Politics Ed Miliband

[Wij]

Yeah because a couple of billion would have made all the difference when we ended up £700 billion down the shitter thanks to banks massively over-extending themselves in the rampant quest for bonuses.

If I remember correctly our bank bailout cost 65 billion but our annual budget deficit is 140 billion or so. We should get most of that 65 billion back too. The budget deficit is mostly just pissed up the wall.

Your figures are completely the wrong way round.

 

[Raven]

Exactly, the bailout is fuck all compared to our deficit and its the deficit that is crippling us. A deficit created by Labour by massively overspending on just about everything. The Tories are having to sort that deficit out now, which means cutting back on spending. No organisation or person can survive if they spend more than they receive.

 

[Calaen]

Exactly, the bailout is fuck all compared to our deficit and its the deficit that is crippling us. A deficit created by Labour by massively overspending on just about everything. The Tories are having to sort that deficit out now, which means cutting back on spending. No organisation or person can survive if they spend more than they receive.

We can't survive without spending either. I'm all for reducing the deficit, but they have went to hard to fast. And they will be out on their arse the second there is another election, simply because people are really struggling to cope.

 

[Wij]

We can't survive without spending either. I'm all for reducing the deficit, but they have went to hard to fast. And they will be out on their arse the second there is another election, simply because people are really struggling to cope.

Swallowed the Labour slogan then ?

Slower and shallower means much more pain in the long-term and would probably have meant noone would buy government bonds unless the gov't upped the yield, meaning we'd end up paying FAR more back. The money has to go back. "Too fast, too deep" is just a nice soundbite that sounds like common sense but is actually just an excuse to oppose EVERY cut. Milliband is trying to have it all ways up now saying that he would have made a lot of cuts but just not any that anyone mentions. Back to the good old days of opposition for Labour then where they promise they would never do anything nasty to anyone, ever (except toffs) and yet they would still be really good with money and stuff.

:/

 

[Scouse]

No best man. Wonder why ?

He's marrying it?

Do you have best men at Jewish weddings?

 

[Calaen]

Swallowed the Labour slogan then ?

Slower and shallower means much more pain in the long-term and would probably have meant noone would buy government bonds unless the gov't upped the yield, meaning we'd end up paying FAR more back. The money has to go back. "Too fast, too deep" is just a nice soundbite that sounds like common sense but is actually just an excuse to oppose EVERY cut. Milliband is trying to have it all ways up now saying that he would have made a lot of cuts but just not any that anyone mentions. Back to the good old days of opposition for Labour then where they promise they would never do anything nasty to anyone, ever (except toffs) and yet they would still be really good with money and stuff.

:/

Nothing to do with the slogan, but I'm sat in a building consultancy and we were relatively small in comparison to others and we have let go over 25 people in the space of 9 months. We held on longer than most other consultants. We were also sat on a bunch of jobs waiting to be signed off by the government most of which have been canned.

You can't just start and stop whole sectors and expect everything to just sort itself out. Most of the guys/gals being made redundant are heading for Australia.

We struggle in the UK as it is for building services engineers due to the small numbers of students going through university despite us sponsoring 1-2 students a year. The past two years we have been unable to start 4 new people on a career path. When this is all sorted we will have no-one to do the work, and the ones who are around will be chargnig over the top prices.

I'm simply telling you how I see it. The fact is there are hundreds of thousands of people in a worse situation than the one I find myself in and they are only going to blame the government for it. By forcing it through like this they are harming their ability to actually make a real difference by being in it long term.

 

[Wij]

Do you have best men at Jewish weddings?

Notwithstanding their atheism, Ed was best man at David's wedding

...before the tensions

 

[Wij]

Nothing to do with the slogan, but I'm sat in a building consultancy and we were relatively small in comparison to others and we have let go over 25 people in the space of 9 months. We held on longer than most other consultants. We were also sat on a bunch of jobs waiting to be signed off by the government most of which have been canned.

You can't just start and stop whole sectors and expect everything to just sort itself out. Most of the guys/gals being made redundant are heading for Australia.

We struggle in the UK as it is for building services engineers due to the small numbers of students going through university despite us sponsoring 1-2 students a year. The past two years we have been unable to start 4 new people on a career path. When this is all sorted we will have no-one to do the work, and the ones who are around will be chargnig over the top prices.

I'm simply telling you how I see it. The fact is there are hundreds of thousands of people in a worse situation than the one I find myself in and they are only going to blame the government for it. By forcing it through like this they are harming their ability to actually make a real difference by being in it long term.

