Open Thread

[Teslacoil]

Sorry, couldn't make head nor tail of the first bit, so removed it.

And as someone said to me elsewhere, grow the f*ck up. My brain is in my skull, not between my legs.

it is ? well omgosh !


Then how come everything you say seems to come out your arse ?

/berget

 

[vavires]

Well, I certainly wouldn't try to convince you of anything. You obviously know it all, so there wouldn't be much point.

And if you quote someone, you do NOT alter the text they've written. I will not add imo to that, because it's an accepted civilized way to behave.

There was no underlining and no bold face in my original. See how you like it. In future leave it alone.

Don't try to make jokes in English. Mine are bad enough, but yours work even less.

Can I also ask why you clutter up threads by including in every post you make the whole of the post your'e answering? Especially when your reply is often a lame one-liner? It isn't necessary though it makes your contribution appear far more important than it really is. Perhaps you feel the need to do this.

It may be your right to do it, but it's your responsibility to do it properly


​

we all quote in our own way , i quote whole ure post and i made the thing i talked about fat and underlined so ppl know what i want. Or are u that clueless to see?

 

[Jupitus]

First and foremost, Mercury, the suggestion that I deliberately waited until you had logged off before I posted is unfair and insulting to me. If I have something to say I will say it as and when, and I don't hide my views, I air them.

My criticism of you was not regarding your views (although I must say I do disagree with the idea of sidelinging a player who is trying to organise an event purely on the basis of them having started in a different realm, or having differing playstyles from yourself), you post in an eloquent and clearly educated fashion and I hold no gripes. My problem is that the purpose of having raid threads (and dedicated mods assigned to sticking and unsticking them, quite a thanless task) is so that people can see clearly the available raids, and sign up to make their availability known. They are not there as stickies for you (or anyone else) to air their views about the qualities, good or bad, of the original thread starter. It is this reason that I got involved, after you had chosen to ignore previous mod intervention. You were clearly the antagonist in this situation, and while I don't disagree that people should have just reported your posts (a great many did) and not reacted so, you brought it upon yourself, in my opinion. I hope this is clear.

Posting it publicly? You have shown that you have the intellect necessary to understand matters and I had hoped that you would have read my post in the spirit it was meant, i.e. 'be careful, and anyone else reading this beware'.

Finally, there are a few in THIS thread who are acting like idiots... suggestions about 'sexual tension' etc etc can be left out, please.

 

[mercury]

Tx

Thank you for that. You sound like my Dad which is no bad thing.

 

[Jupitus]

Thank you for that. You sound like my Dad which is no bad thing.

My eldest is 17... so I could be

 

[mercury]

it is ? well omgosh !


Then how come everything you say seems to come out your arse ?

/berget

It's all to do with where you're looking, dude.

 

[Ingafgrinn Macabre]

Free Speech...

The meaning of this simple phase has become dilluted by what people want it to mean.
In all countries and jurisdictions I know of this term is still superceded by something like -all are created equal-, and -don't harm others-, in whatever wording or language.
The equality part is usually aimed on the rights and obligations of the individual or group. There are differences between people. Women in general are better in organisational skills, and men in general are better in science, but on the whole we are equal.
The part about leaving others in their value, do no harm etc, doesn't only mean physical. Psychological harm can be just as bad, or worse as physical harm.

Since these two supercede the free speech clause one does not have the right by law to just say anything you'd like. People tend to (or just want to) forget this little part. Saying something like "someone is a *bleeping* *bleep*hole" is not covered by "free speech".
Furthermore, your free speech right is also limited by what the forum owner would allow you to talk about.

In general, just don't verbally assault anyone, even if it's in a cloaked way, or intended as a joke. We're communicating by written word. Cynicism, humor, sarcasm are all very hard to identify in written word. No matter how many smilies you stamp in your post.

Now, to all in this thread, I have no idea what happened, and where, and I don't care either. I do think that even though someone called you names etc, if you reply in thesame matter (or a little bit worse as is often the case) you're just as wrong as the one starting it. So be the mature one, and ignore it, or write a reply with "I do not feel the need to resort to insults, nor do I feel the need to reply on those remarks containing them".

 

[mercury]

Wrong

we all quote in our own way , i quote whole ure post and i made the thing i talked about fat and underlined so ppl know what i want. Or are u that clueless to see?

