News Greece - Time to cut them off?

[Scouse]

In the end it won't matter what you or a few others think about it being unfair since they are going to pay one way or another.

Well, lets just not debate anything ever then, eh?

 

[Embattle]

Well, lets just not debate anything ever then, eh?

This stopped being a debate some time ago once you turned it into another Scouse soapbox, which again results in the everyone having the same view at the end of the thread as they had at the start.

 

[Wij]

This stopped being a debate some time ago once you turned it into another Scouse soapbox, which again results in the everyone having the same view at the end of the thread as they had at the start.

No it doesn't. I have now been convinced that the world would have ended long ago if Greece didn't employ 30 people per passenger on its tube system. I been won over by words !

 

[Scouse]

You seem to think some internet debates end up with people changing their views Emb? What strange internets is this?! Got it's IP address?

 

[Yrendan]

There's only 11 million of them, WTF do they need 130 billion for?
The total equals 20,000 euros each.
I'm sure if the UK asked for 20 grand for every person (1.4 trillion) they'd tell us where to get off.

You believe that the 130 billion will go to greek citizens? rly?

 

[Job]

Well duh, I don't expect it to go in bank accounts, though there's a lot of theories to back up that as a good way out of debt.
They owe that much just to keep the wolves from the door, so the total bill must be astronomical, but what have they being buying with it?
If they had the worlds best free health service a massive military, or everyone owned a Ferrari, but they are flat broke and need 20 grand EACH , just to pay the minimum repayment on the country 'credit' card.

 

[rynnor]

Well duh, I don't expect it to go in bank accounts, though there's a lot of theories to back up that as a good way out of debt.
They owe that much just to keep the wolves from the door, so the total bill must be astronomical, but what have they being buying with it?
If they had the worlds best free health service a massive military, or everyone owned a Ferrari, but they are flat broke and need 20 grand EACH , just to pay the minimum repayment on the country 'credit' card.

They had their equivalent of new labour in for a long time wrecking the place with a bloated public sector and increased spending on freeloaders - another 5-10 years of New Labour and we would have been in the same hole.

Edit - oh and it paid for that international blight we call 'the olympics'.

 

[DaGaffer]

They had their equivalent of new labour in for a long time wrecking the place with a bloated public sector and increased spending on freeloaders - another 5-10 years of New Labour and we would have been in the same hole.

Edit - oh and it paid for that international blight we call 'the olympics'.

Physically, their public sector is actually smaller per capita than the UK's under Labour. Their percentage of gdp spend is higher, but that's mainly servicing the 20% unemployed. Every European state sector is "bloated"; the difference is the tax take and the breadth of each economy; Greece is knackered on both counts.

 

[rynnor]

Physically, their public sector is actually smaller per capita than the UK's under Labour.

Are you including state owned industries in that figure?

 

[DaGaffer]

Are you including state owned industries in that figure?

No, but I'm not including UK ones either; like half the banking sector.

 

[mr.Blacky]

DaGaffer where did you get any numbers from? I have been looking but havent been able to find any numbers. Only one states between 700 and 800 thousand people are civil servants. That on a population of 11 is a rather large percentage.
Main question still is what is considered a civil servant, I know from Holland that the definition did change over the years.

 

[DaGaffer]

Econstats put UK public sector employment as a percentage of overall at about 21%. Its difficult to find accurate stats for Greece, but generally what I can find suggests its about 18%. This fits in with generally accepted views on EU social models, the Mediterranean countries came to the welfare state late and don't employ as many people as northern Europe (for reference the US is about 15%, mainly because of the military).

 

[DaGaffer]

A very sobering way to put Greek austerity into context: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-17202274

 

[cHodAX]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17725771

Spain could be about to wobble as well, the debt levels are horrific and growing.

 

[Scouse]

50% youth unemployment. Harsh. The spaniards are being f00ked.

Dirty fish robbers tho eh? We should turn them into slaves like us

 

[DaGaffer]

50% youth unemployment. Harsh. The spaniards are being f00ked.

Dirty fish robbers tho eh? We should turn them into slaves like us

I was reading somewhere that it could actually be worse than 50%, because lots of young people are "hiding" in the education system, putting off graduation for as long as possible. Kind of wonder how its got that bad tbh; I assume a massive baby boom in the 80s and 90s, and Spanish kids haven't mastered the art of fucking off abroad the way the Irish do.

 

[cHodAX]

I was reading somewhere that it could actually be worse than 50%, because lots of young people are "hiding" in the education system, putting off graduation for as long as possible. Kind of wonder how its got that bad tbh; I assume a massive baby boom in the 80s and 90s, and Spanish kids haven't mastered the art of fucking off abroad the way the Irish do.

So they need to do more Tapas and less Tap'Ass?

 

[Raven]

Building too much shit that nobody wanted. simples

 

[Scouse]

Yeah. That was all the yoof

 

[Raven]

It has a knock on effect though. Natural redundancy coupled with companies not replacing staff for one thing. Where they are replacing staff they would rather employ someone with experience. The youth and the old are always the highest out of work.

 

[DaGaffer]

It has a knock on effect though. Natural redundancy coupled with companies not replacing staff for one thing. Where they are replacing staff they would rather employ someone with experience. The youth and the old are always the highest out of work.

Yes but 50% is extremely high

 

[Fweddy]

From what I read a lot of young Spanish people were leaving school early to go into construction. Now nothing's being built they've all been made redundant and don't have any qualifications.

 

[Vasconcelos]

Building too much shit that nobody wanted. simples

This.

From what I read a lot of young Spanish people were leaving school early to go into construction. Now nothing's being built they've all been made redundant and don't have any qualifications.

And this.

 

[BloodOmen]

Started selling kids in Greece now apparently its got that bad :/

 

[Wij]

How much for a fat one?

 

[Bahumat]

1 pot of hoummus

 

[ECA]

Despite europe being in turmoil and trying to claw themselves up the cliff edge, america in a volatile election year, china having a state subsidised housing crash, rising oil prices and a global recession that still isn't over IT IS CLEARLY THOSE FUCKIN TORIES FAULT THE ECONOMY SHRUNK 0.2% THEY CUT TOO FAST TOO SOON!!!!111oneoneoeneoneoe.

 

[cHodAX]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-18046280

Looks like they might finally default, some of the top bods seem to be preparing for it.

 

[rynnor]

The whole exercise of the greek bailout was merely to gain time to bolster the banks a bit before the inevitable - it was never sustainable and certainly wasnt done for the greeks.

 

[Punishment]

It's a global thing really, some countries were just more exposed than others.

I don't get how the Greeks can suddenly be so massively in debt tbh, in Ireland it's understandable enough, banks were going to fail because of lax self governing/people being allowed to get loans as collateral to loans which invented imaginary money, the ECB didn't want to know EU didn't want to know so we had to pretty much write a blank check to bail them out (Stupid idea tbh, very stupid), but we are recovering now after 1 bailout and the Greeks are looking for a third, makes no fucking sense to me.