[INFO] More updates to come (V1.0.5)

[Ogen]

very much so but I'm not gonna bother to explain why because you are probably just one of those million BW hater's that seem to be present on every forum centred around this game.

And perhaps there could be a reason for all those ppl hating bw´s oh so much?

Nvm mind me.. Im prolly just another bw hater who´s totally wrong.. lolz

 

[Javai]

very much so but I'm not gonna bother to explain why because you are probably just one of those million BW hater's that seem to be present on every forum centred around this game.

Did you ever stop to think why so many people single out BWs? Especially when it's much more usual for people to hate stealthers in these kinds of game. Could it possibly be that their damage mechanic (note mechanic NOT damage per se) is considerably more powerful that any other class in the game.

You don't HAVE to defend a class just because you play it, it is possible to see that some aspects of it are not working in-line with everyone else even if you enjoy using them in the game. For example, I play a Sorc, in keep defenses being able to use pit of shades without having to put myself in any danger by being in line of sight is probably too powerful, I probably should need line of sight to the ground target I am using. Its still fun to use it from behind a pillar as Order bunch up on the stairs but that doesn't mean it's balanced.

 

[Tiani]

Nah your one of those soo hard done to uber skilled MDPS chars that have been assf*cked by Mythic in the class balance race :rollseyes:

It seems tickling a BW to death with a feather inst enough for you and you need to stop them dealing damage also, even if they do it to themselves also, thats not enough! NERF!

 

[Ogen]

Nah your one of those soo hard done to uber skilled MDPS chars that have been assf*cked by Mythic in the class balance race :rollseyes:

It seems tickling a BW to death with a feather inst enough for you and you need to stop them dealing damage also, even if they do it to themselves also, thats not enough! NERF!

Want some bread with that whine sir?

 

[Xandax]

I mean what is it with this forum, there is never any discussion without some asshat wading in with some lame remark, and when I shoot back its ME who catches the flak for it.

I mean am I doing something wrong by defending my class (and I genuinly feel there is nothing wrong with BW's apart from PwF) or is it that everyone just hates the BW for some unknown reason and wont rest until they are sub par RDPS that get run over by melee in 2 seconds flat ?

I have been putting my point across in a nice friendly discussion provoking manner until Ogen posted, in more than one thread. Yet I continually catch flak and lame remarks that are completely uncalled for and unprovoked.

I just dont get it.

Don't worry - it is just Destruction players who do not want to loose at anytime. Cause when they do it is obviously because the other classes are overpowered.
I'm sure Destruction vs. Environment will be fun to play in the end.

I like playing a BW, but it is not the only class I play and I see a general trend that the Destruction classes are more powerful then the Order counter parts.
Almost all except the Bright Wizard. And of course that class must be nerfed.
The Iron Breaker was also deemed to powerful by Destruction and must be nerfed as well.
I know I do not get more "skilled" when I boot up my Destruction classes, then I do when booting up Order characters, yet the trend shows on both servers.

Notice the trend - largest group of whiners gets most changes. It was like it was in DAoC - Albion cried, nerfs came while most of their powerful classes got buffed even more. People play the forums and the spell lists way to much to apparently see what is going on in the game with a somewhat unbiased view.

Perhaps once Rift is nerfed and T4 RvR can pick up again, we'll start seeing the more true colors of the balance. And right now - if the BW gets nerfed hard, Order has pretty much no way to stand up against the zerglings.

It doesn't take a rocket scientists to see these things. All it takes is a bit of objectivity - something which is sorely lacking it seems.

 

[Tiani]

Did you ever stop to think why so many people single out BWs? Especially when it's much more usual for people to hate stealthers in these kinds of game. Could it possibly be that their damage mechanic (note mechanic NOT damage per se) is considerably more powerful that any other class in the game.

