sorc: 40/36 or 31 / 44 and why

[old.windforce]

currently level 45 with 36 mind and 30 body

since i will ding real soon i was wondering if the 13 seconds extra mezz time on 44 mind mezz is worth loosing better nuke (35 mind delves for 166) and better root (59 sec aoe root)

 

[Xeanor]

The 44 Mind AE Mezz has +50 radius too.

And you get the better AE Str/Con debuff too, which is evil with Wild Arcana 2

Oh, and you will lose out on the Level 39 Group Mezz Resist Chant.

 

[old.Bubble]

as a sorc just having a good AOE mez will not cut it
hitting the people who purged with a 1 min aoe root is nice(around 40 secs after resists)

thats why i believe 40 36 is the best spec

 

[old.Bubble]

considering respecing to 46 body rest mind

 

[Sharma]

49 mind, rest body imo

 

[Ezeine]

40 Matter / 36 Mind :great:

 

[lofff]

31body/44mind ;P

been talking about it for too long cba to explain again ~~ so just my 2 cents

 

[tildson]

yib, 44mind/31body. best aoemez and also a decent aoe-root + pom4. Probably the best suited for rvr imho.

 

[Xeanor]

I'm 44/31, and I wouldn't want to give away the AE root for a better PoT, self mezz resists and +5% group mezz resists, which all is hardly noticeable

 

[old.linnet]

I'm 40 body 36 mind on my sorceress and I love it. The 30% resist debuffs in body are nice in PvE if you get together with a wizard, and you get a very solid AE root at 39 body to balance up the 34 mind AE mez.

Also, damage dealing ability is also an extra form of support for the group ... and I like having very low variance lifetaps.



(I keep being tempted by the 46 body spec, but I'd miss the pets too much, even though they aren't always esp. useful. )

 

[eben]

Isn't it great that there are so many viable specs for a sorcerer?

It's a shame all the other classes don't have the same versatility. Anyone wanna take a guess on classes where everyone specs the same?

 

[wyleia]

36 mind 40 body imo
I dont want to me just a mezzer, i want to be a crowd controller


What I get->
*2* forms of aecc that work 90%+ of the time. Both are 1 minute long forms of cc.
I get a decent insta str/con and dex/quick debuff
I get NICE Fire/Ice/Matter resist debuffs.. I give fire wizards +dmg instead of -dmg on most targets.
I *can* nuke
I get powerbuff 4
I get cute little pets


Full mind sorc -> can mezz and maybe nuke for about 1/3 my dmg.. Cannot root, cannot do the nice magic resist debuffs..
Can find a nice tree to hide behind so they dont get run over by purging tanks..

44 Mind sorc -> very nice radius on the mezz, but their second form of cc sucks, cannot assist grp very well besides crowd control, since it would take 30 of their nukes to kill something, and they do not have high levels of the resist debuffs..


IMO to spend 8 spec points (36mind-44mind) with ALL you gain is a bigger radius mezz, and give up better aeroot, dmg ability, resist debuffs... more radius isnt worth it for me.. Might be for some though..

Also, for all of those who rave about the str/con debuff as being 'evil' or a good reason to spec high in mind:

- Strength (and strength only) debuffs and disease spells should no longer reduce a player's encumberance below their unbuffed maximum. Debuffers were using the fact that you could reduce an enemy to 0 movement speed as an effective one minute total snare with no counter, which was not the intention of strength debuff spells.

I guess for all you people who are coming into the sorc profession, and think you are making a sorc to play a 'mezzer', take a good look at our spec lines and realize the power of crowd control the sorceror has. They can spec and get two forms of 1minute long (!!) ae cc. 1 minute long aeroot, 1 min long aemezz. And by speccing this way they also get powerregen 4, level 50 pet, 30% fire/ice/matter debuffs, a decent spec nuke, a nice lifetap that CAN keep you alive under fire.... So sorcs have alot of potential for very good group support without having to go full mind, just be able to mezz, then pray that you can find a good rock to hide under before purging tanks find you..

 

[Sagba]

Root=You can't move but you can hit/cast. So far I haven't seen that being rooted makes my playing any harder(well, when soloing it does but you dont need AE root to stop single player). 49secs AE root is more than enough, getting body spec higher than 30 is "just" for debuffs and better nukes imo 44Mind/30Body would be my spec.

