SPAM random annoying things

[Bodhi]

You were talking about the "customer facing" end of the infrastructure a minute ago and you were told that it's for the most part already in place. It stands to reason that, if everybody starts using more electricity, more electricity will need to be either generated or imported. That's obvious... isn't it?

Strange, I was told it was already in place and called the National Grid, yet the Grid themselves said "Er no it isnt". I'll listen to them if it's all the same to you.

 

[Bodhi]

@Bodhi old bean - your argument continues to ignore what's been put before, is full of holes and is generally self-justifing.

Firstly, as said recently, it's not just London - it's UK air quality in all our major cities (so your life expectancy comparison is just cack*). Secondly - Euro6? - the fact that all of the diesel producer's engines exceed (by orders of magnitude) legally mandated levels of pollutants in real-world tests renders these bullshit standards meaningless. Thirdly, the point you've brought up in the Torygraph (and you've made before) about battery tech is irrelevant as we're talking about new tech (toyota's, for a start) not li-ion. Fourth - the power station imperative - yep, we're going to have to do that anyway - but even if you had to bring on gas fired powerstations to replace the emissions from ICE then you'd still make a net gain on almost every emissions standard as they're a) orders of magnitude more efficient at generating the power from a given fossil fuel and b) don't produce the particulates and certainly not right outside schools.

On almost every level other than "Bodhi has to lose his beemer and cry over the V6 noise loss" electric cars will be more beneficial to mankind - and just as convenient when they sort the charging tec out.

Progress!

But hey, like I said - you're already missing the obvious arguments that have been made recently. So meh to arguing this with you



Edit: Your life expectancy comparison is cack for about a bazillion different reasons. The obvious one being more than particulate emissions have an effect on life expectancy. But the fact that that was *so* obvious and you still posted it shows that you're not thinking rationally about this...

So you're basing the fact that this will be a good idea on a bunch of tech that isn't available yet? K.

Still, 8f the problem was as bad as you are determined that it is, it would show up in Life Expectancy data somewhere, especially if we're losing 40 000 people a year to it, yet the figures don't back that up. In fact other than one report with a lot of guesswork in it, I'm struggling to see any evidence for this magical 40k figure at all. But the newspapers are reporting it though, so that's alright then.

Oh, and BMW don't make V6's. They are for peasants.

 

[Scouse]

Unconsciously incompetent.

 

[Job]

I never put more than 300 miles worth of fuel in my car anyway..good excuse to stop for a snack and carrying a full tank just wastes energy.
Id put up with a 20m recharge..but unfortunately the charging stations at that rate would have to be the size of small towns.

 

[Bodhi]

I never put more than 300 miles in mine either. Mainly as I can only do 290

It will do an average of 69mph between Heathrow and Stafford late on a Thursday evening tho, including a stop at a petrol station. Try that in a Zoe.

 

[Job]

Of course we are looking at driverless cars..they will control charging and range for us.
Boring, but very handy.

 

[Scouse]

It will do an average of 69mph between Heathrow and Stafford late on a Thursday evening tho, including a stop at a petrol station. Try that in a Zoe.

Wouldn't care if I could put my feet up, pour a drink and watch a film on my way home. Or maybe even have a quick nap before my car dropped me off.

Not long now hopefully

Boring, but very handy.

I can't see self-driving cars as boring at all. Think of the shit you could get up to if you didn't have to keep your hands on the wheel and pay attention to wankers all around you.

Maybe have dimmable windows. Quite happily spend my time on the way up to a mountain biking weekend in scotland shagging the missus instead of watching her sleep next to me...

 

[Raven]

250 miles is plenty, charge over night, from the comfort of your own home.

Excuses, excuses.

If you need to go on a long journey, there is always the train, they are amazeballs...apparently.

 

[Scouse]

250 miles is plenty

Not for my use. In fact - utterly useless for me. But if Toyota pull it out of the bag on the other hand.

If you need to go on a long journey, there is always the train, they are amazeballs...apparently.

