Driving, fixed penalty - pay or not?

[Tom]

Thats what the Yorkshire Ripper said.

 

[ECA]

I am the happiest person you would ever expect to meet, nothing bitter about me. Although I do confess to being an individual.

I think your posts in this thread prove otherwise

 

[Calaen]

show me where I am bitter?

 

[Bodhi]

Its a road where people with more FUCKING intelligence than you have decided is safer, if people adhere to a speed limit.

Fucking LOL. You've never worked in the public sector have you? It's full of people so stupid they have to go on a half day course on how to sit at a computer without injuring themselves. I wouldn't trust that bunch of cretins to decide the price of tea much less decide on a speed limit.

 

[Embattle]

Pay it, also a lot of these so called loopholes won't work. It was something they had that well known lawyer who has represented various stars look at in a copy of Auto Express one week, the main part of the article was around sites claiming to offer legal loopholes, basically to sum it up most won't work.

 

[TdC]

zomg! it's Emb!

 

[mank!]

I drove home really slowly tonight for no real reason.

 

[tris-]

Fucking LOL. You've never worked in the public sector have you? It's full of people so stupid they have to go on a half day course on how to sit at a computer without injuring themselves.

actually young man, i think its more to do with health and safety and to stop silly twats taking civil actions against the company at every opportunity.

the price of tea is decided by both supply and demand. i wouldnt trust anyone but an experienced economist to decide the prices of tea

regardless if you think your an uber leet driver who can do 140 without a problem, that doesnt mean a damn thing. the law is the law, if you dont want to follow that i hope you accept the consequences.
saying you should be able to speed just because you THINK your a good driver is like saying business men should be able to rip people off just because they can. except speeding is a tad more dangerous in most circumstances.

 

[Embattle]

zomg! it's Emb!

Been away so long took a few seconds for me to remember addy

 

[Ch3tan]

regardless if you think your an uber leet driver who can do 140 without a problem, that doesnt mean a damn thing. the law is the law, if you dont want to follow that i hope you accept the consequences.
saying you should be able to speed just because you THINK your a good driver is like saying business men should be able to rip people off just because they can. except speeding is a tad more dangerous in most circumstances.

What he said. You may think you are all Schumacher, hell Tom may even have day dreamed about him while looking through his camera lens, but that doesn't mean you are all the perfect capable drivers you think you are. And more importantly, the next twat on the road who thinks the same is probably a crap driver. But hey, lets make it easier for them to drive faster, because that will make the roads safer

 

[Calaen]

Come on Ch3t letting Tom drive fast gives him the pot noodle horn.

 

[throdgrain]

Ive not read this thread, too much bitching, but Ill wade in with an opinion anyway
Most speed cameras are put where they will make most money (and annoy most people imo!) , not where they are likely to "save" most accidents.
A 30mph limit is a very good thing in suburban areas, but is a load of bollocks in other places.
The 70mph limit on motorways was given in the '60s when people drove Ford Zodiacs or whatever. Things have changed considerably, and cars brakes and handling have improved hugely, yet there is no change in the law to reflect this. Sometimes you'd be more likely to get done for holding up the traffic than obeying the law at 65mph anyway.
I have and wil continue to ride my motorbike just as fast as I want, and if I get done for it I will try t oget out of it any way I can, but if I cant get out of it then its my tough shit. But to liken me riding at 120mph to someone doing something really criminal is just the work of sanctamonius PC idiots.

Oh, and people under 30 shouldnt be allowed to drive anyway.
So there.
Ner.

 

[Calaen]

I know lots of people that have been caught of speed cameras, even though they have known they are there. Thats a clear enough indication to me that allowing them to drive faster is a risk to other people.

 

[Trem]

Speed cameras slow people down for exactly the length of the lines on the road. They speed up right after, they do not save lifes, if anything they make people jam their brakes on as soon as they see them, very dangerous on motorways, much more dangerous than doing 80mph.