I'll try to make this as clear as possible without resorting to personal insults (oki there's always a first time) :

You're wrong. Not a bit wrong, not partially wrong but completely absolutely and utterly wrong. That is, if you wish to remain honest.

When you QUOTE a person you are saying to others that see or hear it 'this is what the original said, and in the way it was said'. That's what a quote means. This is not a matter of opinion, yours or mine - it's the way things are. If you make up your own way, it's dishonest. If you edit it in any way (to remove obscenities or libel, for example) its on you to say so.
But if you do, it's no longer a quote - it's an edited version.

You don't need to use the WHOLE of a post, but if you select only part you have to make damned sure the meaning hasn't changed. Quoting 'out of context' is a common way the gutter press try to discredit people, but even they do not tamper with the words or the format.

The bit about using the whole of the previous post as a space-filler is a different point altogether. It's simply that in many cases you don't need the lot. Deconstruct it by all means and answer the points one by one, but if all you (thats in general, not you in particular) have is a one-line retort it simple lengthens the thread unnecessarily.

I'm never clueless while I have a ball of string



​

 

[mercury]

Women in general are better in organisational skills, and men in general are better in science, ..........

Damn - and I want to be an astrophysicist. No Inga, Im afraid your'e wrong. imo, ofc. (unless by 'in general' you include the historical condition). Things have taken a turn.

Cynicism, humor, sarcasm are all very hard to identify in written word.

Aye, true, but in my case the written word is all I got.

So be the mature one, and ignore it, or write a reply with "I do not feel the need to resort to insults, nor do I feel the need to reply on those remarks containing them".

I know, I know. But I got tempted and fell.

 

[vavires]

I'll try to make this as clear as possible without resorting to personal insults (oki there's always a first time) :

You're wrong. Not a bit wrong, not partially wrong but completely absolutely and utterly wrong. That is, if you wish to remain honest.

When you QUOTE a person you are saying to others that see or hear it 'this is what the original said, and in the way it was said'. That's what a quote means. This is not a matter of opinion, yours or mine - it's the way things are. If you make up your own way, it's dishonest. If you edit it in any way (to remove obscenities or libel, for example) its on you to say so.
But if you do, it's no longer a quote - it's an edited version.

You don't need to use the WHOLE of a post, but if you select only part you have to make damned sure the meaning hasn't changed. Quoting 'out of context' is a common way the gutter press try to discredit people, but even they do not tamper with the words or the format.

The bit about using the whole of the previous post as a space-filler is a different point altogether. It's simply that in many cases you don't need the lot. Deconstruct it by all means and answer the points one by one, but if all you (thats in general, not you in particular) have is a one-line retort it simple lengthens the thread unnecessarily.

I'm never clueless while I have a ball of string



​

we all quote in our own way , i quote whole ure post and i made the thing i talked about fat and underlined so ppl know what i want. Or are u that clueless to see?

 

[Bluesky]

I purposely decided to stay out of the threads that have been going on about raids/loot etc. I wanted to see if any surprising views came out as well as the blatant sycophancy and flames. I wasn't surprised though as I presumed it would degrade, which it did. After having run a huge amount of public raids (over 450 very varied ones including ML's, CO5, Dragon, Farming etc.) I have my own way of dealing with people and problems as well as lotto's. While MY way certainly won't be everyone’s way it's my raid to run how I see fit. This also applies to any leader on their own raids.

In MY humble opinion the main issue here originates from differing game styles and nothing more. Some don’t like pve and do it purely to be able to rvr so do it as quickly and painlessly as possible. Some like pve and enjoy the benefits they get from it. That’s the beauty of this game we play; it has room for everyone. As I see it the problems arise when differing game styles interact with each other hence differing peoples views on how THEY prefer the game to be played. It's when those differing views come into conflict that people aren't able to compete using words and thoughts of a respectful nature and resort to name calling/flaming etc. This can be down to several things: not understanding someone (miscommunication), not caring about anyone having an opinion other than theirs (selfishness) and a like for abusing, belittling or ridiculing people (bullying).

I agree that Merc and the assorted other posters should not have "hijacked" the raid leaders thread and Merc's "Open Post" is the ideal place to discuss these issues. It's a shame this wasn't done at the start but then I very much doubt the various contributors could have foreseen how some of the threads would devolve. We have this post now which I hope will contain some decent debate and not petty insults and feeble flames.