All not nice I'm sure but where and when would you make cuts ?

 

[Calaen]

All not nice I'm sure but where and when would you make cuts ?

I'm not a politician or a maths genius, but I believe they could have made cuts over a longer stretch I'm not talking decades, but the cuts made in the pas 9 months are a bit savage.

 

[Wij]

I'm not a politician or a maths genius, but I believe they could have made cuts over a longer stretch I'm not talking decades, but the cuts made in the pas 9 months are a bit savage.

They are intended to be and we will still be nowhere near to starting to pay off a penny of the debt. We'll just have started increasing it by only a mind-boggling amount per year instead of a cock-shattering amount.

 

[cHodAX]

The reasonthe defecit jumped wasn't just the extra spending though was it? That doesn't even come close to explaining how the defecit doubled in a year, what does explain it is the first wave of the bailout, the second wave of the bailout followed by the effects of quantitative easing and let us not forget the massive loss of productive output resulting in lost GDP.

The credit crisis is now estimated to eventually cost this country £7 trillion in lost production, the tax revenues have plummeted precisely because of that lost production and it is why the defecit has become so unmanagable. The only way out of this mess now to is to reverse the decline, new growth brings in more tax and lowers the defecit. Yes spending needed to drop heavily as well but not to a level where it actually stagnates growth and kills of any realistic chance of lowering the defecit. That is exactly what is happening now, three lowered growth forecasts in a row, poor retail performance and a jobless total showing no significant signs of dropping.

Credit crisis cost the nation £7trn, says Bank of England - Business News, Business - The Independent

 

[Calaen]

They are intended to be and we will still be nowhere near to starting to pay off a penny of the debt. We'll just have started increasing it by only a mind-boggling amount per year instead of a cock-shattering amount.

I just think it's going to hurt at the next elections regardless of how good a job they have done in the bigger picture. I vote labour, but I've been impressed with how the coalition is working.

Fact is simple folk look at their wages and what they can afford to buy with it. Unfortunately atm it's not much and it gets you even less.

 

[MYstIC G]

Everyone fucking off in December all month because of the bad weather didn't help matters either but we can't blame that on America so nobody says anything about it. I'm generalising here but 1/12 of a years GDP down toilet in poor economic times = lolfailplan.

We need to get back to basics, make stuff & sell it.

 

[Wij]

The reasonthe defecit jumped wasn't just the extra spending though was it? That doesn't even come close to explaining how the defecit doubled in a year, what does explain it is the first wave of the bailout, the second wave of the bailout followed by the effects of quantitative easing and let us not forget the massive loss of productive output resulting in lost GDP.

The credit crisis is now estimated to eventually cost this country £7 trillion in lost production, the tax revenues have plummeted precisely because of that lost production and it is why the defecit has become so unmanagable. The only way out of this mess now to is to reverse the decline, new growth brings in more tax and lowers the defecit. Yes spending needed to drop heavily as well but not to a level where it actually stagnates growth and kills of any realistic chance of lowering the defecit. That is exactly what is happening now, three lowered growth forecasts in a row, poor retail performance and a jobless total showing no significant signs of dropping.

Credit crisis cost the nation £7trn, says Bank of England - Business News, Business - The Independent

You realise that article is over a year old. Estimates having been coming down year on year.

Yes, recessions cost the economy, whatever the cause. The trick is to not max out the nation's spending when the times are good so that you are totally fucked when a recession comes.

 

[MYstIC G]

Yes, recessions cost the economy, whatever the cause. The trick is to not max out the nation's spending when the times are good so that you are totally fucked when a recession comes.

That's not a trick, it's called "being sensible" something Labour fail at.

 

[cHodAX]

You realise that article is over a year old. Estimates having been coming down year on year.

Yes, recessions cost the economy, whatever the cause. The trick is to not max out the nation's spending when the times are good so that you are totally fucked when a recession comes.

A year old or not the figures stand up, output is down hugely and unemployment has soared. The effect those have on tax revenues and benefit payments is massive. That is the lions share of the defecit right there and you won't reverse it with low spending whilst refusing to stimulate the private sector but also addressing the massive issue of forcing the banks to start sensibly lending to small/medium businesses again and this government have done fuck all to address those issues. Lending levels are 30% lower than they need to be be break this stagnation in growth, the banks have had the bailout and are making profits but passing those profits on in bonuses/dividends rather than strengthening balance sheets and seeking out new business.

