Politics Should the UK remain a member of the EU?

[Wij]

But pedantry is obviously still a thing.

Yes. Yes it is.

 

[Raven]

The freaks in the Northern Netherlands get pissy if you say they are from Holland.

 

[Job]

The vast majority of Americans support their union and flag because they fought together against a common foe...us brits and apart from a little civil war hiccup, it has stayed strong.
Europeans have never faced a common foe, we always just fight each other and nothings gonna change soon, if the UK pulls out the whole thing will fall apart because it is held together mostly by distrust.

 

[DaGaffer]

Beligerant little Island with no empire, bit harsh, but I appreciate the honesty, and there lays the problem, we actually all hate each other and tbat is no way forward for a federal Europe, European wide tax?...go fuk yourself...Euro army...not a fat chance, share military hardware? on yer bike.
Everytime we tried to do anything, the squabbling and translations and jealousy and historic prejudices would fuk it up, it's bad enough now....European clout my ass, one push and we'd all run in different directions.
I will vote to stay in Europe, just for a front seat in the circus.

You do understand that I'm actually British right? I'm just aware of our delusional view of ourselves. The interesting thing is, I think by and large, Europeans don't hate each other, certainly not the younger ones. There are obvious exceptions like everyone in the Balkans, but the only people who never seem to shut up about Europe's history of knocking lumps out of each other are the British, probably because we won a lot (its also interesting that we have a very poor recollection of the ones we lost...)

 

[Job]

Yes, a federal Europe will work in 30 years time, too many old schoolers in power and the next generation will be far more immigrants without the history, England will hold out to last though because of our Island status.

 

[Raven]

The "old schoolers" in charge will follow the money. The money being remaining in Europe.

We have always had immigration, though perhaps not so many that offer nothing skills wise. plus the fact most are transient anyway. I don't think you need to worry about a gypsy PM stealing your children and turning them into pick pockets anytime soon...

 

[Bodhi]

Just re read the original post and seen that Golfers aren't welcome. Well fuck you, I shall just ignore the debate, and go an practice my swing instead.


Pfft. Peasants with their inferior ball games any fucker can play.

 

[old.user4556]

I think you missed my odd sense of humour then .

 

[DaGaffer]

No sense of humour golfers, I've noticed that.

 

[Bodhi]

I think you missed my odd sense of humour then .

I think you may have missed mine

 

[old.Tohtori]

Pfft. Peasants with their inferior ball games any fucker can play.

I've got a ballgame that's superior to all others.

 

[Bodhi]

I have 2. Only selected fuckers can play with them though.

 

[Scouse]

The reality of the EU is that it has almost no negative material effects on people's lives in the UK, and a bunch of positive ones they don't see or think about. Until they're gone.

This.

we actually all hate each other and tbat is no way forward for a federal Europe,

That's an utterly convincing argument *for* a federal europe.

No EU = War.

No sense of humour golfers, I've noticed that.

It's an elitist sense of humour.

I have 2. Only selected fuckers can play with them though.

Lies, you one-balled slag.

 

[Tom]

No sense of humour golfers, I've noticed that.

I once had a golfer get irate with me because I drove my buggy past his T as he was doing something with his bat (I was filming a tournament). It didn't matter to him that due to a load of trees and bushes, I couldn't possibly have seen him to turn the buggy off. Later on he got even more irate when I moved my camera out of his line of sight to the hole (I was trying to do the right thing). He came waddling over and told me to "sort myself out", then complained to an official who looked as though he'd rather be wiping old peoples' arses. Presumably the golfer was having a bad day and bent some of his bats or something.

It amused me because you never see world-class footballers demand that 70,000 people all shut up before they take a penalty. They just take it, even while people are screaming obscenities at them. I've noticed this with many sports that require that a small ball be hit by something - golf, tennis, snooker - they all want absolute silence.

 

[BloodOmen]

Yes and No...

Yes if the EU gets it shit goether, it has the potential to be the largest economy in the world

No because technically we would be better off without the EU providing we can keep key trade agreements in place

 

[Wij]

There are some material negative effects for business. Red tape. Lots of it.

And what the fuck is the CAP about :/

 

[DaGaffer]

There are some material negative effects for business. Red tape. Lots of it.

And what the fuck is the CAP about :/

None of which goes away if the UK leaves the EU; the UK would still have to comply to trade to the EU. And "Red Tape" is usually another way of CBI types saying "safety standards" or "worker's rights". Every time some business leader or Tory politician says the words "red type" in relation to anything, they should be required to say exactly what specific bit of red tape they're referring to, and in addition, do a comparison for the red tape involved in achieving a similar goal in the US; which will surprise the hell out of most people.

