[INFO] More updates to come (V1.0.5)

Penlid

Fledgling Freddie
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Aug 9, 2004
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For that haven't seen
Folks,

Some good news as the weekend approaches:

1) We hope to have the PTS up and running this weekend. Right now we are shooting for sometime tomorrow. The Herald will have all the latest information.

2) As promised, our C&C team has combed through this thread (and pertinent links) and here's what they have found in regards to bugs. Unfortunately, there were a number of both unreported bugs and reported bugs that didn't make it up to the C&C team in time for this patch (initially). I am in total agreement with player sentiment that these bugs need to be fixed along with 1.0.5 and as such, the team is already working on doing that today and over the weekend. The current plan is to fix the vast majority of them in time for the patch but some, because of the coding involved or if they are minor bugs (display) will not be fixed for 1.0.5 but will be fixed as soon as practical. The update to the 1.0.5 patch will be updated to reflect these fixes once these changes are incorporated into 1.0.5.

3) We are also going to look at making some additional changes to some of the classes/archetypes. As I've said before, 1.0.5. is not yet up on the patcher and we expect to continue to make more tweaks/adjustments until the patch goes live. Among the changes currently going into 1.0.5 are:

a) BW/Sorcs will have their crit chance lowered for combustion.

b) Sorcs will also see Word of Pain’s debuff changes from a willpower debuff to a resist debuff to match BWs and it will no longer stack Word of Pain and be a single application that deals damage at the end. Stricken Voices will have its cast time removed to match Bright wizard Choking Smoke.

c) For IBs, we are going to make some changes that will allow the IB to get to low grudge more quickly than initially proposed by increasing Oath friend grudge thresholds from 5/3/1 grudge generated to 10/5/3. Also, we are lowering the grudge required (and making a couple other changes) in the following abilities:

Shield Sweep: Cost reduction from 30 Grudge to 25 Grudge.
Oath bound: Cost reduction from 30 Grudge to 15 Grudge.
Avenging The Debt: Increase heal value.
Away With Ye: Reduce cost from 30 Grudge to 25 Grudge. Increase damage. (Also requires cool down from 0s to 10s)
Watch An' Learn: Reduce cost from 30 Grudge to 15 Grudge. (Also requires cool down from 0s to 20s)
Grumble An' Mutter: Increase heal value.

The combination of better contribution from OF and lowering the grudge cost of some abilities should help alleviate some, if not all, of the IB's concern. We will continue, of course, to look at the IB as a whole to determine if additional changes are still necessary.

d) For our healers, we are looking at making the following changes:

Ranged Healers

Long Cast Big heals go from 3s cast to 2.5s cast
Interrupt / setback value on long heals is reduced by 50%

Melee Healers
Divine Strike and Rend soul will now heal for 350% damage dealt instead of 250%

Like the IBs, this is just part of an ongoing process. As I said yesterday, the team will continue to look very carefully at the healers on the PTS and if more changes need to be made, we'll make them.


e) The Chosen seemed to have a higher number of potential (we haven't confirmed them all yet) bugs but in the meantime, we will make the following changes:

Convert Blast Wave, Bane Shield and Quake to magic attacks that use STR instead of INT for bonus damage
Push Aura code fix up that makes twisting easier

f) The Marauders have a similar bug to the Chosen (using INT not STR) so we are making the following change:

Mouth of Tzeentch will use STR instead of INT for bonus damage

g) For the Black Orc the biggest bug appears to losing their place in the combo chain randomly. The team has been trying to duplicate this all day and so far, no luck. If we can duplicate it, it will be fixed.

So, a few things:

1) Let me once again express my thanks to those great people here on the Vault (and elsewhere) who spent time and energy posting helpful (critical, insightful, positive, etc.) messages. You have helped us quite a bit by doing so. The 1.0.5 thread was, at its best, a great example of how developer<->community interaction can work very well at times when you have motivated players and interested developers who are actually paying attention. So again, you have my thanks.

2) The changes here are still part of an ongoing process of evaluation and reevaluation of 1.0.5. Nothing is final and until the PTS is up and running and 1.0.5 goes through the ringer, will it even be close to final. So please, when the PTS goes up let us know what you think through feedback here and in the game.

3) Some of the bugs/changes that I'm listing here will not be fixed/up by tomorrow of course but they will be during the time that the PTS is running and *before* 1.0.5 goes LIVE. We will keep you informed about the changes through the patcher.