Like it's being said, there is many good specs for Sorcs. Anyone tried body/matter sorc? Debuffing your own DoTs and snare DD could be nice

 

[lofff]

Originally posted by wyleia
36 mind 40 body imo
I dont want to me just a mezzer, i want to be a crowd controller


What I get->
*2* forms of aecc that work 90%+ of the time. Both are 1 minute long forms of cc.
I get a decent insta str/con and dex/quick debuff
I get NICE Fire/Ice/Matter resist debuffs.. I give fire wizards +dmg instead of -dmg on most targets.
I *can* nuke
I get powerbuff 4
I get cute little pets


Full mind sorc -> can mezz and maybe nuke for about 1/3 my dmg.. Cannot root, cannot do the nice magic resist debuffs..
Can find a nice tree to hide behind so they dont get run over by purging tanks..

44 Mind sorc -> very nice radius on the mezz, but their second form of cc sucks, cannot assist grp very well besides crowd control, since it would take 30 of their nukes to kill something, and they do not have high levels of the resist debuffs..


IMO to spend 8 spec points (36mind-44mind) with ALL you gain is a bigger radius mezz, and give up better aeroot, dmg ability, resist debuffs... more radius isnt worth it for me.. Might be for some though..

Also, for all of those who rave about the str/con debuff as being 'evil' or a good reason to spec high in mind:



I guess for all you people who are coming into the sorc profession, and think you are making a sorc to play a 'mezzer', take a good look at our spec lines and realize the power of crowd control the sorceror has. They can spec and get two forms of 1minute long (!!) ae cc. 1 minute long aeroot, 1 min long aemezz. And by speccing this way they also get powerregen 4, level 50 pet, 30% fire/ice/matter debuffs, a decent spec nuke, a nice lifetap that CAN keep you alive under fire.... So sorcs have alot of potential for very good group support without having to go full mind, just be able to mezz, then pray that you can find a good rock to hide under before purging tanks find you..

Nice post but u missing a couple points:

- u will still have the 42sec ae root (ofc its a bit poor) and the single root (baseline)

- u will still have the 15% debuffs, not as good as the 30% ones but still make a difference.

- 31+11+ranks(body) should make ur baseline lifetap hit decently (while the 2nd spec DD aint that good..)


the 44 mezz radius is really sweet (not cos u get to mezz a bigger area but for the increased efficience on closer radius) and nowadays with SC resists + resist buffs, getting the very longest duration CC is preety important aswell..

Anyway its all about liking

 

[Shike]

hmm, is it just me that thinks a 15% mezredux would be good for the group?? and wtf is airtheurgs good for but to do an aoemez on stinking hibs that GP? and singleroot is nice aswell

49mind/22body will be my specc I think

 

[wyleia]

Originally posted by lofff
Nice post but u missing a couple points:

- u will still have the 42sec ae root (ofc its a bit poor) and the single root (baseline)

Baseline root is all nice and good, but I only got moa2, not quick enuf to cast it on multiple targets that are closing in on me at close range :/

- u will still have the 15% debuffs, not as good as the 30% ones but still make a difference.

Again we go with spell level here.. The 15% debuffs are 20 level spells and hard as hell to land

- 31+11+ranks(body) should make ur baseline lifetap hit decently (while the 2nd spec DD aint that good..)

Delve the second dd and delve the lifetap, power cost is whats important here.. the dd uses less power..
And what is your definition of decently? When i respecced i left my bodyat level 30 was hitting for about 100-150dmg then resists were applied.. so more around 100dmg total.. was 30 body +15 body magic.. My lifetaps can be very important to me in a battle, it keeps the clerics from having to look after me so much and help out the rest of the group. I do about 200-230 heals on myself with my lifetap at 40 body.. about 80 with only 30 body..
very big differnece there.

the 44 mezz radius is really sweet (not cos u get to mezz a bigger area but for the increased efficience on closer radius) and nowadays with SC resists + resist buffs, getting the very longest duration CC is preety important aswell.

Is a sweet mezz worth giving up a lot of useful utility? Up to the sorc.. I just dont like being so powerless and I see the 44 mind spec to be.. Level 30 aeroot is not as good as the 39, and as you said, with all the resists out there, from SC, RAs, + buffs, its very important to have long cc, especialy in two forms, so you can keep them stuck in the same spot for doubly as long.



