Ninjitsu is bad for you

[Will]

I decided to go along to a Ninjitsu class on Tuesday evening. Since I took up cycling, I've been impressed with the sudden appearence of muscles, and I felt I should do something with them.

So along I go to the class. Get through the warm-up fine, my cardio-vascular is pretty good. Then there is some work on grabs, locks, and throws. I felt a twinge in my back when I got thrown once, but thought nothing of it.

Get home, and the next morning I've really stiff. Not unexpected, I've been using totally different muscles from normal. Two days later, the stiffness is gone, and I've got full freedom of movement again...

...except, I've done something nasty to one of my left ribs. I've either bruised it really badly, or I've cracked it. It hurts to breath deeply, and walking is very sore indeed. Though for some reason, cycling is ok (just).

I might take up Aikido instead.

 

[gunner440]

hum stiffness

did you do a warm down?

it's just as important as the warm up

 

[Wij]

I'm often really stiff in the morning.

 

[Will]

I did warm down. The stiffness (not that kind, Wij) was just down to heavy use of muscles that don't normally get exercised. For example, press-ups work muscles in my arms that do very little when I'm riding my bike.

But this pain in my chest is not related to that. All my aches apart from this were gone by yesterday lunchtime. I think I've managed to really damage something. I'll just have to bear it out though, there isn't anything you can do with any of the possible causes of this injury, apart from rest.

 

[gunner440]

i think you should have gotten into the classes a bit slower i.e. not just a warm up then into the training. could have done some other excercises that involve the parts often used in ninjitsu?


also about the getting hurt bit, weren't you shown how to take and absorb force/damage to you? e.g part of rugby training so you dont curl up in pain after every tackle

I'd have thought that would be the first things taught, as it is a 'contact' sport isn't it?

 

[Will]

i think you should have gotten into the classes a bit slower i.e. not just a warm up then into the training. could have done some other excercises that involve the parts often used in ninjitsu?


also about the getting hurt bit, weren't you shown how to take and absorb force/damage to you? e.g part of rugby training so you dont curl up in pain after every tackle

Well, it was an organised class, so I went along not knowing what to except. I think I was just extremely unlucky to do this.

It is full contact, no pads. One of the other attendees, who was doing a grading, had his collar bone dislocated during a throw, so I guess I got off lightly.

 

[old.Tohtori]

The stiffness was just down to heavy use of muscles that don't normally get exercised.

Hihi...

 

[gunner440]

from what you say it seems you joined some intermediate/higher level class?
not using pads isn't very common for a first lesson..

and grabs/throws wouldnt be included in lesson 1 either i'd have thought as you havent been taught the fundementals yet

if it does turn out you joined the wrong class will you go back and try a beginner's one?

 

[Will]

from what you say it seems you joined some intermediate/higher level class?
not using pads isn't very common for a first lesson..

and grabs/throws wouldnt be included in lesson 1 either i'd have thought as you havent been taught the fundementals yet

if it does turn out you joined the wrong class will you go back and try a beginner's one?

There is no beginners class. There were twelve people there in total, including the instructor. Two of them had only been a few times before.

Ninjitsu doesn't do pads at all. It's just the nature of it. They went over breakfalls and stuff like that. I did martial arts a lot as a kid, so I picked them up again fast. It wasn't the hitting the floor that broke me, it was the streching over someones back that did it.

 

[Tom]

Will, you may have just strained your diaphragm. Best to goto hospital and have a quick checkup. Do it on a Sunday morning when things are a bit quiet.

 

[SilverHood]

if you break something while being thrown, then either
a) you're not being thrown properly
b) you're not landing properly

when I did Ju-Jutsu some years ago, the first thing we learnt was to fall properly... side, back and front. Maybe 20 minutes each session for the first few months, and then a bit less as you could do them. (the new people still had to do them, while we did more advanced falls and rolls)

Using pads isn't really neccessary when doing most martial art stuff... the only reason I can think of when using them, is to practise punches and kicks. (karate and taek wondo)

And yeah, as gunner said, it sounds like it's at quite a high level... if it really hurts, go see a doctor.... and have a chat with the instructor as to what you're supposed to be doing

 

[tris-]

in my job i do a lot of lifting which means i get a bad back. with the bad back ive also had painful ribs. sometimes i just get ribs hurting and not my back, other times it both. so it could be because of your back but like tom said its probably best to get it checked out.

 

[Will]

My money is on option A, as I felt my back twinge as I went over him. He used strength to pull me over him, rather than leverage and technique.

And I'm not really explaining this class very well. But I shall probably go for another class. I can afford to get injured all the time, it interfers with my mountain biking too much, and quite frankly, that's more important to me.

 

[SilverHood]

what type of throws were they?

Judo ones (like over the hip / shoulder?)

by the way, was the person throwing you an experienced person? or a new one like you?

 

[Cyfr]

I used to do Jujisu or however you spell it.. I was always getting hurt, oh and postions where your face ends up next to a ugly girls (smelly) fangita... *cringe*

 

[Will]

what type of throws were they?

Judo ones (like over the hip / shoulder?)

by the way, was the person throwing you an experienced person? or a new one like you?

Yeah, Judo-type throws, this one was over the back/shoulder I believe.

He was experienced, been doing it for a few years, but I do know him from outside the class, and we never really got along, so there is a possibility he did it on purpose. But there isn't any point thinking about that too much. I can't tell for definate that that was even the point I got injured.

 

[Ssera]

My money is on option A, as I felt my back twinge as I went over him. He used strength to pull me over him, rather than leverage and technique.