4) A number of people have commented that this patch seems more chock full of ranged DPS changes and while the team believes that a lot of the changes we made to the the rDPS group will have a significant positive impact on our tanks and mDPS folks, they will turn their attention to those careers again after the 1.0.5 version. Again, please keep in mind that bugs for the mDPS/Tanks will be fixed for this version as well.

Again, my thanks to the many members of the WAR community for their efforts in regards to our game.

Mark
 

Bluelion

Fledgling Freddie
Joined
Aug 15, 2008
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Ah ha, so they realised in the nick of time the sorry state the changes would have left healers in, and so rather than reverse the changes they've made our "fragile" spells more like regular slow cast spells, and decreased the silly length casting duration. Horses for courses I suppose.
 

Kami

Can't get enough of FH
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Well at least they're listening, even if it's a little worring that they needed it pointed out in the first place. It's still an improvement on the feedback/reaction of Mythic whilst running DAOC at the beginning, all I can say is - well done!
 

Roo Stercogburn

Resident Freddy
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Why do they have a Command & Conquer team?

Anyway, toning down and altering the healing changes is a good thing.
 

Shike

Can't get enough of FH
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Now it starts too look alot better tbh, that critchancerate is awesome for BW/Sorc aswell as the healerchanges. WoPchange for sorc.. I dunno, I would rather see it changed to a spell that is cast 1 time instead of 3 and still debuff willpower. Rather that they remove BW's debuff than adding one to Sorcs. I feel Sorcs might become slightly more powerful than intended, depending on how much they reduce the critchance with. Who wants sorcs to recieve same massive justified whines as BW's? Not me anyways..
 

Dre@d

Fledgling Freddie
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393
Pretty nice on the BW/Sorc adjustements, on the healing part is nice aswell.

Still, would like to see that the WE kisses only proc with abilities and not autoattacks :p
 

Boggy

Fledgling Freddie
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Aug 10, 2004
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491
The additional healing change reminds me of the way Gordon Brown approached the 10% tax change, and it's gonna be just as annoying and ineffective, and probably leave Mythic just as unpopular.

The HoT changes in 1.0.5 are pointless. There are 3 ways Mythic could tackle this that will make me anything less than pissed off over this:

1) Explain clearly why the changes have been made. Convince players they are needed instead of leaving them as a mystery. Because at the moment, the only explanation going around is that Mythic wants WAR to be more like WoW with short, FPS-style fights.

2) Remove the HoT changes. Admit that you were wrong and join the select band of MMO providers that has undone a bad decision before it is too late.

3) Make a change to the ST castable heals that makes it REALLY usable instead of a token change that leaves it unusable. Succi suggested elsewhere it should go to 2s and have set backs reduced to nil, which is probably the sort of thing you'd need to do.

Funny how a patch that's supposed to be positive has single-handedly changed me from a happy WAR player to a pissed off one.
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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Sep 4, 2008
Messages
329
If they are nerfing crit chance they better nerf backlash damage and the chance to backlash as well, because with that kind of change depending on how severe it is will kill the BW/Sorc and we might as well all roll something else
 

Roo Stercogburn

Resident Freddy
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BWs are having base damage upped. Although you won't have perma-combustion or double the applied bonus from stats on Detonate, crit changes like that hardly sound class-breaking.
 

Xandax

Loyal Freddie
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BWs are having base damage upped. Although you won't have perma-combustion or double the applied bonus from stats on Detonate, crit changes like that hardly sound class-breaking.

Depends on the decrease of critical chance.
Critical damage was about the only thing which keeps the casters going. Often when my fireball doesn't crit, but struck with combustion explosion I end up hitting with my fireball for 400ish damage (with a 3 second cast) and hitting myself for 600. Hardly a worthwhile trade off if you do not have a substantial chance of critical hits.
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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Depends on the decrease of critical chance.
Critical damage was about the only thing which keeps the casters going. Often when my fireball doesn't crit, but struck with combustion explosion I end up hitting with my fireball for 400ish damage (with a 3 second cast) and hitting myself for 600. Hardly a worthwhile trade off if you do not have a substantial chance of critical hits.

This.

Unless the nerf is a 5 - 10% max it will break the class, we did get a slight base damage buff but so did all the other DPS classes, so the problem will be that all these other classes are doing comparable damage without the risk of hurting themselves, basically making playing a BW/sorc pointless.
 

civy

One of Freddy's beloved
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No mention of Shadow Warriors finding themselves in a no stance mode then having to wait 5 seconds before atempting to enter a stance again.
 

Ogen

One of Freddy's beloved
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Well buh effing huh..

Seriusly, BW/Sorcs are permanently placed ontop of the dmg scoreboards.

Try playing a melee squishy dps, then come back and whine.