And finally..

Originally posted by Sagba
Root=You can't move but you can hit/cast

Hmm... must all have MoC on if they keep casting at you after the sorc gets off a good aeroot... OR perhaps let the sorc know about that aeamensia spell they happen to have in their base mind line that they can easily cast from 2300 range and does not break root but will annoy the heck out of casters.. Also Sagba, you are a tank, what exaclty do you do in a battle when you are rooted and a casters is getting pummeled out of your melee range... cast taunt spell or take out your xbow? With the mezz/root immunity timers, after a purge its good to have a second form of cc ready to stop people in their tracks agian.

getting body spec higher than 30 is "just" for debuffs and better nukes imo

Getting Body spec ihgher than 30 gives more dd power, better debuffs AND the most important thing, a viable aeroot that I can trust my life on. If I just got debuffs and a better nuke i might consider going more mind, its the level 39 aeroot, thats why I am up there in body spec. Getting more body spec makes me a better CROWD CONTROLLER. But yes if your dream is to be a mezzer, go for it Full mind all the way


Play a sorc, learn our spells, before making judgements on what spec is best at this or that..

 

[Sagba]

Originally posted by wyleia
And finally..

Hmm... must all have MoC on if they keep casting at you after the sorc gets off a good aeroot... OR perhaps let the sorc know about that aeamensia spell they happen to have in their base mind line that they can easily cast from 2300 range and does not break root but will annoy the heck out of casters.. Also Sagba, you are a tank, what exaclty do you do in a battle when you are rooted and a casters is getting pummeled out of your melee range... cast taunt spell or take out your xbow? With the mezz/root immunity timers, after a purge its good to have a second form of cc ready to stop people in their tracks agian.

Never been in situation where caster I'm protecting have been out of my melee range. My armsman is the best CC class in whole game, he have slam Once I get nuked with my Armsman, we have lost the fight already.
When I have died with my Wizzie I haven't seen any reason to blame root for that. Spells that interupt my casting can be casted no matter am I rooted or not.

Getting Body spec ihgher than 30 gives more dd power, better debuffs AND the most important thing, a viable aeroot that I can trust my life on. If I just got debuffs and a better nuke i might consider going more mind, its the level 39 aeroot, thats why I am up there in body spec. Getting more body spec makes me a better CROWD CONTROLLER. But yes if your dream is to be a mezzer, go for it Full mind all the way

Started RvR with my Wizzie at lvl35. Not once someone resisted my root.

Even if Sorcs have Bolt range AE mess it doesn't mean Hibs/Mids can't mess us. When they do it's nice to have something that makes it hold shorter time. You will get 10% Mess Dampening at 39 Mind and I do think it's good enough to get and if you do get it, go for 44 Mind for better AE mess. Like I said, AE root aint that good really, but good enough to have. lvl30 AE root should be good enough.

If speccing Mind higher than 34 would be just for better AE mess and AE str/con debuff I wouldn't do it. Better AE mess(400 radius) and 10% mess dampening is good enough reason for me

Play a sorc, learn our spells, before making judgements on what spec is best at this or that..

Never said what spec is best. Just gave my opinion. Also said there is many good ways to spec Sorc, 30body/44mind would be best for me.

 

[Coren]

44+ mind, for a few simple reasons:

The only time the AE root will be useful is when the enemy group's druid uses group purge. Otherwise you'll end up breaking mez on the entire enemy group just because a few people purged, which can easily be taken care of by your group or the single target root.

The dex/qui debuff is nowhere near as useful as the best str/con debuff.

The debuffs are only worth casting when you got the highest ones, which you won't have with 40 body.

Basically, all you'll lose by not going 40 body is your ability to nuke, which isn't that good in the first place unless you go for 38 body. Besides that you gain a longer, less resisted ae mez with (most important of all) a bigger radius, a better str/con debuff, better mez resists and even better mez resist and pot when speccing higher than 44 mind.

 

[bone_idle]

Just spec them all to nuke and dont worry about mezz.

