On clerics and the future of Albion

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robillard

Guest
I have to agree with krillin on the point about infiltrators, the trend in there creation is really damaging the integrity of the realm as whole, both in terms of its offensive and defensive capabilities. I implore people to start playing sorcerers again in spite of what people may tell you about the upcoming mez nerf. Minstrels because as well as being fun to play and relatively easy to level they are a great asset to the realm. And clerics, even regarding what I am going to say below they will still be a very effective class, and will never have any difficulties in getting groups.
.
I may at this point have people thinking as I have seen on the boards in the past

" dont play for the ****ing realm play for yourself"

But if this current trend continues nobody will enjoy playing in Albion.

As opposed to many players in Albion I do actually believe that the realms are almost completely balanced in terms of the classes after the patch. The reason Albion feels hard done by is, as krillin pointed out, having played a character to level 50 ( I guess on average 25 days playing time) and suddenly find its role completely altered is at the very least disheartening.

So what can be done to remedy the concerns felt by all realms:

Well we face difficulties here, obviously the upcoming decrease in cleric's powers are justified, the reasons for this have been outlined on numerous occasions, and I think for the most part people agree that this is justified
Many clerics who no longer want to play the new role that has been forced upon them, would like to change class to one more akin to the original specifications of a smite cleric. However the problem in this again arises from the fact that having put a lot of time and effort into reaching level 50, they justifiably do not wish to do it again.

Ok having established this forced change as unfair what realistic options are there?
Well some clerics may suggest that they should be allowed to change to a completely new class at level 50, this it seems to me is the only fair option to the cleric, but it is in term completely against the roleplaying spirit of the game, and further more is completely unfair if other classes were not allowed to do the same. So to conclude this point, it is totally unviable

In the end it looks as though the cleric will either have to live as a smite cleric with its power to damage significantly decreased, or simply respec to a different template. I am sure that the cleric will overcome this adversity and Albion will continue to flourish.

I’d just like to finish my post on a general observation about people in RvR.
I understand that the sub 50 people I see everyday in Emain (especially scouts) want to experience the frontier, but please guys level to 50 first.
I here people whining about not being able to get into xp groups everyday, and frankly its BS, you’ve never had it so good.
When I was levelling in the low 40’s 6 months or so ago we didn’t even have itemised dungeons for the most part, let alone DF. So my message is stop bitching and follow my steps to success

1)Applicable mainly to the major culprits, scouts. Take yourself of anon

2)Actually get yourself into the xp areas rather than hanging around in emain occasionally sending to group leaders to see if they have a space, the likelihood is someone standing near the group just got your space

3)This one is the best of the lot, instead of relying on other people to make your groups, start them yourself, use the game commands to help you ie. /who <class> 40 45 this really will allow you to organise groups quickly

4)Finally, make a group of friends of a similar level, this helps in two ways, it means guaranteed groups and also groups that understand each other meaning xping is both easier and more enjoyable

I know with regards to the later part of my post people may think I’m being a complete arse, but seriously I’m just trying to help those people I hear everyday saying I cant xp to 50 and who are generally stuck in the low to mid 40’s.
I can tell you, level 50’s are far more fun to play in RvR

Hope you enjoyed my slight rant, and a very good evening to you all.
 
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hrodelbert

Guest
Wiser words have rarely been spoken on this forum :D
 
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Blood

Guest
its all lies... dont listen to them!!

if you want to play a really fun class, try cabalists!!

or if you want to be UBER, play a paladin!! (real ultimate power)
 
P

Pixie.Pebr

Guest
<slaps Blood>

Well said Robillard.
If one has not the patience to get/make a group, then how the hell do they expect to have the patience to level to 50? :D
 
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corranhorn1

Guest
training

well simply put i find training a bloody bore, i done it for say 6months and at season 43 i am doing rather well on the frontier,, it taken me just a couple weeks to get my merc to 87k odds worth of rp and i do a lot of killing the enemy myself so cant accuse me of leaching, i regularly go to odins alone or with one or two of my friends and skirmish there, yes 50 makes more effective, higher damage more life, but in battle i dont take up a healers power much, and always do my fair share, i am team player, i sacrifice myself to help the group, and have many times purposely died to a stealther just to get them to show theirselfs for others to kill them....

training to 50 is a novel idea, one day i will do it, but lyonesse is awful, hate it there, darkness is doable but limited to if can get in and dartmoor is non existant eveen thou it great place to train,,, however when do train i know how to get groups from scratch, but i dont play this game to fight mindless enemies, i like to fight against something with intellegence, that uses tactics, not lets just stand here and hit hoping for best, RvR is what i enjoy, and that cant be changed, i shant give up on it just cause a few arent willing to have a non 50 in the group.
 