You don't HAVE to defend a class just because you play it, it is possible to see that some aspects of it are not working in-line with everyone else even if you enjoy using them in the game. For example, I play a Sorc, in keep defenses being able to use pit of shades without having to put myself in any danger by being in line of sight is probably too powerful, I probably should need line of sight to the ground target I am using. Its still fun to use it from behind a pillar as Order bunch up on the stairs but that doesn't mean it's balanced.

Thats completely different you are talking about bugs and exploits, thats not the game. those are things that need fixing, Mythic never intended for you to be able to do those things.

I genuinly do not think there is anything wrong with the BW barr playing with fire and I think they went too far with the nerf to this one IMO.

The way I see it is Im a BW, I got barely any HP, no armour to speak of and do damage to myself constantly while casting spells on other people. I do a lot of damage to compensate for that, within rights imo, my main damage comes from the backlash mechanic and is achieved through critical hits, fine by me. I spec into the dot tree to improve my dots, fine I spec points, my dots get better.

Whats the problem ? I will tell you. Destruction has an abundance of MDPS and Order has an abundance of RDPS namely Bright Wizards.

People look at end of scenario scoreboards and see every BW in the group on over 100+ damage, they completely ignore the backlash mechanic in the first place, they continually ignore it when it is a known fact is is factored into the end of game numers, further enflating the damage dealt figure.

They post screenshots as 'proof' that BW is OP, they post screenshots of a combat log with a fully combusted BW critting them with his dots (taking expert care to only show the BIG crits portion of the damage of course)

they whine and cry and bitch and moan and completely ignore the other glaring inbalances in the game in regards to other classes being a lot better than their mirror class on order(Marauder/Whitelion Witch Elf/Witch Hunter)

I dont see how it is a problem that a BW kills hard and fast when he is as squishy as a char can get in these kinds of games, and I dont see a problem when it his dots that are doing the majority of the damage (he is dot spec'd after all, I wouldnt expect him to stand their nuking, his dots should do a lot of damage)

even a nerf to our already pointless form of crowd control isnt enough. It seems people wont be happy until the BW is nerfed into oblivion and I will sure as hell defend it up until this point.

 

[Ogen]

even a nerf to our already pointless form of crowd control isnt enough. It seems people wont be happy until the BW is nerfed into oblivion and I will sure as hell defend it up until this point.

Pointless CC? lol what planet do you live on?

 

[Javai]

The way I see it is Im a BW, I got barely any HP, no armour to speak of and do damage to myself constantly while casting spells on other people. I do a lot of damage to compensate for that, within rights imo, my main damage comes from the backlash mechanic and is achieved through critical hits, fine by me. I spec into the dot tree to improve my dots, fine I spec points, my dots get better.

All of the things you say apply equally to the Sorc except the Sorc can't do their damage on the run, I'll repeat its not the amount of dmage BWs do it's the mechanic by which they do it. It's all too easy to do the damage on the move and also to only come into range briefly, while a Sorc is standing around trying to fire a nuke that doesn't land cos you moved during the cast time.

Sorcs key spells are very good but very situational, BWs are very good in pretty much all situations.

 

[Tiani]

I live on the planet where god and his dog has a root breaking spell.

I can count the number of times I use firecage on one hand to be honest, completely pointless to use it in almost every situation,

Only time I use it is to stop people chasing the salvage carrier in SP and they just break out of it anyway.

 

[dee777]

Tiani, have you ever played a Engineer or a Shadow Warrior up to lets say T2? I am pretty sure you ll find those two classes lacking, compared to your Bright Wizard.

Of course this could also mean that the other RDPS classes need some love, but if you check out healing in endgame at the moment, I somehow doubt more damage is reasonable. Especially since you d need to up MDPS as well, since it is supposed to be higher than RDPS.

 

[Tiani]

All of the things you say apply equally to the Sorc except the Sorc can't do their damage on the run, I'll repeat its not the amount of dmage BWs do it's the mechanic by which they do it. It's all too easy to do the damage on the move and also to only come into range briefly, while a Sorc is standing around trying to fire a nuke that doesn't land cos you moved during the cast time.