 

[old.Bubble]

Originally posted by Coren
44+ mind, for a few simple reasons:

The only time the AE root will be useful is when the enemy group's druid uses group purge. Otherwise you'll end up breaking mez on the entire enemy group just because a few people purged, which can easily be taken care of by your group or the single target root.

The dex/qui debuff is nowhere near as useful as the best str/con debuff.

The debuffs are only worth casting when you got the highest ones, which you won't have with 40 body.

Basically, all you'll lose by not going 40 body is your ability to nuke, which isn't that good in the first place unless you go for 38 body. Besides that you gain a longer, less resisted ae mez with (most important of all) a bigger radius, a better str/con debuff, better mez resists and even better mez resist and pot when speccing higher than 44 mind.

Coren does everyone in your RvR group have purge?
everyone in our RvR group does, everyone in warders RvR group probley does same with eclipse,NP and MM.
loseing a good AOE root isn't worth it.



another thing with this thread why are current sorcs advising 40 body 36 mind and other people who don't play sorcs advising 44mind 29 body?

 

[Sagba]

Originally posted by old.Bubble
another thing with this thread why are current sorcs advising 40 body 36 mind and other people who don't play sorcs advising 44mind 29 body?

Because only 4(?) Sorcs have said what spec they think is best?

Xeanor:44Mind/31Body
Bubble:36Mind/40Body
Wyleia:36Mind/40Body
Linnet:36Mind/40Body

Both specs are good.

 

[lofff]

uhm, ok lets go by parts;P

Baseline root is all nice and good, but I only got moa2, not quick enuf to cast it on multiple targets that are closing in on me at close range :/

as i see root shall serve fine on those who purge mezz.. otherwise, once mezz has failed/been purged, aeroot wont help much since opponents will b spread around and u, will surely b engaged (sorcs = main targets)

Again we go with spell level here.. The 15% debuffs are 20 level spells and hard as hell to land

yup, but been a primary target if u have time to debuff and nuke freely, and even run oom, means the fight is preety under control and u had won alrdy. I agree the debuffs are kewl but not the sorc's main task

btw, u just reminded me another reason to go for the 44mezz;P the spell level based chance to land etc

Delve the second dd and delve the lifetap, power cost is whats important here.. the dd uses less power..
And what is your definition of decently? When i respecced i left my bodyat level 30 was hitting for about 100-150dmg then resists were applied.. so more around 100dmg total.. was 30 body +15 body magic.. My lifetaps can be very important to me in a battle, it keeps the clerics from having to look after me so much and help out the rest of the group. I do about 200-230 heals on myself with my lifetap at 40 body.. about 80 with only 30 body..
very big differnece there.

again if u really have chances to go oom, means u aint engaged = fight under control = victory.. in good fights u will have a hard time surviving with lots a sprinting involved;P
On the other hand i didnt know there was so huge difference.. 31+11+ranks = 46+ above rr5, thought that would "fix" baseline nukes ;|

Is a sweet mezz worth giving up a lot of useful utility? Up to the sorc.. I just dont like being so powerless and I see the 44 mind spec to be.. Level 30 aeroot is not as good as the 39, and as you said, with all the resists out there, from SC, RAs, + buffs, its very important to have long cc, especialy in two forms, so you can keep them stuck in the same spot for doubly as long.

yup, up to the sorc What i meant is that actually u can notice a preety important difference from using the 62 sec mezz to the 72 one.

But yeah its all about liking, i dont play a sorc myself, i just talk from the experience fighting em and playing my bard, so from my point of view the sorc, even after landing the mezz 1st, will have a bad time surviving, in which single root, curemezz and sprint gonna b his/her main tools. (oh and moc+lifetap;p)

Adding a 41ice 35earth theurg to the group, u get sum1 to suply ur aeroot needs aswell

 

[lofff]

[snip]

Originally posted by Coren
The only time the AE root will be useful is when the enemy group's druid uses group purge.