And I'm not really explaining this class very well. But I shall probably go for another class. I can afford to get injured all the time, it interfers with my mountain biking too much, and quite frankly, that's more important to me.

yup it sounds as he wasn't throwing you properly. I've been studying ninjutsu for the last 3 years and you occasionally do get injured or hurt. Eventually you get used to falling and taking hits until you can happily roll down a concrete pavement all day .

I also studied Aikido before then for a couple of years and I can assure you you'll get thrown around much more often than in ninjustu. Less direct strikes though

edit: oh the most important lesson I've picked up is to always always relax. If someone is throwing you and you're stiff as a post, then you'll get hurt. Same if someone is punching you, resisting a la Bruce Lee style will only hurt you more than just taking the blow in.

 

[Insane]

on a funny side note, my manager wants me to take up kung fu lessons...

he's the instructor of the class he wants me to attend

 

[Will]

I also studied Aikido before then for a couple of years and I can assure you you'll get thrown around much more often than in ninjustu. Less direct strikes though

Well, the reason I went for Aikido as my next option is that actually has a beginners class. Might be more suited to my current level. I do know how to relax and fall, but my muscle support is still not at it's best since I lost a load of weight last year. Due to illness, I was already skinny.

 

[TdC]

I used to do Jujisu or however you spell it.. I was always getting hurt, oh and postions where your face ends up next to a ugly girls (smelly) fangita... *cringe*

I'd have thought you'd enjoy that heh.

Will, it doesn't hurt (sic) to have a wee checkup mate. Walking about with bruised ribs is teh shite, I kid you not.

 

[Ssera]

Well, the reason I went for Aikido as my next option is that actually has a beginners class. Might be more suited to my current level. I do know how to relax and fall, but my muscle support is still not at it's best since I lost a load of weight last year. Due to illness, I was already skinny.

hmm we didn't have beginner classes when I started up - maybe it's a different school (I was doing Aikikai). Anyway, people tend to seem more friendly in Aikido (generally) and it's great for mental discipline as well as smacking people around

I've always thought the difference between Aikido and Ninjutsu is that in Aikido you give your oponent a chance to walk away, in Ninjutsu you don't

 

[SilverHood]

yup it sounds as he wasn't throwing you properly. I've been studying ninjutsu for the last 3 years and you occasionally do get injured or hurt. Eventually you get used to falling and taking hits until you can happily roll down a concrete pavement all day .

I also studied Aikido before then for a couple of years and I can assure you you'll get thrown around much more often than in ninjustu. Less direct strikes though

edit: oh the most important lesson I've picked up is to always always relax. If someone is throwing you and you're stiff as a post, then you'll get hurt. Same if someone is punching you, resisting a la Bruce Lee style will only hurt you more than just taking the blow in.

Hehe, some of the Aikido throws are great... the one were you place your foot on the persons stomach muscles and then roll on your back, using your momentum to hurl him across the room was my favourite (was also the most painful).

 

[TdC]

heh and I thought you weren't supposed to let go? oh well live and learn

 

[SilverHood]

hmm we didn't have beginner classes when I started up - maybe it's a different school (I was doing Aikikai). Anyway, people tend to seem more friendly in Aikido (generally) and it's great for mental discipline as well as smacking people around

I've always thought the difference between Aikido and Ninjutsu is that in Aikido you give your oponent a chance to walk away, in Ninjutsu you don't

Not trained Ninjitsu, but...

Aikido is more about self defence... very hard to be aggressive in Aikido... it's not like you can go over and force someone to hold your arm so you can do some fancy technique rendering him in pain on the floor.

 

[SilverHood]

heh and I thought you weren't supposed to let go? oh well live and learn

you're not, atleast for 90% of the throws when practising... (of course, on the street, you let them fall on the ground... the guy isn't getting up and throwing you afterwards )

 

[Ssera]

Not trained Ninjitsu, but...

Aikido is more about self defence... very hard to be aggressive in Aikido... it's not like you can go over and force someone to hold your arm so you can do some fancy technique rendering him in pain on the floor.

ah that's true in most cases but there are techniques in aikido where you'll attack your opponent first, without giving them a chance to attack you in the first place. They are quite rare though but it would be foolish to think that Aikido is 'only' countering someone's attack on you. There are ways to make someone grab you too. For example, you go and grab his neck with one hand and start squeezing. 99.9% of the time that person will grab your wrist to get you off. There you go, he's grabbing you, now flip him around a few times

Self defence means exactly that, defending yourself. If you see someone walk at you with a knife on a dark rainy night you're not gonna wait for him to lunge out, you're going to take him out first (or run away of course!).

It's not about doing set pieces against specific attacks but adapting to the situation. In most of our training sessions the last hour would be sparring, sometimes with special rules like 'no fists' or 'no pressure points', but there was no set way to do it.

If you're fighting someone and see an opening which you know will bring them down, use it! Not like O'Sensei will suddenly appear and tell you off!

 

[k9awya]

...except, I've done something nasty to one of my left ribs. I've either bruised it really badly, or I've cracked it.

i bet its bruised nerves!

happened to my brother, punched him a few times on tuesday and he stayed off work thurs/fri cause of it and went to hospital

 

[gunner440]

cracked rib? i think you'd have been in a bit more pain if it was that..

x-ray and doctor time ://///


thought x-rays are such a waste of time sitting for 10minutes, getting the x-ray done and another 10minutes of waiting (and i never got why i had to wait the extra time)

 

[old.Tohtori]

Found a pictar of Will

 

[gunner440]

Found a pictar of Will

you mean more like:

http://www.ridingclubs.org/images/pageimages/injured.jpg