Sorcs key spells are very good but very situational, BWs are very good in pretty much all situations.

and that is a sorc/BW problem not a BW needs a nerf issue

Looking at the other classes the WE in particular pisses all over their WH counter-part, people dont seem to care about this

Whitelion and marauder, more of the same.

Also I spec dots I expect them to do enough meaningful damage to actually make a difference, just because they give the caster mobility doesnt mean they should be shit.

I mean all melee moves can be used on the run amirite ? but thats ok ? they hit for same damage as a tick of a dot but no one cares about that.

HoT's are also on the move fire and forget and heal very effectively, but thats ok also because its heals not damage.

Peoples perspectives are greatly scewed in my opinion.

( can I just say that I do not mean any offence with any of my posts and I will be extremely pissed off if this thread degenerates into a flame war )

 

[Tiani]

Tiani, have you ever played a Engineer or a Shadow Warrior up to lets say T2? I am pretty sure you ll find those two classes lacking, compared to your Bright Wizard.

Of course this could also mean that the other RDPS classes need some love, but if you check out healing in endgame at the moment, I somehow doubt more damage is reasonable. Especially since you d need to up MDPS as well, since it is supposed to be higher than RDPS.

I got a low lvl marauder around 19 I think in T2 and I have on my account and have played a fair bit a lvl 32 SW, he is lacking in DPS slightly yes, but he also has NO added backlash mechanic, he crits on festering arrow for 1.5k (highest I seen so far) takes no damage in return, can also drop various AoE dots on people that tick for 100+ and broad headed arrow hits fairly descent on single targets, Fell the weak is alos a good hard hitting spell if you can get the person before he is healed up again I would kill for takedown to be honest. Rapid fire is ace for killing or just interrupting casters, especially with steady aim.

You see I dont think the SW is straight RDPS, I play him as a neucanse (sp?) he is there to annoy people, and kill low armour/low HP people

He picks his targets and has various skills to annoy hinder and generally take focus off of the killer DPS classes.

he has knockback, knockdown, reduced healiing, dots, armour reduction, initiative reduction can shoot on the move if he wants and an array of AoE abilities that, ok, wont kill anyone but will put pressure on players coupled in with other classes abilities.

 

[dee777]

[...]
It doesn't take a rocket scientists to see these things. All it takes is a bit of objectivity - something which is sorely lacking it seems.

You clearly are an expert in this field...

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

I disagree, I think where we are now is where we should be, I dont think we need a nerf to our damage ? we are squishy and have added backlash, we are completely ineffective without a pocket healer,

Nope, you are above where you should be. Regarding larger fights, all classes need healing or are ineffective. That you need a healer for such is no indication of class weakness. Its an aspect of how *dangerous* a BW is to the other side that BWs are considered primary targets. As I've already said, your base damage is being increased, just your Combustion based damage will go down as you won't be able to get to 100% and permanently keep it there. As a nice result for you, your vulnerability to Backlash will also reduce.

I can tell you I have run a fair few SP recently with 0 healers on order side and I spent most of the time at the Order Spawn point either from rezzing from death or trying futily to regen my health so I can actually cast a spell or two.

That actually means nothing. You couldn't take out a zerg without healing. This says nothing about the Bright Wizard class, only that you were in a pug.
I also have ran SP without healers. Ouch-time for any caster.

People just look at the scoreboard read a few things on a forum and think that playing a BW/Sorc is a case of tab dotting the whole team (the whole " all BW do is tab dot dot dot tab dot dot dot" with all their insta cast no cooldown dots lame ass excuse that destro throw about all the time) and everything falling down in front of you and its just not the case at all.

I've played a lot against Bright Wizards. Even when I was single-target spec, my DPS did not come close to that of a BW in 1v1 encounters with both starting at full health. I think BW dps should probably be slightly above Magus direct damage, but not to the extent it is. A Magus depends on dirty tricks rather than right-out firepower. The difference between the two I feel is too great.