My personal view is very similar if not exactly the same as Merc's on many matters about raids but that doesn't mean I will speak to, or deal with people in the same way or "fight for the cause" in the way Merc does. I admire her passion for saying what she thinks is right and just. Occasionally I will actually go further than Merc will or lose my temper but its how I express that on these public forums or in-game that gives people an opinion of me. Keeping something "inside" or between friends is often better than letting loose on a public forum. On the contrary also sometimes it really is better to let something out but I think that depends on the issue at hand and the people involved.

My personal view is just that, PERSONAL so I wouldn't intentionally make insulting posts unless I sincerely thought someone was seriously out of order and it really needed saying. To use one of my favourite phrases "don’t open your mouth without engaging brain or you will just end up changing feet". Far too many people seem to think its big/clever/smart/1337 to just jump into a thread and hurl some insults at others or use abusive or highly derogatory language. It seems that’s how they get their kicks and amusement and that’s their choice to do so. Whether that’s within the FH CoC is another matter. FH is a PUBLIC forum for all people to air their views and opinions. If they cross certain boundaries they are dealt with by the board moderators as they should be. Free speech it may not be but how many of us truly want free speech when it encapsulates kindness and respect at the same time as abuse and insults?

It's a grey area but one thing that seems sadly lacking is respect. A long time ago a good friend of mine once said to me "respect others until they give you a reason not to". I thought this was ideological babble as my view was people should earn respect. Think about it though. How much better would this place be if people were respected for their views and opinions on first impression before negativity/insults/flames set in? Yes, people can ignore it and flame away thinking they're "all that" in front of their 1337 forum buddies but maybe, just maybe once they could think someone else’s opinion may carry weight before trampling over a post with negativity.

Look for the possibility of a positive before presuming a negative.​

 

[mercury]

we all quote in our own way.....

You don't listen to anything anyone says do you? We don't all quote in our own way, unless you want to cheat. English is a language I'm more than familiar with and I'm telling you, whether you like it or not, that that is NOT what quoting is about. It's an unwritten consensus. Sorry if that sounds heavy-handed but you don't seem to understand.

And if your only contribution is to simply repeat your last post with a different attachment, I must ask you not to bother. We all noticed it the first time.

If you insist on modifying my post to you own ends without saying you've done it I shall ask a mod to remove it.

There's lies, damn lies and mis-quotes​

 

[Jupitus]

Sorry Mercury, but a request like that is likely to fall on deaf ears - we can't follow individual users around handholding every time they are quoted - you and the others need to eaither accept where people take your words out of context and trust other users to see that too, or just chill alot more.

Relax!

This isn't aimed at Merc only, it's for all of you.

 

[Qbic]

You don't listen to anything anyone says do you? We don't all quote in our own way, unless you want to cheat. English is a language I'm more than familiar with and I'm telling you, whether you like it or not, that that is NOT what quoting is about. It's an unwritten consensus. Sorry if that sounds heavy-handed but you don't seem to understand.

And if your only contribution is to simply repeat your last post with a different attachment, I must ask you not to bother. We all noticed it the first time.

If you insist on modifying my post to you own ends without saying you've done it I shall ask a mod to remove it.

There's lies, damn lies and mis-quotes​

Well it might come as a surprise to you but if you check the Cambridge Dictionary Online you will see what it says about this wonderous word and I quote "to repeat the words that someone else has said or written"; now unless I am blind nowhere is said anything about the form hence putting something in bold or underlining it. In other words as far as I can tell you haven't got a leg to stand on. Try to remember this the next time you want to lecture someone.

 

[mercury]

Well it might come as a surprise to you but if you check the Cambridge Dictionary Online you will see what it says about this wonderous word and I quote "to repeat the words that someone else has said or written"; now unless I am blind nowhere is said anything about the form hence putting something in bold or underlining it. In other words as far as I can tell you haven't got a leg to stand on. Try to remember this the next time you want to lecture someone.

If you use bold/and or underlining, or caps that the original didn't have then that is NOT repeating what they said. It's modifying it. Whether you like it or not, quoting somebody means using their words. Bold face, underlining and caps have a conventional usage which changes such words - whether you like the lecture or not. It wasn't aimed at you anyway, as I'm sure you would not be so stupid or dishonest or both as to try it on.

