually dont think that 25% duration actually mean 25% as well as 10% casting speed dont mean 10% lower casting time)...but as with all empiric tests it could be wrong. But thats just 1 nuke less anyway.
Still by by birdy...

About the template rarity:
Hrm Hrm Hrm...

People snort at my roleplaying template, but..

Mael, 50th ment.

https://forums.freddyshouse.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1347

 

[charmangle]

Lol I just figured out why I get double posts sometimes!

When in write mode too long apprently the game saves down a copy as post while you are writing it, on its own!

Anyway its just double the pleasure isnt it!

/Charmangle

 

[bigchief]

Well got 14 secs from a test we made on the test server when NF came (I actually dont think that 25% duration actually mean 25% as well as 10% casting speed dont mean 10% lower casting time)...but as with all empiric tests it could be wrong. But thats just 1 nuke less anyway.
Still by by birdy...

About the template rarity:
Hrm Hrm Hrm...


https://forums.freddyshouse.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=1347

So errr one person having +dur makes it not a rarity?

O no wait, thanks for proving pups point.

 

[Corran]

Charmangle... now show me that same persons stats/resists.....

they will have made a heavy decision to have lower resists/stats for that duration, whereas most casters will want pretty decent resists whilst capping the important things.

Hell even most sorc's have sod all +duration as lack of decent items with it

 

[charmangle]

Hmm...

So errr one person having +dur makes it not a rarity?

O no wait, thanks for proving pups point.

Well its a pretty successful players template so why not just use his temple if it works that well ? Hmm...proving pups point ? What ever might you mean with that ? Think you just skipped ahead in your head without leading us along the way!

Charmangle... now show me that same persons stats/resists.....

they will have made a heavy decision to have lower resists/stats for that duration, whereas most casters will want pretty decent resists whilst capping the important things.

Hell even most sorc's have sod all +duration as lack of decent items with it

No idea what his resists are but we are talking about a rr11 menta thats counted as the one of the absolutly best casters on hib so I would be surpriced if it was crap ?

Apprently this needs some clarification since 2 people didnt get it:
That was the stats on a very successful caster in hib, so apparently the template cant be that crappy...maybe its actually good to get 1 more second on the stun ?

Anyway its still a moot point since its just 1 nuke less...discussing the semantics of it is just a waste of time!:/

/Charmangle

 

[Dorin]

Well its a pretty successful players template so why not just use his temple if it works that well ?

think maeloch uses it for charm

and...

maeloch is a gimp! a drunken one

 

[bigchief]

Well its a pretty successful players template so why not just use his temple if it works that well ? Hmm...proving pups point ? What ever might you mean with that ? Think you just skipped ahead in your head without leading us along the way!

The point was as you appear unable to comprehend simple english:

One person using 25%dur in a caster template does not make it a common occurance. He is the only person I know that uses that in a rvr template, most casters would and will laugh in your face if you suggest that they gimp something else to get +dur which at the end of the day is exactly what he must have done unless he has some of the best rog's i've ever seen.

 

[Manisch Depressiv]

Only possible with ubah RoGs or you gimp some resists seriously.

 

[Vilje]

Well, the intercept rate might get nasty sometimes, especially against pure tanks -But I for one very rarely find myself fighting a pure tanks. More often I meet dw's, hybrids or other casters.

When it comes to fighting other casters as a sm, its pretty much like with any other caster vs caster fight -Mostly the one who gets the jump wins.

But if I meet for ex. a cabby or a light eld or a sorc or a theurg, head on, I'm mostly in for one tough fight, be that either because of nearsight, better range or stun.

Sm's may have a cutting edge agains some tanks, but still there is some casters and other classes who sure has a cutting edge against sms too. We all have our strong and weak points.


I like the fact that someone takes their time to test such things, good work =) Still, I would think it requires testing over time to determine that the intercept rate really is 75%.

 

[Maeloch]

Template is for solo and based on SoG/chavskin cloak, rather than tarts/CS. Lose 5% damage and MCL2, instead get 25% dura and nearly 2mins of steathlore. Resists are pretty standard, with most capped and 2/3 weak points, 26 dex cap, 19 int cap, 10% pierce.