If we receive a significant reduction in our crit chance via combustion, we better receive substantial buffs to our base non crit damage and the damage from combustion and the rate at which it procs will need to be toned down significantly also because what would be the poing in being a BW if other classes put out the same damage with no backlash or reliance on healing

You ARE getting buffs to your base DPS but this concern I'm sure has been noted. However, you will get Backlash *less* due to not being at 100% combustion nearly all the time. I've said this before. I don't want to see BWs nerfed into oblvion, just a toning down of the DPS. As squishy casters, they absolutely should be able to do high damage. Just not quite to the level they have been.

An element of theorycrafting in my responses because I'm mostly going by the patch notes. I accept that I do not know the BW class inside out and can only use my own observations as squishy Lvl40, RR32 Magus; I'm not without experience in facing off vs Bright Wizards in most situations (solo, group, scenario, zerg, keep assault, objective assault) and while I may not have reams of statistical data to back up my points of view I think I've got a reasonable assessment from an outsider's point of view of the Bright Wizard class/career.

 

[dee777]

You see I dont think the SW is straight RDPS, I play him as a neucanse (sp?) he is there to annoy people, and kill low armour/low HP people

I see where you are coming from. So would you be ok to trade the backlash mechanic for some kind of "usability" mechanic? Much like the old DAoC wizard debate.

IMO BWs and sorcs have so little sympathy, because there is too much DPS (or too little HPS) in the game at this point. How would you change that?

 

[Xandax]

Tiani, have you ever played a Engineer or a Shadow Warrior up to lets say T2? I am pretty sure you ll find those two classes lacking, compared to your Bright Wizard.

Of course this could also mean that the other RDPS classes need some love, but if you check out healing in endgame at the moment, I somehow doubt more damage is reasonable. Especially since you d need to up MDPS as well, since it is supposed to be higher than RDPS.

Define lacking.
If you mean "damage" then no. My T2 engineer consistently is near the top on scenarios damage score.

Utility. Not really - I feel the engieer, at least in T2, has great utility. Debuffs, good CC with the root and knockback, can target multiple people at once due to AE and Turrent.
The turrents could use more hit points and damage for sure, but I must admit that I do not lack that.

I've not played Shadow Warrior to T2, there's too much "Legolas wannabe" over it for me to fall for that class, so can't comment on that, but that class looks bland indeed in abilities sure. But that's a SW problem and not a BW problem as such.

The entire problem arises that the first influx of whines were based solely on damage. When that was begun to be refuted as both wrong and rather pointless people started focusing on "mobility", yet the DOT tree while easy to play (IMO) is boring and not all that powerful. Sure Playing With Fire is good and did deserve a tone down - but the rest of the abilities. Meh. And that is one of the main reasons why it looks to be "i died whine" and not balance interested complains. It lacks objectivity and I thought Mythic had it until I saw the revised 1.0.5

And no, I'm not a Immolation specced BW. I've been Immolation specced for a few runs in T4 scenarios and hated it every step of the way. I'm Incineration or Conflagration depending on mood.
The lure of Immolation is that it is easy and when you see 3 BWs dot tick away it looks overpowered. But then you have a situation of 3 vs 1 and it should hurt. Otherwise what is the point of playing in groups?
3 Squig Herders fireing on me hurts already. 1 WE hurts. 1 Maurader hurts ... 3 hitting on me? Forget it, I'm dead before a healer targets me.

Loosing critical hit chance is really going to hurt both Incineration and Conflagration specs, because my fireballs are generally pointless without a significant critical chance (and I suspect they'll hurt Sorcerers as well). It will not hurt the Immolation spec as much as it does the other two.

The whole problem stems right back to the number of Bright Wizards playing. And the issue for that is entirely different and warrants attention - because simply nerfing the BW (more then the Sorcerer) will do little - except possible breaking the fragile balance in the game factionwise.
Having 6 Bright Wizards in a fight makes them and the effect much more visible then if it were 2 Engineers, 2 Shadow Warriors and 2 Bright Wizards.

