TV New Season!

[Jupitus]

Just watched the new grand tour. … meh .. really.

Indeed - nowhere near as good as I'd hoped it would be....

 

[caLLous]

Even the cinematography wasn't up to the usual standards. The scripted jokes were just the same as all the other scripted jokes. Hammond capsizing the boat was good but - having just had a pretty serious forest fire about 20 km away - I didn't find the idea/imagery of emptying a fire engine for comedic purposes (no matter how obviously it was a joke and they had permission and blah blah blah) funny at all. Aside from that, it's like they had to make the show a certain length and didn't have enough ideas to fill it. Normally they take 3 cars/boats/vehicles and set off on an adventure but here they took 3 American cars and pissed around a bit, then suddenly they were in a field with 3 different American cars and... 3 Russian cars and then they were in 3 *different* American cars for about 3 minutes and then they were back in the original ones.

 

[Overdriven]

From the first 60m I've seen of GT:

No one wants to watch 3 people drive around Scotland. It's not interesting. They could have literally used any car from any country and still no one would want to watch it.

We want them driving through death filled possibilities and stuff we don't experience here (County wise)

They should have not bothered and then done a "drive across China" or something else like that.

 

[Gwadien]

We not gonna give them a covid pass?

 

[Moriath]

We not gonna give them a covid pass?

Nah they should have not bothered and waited till they could do something proper rather than this half hearted stuff

 

[Yoni]

7 episodes in and me and the Mrs are enjoying it. Quite dark in places but really well done.

We have watched 4 episodes- it is an excellent series

 

[MYstIC G]

Indeed - nowhere near as good as I'd hoped it would be....

Very mediocre this one. Like what was the point of being in the car park with the hunt? Moving a bin... wow 🙄

The ending was very flat as well

 

[Moriath]

Still loving Atypical. On netflix

not renewed for season 5 but still loving jennifer jason leigh after 3p years of seeing her naked in flesh and blood with rutger hauer

 

[Hawkwind]

Atypical was a decent show, the last season was not as good as previous ones for me and the Mrs though. Still better than most shows.

That scene in the Hitcher in the diner with the bowl of fries still gives me the chills, great film.

 

[Embattle]

View: https://twitter.com/LOTRonPrime/status/1422255647106617359/photo/1

 

[Scouse]

I'll watch it, of course, but meh tbh. It's just some made up shit in a lookalike Tolkin-esq, right?

 

[caLLous]

I still need to watch the films but I just... can't be bothered.

 

[Scouse]

I still need to watch the films but I just... can't be bothered.

First one is great. Goes downhill in a linear fashion from there. The third is a cringefest.

Worth it tho. The problem comes when they deviate too much from the book - which becomes more and more common. The "original" stuff is the worst stuff.

 

[caLLous]

I never read the books, I had no interest in fantasy stuff growing up. I enjoyed Game of Thrones (the first 7 seasons of it, anyway) without having read any GRRM stuff so maybe it'll be the same with Lord of the Rings.

 

[Raven]

I thought they were OK first time around, but they aged pretty badly. I read the books years ago, if they tried to fit everything in it would be an unfollowable mess and it would be 10 times as long.

 

[Aoami]

The films are amazing (and still amazing, great make-up > cgi), the books are even better. Anyone who disagrees is a heathen.

 

[Scouse]

The films are great, taken as a whole. The books make them look like the scribbled crayon drawings of a special needs child.

 

[Scouse]

Oh. The Hobbit films are unmitigated wank.

Apart from that it gave rise to this from the auralnauts:

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lcMkf2iq1Ac

 

[Moriath]

I'll watch it, of course, but meh tbh. It's just some made up shit in a lookalike Tolkin-esq, right?

You talkin like the books were factual and not made up.

 

[Embattle]

I've got the extended editions on blu-ray of both Lord and Hobbit, I may eventually get them on 4K and I'll certainly watch the series on Amazon.

 

[Aoami]

I've got the extended editions on blu-ray of both Lord and Hobbit, I may eventually get them on 4K and I'll certainly watch the series on Amazon.

The Hobbit was awful imo, but there are some decent enough fan edits that make it watchable. Such a shame as I'd basically been waiting for a good Hobbit film since I first read the book at about 7 or 8.

 

[Yoni]

I watch the extended version of lotr every time I am sick :/ - it is superb!

 

[Wij]

I watch the extended version of lotr every time I am sick :/ - it is superb!

I watch pr0n but ok.

 

[Scouse]

The Hobbit was awful imo, but there are some decent enough fan edits that make it watchable. Such a shame as I'd basically been waiting for a good Hobbit film since I first read the book at about 7 or 8.

Link to fan edits? They fucked up all over the place with that tbh. Especially with the original content.

 

[Scouse]

You talkin like the books were factual and not made up.

It depends on who does the making up.

A team of scriptwriters or an actual genius?

Tolkein's world-building has never been topped by another human as far as I'm aware. Even in the telling of the stories of ancient Greek or Roman gods. He invented multiple, complete, speakable langugaes on his journey and a full ancient history for middle earth. But that wasn't even scratching the surface. He was a hugely influential linguist and academic. I'm not going to do a potted history but stuff he 'casually' did shows the brilliance of his mind - like translate Beowulf and critique it to such a depth that he transformed our understanding of the ancient text - without ever publishing his translation (because it was for him, to help him - not everyone else. (His son did release it)).

So yes. He "made shit up". But, like everything, making shit up is hugely dependent on the talent and intellect of the person doing it.

