Is Eve gonna kill DAoC ?

[Ziva]

Originally posted by old.Tohtori
Oh look! Another Sigmund Freud! Next you're going to tell me that i say one thing when i mean my mother.

It was a rough example, you can also chat in IRC but that doesn't make it a game.

Read. Comprehend. Reply. It's a good formula.

If there was ever a Sigmund Freud wannabee it would be you and not me. And u might want to use your own formula on my post cause i was beeing sarcastic just like you.

Anyway, have fun in Eve People who descreibe the game like you (even though you were using an example) aren't a big loss for this community anyway.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Originally posted by Ziva
If there was ever a Sigmund Freud wannabee it would be you and not me. And u might want to use your own formula on my post cause i was beeing sarcastic just like you.

Anyway, have fun in Eve People who descreibe the game like you (even though you were using an example) aren't a big loss for this community anyway.

So now you start the old "No you are Freud!" thing? I didn't start analysing you as a person for something you posted, i stated that you did. If you were sarcastic, and not just trying to save your flamed butt, you failed. Sorry.

My description of the game was towards the people calling EVE boring, meaning that they take a look at the modern state of MMORPG and then go calling the pot black. I don't find DAoC boring and never did say that.

And since we're evidently getting personal here, i hope you stay in DAoC 'cause the EVE community would be better off without the kinds of you.

 

[ami]

Nope dont thinks so since Eve is not really a fantasy MMORPG so many of the people who dont like "future"mmorpgs will stay.

 

[Amadon]

Originally posted by Ziva
I think u don't know very much people do u? Cause i use a lot of more keys then f8, f6, 1, 2, 3 etc. when i play DaoC. This is also called talking.

 

[Amadon]

Originally posted by old.Tohtori
So now you start the old "No you are Freud!" thing? I didn't start analysing you as a person for something you posted, i stated that you did.

and

Oh look! Another Sigmund Freud! Next you're going to tell me that i say one thing when i mean my mother.

Her original post was merely pointing out that the discerning factor that you identified between EVE and DAoC was not in fact a discerning factor at all...

Now EVE is a space "opera" per say, i'm not defending it with teeth and claws but i'm saying it's not DAoC and it's not supposed to be. It's about the community, it's a bit more rough on the edges, it's a bit slower and some people do like it over the keepraids and "steal the flag" fests.

... where you essentially state that EVE is about the community and imply that this differentiates it from DAoC. DAoC is more about the community than about RvR - all MMORPGs are about the community (ergo the MM part of the acronym). RvR is one aspect of the community in DAoC, not the sole aspect of it.

 

[Sibanac]

EvE has alot of potential, not everything is in the beta test yet, and with the latest patches in say 5h played you can easy get enough money to buy a fairly good ship.

PPL saying its all about minning for hours on end are about as right as saying DaoC is bashing mobs till 50 then standing around in rvr mezzed.

 

[old.Tohtori]

"Her original post was merely pointing out that the discerning factor that you identified between EVE and DAoC was not in fact a discerning factor at all..."

Don't want to be rude but...butt out. If she defends herself then she does, no need for a knight in shining armor. thanks.

She said:

"I think u don't know very much people do u? Cause i use a lot of more keys then f8, f6, 1, 2, 3 etc. when i play DaoC. This is also called talking."

And my original post was a rough example of the variety of the game.

Now to you then:


"... where you essentially state that EVE is about the community and imply that this differentiates it from DAoC. DAoC is more about the community than about RvR - all MMORPGs are about the community (ergo the MM part of the acronym). RvR is one aspect of the community in DAoC, not the sole aspect of it."

I did -not- say the community is the difference between DAoC and EVE, i listed quite a few things about EVE because people say it's boring. Like community(much higher in EVE i believe for the craft only buy option), roughness and slow pace.

I didn't say "daoc has no community" so please don't put words in my mouth. And RvR is the -main- difference in DAoC compared to other mmorpg's, is it not?

 

[Amadon]

Originally posted by old.Tohtori
Don't want to be rude but...butt out. If she defends herself then she does, no need for a knight in shining armor. thanks.