Cant wait for this patch, especially the root fix(It will now brake on dmg) and cc imunity buff (Diminishing return)
:clap:

Tbh, thats what the casters should fear, instead of whining about not doing enough dmg lol.
 

Muylaetrix

Can't get enough of FH
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2,021
Depends on the decrease of critical chance.
Critical damage was about the only thing which keeps the casters going. Often when my fireball doesn't crit, but struck with combustion explosion I end up hitting with my fireball for 400ish damage (with a 3 second cast) and hitting myself for 600. Hardly a worthwhile trade off if you do not have a substantial chance of critical hits.

:iagree:

without substantial chance to crit we do more damage to ourselves than to our enemies.
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
Joined
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Messages
329
Well buh effing huh..

Seriusly, BW/Sorcs are permanently placed ontop of the dmg scoreboards.

Try playing a melee squishy dps, then come back and whine.


Cant wait for this patch, especially the root fix(It will now brake on dmg) and cc imunity buff (Diminishing return)
:clap:

Tbh, thats what the casters should fear, instead of whining about not doing enough dmg lol.


try playing a squishy RDPS, with an inbuild self harming mechanic and see how easy it is, people who think end scenario scoreboards are the be all and end all of the game make me laugh, and you do realise that the damage I do to myself is actually added to the damage dealt table right ? I might do 100k in a scenario but you can bet your ass at least 20 - 30k I did to myself (bringing my damage down to 70k which is average for my SW in a good scenario, and he didnt do a single scrap of damage to himself during that time) numbers dont look quite so impressive now do they hmm ?
 

Xandax

Loyal Freddie
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Messages
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try playing a squishy RDPS, with an inbuild self harming mechanic and see how easy it is, people who think end scenario scoreboards are the be all and end all of the game make me laugh, and you do realise that the damage I do to myself is actually added to the damage dealt table right ? I might do 100k in a scenario but you can bet your ass at least 20 - 30k I did to myself (bringing my damage down to 70k which is average for my SW in a good scenario, and he didnt do a single scrap of damage to himself during that time) numbers dont look quite so impressive now do they hmm ?

Only people who want to be on top of it, whines about others being on top of them. It is an e-peen thing for some I'm sure.
Seriously though - I can top the damage scorecard with my engineer in MT if I wanted to. Doesn't mean my team win though.

I dislike they put that score card into the game, cause it just opened up for the elitist solo people who don't care about team work or who wins as long as they can "own".
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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Yes I wish they would remove the stupid scoreboard, dont see the point in it personally, I see I did a lot of damage dont need a scoreboard at the end of it to tell me again, only thing I am interested in inside a scenario is the win/loss and exp/rp gain, all the rest of the crap can be deleted from the board for all I care.

Its not a valid way to measure a classes effectiveness and it is definately 100% scewed in perspective when the BW/Sorc numbers are looked at (backlash adding to total damage can put upto 20 - 30k+ damage on top of your actual damage dealt figure, inflating the numbers into the silly end game figures you usually see, no one seems to care when WE/WH and marauders put out 100k + with no backlash :p)
 

Ogen

One of Freddy's beloved
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try playing a squishy RDPS, with an inbuild self harming mechanic and see how easy it is, people who think end scenario scoreboards are the be all and end all of the game make me laugh, and you do realise that the damage I do to myself is actually added to the damage dealt table right ? I might do 100k in a scenario but you can bet your ass at least 20 - 30k I did to myself (bringing my damage down to 70k which is average for my SW in a good scenario, and he didnt do a single scrap of damage to himself during that time) numbers dont look quite so impressive now do they hmm ?

Yep, i have a rank 17 BW on K8P. Bigtime easymode compared.
Just learn to aoe nuke, and you wont kill your self as much, compared to damage delt.

But i guess your just another easymode singletarget dotter...
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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Yep, i have a rank 17 BW on K8P. Bigtime easymode compared.
Just learn to aoe nuke, and you wont kill your self as much, compared to damage delt.

But i guess your just another easymode singletarget dotter...

you are right!

Please enlighten me with your vast experience of T2 lol :worthy:
 

klasa

Loyal Freddie
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Ogen has played other games you know so he knows easymode from hardmode. Be a bit humble please Tiani, you give order a bad rep!
 

Roo Stercogburn

Resident Freddy
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:iagree:

without substantial chance to crit we do more damage to ourselves than to our enemies.

...Only because you are used to being able to keep combustion up. As I understand it you won't be able to keep that permanently up after the patch so you have less to worry about from taking damage from your own spells. You'll get those big nukes off less often, but do higher general damage. Overall it will lower your DPS (long overdue) but won't make the class ineffective but your base DPS without crit will go up.

