Matrix Reloaded (yes again, get used to it )

[nath]

PRECISELY.

Hollywood execs: stop wasting all this dosh on fancy schmancy effects when proper ingenuity goes much further.

Phantom menace/Attack of the clones look so tacky now thanks to an over use of cg. I'm sure the matrix will go the same way (albeit perhaps to a lesser extent). Star Wars/ESB/ROTJ still don't make me cringe and they're decades old.

 

[Durzel]

I thought the SFX in Matrix Reloaded were spot on. I watched the park fight sequence on loop yesterday, the bit where Neo belts one of the Smiths with a pipe.. clearly CGI but its so well done, even in slow motion, you have to look closely to spot it.

also they tend to use romantic physics as opposed to real ones, neos coat being the main example. the bit where he spins in the air with the pole over the agent smiths. it mostly looks fake because his coat isn't right, its moving 'cooly' and not realisisticly. we expect it to be all bunched up or round his ankles. in one of the documentaries about the yoda fight in EP2 they talked about making yodas clothes physcially correct, but it ended up rolling over his head or getting caught on his legs so they ended up using a bit of artistic licence. end result is something which our eyes tell us can't happen, but its more pleasing to see.

Well put.

Although, I read somewhere that Neos coat was weighted in key places and deliberately not leather because it didn't move in the way they wanted it too.

 

[nath]

It'll look turd in about a year.

 

[leviathon]

'Secondly, what's the point of spending 36 million on cg that does't look real? The effects in Star Wars are still more realistic and they are miniatures.'

probably true. but you can't do everything in minatures. certainly lucas over uses cg and i remember reading about people in the production of the star wars films having to calm lucas down saying 'you can do it real, you don't have to CG it all the time you loon' or something to that effect. i don't personally think the walkers in star wars look real, as in massive real. they look real in the fact they ARE real, but not real as in what they are supposed to be, especially when the move and fall over. the speeder chase in jedi doesn't look real to me although it's still really intense, in fact a lot of stuff looks rubbish, yoda puppet (the cg version owns the puppet), the ships, the laser fire.

just cos something doesn't look real doesn't mean you shouldn't do it. i can suspend my disbelief to watch the agent smith fight as it's still cool. and also, how realisticly can you hit someone in the head with an iron bar enough to pelt him across a courtyard. they are super humans, they don't move in a human way, they swing faster and stop quicker and have greater control over their actions, certainly doesn't look real but it's probably accurate.

i watched final fantasy yesterday. the animation is lame compared to flight of the osiris. but that had alot to do with never animating anyone in the final fantasy film properly which ruined the illusion. would like the people who worked on golum to do more human characters, that would be something to see.

 

[danger]

Maybe it's just me but I thought the agent smith fight was pointless, went on too long and was never going anywhere....

I mean Neo didn't kill any of the Agent Smith's... just kept knocking them down and letting them get back up... then eventually he flies away... why didn't he just do that in the first place and save himself the effort? I felt that the scene got boring as more and more Smith's came it looked increasingly CG'd and started to degrade smith's credibility as a "bad ass fighting machine..." it just made him look weak because 9.9x10^52 agent smiths couldn't get more than the odd punch in on him.... Especially as he's supposedly "The Two" now or at least has part of Neo's powers.

Personally if they'd shortened the film to the car chase and the architect bit I think I could of enjoyed it more. Sorry just my two pence worth but I really wasn't a big fan of the film... I'm not judging it by the first film... I thought it was poor in it's own right... I really felt overall the blatently CG'd effects wouldn't allow my brain to suspend disbelief... I would've liked to have been able to, but couldn't.... and my other complaint... the film was way too long with too many redundant scenes i.e. most of the crap in zion and a few of the the gratuitous fighting scenes that weren't necessary.

The only good part I found was the eventual twist to the story line, I thought that all that was uncovered during the short but cool architect bit was great... All I hope is that when all is said and done I'll regard this film as naff but "boy did it set up a great ending for the trillogy"... here's hoping.

 

[nath]

Originally posted by danger
I mean Neo didn't kill any of the Agent Smith's... just kept knocking them down and letting them get back up... then eventually he flies away... why didn't he just do that in the first place and save himself the effort?

Why not? He wasn't going to get hurt, he felt like having a laugh.

 

[Clowneh!]

lmao

 

[(Shovel)]

Originally posted by nath
Why not? He wasn't going to get hurt, he felt like having a laugh.

Exactly, I mean, I guy has to keep fit...

 

[danger]

Originally posted by (Shovel)
Exactly, I mean, I guy has to keep fit...

nah he was just tryin' to impress the ladys really... you know all "look at me I'm so rich I'm 70% computer generated!"

 

[(Shovel)]

LOL.