Depends on the journey. If I was going to London or Edinburgh then I wouldn't think twice. But that's why we have a mix of transport options

 

[Raven]

They are still wasting their time with batteries, they are horrific for the environment, both in manufacturing and disposal, but it keeps westerners happy (especcially when they can harp on about them yet still somehow refuse to use them when they are already available) because the mess is somewhere else, kind of like biofuels and veganism I guess.

What we actually need, which will take a lot longer than 22 years is magnetic resonance charging on main roads and smaller batteries to cover minor routes, something far more manageable in automated cars, which will be a thing long before everyone gives up caring how they fill their cars up. People probably wont even own cars in 20 years, they will be kind of shared pods.

 

[old.user4556]

Who gives a fuck if it takes seconds to recharge?

Something that a lot of anti electric brigade also seem to forget is:

Average commuting distances:

• The average distance commuted to work in England and Wales increased from 13.4 km in 2001 to 15.0 km in 2011. This is estimated using only workers making a regular commute between their enumeration address and their workplace address.
• On average workers resident in the East of England (17 km) had the longest commutes while working residents in London had the shortest commutes (11 km).
• In both 2001 and 2011, males commuted further than females. In 2001, 39% of males and 25% of females commuted more than 10 km. By 2011, the rates of commuting such distances had increased to 42% for males and 30% for females.
• With the exception of those living in London, workers in managerial and professional occupations (groups 1 to 34, 5, 6) were more likely to commute 20 km or more. The difference with other occupation groups was not so noticeable for London residents, where skilled trade workers were most likely to commute 20 km or more.
• Full-time workers commuted longer distances in 2011 than their part-time counterparts. While 55% of part-time workers commuted less than 5 km, 38% of full-time workers did the same.

Source.

Another set of average commute stats:

Region of residence Commuting miles Unweighted sample size (individuals)
North East 9.2 1,787
North West 8.9 4,484
Yorkshire and The Humber 9.8 2,958
East Midlands 10.5 2,736
West Midlands 9.8 3,561
East of England 10.8 3,811
London 8.6 4,773
South East 11.2 5,085
South West 8.7 3,205
England 9.9 32,400
Wales 9.5 1,758

I get the range anxiety argument, it bothers me in particular considering how rural some of Scotland is, but for the vast majority of commuters then the range is perfectly adequate.

 

[Raven]

Something that a lot of anti electric brigade also seem to forget is:



Source.

Another set of average commute stats:



I get the range anxiety argument, it bothers me in particular considering how rural some of Scotland is, but for the vast majority of commuters then the range is perfectly adequate.

Exactly, 250 miles is more than enough.

However, there is a reason people don't drive around in Renault Zoes.

 

[old.user4556]

I quite like it. It makes me feel all transgender inside.

 

[Scouse]

I get the range anxiety argument / going to work etc etc

I don't own a car to go to work (though I do use it for that). I own a car to allow me to do what I want to do.

For me - it's not "range anxiety" - it's "electric cars are fucking useless to me right now".

But as soon as the recharge thing is sorted properly I'll be getting one. Bought my last car in 2003 - it's done just under 200,000 miles. See no point in getting shot unless I *have* to.

But if decent leccy options come along I'd be right in there I reckon.

 

[old.user4556]

Also:


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vDL_xQGEQkg


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xmJpqBgaWyk

 

[Raven]

20 mile range?

You know batteries are wank when the jewel in the crown of electric racing has to stop half way through to change cars.

 

[old.user4556]

'concept' being the key here.

 

[Raven]

But anyway, the whole point of this discussion is time frame. 20 years? Fine, good target, achievable. Now? No, 5 years? No, 10 years? No.

 

[Moriath]

I did plymouth and back the other day 212 miles each direction. Electric wouldnt do that for me at the moment. When it can do those kinds of miles then the torque on electric motors would be much more fun than petrol engines atm.

 

[Tom]

However if it was anywhere near accurate I'd expect life Expectancy in London to be signaificantly worse than anywhere else

That's because you don't understand the claimed figures. They represent a reduction in life expectancy. That might mean that someone who would normally die at 85 now dies at 84. Or someone who'd die at 48 would die at 47.5 Etc. And you can't really base life expectancy just on one factor - people in London are generally more wealthy than people outside London, so life expectancy is going to be better anyway. Wealthy people live longer lives than poorer people.