In The Oxford English Dictionary (2nd Ed) : Quote va 4a. To copy out or repeat (a passage, statement etc) from a book, document, speech etc. giving some indication that one is giving the words of another. The 'wrap text in quotes' button on this Forum allows posters do do exactly that - copy somebody's words.

The OED is the recognized authority on things linguistic / my dictionary is bigger than your dictionary (choose your level). It makes extensive use of quotes from a huge number of sources, and in every case it appears they retain the formatting of the original.

I could, if the fancy took me, re-format your sarcastic comments to make them look and sound quite different, which is exactly what my complaint was to the guy who did it to my post.

You don't need a leg to stand on, two is the more comfortable option.​

 

[mercury]

Sorry Mercury, but a request like that is likely to fall on deaf ears - we can't follow individual users around handholding every time they are quoted - you and the others need to eaither accept where people take your words out of context and trust other users to see that too, or just chill alot more.

Relax!

This isn't aimed at Merc only, it's for all of you.

I've no complaints about being quoted, out of context or not - it's being mis-quoted I object to - where my words with additions are presented as though they were my own. Am I so far out in objecting to this? Changing the emphasis I placed on the original words is almost as bad as changing the words themselves. I doubt anything will improve, but I get an insight into the sort people I'm arguing with.

I said I'd ask a Mod to remove such dishonest reporting - I didn't say I expected them to.

For me, holding hands is like a gag - it keeps my fingers off the keyboard. I don't think I'd want that - ymmd.

But the thought of being followed around by a Mod makes me afraid, very afraid.

Apart from that I'm extremely relaxed - quite chilled out now Mum brought me my Earl Grey. None of my ideas afaik stem from tension of any kind.


Just because Im paranoid doesn't mean I'm not out to get you.

 

[Qbic]

I could, if the fancy took me, re-format your sarcastic comments to make them look and sound quite different, which is exactly what my complaint was to the guy who did it to my post.

By all means re-format my comments using bold and underlining my exact words and make them look and sound quite different.
Put your money where your mouth is.

 

[vavires]

ya know merc, ure just boring me now.
Do what ya want and say what ya want. U have nothing to justify what you have done on mck's thread. U attack EVERYTHING that doesnt SUIT you. Well from now on YOU dont suit ME anymore. Cant get more clear than this i think. If ya wanne act all high and schooled do it somewhere else.

And to place it in 1 line what all ppl have tried to say to you.

If you dont like what other ppls rules are then just SU and stay away.

Vav.

Ps. You say you dont like the i claim an item rule, still u came smudering about each ml raid i did, saying hun this hun that wanne be in my group all the time. To think about that now, u kinda make me sick.
last post i bothered to post in this useless bs

 

[Qbic]

If you use bold/and or underlining, or caps that the original didn't have then that is NOT repeating what they said. It's modifying it. Whether you like it or not, quoting somebody means using their words. Bold face, underlining and caps have a conventional usage which changes such words - whether you like the lecture or not. It wasn't aimed at you anyway, as I'm sure you would not be so stupid or dishonest or both as to try it on.

In The Oxford English Dictionary (2nd Ed) : Quote va 4a. To copy out or repeat (a passage, statement etc) from a book, document, speech etc. giving some indication that one is giving the words of another. The 'wrap text in quotes' button on this Forum allows posters do do exactly that - copy somebody's words.

The OED is the recognized authority on things linguistic / my dictionary is bigger than your dictionary (choose your level). It makes extensive use of quotes from a huge number of sources, and in every case it appears they retain the formatting of the original.

I could, if the fancy took me, re-format your sarcastic comments to make them look and sound quite different, which is exactly what my complaint was to the guy who did it to my post.

You don't need a leg to stand on, two is the more comfortable option.​

And another thing; your dictionary may be bigger but nowhere anything is mentioned about the form just the words that were repeated. I am sure you made an essay before where you quoted certain sources; did you at that time study the font of the original document and make sure you used exactly the same font because that is what you are basically implying. (it may sound a bit farfetched but the whole disagreement is farfetched if you ask me; farfetched but highly entertaining). The statement you made about the OED implies as well that you should verify this as what appears to you doesn't mean that it is reality. I have had some rather stupid disagreements on FH but this one sure ends up in the top three.