CAP is...well, not important really. I costs your household the equivalent of about a tankful of petrol per year (or about half a TV licence). Not worth wrecking one's economy for.

 

[Raven]

There would be a hell of a lot more red tape dealing with Europe from the outside than dealing with Europe from the inside.

Just try dealing with America for example.

 

[Wij]

None of which goes away if the UK leaves the EU; the UK would still have to comply to trade to the EU. And "Red Tape" is usually another way of CBI types saying "safety standards" or "worker's rights". Every time some business leader or Tory politician says the words "red type" in relation to anything, they should be required to say exactly what specific bit of red tape they're referring to, and in addition, do a comparison for the red tape involved in achieving a similar goal in the US; which will surprise the hell out of most people.

CAP is...well, not important really. I costs your household the equivalent of about a tankful of petrol per year (or about half a TV licence). Not worth wrecking one's economy for.

It's a fair point but red tape works at different levels. Some would remain where you wish to sell goods to the EU. Not all though.

 

[Wij]

There would be a hell of a lot more red tape dealing with Europe from the outside than dealing with Europe from the inside.

Just try dealing with America for example.

Unlikely in my opinion but happy to see some examples.

 

[Job]

This.



That's an utterly convincing argument *for* a federal europe.

No EU = War.

Being stuck together just highlights our differences, I would love a unified Europe with just a few stipulations...firstly drop the Euro name, it's fucking naff, and secondly, all speak English and drop your native language.
In return we won't charge you for using it.

 

[DaGaffer]

Unlikely in my opinion but happy to see some examples.

Have a look at Hawkwind's DoJ comments in the Blatter thread.

From a personal POV, thing I've found with America's bureaucracy has a different focus, but there's still just as much of it. The tension between state and Federal laws can be mind-boggling and almost designed to create work for lawyers, plus, "too much democracy". States can change or reverse laws every time there's an election, which is every two years. Then of course there are things like the absurd patent system, which once again an example of superficially light regulation, that's more than offset by the amount of money you're going to end up spending on lawyers.

 

[Hawkwind]

Then of course there are things like the absurd patent system, which once again an example of superficially light regulation, that's more than offset by the amount of money you're going to end up spending on lawyers.

Funny you should mention the absurd US Patent system. We just paid out 7 million USD because someone managed to patent the idea of paying for services over WiFi on a plane! Easier to just pay than get lawyers involved in lengthy arguments that hold back development etc. Crazy system.

 

[DaGaffer]

Told you:
http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2015/jun/02/nicola-sturgeon-scottish-backlash-if-uk-exits-europe

 

[old.user4556]

That's not news though, they've always said being taken out of Europe could trigger another referendum.

 

[Job]

Interesting perspective of the IMF's involvment in saving the Euro and why Greece is defaulting.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/...ssion-in-Greece-captive-to-EMU-creditors.html

 

[Embattle]

MoS Poll - http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/09/05/uk-britain-eu-poll-idUKKCN0R50X820150905

 

[fettoken]

MoS Poll - http://uk.reuters.com/article/2015/09/05/uk-britain-eu-poll-idUKKCN0R50X820150905

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XPHL4Q86t4


Or some such

Just want to point out this might be the best national anthem of all time.

 

[Job]

What we are seeing is how quickly the EU can fall apart...first crisis and everyone reverts to self interest, the union is a paper illusion and totally lacks any real power to stop individual countries calling the shots based on it's individual political leanings at the time.
Pretty obvious UK would swing to no vote when millions of Muslims are at the door and Merkel is basically threatening us to take them in...and how the living fuk is she in this position?
How come Cameron isn't calling the shots?
We're the fuckin nuclear power ffs, he goes over there like we're Albania.

 

[chipper]

its a pretty interesting situation isnt it a month ago i was watching merkel tell a girl she was been deported and now she is telling the german populous to welcome them with open arms. i cant help but see merkel as using this whole situation as a political foothold to place germany at the top of the ladder in the EU, other countries will be happy to let them take the refugees and she will happy to throw this whole situation in the rest of the EU's faces when a suitable situation comes along namely against the UK due to our reluctance to take them.

merkel is not a nice lady she is cold calculating and tbh playing an absolute blinder. she would like nothing better than to see the UK leave the EU it would put her in a position to pretty much dictate policy in the EU after all, the brownie points shes gonna be lapping up with the refugee situation who is gonna say no to her? france? italy? spain? very unlikely.

we must stay in the EU its vital tbh to world stability we are one of the few voices of reason in the EU and i wouldnt put it past her to jump in bed with putin tbh both power crazy fools.

i know its sounds like proper conspiracy stuff but she is a dangerous lady and needs watching.