I dislike fantasy in general. I think it's weak really - I much prefer hard sci-fi where you have to have a premise (with a solid scientific basis) and obey that ruleset and then create a wonderful fantasy that obeys those rules - and I think human intellect produces much better stories because of the self-imposed limitations sci-fi writers put themselves under.

Fantasy in general. Harry Potter? Yeah, you can magic your way out of any fucking situation. It has invention, but it is writ through with bullshit from beginning to end and is a comfort-blanket, not a piece of art that's capable of entertaining you emotionally and intellectually in a worthwhile way.

Tolkein, however, gets a pass. The completeness of his vision and the depth of imagination meant that, even though the world is built on fantastical notions, when he obeyed his rules it lifted his stories. And his stories were allegorical and prophetical and about the world he lived in, the people in it and the direction of travel mankind was taking. - His stories were worthwhile.

So yeah. It's about the who makes it up - and the medium through which that story is delivered. Books are software that run on the mind. Even the very best of TV and movies are, by comparison, the junk-food consumption model of the storytelling artform.

 

[Scouse]

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6de_SbVUVfA


Tolkein speaking this poem:

"Ah! like gold fall the leaves in the wind,
long years numberless as the wings of trees!
The long years have passed like swift draughts
of the sweet mead in lofty halls
beyond the West, beneath the blue vaults of Varda
wherein the stars tremble
in the voice of her song, holy and queenly.

Who now shall refill the cup for me?

For now the Kindler, Varda, the Queen of the stars,
from Mount Everwhite has uplifted her hands like clouds
and all paths are drowned deep in shadow;
and out of a grey country darkness lies
on the foaming waves between us,
and mist covers the jewels of Calacirya for ever.
Now lost, lost to those of the East is Valimar!

Farewell! Maybe thou shalt find Valimar!

Maybe even thou shalt find it! Farewell!"

(In Elvish):

Spoiler

"Ai! laurië lantar lassi súrinen,
yéni únótimë ve rámar aldaron!
Yéni ve lintë yuldar avánier
mi oromardi lisse-miruvóreva
Andúnë pella , Vardo tellumar
nu luini yassen tintilar i eleni
ómaryo airetári -lírinen.

Sí man i yulma nin enquantuva?

An sí Tintallë Varda Oiolossëo
ve fanyar máryat Elentári ortanë,
ar ilyë tier undulávë lumbulë;
ar sindanóriello caita mornië
i falmalinnar imbë met, ar hísië
untúpa Calaciryo míri oialë.
Sí vanwa ná, Rómello vanwa, Valimar!

Namárië! Nai hiruvalyë Valimar.
Nai elyë hiruva. Namárië!"

I like what one of the commenters quoted:

Lucas wrote a story, and imagined a world to contain it. Tolkien imagined a world, and told one of its stories.

 

[Moriath]

It depends on who does the making up.

A team of scriptwriters or an actual genius?

Tolkein's world-building has never been topped by another human as far as I'm aware. Even in the telling of the stories of ancient Greek or Roman gods. He invented multiple, complete, speakable langugaes on his journey and a full ancient history for middle earth. But that wasn't even scratching the surface. He was a hugely influential linguist and academic. I'm not going to do a potted history but stuff he 'casually' did shows the brilliance of his mind - like translate Beowulf and critique it to such a depth that he transformed our understanding of the ancient text - without ever publishing his translation (because it was for him, to help him - not everyone else. (His son did release it)).

So yes. He "made shit up". But, like everything, making shit up is hugely dependent on the talent and intellect of the person doing it.

I dislike fantasy in general. I think it's weak really - I much prefer hard sci-fi where you have to have a premise (with a solid scientific basis) and obey that ruleset and then create a wonderful fantasy that obeys those rules - and I think human intellect produces much better stories because of the self-imposed limitations sci-fi writers put themselves under.

Fantasy in general. Harry Potter? Yeah, you can magic your way out of any fucking situation. It has invention, but it is writ through with bullshit from beginning to end and is a comfort-blanket, not a piece of art that's capable of entertaining you emotionally and intellectually in a worthwhile way.

Tolkein, however, gets a pass. The completeness of his vision and the depth of imagination meant that, even though the world is built on fantastical notions, when he obeyed his rules it lifted his stories. And his stories were allegorical and prophetical and about the world he lived in, the people in it and the direction of travel mankind was taking. - His stories were worthwhile.

So yeah. It's about the who makes it up - and the medium through which that story is delivered. Books are software that run on the mind. Even the very best of TV and movies are, by comparison, the junk-food consumption model of the storytelling artform.

So you dont like fantasy You might be more forgiving if you liked the genre more

i just finished ‘the deed of paksinarrion’ was 3 books around 1500 pages of paladin awesomeness

 

[Scouse]

So you dont like fantasy You might be more forgiving if you liked the genre more

I'd be more forgiving if the genre itself had more in common with logic and reasoning and less in common with holiday chick-lit.

To be fair - science-fiction IS fantasy. It's just fantasy with a rational base.

 

[Zarjazz]

holiday chick-lit.

I think you've been reading the wrong kind of fantasy books.

 

[Moriath]

I'd be more forgiving if the genre itself had more in common with logic and reasoning and less in common with holiday chick-lit.

To be fair - science-fiction IS fantasy. It's just fantasy with a rational base.

Yup both fantasy. But fantasy in a book store is differently separated from sci-fi.

and i disagree about chick lit. No romance in the paladin book i mentioned. Completely the opposite.

i like sci-fi to watch. But not to read really. Its too constrained in logic.