 

[Tom]

But the Infrastructure is already there!

Oh dear, you're suggesting that my comments, which referred to the infrastructure for charging a vehicle outside your home (I said mostly, right?) were actually aimed wholly at national supply? That's a very poor argument. And in case you didn't notice, the National Grid report you quoted (ignore the shite from the AA) talks about peak demand. But most electric cars will not be charged during peak periods. They will be charged at night, when most power stations are idling.

 

[Bodhi]

Oh dear, you're suggesting that my comments, which referred to the infrastructure for charging a vehicle outside your home (I said mostly, right?) were actually aimed wholly at national supply? That's a very poor argument. And in case you didn't notice, the National Grid report you quoted (ignore the shite from the AA) talks about peak demand. But most electric cars will not be charged during peak periods. They will be charged at night, when most power stations are idling.

I have no idea where I got that idea from - other than you specifically mentioning the National Grid. With this anouncement, tied in with the push to make all new biulds heated by electricity rather than gas (yay storage heaters!) means it's either going to need a few upgrades, or we are going to have to get used to importing most of it from the continent. Still, at least the railway network won't be adding to it, what with electrification of the rest of the network being cancelled (wait, what?).

Luckily on further investigation it appears hybrids won't be affected by this, so we can just continue to buy those. Like it or not, as an energy store, hydrocarbons crap on lithium batteries from a great height - mind you, as mentioned, so do Ham Sandwiches - so will continue to be the way to go until we find something useful. Could be solid state batteries, fuel cells (not necessarily hyrdogen), Mr Fusion (yes please!). Hell I wouldn't even say Hydrocarbons are done yet - for instance Audi have figured out how to get diesel from water and CO2, so we could even have a situation where making diesel sucks more CO2 out of the atmosphere than burning it does - how cool would that be?

See, lots of possibilities, which is why going all in on one technology is fucking retarded. Especially when that one technology (batteries), and progress within that one technology is so poor. Look at what happens when subsidies are removed from EV's - no one buys them, even Teslas. Becuase for all the Youtube videos showing how fast they are, apart from that, they're still a bit shit.

 

[Job]

If this Toyota battery actually works its going to make Musks lithium factories look very silly indeed.

 

[sayward]

Just tried to log onto patient site to get a repeat prescription. Oh joy it won't take my password so have to fill in all my details. oh good i don't exist so now it's locked me put of the site!

 

[Moriath]

Just tried to log onto patient site to get a repeat prescription. Oh joy it won't take my password so have to fill in all my details. oh good i don't exist so now it's locked me put of the site!

Yup and now you have to go to the surgery and get them to re apply for your account to get into it again.

Been there done that. No forgot password option

 

[Raven]

Ah, the NHS and their amazing PFI bullshit. Cost and absolute fortune, don't work.

If they had spent the money they wanked up the wall on IT, on staffinf they would still have an IT system that doesn't work but they would also have enough money to pay nurses a reasonable amount.

 

[CorNokZ]

I can see we are doing the whole energy discussion, so I'll just add the following

Bikes
Wind mills
Solar panels
Nuclear power
Global warming

Do with it whatever you like, but it seems to be the discussion cycle(yes, pun in-fucking-tended) of the forum at the moment

 

[CorNokZ]

And then foreigners.. But that's mostly just @Job vs the rest, so I left that out

 

[Job]

We could look at why people drive around so much..I guess a lot is work and school runs.
So everyones going to lose their jobs to AI and robotics..so that gets rid of the rush hour...teach kids in VR classrooms...gets rid of school run.
We'll be left with pleasure driving..or just sit on the path and let the screen windows take you around the world.
We have a population heading to 10 billiion and more of them having money to visit the world.
Traditional tourist spots are going to have to become virtual.
Might as well just invent some new ones while we're at it.

The future is going to be so weird.

 

[Syri]

Auto-playing videos on news sites. The local paper's site just got overhauled, and they've put auto-playing videos on pretty much every article page. If there isn't a video related to the article, they just chuck in a random one that's got some vague relation to the written content, no matter how weak the link. Just because you can do something, doesn't mean you always should...