This is a public forum, I can say whatever I want. If you want it to be a private discussion then take it to pm's. If you discuss it on an open forum it's open to anyone to post their opinions on the matter.
If I think you're being a twat I'll say so, and I think you are, regardless of me trying to be a shining armoured knight.
And I know perfectly well that she can defend herself, that doesn't mean I can't think you're a twat and point out why.

And my original post was a rough example of the variety of the game.

your original post contained a load of bollocks (since you started being rude...)

I did -not- say the community is the difference between DAoC and EVE, i listed quite a few things about EVE because people say it's boring. Like community(much higher in EVE i believe for the craft only buy option), roughness and slow pace.

implied != said
you made a list of "differences" which weren't particularly different or relevant at all, just a load of bollocks as i said above

I didn't say "daoc has no community" so please don't put words in my mouth.

when you stop doing likewise so freely

And RvR is the -main- difference in DAoC compared to other mmorpg's, is it not?

Yes it's the main difference, but it's not the sole factor of the game, without the community the game would be nothing, as with any MMORPG.
To request that EVE should be given exceptional treatment because it's rough, of a slower pace and is focussed more on the community than other mmorpgs is a load of horseshit.
Roughness and pace contribute to the atmosphere of the game.
Atmosphere is a differentiating factor, but if people find that playing in that atmosphere is tedious or boring, then why the hell should they not judge the game so?
The community aspect is the same regardless of what MMORPG you play.
You get out what you put in, and based on your trollvision here, I guess you don't get much out of the DAoC community which is why you think EVE has more focus on the community.

 

[Ziva]

Originally posted by old.Tohtori
So now you start the old "No you are Freud!" thing? I didn't start analysing you as a person for something you posted, i stated that you did. If you were sarcastic, and not just trying to save your flamed butt, you failed. Sorry.

If u prefer to swap beeing "sarcastic" for "flaming you" then go ahead. In that case i hope u don't mind me swapping your so called "rough example of daoc" into a "flame on daoc".

Maybe... just maybe i just made that comment because u were saying that EVE is more about the community (then DaoC). So i just put 1 and 1 togheter (this comment + your rough example of DaoC) and the result was seeing u as someone who maybe didn't talk to a lot of people in DaoC. But offcourse i can be wrong here cause i don't know you and can only judge on what u said (which i did).

And sorry for the fact Amadon understood my post i didn't know u were trying to make a 1 on 1 fight of it. In that case i have to disappoint you cause im not into that. Like you i'm just posting what my thoughts are and if u feel insulted by them then i'm sorry u missed my tone of voice.

If u feel like flaming me more or just explain yourself feel free to pm me cause i think this is kinda useless.

 

[old.Glendower]

EVE is the wrong genre.

I think it will be Horizons and WoW that will take a large number of folk...and Mythics bungling driving folks away

 

[PJS]

Originally posted by Sibanac
PPL saying its all about minning for hours on end are about as right as saying DaoC is bashing mobs till 50 then standing around in rvr mezzed.

but DaoC is bashing mobs till 50 then standing around in rvr mezzed. Im confused

 

[Killgorde]

Err....endless mining in Eve? In the time it took me to pop the last 3 levels of DaoC at the lair (I would rather watch the poles melt than do that again) I earned enough in Eve to do pretty much what I wanted - a couple of days /played hard graft and the universe is your oyster to do whatever you want - trade, manufacture, smuggle drugs, pirate, wage war etc. Anyone who joined beta and found mining the only viable way of progressing financially either isnt in it at the moment or tried it for a day or two without guidance. I've been in for 10 weeks and am still learning.

The levelling system on Eve isn't geared to mind-numbing mob bashing for 50 levels either..its light years ahead of all other mmog's in that respect and levelling is stress free, which leaves you to focus on enjoying the game. Comparing Eve with DaoC in terms of depth is like comparing LOTR with Harry Potter or a Château Mouton Rothschild with a bottle of Beaujolais. And like the two comparisons above it will never appeal to the masses. It requires an element of large scale teamwork and co-operation to be successful which is hard to find on the DaoC servers - although even the prima donnas and 1337 kiddie brigade will have a blast pirating solo I suspect.