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old.Atrox

Guest
i like to fight against something with intellegence,

and still you go to Odins to fight mids ?


anyway I totaly agree with Robillard
 
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[PS]Riddler

Guest
The bit about leveling to 50 before going to Emain is complete BS imho. Im level 44 and i dont have much problem going there, i see quite a few others who are yellow/blue/greencon! If i remember correctly, in the beta days u had level 29's running around in emain :) Dont put down lowbies, just because they cant sit behind their PC for 24hrs a day and level to 50 doesent mean they cant be as effective as you in RvR!
Cheerio!
 
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old.Atrox

Guest
just because they cant sit behind their PC for 24hrs a day and level to 50 doesent mean they cant be as effective as you in RvR!

Im afraid it does...
Sub 50's have a greater chance to get resisted/miss, and the dmg output are lower.
Thou I rather have a good lvl45 player thena stupid lvl50 beside me, thou they would be of more use if they were lvl50 and good.
 
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Roalith

Guest
Originally posted by old.Atrox


Im afraid it does...

I have to disagree with you, and agree with Robilard here. I can craft all ram parts. I can carry a ram on my own, and build it within 20 seconds of getting on a door. I can take said door down within 5 minutes, provided they ain't relic door level :)D).

I'm level 43. I'm not useful?
 
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old.Atrox

Guest
your usefullness is not the issue here, no1 ever said sub50's were useless, just that they would be -more- usefull if they were lvl50
 
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sendar

Guest
well...

No... robillard said not to goto RVR untill 50. Which I think is wrong.
Like rolaith, I can also carry over 250lbs of wood and repair upgrade doors, build rams etc all on me own. Im 45 and im sheild spec, I now have 45 +7 in sheidl, meaning a lvl 52 sheild is guarding who I choose in my grp. I also use slam and let the backup squidgeys pulversise them while the enemy stands there counting the seconds. Also, cos im 45, they dont target me first, they go for the higher lvls around me. BIG mistake... if I miss my slam style, I keep trying, stuck to them while they chase the lvl 50's about. I usually land it on first or 2nd blow, and then thwack the hell outa them, also allowing my grp mates to get stuck in.

Its good to lvl, and help the realm as best you can, but c'mon, nice to have a break from pigmeys every now and again! Lower lvls have their place in rvr too. Guarding and sticking with the casters for instance... keeping lookout, scouting out the enemy. One of the best scouts I know is about lvl 35! Constantly reporting back numbers and position etc. Infact, being low lvl helps, a nice healthy fear of death means he always keeps is distance, keeps stealthed and is very cautios.

anyway, /rant off :)
 
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Taggart

Guest
" dont play for the ****ing realm play for yourself"

wOOt !!! that was me that said that on a previous thread lol.

Anyway, about the "smite clerics" i think you assholes should shut the fuck up and stop crying!! Atleast you guys had it good! Paladins have never had it good at one point, you don't hear people saying NERF paladins!! i always hear people saying NERF smite clerics, and for a good reason, they are awesome in rvr, we have never had it good, this is why basically every lvl 50 paladin has a high lvl alt that they want to become their main. So i say shut they fuck up! About clerics being a main character in rvr, ive hardly ever had a heal from a cleric and when im rezzed its always been from a paladin!

So try being a paladin! were perma nerfed.
 
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darbey

Guest
I agree ,with most of originators post however saying to level to 50 is wrong and a little irresponsible. Jeez i was rr3 before my warden hit 45 on MLF. Fair enough certain classes it helps to be on the same playing level but not necessarily all of them. Saying that certainly wont detract from the elitist image many level 50 club people have.
 
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Wibbler2

Guest
//rant//

So, let me get this straight, because I am not level 50, I should not be in the frontier.

Can you tell this to all the people I have ressed

Can you tell this to the people I have killed

I have been in the frontiers since I was level 20, sure I get owned lots, but it's a damned site more interesting than levelling all the time.

Yes, I am getting closer to 50, 3.2 levels to go, but I am certainly not going to give up going to RVR until I hit it, i'd be more likely to give up playing altogether!!!