A shame for him that the only ladee who came by was an old biddie who became an agent pretty soon after

 

[Jonny_Darko]

Couple of things, firstly, why does everyone hate the dance scene so much? I don't think I've ever seen that many wet sweaty ladies grinding away in one place before! And there was definitely some major lesbian action there, so certainly not a problem for me.

Also, I didn't have a problem with the effects. People habve said that the bulet-time wasn't as good as the bullet toime from the first movie but this isn't bullet-time this time, it's something new so that might explain it. Anyway, I don't think it's the effects which make this movie and the last one so good it's the style with which they're shot, if that makes sense...that first bit when Neo's doing "his Superman thing" he just looked the Daddy, and with the new Superman film they have to make him fly with that much style.

Things I didn't quite get:

1. Just why they had to keep destroying / rebuilding Zion.
2. The chocolate cake bit...kinda got it but wasn't sure...

 

[Nos-]

You've never been with a lady have you.

 

[Clowneh!]

free nos

 

[The Fonz]

Originally posted by Jonny_Darko
1. Just why they had to keep destroying / rebuilding Zion.
2. The chocolate cake bit...kinda got it but wasn't sure...

1). So those few who reject the matrix have somewhere to go instead of destroying the matrix. When the number of people in Zion reached a certain amount (an amount which cold pose a threat to the machines), they destroyed it.

2). I didn't quite understand this either, who was that woman though, she was pretty.

 

[Durzel]

Originally posted by danger
I felt that the scene got boring as more and more Smith's came it looked increasingly CG'd and started to degrade smith's credibility as a "bad ass fighting machine..." it just made him look weak because 9.9x10^52 agent smiths couldn't get more than the odd punch in on him.... Especially as he's supposedly "The Two" now or at least has part of Neo's powers.

There was definitely certain amounts of CG for the sake of CG.

But that's a curse of Hollywood in general, and to a certain extent the bleeding edge of CG is a big selling point for films in its own right. I'm sure the hype surrounding BulletTime™ was enough to make a sizeable proportion of people who would not have otherwise seen the film go and watch it.

 

[Jonny_Darko]

Originally posted by The Fonz


2). I didn't quite understand this either, who was that woman though, she was pretty.

I got the impression the cake was laced with something (a program) that made her get the horn, and she had to rush off to the toilets to, umm, let off some steam.

Then of course that French guy was found in the ladies toilets with lipstick not on his lips...so my guess was he followed her in and got a BJ off her after "spiking" her with horny-making cake.

I was either immediately right, or extremely wrong with just a sad little boy's mind. Can't make up my mind which.

 

[Clowneh!]

yeh remember in the film there was references that different programs controlled different things. i thought that that french dude wrote some code into that cake program which gave some obvious side effects

 

[tris-]

it was about cause and effect

 

[Jonny_Darko]

I know that, he said as much, but she got up and rushed to the toilet why? Precisely?

a)because the cake caused her to have the runs and she legged it to the toilet
b)because the cake made her feel horny and she had to go relieve

the second one links in with him being in the ladies toilet 2 mins later...

 

[leggy]

It was an orgasm johnny you virgin

 

[Clowneh!]

i thought that was obvious

 

[Tom]

The French guy was a program himself, and wrote his own programs inside the Matrix. This is where the twins appeared from (in the car chase one Twin attempts to kill an Agent).

Now, if only I could buy 'chocolate cake v1.3'

 

[nath]

Does he? Or is it morpheus who was, they were both holding the gun.

 

[Jonny_Darko]

/me reckons morpheus will turn out to be part of the matrix

 

[Wij]

What if the computers are being fooled and are actually in a matrix created by humans which makes them think they are cool looking and in control of humans when in actual fact the humans have put signs on them like 'kick me' and 'i suck tin dicks'.

 

[whipped]

Yeah, but what if the humans are actually in a matrix that makes them think they've put the machines in a matrix that makes the machines think they've put the humans in a matrix.

My head hurts

 

[Wij]

I can't believe noone's quoted the last four words of my post out of context.

 

[dysfunction]

Originally posted by Wij
I can't believe noone's quoted the last four words of my post out of context.

Cos we know you do without having to quote it

 

[Ch3tan]

The french dude was a program, yes. And he quite clearly says he programmed something into the cake (or thats the impression I went away with).

The twins are not programmed by the french dude, earlier in the film someone (I think the Oracle) says something about old programs to control the matrix (like the agents), that survived through the versions -such as werewolfs and ghosts.

The current agents would attempt to kill the twins as the are rouge programs that do not belong in the matrix anymore. SO I assume the twins would also fight agents to protect themselves.

 

[mank!]

Originally posted by Tom[SHOTTEH]
although I thought Morpheus's speech could have done with a bit of a re-write (or perhaps his delivery wasn't quite up to it).

I don't think it was anything to do with his delivery, I just thought it was a pretty crap speech.