 

[mercury]

Ps. You say you dont like the i claim an item rule, still u came smudering about each ml raid i did, saying hun this hun that wanne be in my group all the time. To think about that now, u kinda make me sick.
last post i bothered to post in this useless bs

My reson for wanting to be in your group was safety, not because I wanted any loot, and most certainly not because I like you. You always seemed to me rather sad the way you suck up to some and arbitrarily kick others from you BG. You were always so fond of leading off without saying anything it was easier to have your name in my minigroup window than make a target macro.

I dont see how I can have been on each ml raid you did, I haven't got that many toons, but at the time you were the only one doing them. Any port in a storm.

You seem to spend an awful long time on what you call useless bs. But its your right to be wherever you please. I would never dream of telling you to 'SU and stay away' and 'do it somewhere else' (your words). Typical of your arrogance, I'm sorry to say. You forget Mr Professional ML Raider this thread was started by me, and it's for anybody who can be bothered. It's not up to you to wield a blue pencil here.

Thank you for the translation in one line of what people have tried to say to me. All I need is more schooling in my mother tongue.

Have a nice day

 

[mercury]

I have had some rather stupid disagreements on FH but this one sure ends up in the top three.

Couldn't agree more. Your perogative to butt out...And if you don't know the difference between font and formatting, Im not being paid to give you a lecture on it. Go discover.

 

[Qbic]

Couldn't agree more. Your perogative to butt out...

Correct me if I am wrong but you are the one who started this whole discussion and the second someone disagrees with you on a public forum you tell them to butt out?

 

[Golena]

You know the english definitions of stuff, that's great. Means nothing ofc, but it's great!

Like everything else you've posted you've completely missed the point. There's more than your way of looking at stuff, and when you learn to accept this then i'm sure you'll be able i'm sure to put together a sensible argument, but at the moment your failing.

What the dictionary definition of quote might be is meaningless. The thing that matters is how the function is used in every day practices here on this forum. Again you've completely ignored this however, and wandered off down your own little mercury hates Vavi path, throwing toys left, right and center as you go.

What is blatently clear is that everything comes back to "I hate Vavi". Now i've no idea what he's done to you, and neither do I really care. I'm fairly sure most other people don't give a crap either tbh. At the moment however he's looking like a fairly sane normal person, and your looking like a crazy paranoid person in need of some kind of psychiotrist. Let the argument go already.. Yes you don't like him.. we all got that 3 threads ago.

Most of the stuff you've said is your personal opinion, and you've gone to great lengths to point out that it's how you feel not how other people feel. Yet somehow anyone disagreeing or thinking differently from your personal opinions is deeply insulting and offensive to you. There's a difference between stating how you feel about something, and attacking people who feel differently. Why is it not ok for people to have differing opinions to you, without them being some evil person that must be shunned?

You've also not stated any real reasons WHY you feel like that, which makes the entire exercise fairly pointless. After 3 threads, i've still not had any explanation as to why a lotto is so important to you, other than lots of insults about people who don't do them not being arsed. I've explained fairly clearly on many occasions why I think they are a bad idea for raids that I run. All i've got out of you is "ffs lazy idiot can't even make someone else lotto holder so I can get my lotto!!". It's not discussing your points, it's throwing them down other people's necks while screaming.. This is what I think, memememe, didn't you hear me, I THINK THIS!!!!

Either you are completely off your rocker, or your not as calm and collected as you think you are at the moment. My guess is your just bored and enjoying the attention, which would explain the need to shout about how your a girl at every available opportunity. Something that's not even slightly relevant to anything else your saying.

 

[Ingafgrinn Macabre]

I'm sorry mercury. Quoting is indeed to repeat the exact words. Changing the font or format doesn't matter. Otherwise you wouldn't be able to quote something that originally was said verbally, because if you cannot change the format you'd need to add a cassette or CD with every book.

as it's printed in the oxford:

quote

• verb
  1. repeat or copy out (a passage from a text or speech by another). > repeat a passage or statement from.
  2. (quote someone/thing as) put forward or describe someone or something as being.
  3. give someone (an estimated price). > (quote someone/thing at/as) name someone or something at (specified odds).
  4. Stock Exchange give (a company) a listing on a stock exchange.
• noun
  1. a quotation.
  2. (quotes) quotation marks.