That's why I'm opposed to such nerfing of the Bright Wizard class like this, which looks purely to be based on whining from my perspective as playing both sides - I don't care that the class itself get nerfed, I like it and will play it - like I play other classes as well.
But if Order doesn't get something soon, it'll be Destruction vs. Environment and then World of Warcraft have "won".

 

[Xandax]

You clearly are an expert in this field...

More so then so many others it seems. My worry is the overall game, and not just "hah, nerf the BW cause they killed me".

 

[Shike]

Want some bread with that whine sir?

I think the gender is female in this case.

 

[Tiani]

I see where you are coming from. So would you be ok to trade the backlash mechanic for some kind of "usability" mechanic? Much like the old DAoC wizard debate.

IMO BWs and sorcs have so little sympathy, because there is too much DPS (or too little HPS) in the game at this point. How would you change that?

I would be fine with it if I had rolled that type of char (i..e I wanted to play that kind of character) by boyfried does, thats why he plays a SW.

To the guy above you, I see your points but I cannot do anything without a healer in pvp seriously, backlash doesnt just proc on 100% you know only the damage increases, 5 backlash procs from 50 combustion will still hurt you incredibly and out you out the fight for as long as it takes for you to regen your health (and as we all know getting out of combat in rvr takes friggin ages! )

thats before I have even taken a single point of damage from the enemy.

Sorcs and BW should be outdamaging magus etc, by a fair margin in my books and it is because we do damage to ourselves in order to do damage to others (and we still take damage from the enemy also), thats not to say the magus shouldnt be doing good damage, I just think they should have some other form of mechanic that seperates them from the 'rdps' category (and this mechanic isnt a lame ass spell that pigeon holes your char into performing one role, ie chaotic rift)

that however is a problem with the Magus career, and I dont think that should directly impact on the level of damage the BW/Sorc dish out.

 

[Ogen]

I live on the planet where god and his dog has a root breaking spell.

I can count the number of times I use firecage on one hand to be honest, completely pointless to use it in almost every situation,

Only time I use it is to stop people chasing the salvage carrier in SP and they just break out of it anyway.

Well, being leet BW and all, i assume you know about kiting, and firecage can and will give you a good headstart.
Also assuming you know how to run away and cast your insta leet dots on what ever may be chasing you, without turning around. (Hold down right mouse butten, and press A).. lol - Ofc this demands keymapping to avoid using your mouse, but being leet and all, i guess you do that allready.


Least in 1on1, that kinda works well - especially with the build in "out of range" bonus you get when chasing people as a melee´er


But while your at it, would you please tell your fellow BW buddies that CC is completely useless? Thank you very much

 

[Tiani]

yes because 1v1 happens so much in oRVR (i.e. more than 2 people fighting) or scenarios, go ask how many BW actually use this spell effectively.

the answer will be none, because there is no point, anyone I would want to use this spell on can break it, so why bother.

And how shall I kite mr know all ? with my snare (oh yes the channelled one where I have to stand there and effectively cast while the big bad melee guy catches me up) or shall I sit around and wait for my morale 1 to be up in order to knock the guy back ?

The firecage giving me a headstart is lol ? according to your uber 1v1 situation mr baddass MDPS would have his juggernaught skill up so in the time I fire it off the geezer is already spamming his root free button and proceeding to snare me, I will carry on casting my uber leet dots that do so much damage with 0 combustion, or I could run at full combustion and kill myself for you ? but this is an non issue anyway because im snared so in melee so getting bashed on and proceeding to die in 3 swings.