And yes, I play a gimpaladin...

//rant off//

<goes off to make a nice warm cup of cocoa to calm down>
 
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hangianix

Guest
Originally posted by Taggart
" About clerics being a main character in rvr, ive hardly ever had a heal from a cleric and when im rezzed its always been from a paladin!

They are nerfing the smiters not the other clerics and you know that you get heal or not, doesn't depend on the kind of cleric. :) I'm also a smiter (44+9) but never got complains 'cause my healing. And well, if you never got healing then you always chosen wrong company. Most of the cleric who i saw out there were healing not only their grp but a lot of soloer too.


__________________
Killerbee lvl 50 Cleric
7XX Armorcrafter
Carnificis Ministerium

"[Party] Hitokiri "but if u come here ill ave to pass down my medal of crazyness to u"

I'm still waiting Hito...
 
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Danya

Guest
Level 50 is a lot more effective than 4x for one major reason - epic armour. If you don't have epic, you're going to take more damage, have worse stats etc. The difference is significant. Lower levels aren't useless in RvR, but they would be a lot more useful at 50 with epic.
 
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cHodAX

Guest
100 more Alb's with the same attitude as robillard an we would be in much better shape.
 
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sendar

Guest
yeh

/rant on again
yes, ure right danyan. Lvl 50's are more "usefull", still, does that warrant the fact to say "ok, dont come ere unless ure the best you can be" ? I think not.

Yeh, albion would be far better off in rps, relics etc if everyone in emain was lvl 50. But that aint gonna happen is it? I mean, lvl 50 is SUPPOSED to be hard to get! Thats why u get that warm glow and feel proud to be a 50, cos u have spent over 600 hours unfront of your pc!

Bit cheaky to expect everyone else to put such time and effort into what is in affect a game. And then tell them they cannot enjoy the main aspect of the game cos u dont want them around you, making your realm look bad and reducing the rp's u may get.

Anyway, thankfully not many people have this "50's only" elitist view, its only a few people, and they are allowed their own opinions, just thought I would voice mine. :)
 
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Taggart

Guest
I sure as hell don't think u need to be lvl 50 to be of any real use in rvr, knudden from my guild, who is a smite cleric had 200k+ rp's when he just hit lvl 45, so stick that in your pipe and smoke it! :p
200k+ rp may not seem like alot to some people, but to alot of us it does, he has a shitload more than most peeps i know that are lvl 50!
 
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robillard

Guest
my point about experience is not elitest, merely practical.

ok so you've spent all this time getting to, shall we say level 45, why suddenly stop there, thus limiting for full potential of your character massively.
I seem to remember that getting from 45 to 50 isnt actually that bad, you just have to follow my previous advice ( the same formula I used to get to 50) and you should be able to half ding at least every other evening, hence a little dedication delivers huge rewards( ang the difference between level 45 and 50 characters really is significant)

Just to emphasize my point about

in the catagory of the sub 50's only 13 have more than 100k rp
in the post 49 catagory there are 100 ( results for Albion Prydwen)

I would also like to say to you that the Rp's you may think you are missing out on by the time taken levelling to 50, will be more than compensated for by your extra rp earning ability at 50

more food for thought for those mid 40's I see in emain every day
 
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Taggart

Guest
Easier said then done matey, its not the easiest of times to xp atm, when i was xping with my paladin used to be tons of tangler grps and all the witherwoode spots had grps at em, now ya lucky if ya see one tangler grp and one withers grp and trying to find cc for a tanglers grp is fucking murder to find. Easy enough to get that mini ding a day if your able to find a grp or the right people to make one!
 
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sendar

Guest
not saying we stop at 45 :)


I xp alot in df, the xp is quick there and the cash is great (im a crafter so need cash) So, I rvr for a bit when we dont have df... then go df lvl a bit... then maybe trees/tangs when no good grps... then rvr some more... anyone not 50 is going to be doing something like this. Doubt there are many who have reached 45 and stopped xping. personally, I would agree with you there, anyone stopping at a mid 40 is loosing out. But thats their choice, and I wont judge them :)

Plus I doubt anyone is :) Heck, DF is positively fun compared to some nights in emain playing "follow the zerg" :p
 
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hrodelbert

Guest
you can't fight Rob's logic :D . A lot of sub 50's are getting the wrong impression here Rob didn't say sub 50's are yseless in RvR he said they are massively below their ultimate potential. I group with loads of blue cons in RvR but when it comes down to it when a blue con attacks me 1v1 for example i resist most the stuff they throw and me and then beat the crap out of them. Not saying i'm uber this is just a simple fact
 
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robillard

Guest
with regards to the point about not seeing any groups in lyonesse I accept this wholeheartedly. This is why I saw it as important to include step 3 in my guide to levelling.