PHRASES

quote —— unquote informal used parenthetically to indicate the beginning and end of a quotation.​

ORIGIN

Middle English (originally 'mark a book with numbers or marginal references'): from medieval Latin quotare, from quot 'how many', or from medieval Latin quota (see quota).​

I'm sorry but it doesn't say anything about the form of the original text versus the quoted version. Infact, not all books use the same font, so those books don't use quotes? I'm afraid you're not right here. You can quote someone but want to make a few lines bold or underlined to emphasize them or whatever. Doesn't make it less of a quote. (aslong as the wording is the same though)

 

[mercury]

Ffs

You know the english definitions of stuff, that's great. Means nothing ofc, but it's great!

What the dictionary definition of quote might be is meaningless.

Sorry, but knowing what words mean is far from nothing, otherwise there'd be no meaningful communication.
I wonder why you chose me to throw the dictionary at? I would never have even thought about bringing in such heavy armour until someone else did. I read dictionaries for breakfast. Seems to me its Golena can't stand Mercury rather than any rational reason. Look to the source.

The thing that matters is how the function is used in every day practices here on this forum. Again you've completely ignored this however, and wandered off down your own little mercury hates Vavi path, throwing toys left, right and center as you go.

As far as I can see the quote function works on this Forum as on any other. Far from ignoring it, I try to use it. Maybe it's just me, but I would no more think of putting my own formatting on somebody else's words, and then presenting them as my own than I would of claiming unique loot items on a Raid just because I'm the leader. Both are easy to do and not that important in the long run, but is it right to do them? I've even had 'quote' so badly misused that words I never said have been laid on me. So there's not much point in talking about how the quote function is used, when I'm objecting to its MISuse. I haven't seen either of these abuses anywhere else on FH. If I'm throwing toys around, at least they're adult toys.

What is blatently clear is that everything comes back to "I hate Vavi". Now i've no idea what he's done to you, and neither do I really care. I'm fairly sure most other people don't give a crap either tbh. At the moment however he's looking like a fairly sane normal person, and your looking like a crazy paranoid person in need of some kind of psychiotrist. Let the argument go already.. Yes you don't like him.. we all got that 3 threads ago.

Not everything, and I don't hate him at all. It's down to him and a couple of others that this loot claiming ever came up on Prydwen at all. It's what he did that I object to, not what he is. I had hoped that maybe the argument had become about issues, not people, but your whole post is aimed at attacking me, my ideas, my mentality, my gender and my motives. You left out my cat, btw. In fact, you are doing exactly what you accuse me of, pushing YOUR ideas of what a raid should be and dissing any that don't fit your mold.

Yet somehow anyone disagreeing or thinking differently from your personal opinions is deeply insulting and offensive to you. There's a difference between stating how you feel about something, and attacking people who feel differently. Why is it not ok for people to have differing opinions to you, without them being some evil person that must be shunned?

Odd interpretation of what I said at the start of this thread. For the record, NOTHING in any of the three threads you're banging on about have I found deeply insulting and offensive, and especially not if it's simply a difference of their opinion from mine. I feel I have the right to lay into someone who calls me names as listed elsewhere, unless they're j/k. My dad and I differ alot in the way we think. But he's neither evil nor shunned by me.

You've also not stated any real reasons WHY you feel like that, which makes the entire exercise fairly pointless. After 3 threads, i've still not had any explanation as to why a lotto is so important to you, other than lots of insults about people who don't do them not being arsed. I've explained fairly clearly on many occasions why I think they are a bad idea for raids that I run. All i've got out of you is "ffs lazy idiot can't even make someone else lotto holder so I can get my lotto!!". It's not discussing your points, it's throwing them down other people's necks while screaming.. This is what I think, memememe, didn't you hear me, I THINK THIS!!!!

I'll try ignoring the rant in that. I assumed you'd read and understood what I'd said previously. The Raid Leader thread stemmed from the sh*t I got during an ML10 raid because I'd let in to the BG someone who, by not following the usual procedures had left himself open to accusations of stealing. I set down a few ideas that I'd found helped to silence the moaners, and I said so. As I've also said elsewhere, about the only things I would want or need from a lotto would be Remains for a trophy I hadn't got already. There's no such animal on an ML raid. I do not use ffs in my posts - often - and I can't remember calling anybody an idiot, but Im not going to troll through and look, so I'll assume your telling it as it is.