In a perfect situation I could probably kite the guy to death ( that is I see him coming from 100feet away), in a 1v1, I would still probably end the fight on less than 30% HP and thats even if the guy doesnt hit me. but the game is not based around 1v1 and I certainly prefer large scale fights to 1v1's

Factor in stealth, enfeebling strike, snares backlash and throwing knives and its not so picture perfect for the BW as you make it out to be.

so yes, in your completely theoretical, perfect BW mock up battle where I see anyone other than a WE charging me from 100ft away then yes, I would be OP and own his ass hard. Its a shame that these situations never actually happen.

 

[Ogen]

yes because 1v1 happens so much in oRVR (i.e. more than 2 people fighting) or scenarios, go ask how many BW actually use this spell effectively.

the answer will be none, because there is no point, anyone I would want to use this spell on can break it, so why bother.

And how shall I kite mr know all ? with my snare (oh yes the channelled one where I have to stand there and effectively cast while the big bad melee guy catches me up) or shall I sit around and wait for my morale 1 to be up in order to knock the guy back ?

In a perfect situation I could probably kite the guy to death ( that is I see him coming from 100feet away), in a 1v1, I would still probably end the fight on less than 30% HP and thats even if the guy doesnt hit me. but the game is not based around 1v1 and I certainly prefer large scale fights to 1v1's

Factor in stealth, enfeebling strike, snares backlash and throwing knives and its not so picture perfect for the BW as you make it out to be.

Nope.. When you have one chasing you, just pop the cage and keep running. That will leave enough space between you that he wont be able to hit you. If he sprints, he cant do dmg for ages.

Ofc, it dosent work against stealthers, but thats just 1 class..

In zerg fests, its really nice aswell, since juggernut is on CD moust of the time, duo to the amount of roots in this game.

 

[Tiani]

but what is it you are talking about 1v1 or mass pvp ?

Also you forget that melee get snares, any descent MDPS will snare you as his Nr 1 priority and then pop out of the cage.

and even if he doesnt use juggernaught to break it one of the vasy array of dots, melee hits and direct damage will break it anyway, and after the patch it will break even more AND make you immune to it for the next 5 seconds.

 

[Boggy]

I disagree, I think where we are now is where we should be, I dont think we need a nerf to our damage ? we are squishy and have added backlash, we are completely ineffective without a pocket healer,

I can tell you I have run a fair few SP recently with 0 healers on order side and I spent most of the time at the Order Spawn point either from rezzing from death or trying futily to regen my health so I can actually cast a spell or two.

People just look at the scoreboard read a few things on a forum and think that playing a BW/Sorc is a case of tab dotting the whole team (the whole " all BW do is tab dot dot dot tab dot dot dot" with all their insta cast no cooldown dots lame ass excuse that destro throw about all the time) and everything falling down in front of you and its just not the case at all.

If we receive a significant reduction in our crit chance via combustion, we better receive substantial buffs to our base non crit damage and the damage from combustion and the rate at which it procs will need to be toned down significantly also because what would be the poing in being a BW if other classes put out the same damage with no backlash or reliance on healing

"Pocket healer" is more of a WoW term, where people think so much about 1v1 combat, although it did exist in DAoC solo play. WAR seems more designed around full group combat, which means you should assume healers are in the group. If you regularly play without healers, it will either be because there are too few around (maybe because they are not an appealing enough class to play) or you are not engaged enough with other players.

You talk about the scoreboard and also about BWs being squishy. Next time you read the scoreboard, as well as the damage column, also look at the deaths column. I've been doing that myself ever since this BW debate began and BWs do not top the deaths chart particularly often. It's much more common to see melee DPS there.

I'm still not convinced BWs need a damage nerf. I freely admit it's a complex issue probably beyond my ability to assimilate all the factors. However, I do find the population imbalance coupled with the forum complaints fairly compelling. If BWs were a nicely balanced class, what reason would anyone have to complain?

 

[Ogen]

but what is it you are talking about 1v1 or mass pvp ?

Also you forget that melee get snares, any descent MDPS will snare you as his Nr 1 priority and then pop out of the cage.

and even if he doesnt use juggernaught to break it one of the vasy array of dots, melee hits and direct damage will break it anyway, and after the patch it will break even more AND make you immune to it for the next 5 seconds.