[/snip]

sadly, gp aint _that_ good/usefull, sos is 100 times more effective >.<

Most time gp gets fired when 3+ members get cced altho rest are free, so the rest can get mezzed on a 2nd aemezz etc etc

The --->ideal<--- situation to use aeroot, would b when u find a fg hibs all stuck together and mezz em all in 1 single cast (no1 resists, no1 self-purges) then druid uses gp and automatically before they move u land ae root. This situation is just ideal.. not that it will ever happen. (even if the first mezz works like this, no1 resists no1 purges, no1 outta range etc, ppl wont b there waiting for the aeroot once druid gps)

 

[lofff]

Originally posted by old.Bubble
Coren does everyone in your RvR group have purge?
everyone in our RvR group does, everyone in warders RvR group probley does same with eclipse,NP and MM.
loseing a good AOE root isn't worth it.



another thing with this thread why are current sorcs advising 40 body 36 mind and other people who don't play sorcs advising 44mind 29 body?

- yup, every1 should have purge, and it should b one of the very first RAs to get (since its a pain to save points for it on higher ranks, while its not as bad to save 1-6 points for passive stuff)

- to answer ur question, i believe 40body 36mind is just funnier to play, its a cool spec aswell but in terms of rvr wont serve as well as 44mind does. Then again the player will make the difference there, a good sorc with 40body 36mind will do better than a "not-so-good" player with 44mind


ps: /spam off | sorry am bored ~~

 

[Krillin.]

Sorcerer has multiple specs;

46 body / 27 mind gets you hard nukes and 30% debuffs for matter and 50% debuffs for ice and fire as well as strong aoe root, you get lowest aoe mezz and pot 3. Ideal for gank grps and 1 fg s 1fg rvr - spec is very dependent on your grp around you.

40 body / 36 mind - decent nukes, second aoe root, 30% debuffs, second aoe mezz, pot 4 - all rounder spec - ideal for RvR & PvE

40 matter / 36 mind - snare nukes, second aoe root, 30% debuffs, second aoe mezz, pot 4 - all rounder spec - ideal for PvE

37 body / 39 mind - same as above apart from trade second highest aoe root for second highest grp mezz buff.

44 mind / 31 body - best aoe mezz, pot4, only difference between this spec and last is you specced 8 levels of mind for 10 seconds longer and 50 more radius, lowest aoe root, weak nuke, weak debuffs. - strong CC spec.

46 mind / 28 body - Pot 5, decent self buff mezzes, best mezz, weak nuke, low debuffs, no aoe root. - strong mezz spec

49 mind / 22 body or matter - no debuffs, best mezz, best grp buff chant for mez, best mez buff for self, weak nukes, no aoe root. - best mezz spec.

Everyone of them specs listed above is perfectly viable for a sorc. For people here to say only one sepc is viable is talking rubbish. Reason why the sorcerer is so enjoyable is because so many specs are viable. So don't discount any specs. The top sorcerer on the seer is specced 40 body & 36 mind i believe, second and a few others in top 10 are specced 45 body +. The rest are specced 44 mind and 31 body in top 10. There are no 46 and 49 mind spec sorcs in top 10 because these specs are new.

Differences between mezz resists

44 AoE mezz

34 AoE mezz is 5% more likely to be resisted than the 44 AoE mezz

24 AoE mezz is 10% more likely to be resisted than the 44 AoE mezz.

I hope the information above shows that there are alot of viable specs for a sorcerer.

I currently am specced 41 body and 35 mind - not sure on what to respec too as we are usable and good in so many specs so i am deciding on WHAT I WANT.

So try to listen to sorcerers that are active or go look on VGN and do some research. Remember its your char and not your guilds or your friends so spec how you like.

Regards K

 

[lofff]

Originally posted by Krillin.

Remember its your char and not your guilds or your friends so spec how you like.

Regards K

yup, thats a true and selfish statement.

Sadly u cant solo as a sorc, this is a group game in which u gotta play with other peeps etc

The only reason i lvled myself a bard was that my guild/friends was lacking bards, they/we needed more active bards. Thus i rolled one..

So yep if u are gonna play a class for urself then dont bother to come here and ask for a spec, if u are gonna play a group class and wanna learn what spec will serve better ur group then K's statement is invalid.

 

[spathi]

i am 49mind 22body and i love it...

Heres my reasoning.

1) If i wanted to kill people i would play a fire wizzie.

2) If i could nuke "well" i would be tempted to nuke in a battle rather than mez/root like i am supposed to, the amount of times i have just thought, ahh nahh lets not nuke him, lets root him - and that troll just stands there for another 30 seconds while his mates get killed, i dont get the killspam but am i supposed to?