I also don't notice any use by you of the words FFA or modded, both legit methods of raids you seem to ignore. Is it because they don't fit in with YOUR notions of what a raid should be? Or are you going to say its only pure ML rushes we're talking about? Tell me the last ML you went on where there weren't all sorts of requests for artis to be done at the same time, then tell me the boss mobs don't drop loot players want. Seen the price of Immolated Ring or Ring of the Heaven on ME ?

You say its just me, but suggest an ML10 raid without a lotto and they'd laugh at you and leave you to it. Same with a Dragon Raid - its not the items people go for particularly - there aren't that many to go round, but there's always a lotto. So don't push me out on a limb on my own, there's room for a few more yet.

Either you are completely off your rocker, or your not as calm and collected as you think you are at the moment. My guess is your just bored and enjoying the attention, which would explain the need to shout about how your a girl at every available opportunity. Something that's not even slightly relevant to anything else your saying.

Look back at your post, then tell me its me screaming. Tell me where I've suggested someone who disagrees with me is 'off their rocker' or 'needing a psychiatrist' or 'a crazed paranoid person' or 'evil' or 'to be shunned'. These are, ofc, the considered opinion of a calm and collected person.

As for being a girl, I bring that in only when somebody who happens to know I am mentions it, when it's used to couch some smart-arse comment about 'go and get laid and leave the discussion to the real men' or refers to me as 'my lady' and a whole lot of others.. Its not something I need to justify. It just is.

And you know the funny thing? I cannot ever imagine that a post like yours would ever have been written by a woman. Now I wonder why I might think that?

 

[mercury]

Correct me if I am wrong but you are the one who started this whole discussion and the second someone disagrees with you on a public forum you tell them to butt out?

You are wrong. I did not tell you to do anything. I simply suggested that if you thought the disagreement so stupid as to be amongst your top 3 ever, its your right not to take part. I think you may need that dictionary a little more than I do, though I may have spelt 'perogative' wrong. One day your 'quote' may get tampered with, and I rather think you may feel the same as I do -

:touch:

 

[mercury]

Format

I'm sorry mercury. Quoting is indeed to repeat the exact words. Changing the font or format doesn't matter.

Yes, it does.

Yes, it does.

Yes, it does.

Yes it does.

Yes it does

Do you say these in the same way? Doesn't the formatting tell you anything about what the typist ws trying to get across?

Inga :

are you saying the above mean exactly the same to you?. You are forgetting that in a word processor or editor the formatting carries hidden value whereas a formal font does not. I know that caps was not used in the particular misquote, but how many times have you typed something in a chat screen and had to say 'oops caps' or similar. UPPER CASE is agreed to mean SHOUTING, and italics, underlining and bold or all three are all means of emphasis that should not be imposed on original words that did not have them.

*************************************************************

Are you saying these mean exactly the same to you? You are forgetting that in a word processor or editor the formatting carries hidden value whereas a formal font does not. I know that caps was not used in the particular misquote, but how many times have you typed something in a chat screen and had to say 'oops caps' or similar. Upper Case is agreed to mean shouting, and italics, underlining and bold are all means of emphasis that should not be imposed on original words that did not have them.

*****************************************************

Do the above hastily compiled paragraphs say the same thing to you? If they do, then I'm wrong and formatting carries no hidden value.
I can say that its overuse in the first irritates me, for instance, and would suggest a child may have done it.​

Fonts (the formal type) do not carry the same implications. Times New Roman or Arial - makes no odds. Informal fonts are, ofc a different matter I need not explain.​

​

 

[Qbic]

You are wrong. I did not tell you to do anything. I simply suggested that if you thought the disagreement so stupid as to be amongst your top 3 ever, its your right not to take part. I think you may need that dictionary a little more than I do, though I may have spelt 'perogative' wrong. One day your 'quote' may get tampered with, and I rather think you may feel the same as I do -

:touch:

I doubt I will ever feel the same way you do as we have totally different views on this subject. I sincerely don't need a dictionary though I admit using one for a post earlier. If I misunderstood your suggestion for my right not to take part then that was my wrong but your "suggestions" aren't always clear. To end this topic (from my side anyway; doubt you will stop) maybe if you are a bit more clear in your posts you might avoid threads and difficulties like these in the future.

 

[mercury]

maybe if you are a bit more clear in your posts you might avoid threads and difficulties like these in the future.

Well, it's advice that can be acted on at least. Not sure I want to avoid anything tho.