Ofc, but afaik you will get imune to snares aswell for 5 secs..

 

[Tiani]

"Pocket healer" is more of a WoW term, where people think so much about 1v1 combat, although it did exist in DAoC solo play. WAR seems more designed around full group combat, which means you should assume healers are in the group. If you regularly play without healers, it will either be because there are too few around (maybe because they are not an appealing enough class to play) or you are not engaged enough with other players.

You talk about the scoreboard and also about BWs being squishy. Next time you read the scoreboard, as well as the damage column, also look at the deaths column. I've been doing that myself ever since this BW debate began and BWs do not top the deaths chart particularly often. It's much more common to see melee DPS there.

I'm still not convinced BWs need a damage nerf. I freely admit it's a complex issue probably beyond my ability to assimilate all the factors. However, I do find the population imbalance coupled with the forum complaints fairly compelling. If BWs were a nicely balanced class, what reason would anyone have to complain?

They cant steam roll them anymore like they did mostly in T1&T2

They cant be mitigated by run and smack stuff with melee chars while they are spam healed by a shaman.

They are slightly better than the destro counterpart and therefore should not excist in their current form.

These are the only reasons I can draw from the drivvel I have seen on various warhammer boards since its release.

A lot of people know nothing of the class or their abilities, and look purely at damage numbers, get crit by dots a few times and call nerf.

and there are not enough healers on Order to always guarantee one, and there is generally only 1 when there is one and he has to keep the whole scenario up, which he cant do obviously.

to perform my role I practically need a dedicated healer of my own.

 

[Tiani]

Ofc, but afaik you will get imune to snares aswell for 5 secs..

but no break snare spell ? where is my snare breaker ? Also I didnt see that in the notes either unless I missed it ?

 

[Boggy]

You're not thinking straight.

You think only playing a BW gives valid input into its balancing argument. What about all those people who have hours of experience playing against a BW or alongside a BW? You are suggesting that the only opinion that counts is the one practically guaranteed to be the most biased.

You think that not having enough healers around means your ranged DPS class - of which there are more than the fair share - should be designed to compensate. It doesn't occur to you that a better solution would be to slightly reduce the appeal of the overplayed class and increase the appeal of the under-played ones?

You honestly think the "I practically need a healer all to myself" argument is a tenable one from games design persperctive? Honestly? Think for a moment before you answer.

 

[Tiani]

You're not thinking straight.

You think only playing a BW gives valid input into its balancing argument. What about all those people who have hours of experience playing against a BW or alongside a BW? You are suggesting that the only opinion that counts is the one practically guaranteed to be the most biased.

You think that not having enough healers around means your ranged DPS class - of which there are more than the fair share - should be designed to compensate. It doesn't occur to you that a better solution would be to slightly reduce the appeal of the overplayed class and increase the appeal of the under-played ones?

You honestly think the "I practically need a healer all to myself" argument is a tenable one from games design persperctive? Honestly? Think for a moment before you answer.

I think your argument works both ways, you think people who have only played against BW and not played the class to a descent level gives valid input into its balancing argument ? I can say that playing against a class will give you a massively skewed opinion as opposed to playing the class through the game, personally.

Also the healer comment is a tenable one from game perspective, I do lots and lots of damage to the enemy and myself, ergo I need a healer to perform that role, balanced ? I think so

not to say that any other class doesnt need a healer to perform, just that I am literally bound to how well I can perform my role based on the number of heals I receive.

 

[Tiani]

think of it like this, all other classes in the game only require Ap to cast them, a BW and a Sorc need both Ap AND HP to perform their abilities (they can of course just never use the backlash mechanic but they will do pathetic damage and not fufull their role in rvr)

if a SW is low on HP during a skirmish all he has to do is backup a bit and can continue to fight, a BW has to remove themselves from the game completely until their health is topped up again.