3) The low level resist debuffs i would get from a lesser mind spec (e.g. 44/46 so i still have the real ae mez) wouldnt warrant use in RvR, it would just clutter my quickbars, and i'd rather single-target mez/root them instead anyway.

Also : power crack 5 is damn useful, AE root i just would never use, and charming a level 50 pet first time every time has saved me before.



I got to level 46 with about 44 mind and 22 body and i was using the baseline nuke in PvE and RvR simply cos it just did more damage. I decided that it was pointless to spec any higher in body, cos the debuffs just wouldnt be used in RvR, and the next body nuke wouldnt make any difference except in a PvE power-conservative situation. Okay, the power drain is 1.5x larger on a baseline nuke, but with Powercrack5 and MCL its hardly a huge problem. I decided that since the damage was if anything slightly higher on the baseline lifedrain nukes, i would use those in RvR, and spec higher in mind to get the final mez resist.

Wyleia raised the point that with only 22 in body i get massive variance on my baseline nuke damage, but to be fair it doesnt seem to vary that much at RR3 with 22+13 body.

Anyway, I gotta admit it owns. I have mastery of the art III and capped dex, [at the recommendation of many people including Asysh], and its brilliant. My casting speed on lifedrain nukes is awesome and if someone starts nuking me i can usually out-nuke them due to the sheer fact that my nukes give me health back.


Little event that happened in odins the other day. Running along on my own and see a norse and a troll, ae mez them from long range and am just about to run off when i see a yellow pet. Charm pet first time, put the pet on the norseman and time it so i get my DOT on him just as the mez gets broken, slap the str/con debuff on him and nuke nuke nuke, he is dead before he gets close.

70% power, DOT /debuff on the troll. Exactly the same thing, cept he is a zerker in epic armour and he reaches me and zerks, bladeturn bounces his first hit and i quickcast lifedrain and get my life back. Staff out, 65dmg, DOT still going for 80-100 per tick and a level 49 pet still hitting him. He hits me once and goes down.

Finish battle on 50% power and 80% health. /bow

Both corpses conned yellow ~

 

[old.linnet]

Originally posted by lofff
yup, thats a true and selfish statement.

Sadly u cant solo as a sorc, this is a group game in which u gotta play with other peeps etc

Enh, try reading his post before you say that. Krillin said that there are lots of effective ways to spec a sorcerer, which is _true_. Effective means effective.

Just because you got guilt tripped into playing a character you don't like, doesn't mean we all do. (And if you like playing your bard, stop whining about it )

 

[Xeanor]

Originally posted by spathi
Little event that happened in odins the other day. Running along on my own and see a norse and a troll, ae mez them from long range and am just about to run off when i see a yellow pet. Charm pet first time, put the pet on the norseman and time it so i get my DOT on him just as the mez gets broken, slap the str/con debuff on him and nuke nuke nuke, he is dead before he gets close.

70% power, DOT /debuff on the troll. Exactly the same thing, cept he is a zerker in epic armour and he reaches me and zerks, bladeturn bounces his first hit and i quickcast lifedrain and get my life back. Staff out, 65dmg, DOT still going for 80-100 per tick and a level 49 pet still hitting him. He hits me once and goes down.

Finish battle on 50% power and 80% health. /bow

Both corpses conned yellow ~

44 or 49 Mind wouldn't have made a difference in that situation

 

[Krillin.]

Originally posted by lofff
yup, thats a true and selfish statement.

Sadly u cant solo as a sorc, this is a group game in which u gotta play with other peeps etc

The only reason i lvled myself a bard was that my guild/friends was lacking bards, they/we needed more active bards. Thus i rolled one..

So yep if u are gonna play a class for urself then dont bother to come here and ask for a spec, if u are gonna play a group class and wanna learn what spec will serve better ur group then K's statement is invalid.

Oh please if you want to start calling me a selfish person go find some things out about me and my chars and there specs - you know the sorc spec so go find out my other and see if its not group orientated. So why not post your comments somewhere else you stupid prat and stop making assumptions.

What i was actually saying before you started up was that he should choose which ever spec suits him and if you actually read my post you might actually see I presented specs identifying weaknesses and advantages to each, it is difficult to enjoy a toon that you have not specced because thats how you wanted it.