The need for alt chars to keep yourself interested (a definate DaoC trait) is diluted by the fact that you can diversify your main character into whatever areas you wish - the only penalty being that it will take longer to progress in your primary career (which happens if you switch in DaoC anyway).

The biggest problem with Eve in Beta is the sheer scale of the universe and with a couple of thousand beta testers it is sparsely populated. Even with 20k or more on the server at any one time after release there will be 50% of the universe underpopulated where the more ruthless elements will likely ply their trade. Try to imagine taking your crew out into the frontiers of DaoC and carving out your own little (or large) bit of turf from which to wage war perpetually? Might happen for 24 hours if you are lucky. EVE's potential for perpetuity in this respect is staggering if you have the determination and teamwork to make it happen.

Perhaps the best perspective I can give on the depth of the game (and bearing in mind he only touches on one of the more mundane aspects) is a post by Ragnar, TTI's CEO: http://www.eve-online.com/beta/diaries/d3.asp

It is the real deal, but not everyone's cup of tea. Just a bugger Karam's been attracted to it

 

[ulrikakaka]

I think you've all overlooked something

http://www.a-tractor.com/

I'll quote from the homepage for those to lazy to explore this wonderful world

Welcome to a-tractor.com, the future of tractor-related internet gaming.

speaks volumes wouldnt you say?

 

[Jebelious]

at the end of the day the only MMORPGS that will come close to being as succesful are SWG as its Star wars nuff said really. and WoW as it just looks sweet as. im gonna stick daoc any way as it rules over EQ and out of principle

 

[StormriderX]

I think eve + swg will increase daoc's longevity to be honest.

Why?

Less players = less zergs = more enjoyable rvr for all

 

[old.Tohtori]

To Amadon and Ziva.

All flames, cussings, whatnot stupid (as you stated) trolling aside, i'll make my point clear here since especially Amadon thinks my original post was towards the community drive of the games:


DAoC community is(roughly) about guilds, crafters, groups, hunts. Correct?

EvE community is (roughly) about guilds(clans), crafters, groups, hunts and of the fact that nothing is bought from NPC merchants but from other players.

Now doesn't this mean EvE has is a bit (just a tiny bit) more community based?


And why shouldn't i defend EvE with it being more slow paced? It's a different style of MMORPG. Afterall, WoW isn't DAoC either.

I was defending a game i think will be better then DAoC(because of the tech, space...personal opinion), not trying to set loose the defender dogs of hades.

If you felt a bit, insulted or hurt then sorry about that. Maybe i acted a bit trollish. Apologies to those insulted, now hopefully you realise that i was aiming at something different then your head.

 

[darzil]

The advantage that things can be bought from NPCs in DAoC is that it places a limit on what crafters can charge, which results in reasonable prices, except at the higher levels.

With no such control, and sparser playerbase, isn't that liable to be an issue in Eve ?

 

[old.Tohtori]

Originally posted by darzil
With no such control, and sparser playerbase, isn't that liable to be an issue in Eve ?

The longer the game continues, the less the "eleet" players will need those starter weapons. This gives the new players a good chance in getting free/very cheap weapons at the start of the game.

Ofcourse there will be those ruthless merchants who will ask for killer prices for cheap stuff but then the basic marketing comes into play. If someone sells something at a price, let's say 500C, then the next merchant will sell the same for 490C, then the first merchant(because everyone buys from the other) drops the price to 480C and so on.

Have to wait and see if it works but i have a firm confidence in markets working the same way sa they work IRL.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

I may have a look at Eve, its unlikely to really grab me though I've heard some interesting reports from beta players.

At the moment its looking like I will run SWG and DAoC, so I've got a fantasy and sci-fi (ok, SW might be more fantasy than sci-fi, don't get picky ). EQ2 is not of much interest to me, Dragon Empires dunno. World Of Warcraft just might get me interested.

I know everyone is expecting SWG to be full of L33t kiddies but I know of one player association where that won't be the case

 

[hercules-df]

dont think any of the above will "kill" daoc.

just like last years swarm of shit mmorpgs, all the l33t ppl will move to them for a month or 2 then get bored, and the rest of the ppl "moving" will realise what a mess new mmorpgs are, and move back to tried and tested formula.