I get what you are saying Cal but speed cameras are not here for safety, and the so called safety vans are not for safety, like said earlier I have never seen one outside a school or busy area, thats because they won't earn money in those positions.

Motorists are easy targets for this government to make money from, its been proven day in and day out.

They put a safety van on the way into work, they put it right after a 60mph speed limit where the road turns into a 40, it was a new 40mph limit and the camera van was there as the workmen were putting up the new speed limit sign. They want you to jam your brakes on immediately after the 60 limit in this instance. Doesn't sound like safety to me. Its a clear dual carriageway with no houses or junctions by the way.

I rarely see coppers on the roads anymore, when I started driving I got stopped every other night for a check on me and my car, that is the way it should be but guess what, that costs money and doesn't make money, the argument speaks for itself really.

 

[throdgrain]

The fastest Ive ever done was 170 on the clock on a ZZR1100, on the M25. Oh and 135 on a ordinary road on an old ZX-10
I truly believe baby jebus still loves me though

 

[Calaen]

Im not arguing about why speed cameras are there though. I am saying that you cant have Tom decide what is the safe speed to drive at because by all account he is a nobody. When you let individuals make there own decisions they tend to make the wrong one. Alot of people making the wrong decisions costs lives.

With regards to the Police driving around you are right it does cost money, but where do you expect that money to come from?

It's a common discussion on these forums if its a law Tom does not like he spouts of some tripe about if enough people dont like the law they can change it. Thats a shit attitude to have.

Its easy enough for us to sit here and blame politicians and whatever else for the countires problems but alot of the shit rests at our doors im afraid. The majority of people in this country dont think any of the parties available for election are any better than the restso why do we take it? If you really want to change something start your own party up, have sensible beliefs and plans. Do not talk crap, tell us only what can be achieved and not lie about shit that cannot possibly be done. Surely then you would have the best party in the country and you would no doubt be elected everytime.

 

[Trem]

With regards to the Police driving around you are right it does cost money, but where do you expect that money to come from?

Where did the money come from before? They always used to manage when our money was handled correctly.



Labour has aimed its money making at the motorist, lies, lies, lies is all they spout about every single reason they give for cameras, petrol tax, road tax, congestion charges etc.

If they told the truth then I would have no argument, if they said "listen people we need more money so we are putting more speed cameras up" then it would sit better with me rather than them saying they save lifes, they couldn't give a shit if someone dies if they hit a tree at 100 mph, they will care a little because ambulances cost money but only for that reason.

If they cared then every single penny made from cameras would go to the NHS or the police force. Honestly I want to see more coppers patrolling, I truly do, I have my son to think of.

Slight edit - Coppers also want to be out and about more, they want to do their job, the job they trained for, my mates brother is a copper and he says the job is one constant stream of paper work since Labour got in, he hasn't chased a scumbag for months.


This isn't me arguing or even being relative to this thread, its my thoughts.

 

[Wij]

Starting your own party is not going to work in this day and age. If you want something changed you have to make people aware and change public opinion. Then the major parties will adopt it as a policy, but only if people really care about the issue and aren't just apathetic.

Speed cameras are mostly just for cash generating. They often put them on perfectly safe bits of road where no accidents occur. And a lot of the speed limits are dumb. And they should have more police patrols to catch the kinds of bad driving that cameras can't detect which cause far more accidents.

That said you, got caught, you know the law. It's only £60. Just pay it.

 

[Tom]

Nothing hes said has suggested that he actually broke the law. Speed cameras are very far from reliable.

 

[Calaen]

He has not denied doing the speed limit so you cannot say otherwise.

 

[ECA]

It's a common discussion on these forums if its a law Tom does not like he spouts of some tripe about if enough people dont like the law they can change it. Thats a shit attitude to have.

Democracy bad, totalitarianism good.

 

[Calaen]

Ignorance is bad.

 

[ECA]

show me where I am bitter?