Basically if u go SoG/chavskin you can start sticking Bracers of Snow (+10% duration) into template without ridiculously overcapping int. Kept meaning to do a standard template for grp play, but never got around to it (CS is still lvl 3 or something). Nearly all templates have 6% dura tho', i've forgot what the point of this was.

 

[charmangle]

Sigh talk about a person without any kind of basic skills of thought...

The point was as you appear unable to comprehend simple english:

One person using 25%dur in a caster template does not make it a common occurance. He is the only person I know that uses that in a rvr template, most casters would and will laugh in your face if you suggest that they gimp something else to get +dur which at the end of the day is exactly what he must have done unless he has some of the best rog's i've ever seen.

Sigh are you so stupid that you havent learned to read or is it mearly a case of inablity to comprehend ?

You keep parroting the time limit when I 2 times have made it rediculously clear to all but your thickheaded self that it doesnt matter. The point is MOOT! (means not important or void of all interest) Its 1 extra spell that makes no difference for the discussion what so ever.

To respond to your prefectly moronic comments though...a person laughing at a template for having 25 duration with such a powerful tool as stun just hasnt got any clue about template making what so ever. Im pretty sure maelochs template is made for solo playing or duoing. And beeing able to get 1 more nuke in during your stunduration there is VERY important. More important than the 20 less damage you would get from someone nuking you with heat for example, with a little less resists.

Even though you dont understand this, you dont get to be rr11 by playing stupidly. You use skill, brains, and utilities. But its a hard concept for people like yourself to grasp.

And once again, since I assume youve forgotten it by now...the spell duration discussion was to explain what the time reference was from. It has absolutly nothing to do with the endresult or argument. Im sure you can wrap your mind around that eventually lets just hope it wount take 3 or 4 more posts for this apparently unique occurance of understanding to appear.

/Charmangle

 

[CstasY]

Even though you dont understand this, you dont get to be rr11 by playing stupidly. You use skill, brains, and utilities.

Haha, that is the most idiotic thing I have ever read on these boards.

 

[charmangle]

Hehe well your temp works thats all thats needed!

Template is for solo and based on SoG/chavskin cloak, rather than tarts/CS. Lose 5% damage and MCL2, instead get 25% dura and nearly 2mins of steathlore. Resists are pretty standard, with most capped and 2/3 weak points, 26 dex cap, 19 int cap, 10% pierce.

Basically if u go SoG/chavskin you can start sticking Bracers of Snow (+10% duration) into template without ridiculously overcapping int. Kept meaning to do a standard template for grp play, but never got around to it (CS is still lvl 3 or something). Nearly all templates have 6% dura tho', i've forgot what the point of this was.

Well it works anyway! With some skill at playing you really dont need that leet template!

Bahumbug I should know you made an annoying appearance a couple of months back when me + bb and 2 friends were annoying albs at a tower way down south in hib. When we pulled back to the woods a horrifying trehugger appears and those oh so annoying colors infront of our eyes start appearning! A short story even shorter...3 dead mids + bb and the 7 albs in the tower didnt get 1 rp!

* cough cough * Ofc it has to have been the template beating us!

/Charmangle

 

[charmangle]

So you mean rr10+ chars dont use skill ?

Haha, that is the most idiotic thing I have ever read on these boards.

So your meaning is that rr10+ players dont play by skill ?



Guess that will have to stand for you mate. I still say they do, never mind what I think of their opinions, they are still good players!:/

/Charmangle

 

[CstasY]

So your meaning is that rr10+ players dont play by skill ?



Guess that will have to stand for you mate. I still say they do, never mind what I think of their opinions, they are still good players!:/

/Charmangle

1 word; Excalibur.

 

[Lethul]

1 word; Excalibur.

rly ?
so you say every rr10+ player on pry r0x?

 

[CstasY]

rly ?
so you say every rr10+ player on pry r0x?

Perhaps you're seeing things?

 

[Lethul]

Perhaps you're seeing things?

perhaps

 

[Azathrim]

1 word; Xxcalibur.

You can't keep using him as an excuse.