Anway, I'm off to bed.

 

[Golena]

Sorry, but knowing what words mean is far from nothing, otherwise there'd be no meaningful communication.

There's also knowing how they are used in certain contexts. Yet this seems to of escaped you.

Seems to me its Golena can't stand Mercury rather than any rational reason. Look to the source.

I neither like or dislike you. Again if you stepped back and stopped being so worked up, which you obviously are however much you try to deny it, you might realise this.

Maybe it's just me, but I would no more think of putting my own formatting on somebody else's words, and then presenting them as my own than I would of claiming unique loot items on a Raid just because I'm the leader.

Here's another go at Vavi? Didn't you have a huge go at him earlier about how you shouldn't quote an entire post, but select certain bits of it instead?
Only quoting a bit of someone can be just as misleading as highlighting or underlining a bit, probably more so.

Not everything, and I don't hate him at all. It's down to him and a couple of others that this loot claiming ever came up on Prydwen at all. It's what he did that I object to, not what he is.

And you ran your own raids instead because you disliked it? No you just kept attending his, so your as guilty as everyone else for the loot claiming. Now get over something that happened what, 2 years ago, and move on. You said that Vavi was the only person organising raids.. all it would of taken was one person doing none pre-claim raids, and most would probably of stopped attending the pre-claim ones.

but your whole post is aimed at attacking me, my ideas, my mentality, my gender and my motives.

How am I attacking your gender, please explain this one to me!! Your gender shouldn't be an issue, as I tried to say. It's you that keeps bringing it up, and up and up. I'm also not attacking your ideas, more the way your trying to put them across.

I also don't notice any use by you of the words FFA or modded, both legit methods of raids you seem to ignore. Is it because they don't fit in with YOUR notions of what a raid should be?

Yes, they are both Legit methods of doing raids, and I haven't talked about them because I don't use them. If other people want to use those rules for raids then I have no problem with that. I have no notions of what a raid should be, just of the type that I try to lead. I've attended plenty of FFA raids in my time. If it's a raid that doesn't fit in with my notions, like most of Vavi's have been then I simply won't attend. If other people enjoy them, then what's the problem.

Or are you going to say its only pure ML rushes we're talking about?

You hijacked a ML rush thread, so my comments were based on how ML rushes tended to be held in the other realms, and ones i'd done. If you want to talk about other types of raids, then maybe pick a different place from a ML rush thread to do it? I don't think that lotto's work well on an ML rush, I wouldn't flame someone if they wanted to try it tho. It's my opinion that they are better without, if someone else disagrees, it's not hard for them to run their own and attend that one instead now is it.

Tell me the last ML you went on where there weren't all sorts of requests for artis to be done at the same time, then tell me the boss mobs don't drop loot players want. Seen the price of Immolated Ring or Ring of the Heaven on ME ?

That would be the last 50 ML raids i've lead, thanks for asking.. If a immo ring or ring of the heavens drops then it goes to someone there hitting the mob. When you've explained how this is less fair than someone lottoing it 20 seconds later between the same players then i'll accept you have a point.

You say its just me, but suggest an ML10 raid without a lotto and they'd laugh at you and leave you to it. Same with a Dragon Raid - its not the items people go for particularly - there aren't that many to go round, but there's always a lotto. So don't push me out on a limb on my own, there's room for a few more yet.

There's a lotto because there's always a lotto. Well i'm glad we've got a good reason! I can't think of any reason why a lotto on ML10 would be needed. Take 3 balanced full groups and everyone has the same chance of getting an item as they would if there was a lotto. You can do it either way without any real issue. It's down to preference, there's not a right way or wrong way.

As for being a girl, I bring that in only when somebody who happens to know I am mentions it

Or in your very first line of the post.. I'm a girl, look at me!!!

It is not about women's rights - it's sheer coincidence I'm a girl. If I'd been a bloke it would have been the same, but with more fists.

And you know the funny thing? I cannot ever imagine that a post like yours would ever have been written by a woman. Now I wonder why I might think that?

Yet after all that ranting you've still failed to answer the simple question, why is the lotto so important.
What is it about typing /random 100 instead of letting the random number generator that the game uses when the loot is picked up that makes it so special.

What i've realised is that your actually far more interested in arguing with people and causing a scene than you are in any content your actually saying.. cya same time next month?