Those of you playing Bright Wizards should probably brace for low levels of sympathy from the rest of the community. While there are genuine issues affecting the class you play of course, for the most part you've been able to spend the last couple of months owning nearly everything in big time easymode. The only people who disagree with this, oddly enough, tend to be people who play Bright Wizards.
 

`mongoose

One of Freddy's beloved
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let's wait and see how the patch gets to us eh?

It's not even hit test yet. I (as a shammy with a sorc alt) am not thatl concerned about these changes. As I've said elsewhere - most of my healing is via the 3 sec spell anyway. You try keeping a tank or a sorc up without it - it's not going to happen. Hell sometimes even my stupidly big heal doesn't heal people quickly enough.

This is good - otherwise the game would be full of tanks/sorcs who never die and we'd be bored in scenarios.

The root change is what I think will make most difference. It will stop those irritating pull in attacks being so effective and if calculated properly will see all ranged classes finding it harder to avoid the pain train.

I'm not sure it's a good thing tbh, but I'm willing to give it a go and see.

M
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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I'm sorry but I have played this class extensively in every teir I wont be told by someone who happens to have a low rank toon in teir 2 aka basically the game's tutorial zone telling me about BW and to AoE nuke ? I mean lol the suggestion itself deserves a huge great LOL

other games are not WaR. I have played other games also, check my sig. That make me an expert in WaR ? Nope.

You are telling me to be humble ? check his Original Post

oh btw I have a low lvl marauder, I think that constitutes squishy MDPS, hes also in T2 so I guess I must know what Im talking about ? having extensive experience with the class.

There aint nothing wrong with them, spec aoe and all will be fine.
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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...Only because you are used to being able to keep combustion up. As I understand it you won't be able to keep that permanently up after the patch so you have less to worry about from taking damage from your own spells. You'll get those big nukes off less often, but do higher general damage. Overall it will lower your DPS (long overdue) but won't make the class ineffective but your base DPS without crit will go up.

Those of you playing Bright Wizards should probably brace for low levels of sympathy from the rest of the community. While there are genuine issues affecting the class you play of course, for the most part you've been able to spend the last couple of months owning nearly everything in big time easymode. The only people who disagree with this, oddly enough, tend to be people who play Bright Wizards.

I disagree, I think where we are now is where we should be, I dont think we need a nerf to our damage ? we are squishy and have added backlash, we are completely ineffective without a pocket healer,

I can tell you I have run a fair few SP recently with 0 healers on order side and I spent most of the time at the Order Spawn point either from rezzing from death or trying futily to regen my health so I can actually cast a spell or two.

People just look at the scoreboard read a few things on a forum and think that playing a BW/Sorc is a case of tab dotting the whole team (the whole " all BW do is tab dot dot dot tab dot dot dot" with all their insta cast no cooldown dots :p lame ass excuse that destro throw about all the time) and everything falling down in front of you and its just not the case at all.

If we receive a significant reduction in our crit chance via combustion, we better receive substantial buffs to our base non crit damage and the damage from combustion and the rate at which it procs will need to be toned down significantly also because what would be the poing in being a BW if other classes put out the same damage with no backlash or reliance on healing
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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mature... But am i wrong?

very much so but I'm not gonna bother to explain why because you are probably just one of those million BW hater's that seem to be present on every forum centred around this game.
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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Sep 4, 2008
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Yes you are, because Tiani is a leet player who uses pure skill to own all scenarios, it has nothing to do with playing an OP class ;-)


lols of course not! all BW are noobs who press a few buttons and win, no skill, no intuition, apsolutely no thought nothing but button mashing dots that own the whole of destro team.

Of course destruction characters are played by mini Fat4lity's in the making and require uber skill and thought to even get close to a BW let alone kill one!

You shouldnt judge me because I defend my class, especially when you know nothing about me or my background.
 

Tiani

Fledgling Freddie
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Sep 4, 2008
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I mean what is it with this forum, there is never any discussion without some asshat wading in with some lame remark, and when I shoot back its ME who catches the flak for it.

I mean am I doing something wrong by defending my class (and I genuinly feel there is nothing wrong with BW's apart from PwF) or is it that everyone just hates the BW for some unknown reason and wont rest until they are sub par RDPS that get run over by melee in 2 seconds flat ?

I have been putting my point across in a nice friendly discussion provoking manner until Ogen posted, in more than one thread. Yet I continually catch flak and lame remarks that are completely uncalled for and unprovoked.

I just dont get it.
 

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