UO is still alive, even if now all warped and freaky daoc will still be alive and well this time next year, and maybe the euro servers will have an ingame support by then, and housing will just about be testing on gorre

 

[Repent Reloaded]

Most of you are missing the point, not one great game can truly kill DAoC but with all the future MMORPG's that are due to come out DAoC is gonna loose alot of its players, SB, EvE SWG or whatever, they are all diffrent and people like diffrent things, each game will catch someones eye, time will tell if DAoC gets raped by all these amazin games.

 

[katt!]

You are missing the point 18_and_clueless. just as a point of reference, has eq been killed.. err.. has eq even suffered a major loss subscriptions? how many mmorpgs have been released during EQs lifetime?

is it dead?

no.

is it dying?

no.

which leads us to the point.

no mmorpg, to my knowledge, except meridian 59 has truely died. even that was not due to "A NU ARPEGEE KEELING IT".

 

[Killgorde]

Don't think Mythic will be quaking in their boots about SWG if this is anything to go by. Whoever made that promo movie should be hung drawn and quartered or offered the "Cheesy promo of the year" award.

Eve will attract a different audience to DaoC in the main - its depth is scary (something no one can argue is one of DaoC's strong points, although I have no complaints about just having fun - I had a great 9 months on Excal) and I can't see there being the instant gratification of Emain combat 24/7 that those demand who possess a need for senseless (i.e. no strategic) action from the minute they log in.

 

[Repent Reloaded]

Katt, since loads of ppl r unhappy about the way DAoC is goin atm I think they will loose quite I few ppl.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

I'm not going to play DAoC forever.

I hope I'll be in contact with the friends I've made there for about that long though

 

[kain_pravus]

Just managed to get myself into eve beta, it seems to be the perfect companion for DAoC ... Eve for the depth and DAoC for the insta rvr (well if you manage to level something to 50 )

so the perfect 2 games for me.

DAoC does get a little dull tho after lvl 50, and alot of people like me can't level multiple characters to rvr level.

 

[katt!]

Originally posted by Repent
Katt, since loads of ppl r unhappy about the way DAoC is goin atm I think they will loose quite I few ppl.

how do you know "loads of ppl r unhappy". do you think you have even heard 0.01% of the customerbase.

no..

didnt think so.

a game with 250k++ subscribers wont get "killed" by a new leet release, not several new ones. not even if those ones include swg.

especially not since eve is such a "niche" game. it wont appeal to everyone.

 

[Repent Reloaded]

but DAoC will loose some people over the release of these games.

 

[katt!]

Originally posted by Repent
but DAoC will loose some people over the release of these games.

sure. but they will also lose players to the release of ANY_NEW_FPS_RPG_RTS_ETC. and they will also lose players due to .. nothing.


SO WHAT IS YOUR POINT?

 

[osy]

Originally posted by teh Seel

EvE community is (roughly) about guilds(clans), crafters, groups, hunts and of the fact that nothing is bought from NPC merchants but from other players.

erm, wrong.

Ofcourse there will be those ruthless merchants who will ask for killer prices for cheap stuff but then the basic marketing comes into play. If someone sells something at a price, let's say 500C, then the next merchant will sell the same for 490C, then the first merchant(because everyone buys from the other) drops the price to 480C and so on.

Actually, player A discoveres that on planet 1 there is demand for kleenex going at 100 units. Player A jumps around system and/or different galaxies, finds cheap kleenex (5 units per piece), then proceeds to planet 1 with as much kleenex his ship can carry.
Problem is planet 1 has a limited demand, as in only 50 pieces of kleenex. Player A satisfies that demand, and suddenly planet 1 doesnt demand kleenex anymore, but pampers. Player A is now torn between:

a) finding a place with pampers.
b) finding a Planet 2, that also demands kleenex, since he already has a trade route established.
c) Give up trading and camp crossroad systems for innocent traders to pirate on.
d) Mining cotton, so he can manufacture pampers, thus meeting Planet's 1 demand.
e) Loging off, thinking EvE is a screwed up game, and annoying people on forums.