As to your point about CC this as I pointed out, is the unfortunate consequence of the alterations to classes in the upcoming patch.

The answer, although it is a long time since I did any xping at these levels is I believe to be found in DF. I have gone on several hunts here with my ~40 character and i think the xp is as good as lyonesse but is somewhat less dependent upon CC

Even taking this into account I agree with your point that xping is difficult, but it is still by no means impossible as long as it is done properly.

As a foot note to xping (and I know many people will disagree with me here) make full groups of 8 as in the end when you consider you should definately die less, you will make more xp.

As well as this you will make more friends, and better understand how you interact with other classes, this will be a great advantage when you hit 50 and come to RvR.

A final point on this issue is, if you care for the realm as a whole, you should let others into the group if you have space, even if they do not perfectly fill the role you intended the space for ( this especially applies to inviting scouts who have a harder time than most).

I for one when I was leader of groups in the past always played with a full group, and didnt discriminate over the last couple of spaces, unless there was no cleric or CC in the remaining 6.

Hopefully if people followmy advice Allbion will be a happier place :)
 
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robillard

Guest
Originally posted by sendar

Plus I doubt anyone is :) Heck, DF is positively fun compared to some nights in emain playing "follow the zerg" :p [/B]

following the zerg is by the way the quickest way to stop enjoying the game forever......dont do it ;)
 
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mercurial

Guest
Sad Sad Sad

In response to robillard's post about the "deserved" cleric nerf.

I must say I'm not surprised to see the nerf to the cleric being backed by members of my own realm. Not surprised but disappointed, Hibbies and Mids sure I can understand them, afterall any class that kills your uber char must be overpowered, but my own realm? that takes the biscuit.

The point is that the cleric nerf not only hurts the 48 spec "Wizards in chain" smite cleric but also the those that spec in rejuv and in enhance.

The nerf lessens damage across the board on smite not just the "uber" 48 spec smite, which isnt so uber in comparison to to other casters, and makes it ineffective for all clerics regardless of smite spec. Casting times, mana pools, range blah blah blah etc.

Though the true nerf is the raising of the insta mez from 30s to 5mins, which is truly damaging to albion but just in general pve whilst trying to level.

But there's no point in mentioning that as I'm sure you're all experts on clerics and have levelled one to 50 ;). And I'm sure my points will be blown out of the water by your superior knowledge of my class.

I'd never realised to be truthful how much clerics were reviled in albion until I started to read the vnboards and to see the same illinformed Sh*te spewed over here makes me wonder why we bother.

Well good luck Albion all the PAs/first aids/IPs aren't worth bugger all if you can't find a healer to group with whilst levelling in PVE to get those precious realm points, don't believe me? do a /who cleric and see how many low levels you'll find actively levelling to 50 which aren't buffbots for BG or played by new players who will give up when they are a little more well informed.

You may then want to review the contents of your levelling guide...

Oh and by the way....

Tanks: USE STYLES!!
Casters: CAST SPELLS!!!

And stop trying to tell me how to play my class. I heal for 90% of the time I rvr - I miss whole battles while playing whack a mole trying to heal people who have ran out of range/ running about trying to get in range/LOS, doing a good spec ress only to have a pally nip in and do a "quickie". Hey then, someone (not grouped with me or maybe even grouped with me) shouts "heal plz" and i'm flamed for not giving it them, well thanks.

Mercurial Lvl50 Cleric (standing motionless at a PK near you soon)
Lionhearts
www.mumer.com
 
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mercurial

Guest
I'd read his post previously (one of the reasons I had replied to yours). His perspective is from a 48 spec cleric totally different from the majority of other clerics I have met.

The matter of playing my class was not directed at you directly but more at the collective "other guy". And i was having a bit of a rant by then :). In fact the whole post was to be honest (aimed at albion as a whole not you personally).

I don't think that comment which you chose to remark upon negated the other points in my post though.

Mercurial Lvl50 Cleric
Lionhearts
www.mumer.com
 

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