 

[Wij]

That is the lions share of the defecit right there

No it isn't. The structural deficit has been estimated at 80 billion.

and you won't reverse it with low spending

deficit = spending - income so yes, you will.

whilst refusing to stimulate the private sector

If it was as simple as public spending always returns more income than it costs then every government would have figured that out by now and be doing it infinitely. It doesn't, so they don't.

but also addressing the massive issue of forcing the banks to start sensibly lending to small/medium businesses again

Risky lending was half the problem the first time round. Banks aren't doing risky loans to businesses now. Sorry, but if the business plan stacks up then the bank will lend. If it doesn't then they won't. Pumping loans at shit businesses to meet an arbitrary figure won't help anything.

and this government have done fuck all to address those issues.

because it can't for the reasons above. Labour know this as well but being in opposition they can pretend it's not true and that they would have forced the banks to magic up billions all round.

Lending levels are 30% lower than they need to be be break this stagnation in growth

Source (?) and the lending levels will increase when the market is right, not by forcing the banks to do it. You're putting the cart before the horse.

the banks have had the bailout and are making profits but passing those profits on in bonuses/dividends rather than strengthening balance sheets and seeking out new business.

I work for one of those banks and can assure you this is not the case. I will be made redundant in May due to this whole thing.

/thread (well, we can still talk about Ed's wedding if you'd like)

 

[Wij]

Hmm. Some kind of set-up ?

BBC News - Gillian Duffy - Brown's 'bigoted' woman - collars Clegg

 

[Wij]

Oh Jesus !

BBC News - Cameron hints at blocking Brown bid for IMF job

 

[ECA]

God help 3rd world countries if Nodrog becomes head of the IMF.

 

[Wij]

WTF???

BBC News - Ed Miliband: 'These strikes are wrong'

 

[caLLous]

Is the WTF for the stance he has taken or the fact that he answered 5 questions with exactly the same words, just in a slightly different order?

He's so..... wet. :\

 

[Wij]

Is the WTF for the stance he has taken or the fact that he answered 5 questions with exactly the same words, just in a slightly different order?

He's so..... wet. :\

The latter. He could hardly come out fully in favour of the strikes as he's already seen as in the pockets of the unions. There was a bit of tweeting going on between the journalist involved and the guy who writes the IT Crowd and the journo couldn't believe he just gave the same answer over and over.

Check out Glinner's feed. V funny today

https://twitter.com/#!/Glinner

 

[- English -]

The strikes are SO wrong. The public sector needs to get real! Nobody gave a monkeys about the 90billion stolen by labour from the private sector pensions and savings during the labour years! It just shows how ignorant the unions and labour voting skanks are.

 

[- English -]

Is the WTF for the stance he has taken or the fact that he answered 5 questions with exactly the same words, just in a slightly different order?

He's so..... wet. :\

lmao

 

[Wij]

The strikes are SO wrong. The public sector needs to get real! Nobody gave a monkeys about the 90billion stolen by labour from the private sector pensions and savings during the labour years! It just shows how ignorant the unions and labour voting skanks are.

Polly Fucking Toynbee on QT last night was whinging that private pensions still get a BIT of tax relief and that they should get rid of that before touching public sector pensions. If I was on the panel I'd have blown my nose on the bitch

 

[cHodAX]

It just shows how ignorant the unions and labour voting skanks are.

I voted Labour but I am not deluded as to the mistakes they made, nor am I a skank.

Facts are, the public pensions are a massive drain on the exchequer, they are way out of line with private sector pensions and we need to restore some kind of parity if we are offload a huge liabilty from the public finances and back onto the people who will ultimately benefit. They should all sit down and thrash out a deal that works for both the public sector and the taxpayer, if both give ground we can save alot of money whilst still giving public servants a good deal.

 

[cHodAX]

Polly Fucking Toynbee on QT last night was whinging that private pensions still get a BIT of tax relief and that they should get rid of that before touching public sector pensions. If I was on the panel I'd have blown my nose on the bitch

Aye she clueless, the private sector pension holders needs a few breaks after consistently being raped for the last 5 years. They still grossly underpeform compared to the public sector pensions.

 

[Embattle]

He is just fence sitting and will lose whatever happens, then again not as if any one has really noticed him yet any way.

 

[cHodAX]

He is just fence sitting and will lose whatever happens, then again not as if any one has really noticed him yet any way.

Yep, they picked someone weak because they don't want the reins again anytime soon. Not only would they have to mop up the mess from previous governments but also have to deal with an E.U. sliding towards failure and a rudderless world economy.