Jesus you are such fucking morons sometimes.
You are no different to scum bags that commit other crimes and get off with it due to some fucking loop hole..

With all respect intended mate you can fuck right off. This comment shows everyone that probably already thinks you are a cock they are right.

You have no fucking respect for other people when you drive. I feel sorry for you I really do.

Fixed for clarity. Cock bag.

Its a road where people with more FUCKING intelligence than you have decided is safer, if people adhere to a speed limit.

I really look forward to your I crashed my car into a wall post, no doubt it will be someone elses fault.

Until then please carry on in your sub standard life.

No mate I am the guy that could stamp on your face for eternity and never get bored.

Hmmm I wonder

Its strange that most people on your side of the argument are of the rather limited debate but high on insult side isnt it?

 

[Skyler]

I would love to see more police around, traffic cops and your standard bobbies would be great.

Genuine motorists suffer at the hands of the speed cameras, uninsured drivers, banned drivers, drivers without a license, car thieves, joyriders.. none of these really suffer by being caught by a camera.

If a car thief is flashed the fine will go to the owner of the car, joyriders again will go to the owner of the car - if it even has an owner. Chances are that uninsured and banned drivers wont be caught out by simply paying the fine promptly since I'm sure they have no way of proving who is in the car!

The real sufferers are those who always drive carefully and get caught out by the scameras already mentioned, such as ones placed on perfectly straight roads which have sudden drops in speed limits - these are potentially deadly - far deadlier than Toms driving at 100mph on his own judgement. These people will get the fine, pay up and get on with things, that's not how things should be.

I'm still finding it hard to believe that there are not enough motorists who can get together and try and change the way things are or even just stop them getting worse.

The whole global warming environmental argument seems to loom over anything motorists do even if they are being treated unfairly. Yes, we have climate issues, yes we should do something about it, but in reality England is not the one that is going to ruin the world - if that's what will happen. The governments answer to global warming is to charge people more money, this does nothing to save the planet and lines their pockets.

China and India will do thousands of times more damage to the environment over the next 20-30 years than we as a country could ever do. Not to mention what America has already been doing and continues to do without any care whatsoever.

Anyway that's another discussion

http://www.speedcam.co.uk/spot_the_trap.swf

Pretty nifty little game, illustrates just how sneaky the camera vans are. You might think the first one is obvious, but that could easily be just another motorway maintenance van, an ambulance, even people would think that's the RAC. How can they expect someone to automatically think that it's a speed camera van?

 

[Trem]

I would love to see more police around, traffic cops and your standard bobbies would be great.

Genuine motorists suffer at the hands of the speed cameras, uninsured drivers, banned drivers, drivers without a license, car thieves, joyriders.. none of these really suffer by being caught by a camera.

If a car thief is flashed the fine will go to the owner of the car, joyriders again will go to the owner of the car - if it even has an owner. Chances are that uninsured and banned drivers wont be caught out by simply paying the fine promptly since I'm sure they have no way of proving who is in the car!

The real sufferers are those who always drive carefully and get caught out by the scameras already mentioned, such as ones placed on perfectly straight roads which have sudden drops in speed limits - these are potentially deadly - far deadlier than Toms driving at 100mph on his own judgement. These people will get the fine, pay up and get on with things, that's not how things should be.

I'm still finding it hard to believe that there are not enough motorists who can get together and try and change the way things are or even just stop them getting worse.

The whole global warming environmental argument seems to loom over anything motorists do even if they are being treated unfairly. Yes, we have climate issues, yes we should do something about it, but in reality England is not the one that is going to ruin the world - if that's what will happen. The governments answer to global warming is to charge people more money, this does nothing to save the planet and lines their pockets.

China and India will do thousands of times more damage to the environment over the next 20-30 years than we as a country could ever do. Not to mention what America has already been doing and continues to do without any care whatsoever.

Anyway that's another discussion

http://www.speedcam.co.uk/spot_the_trap.swf

Pretty nifty little game, illustrates just how sneaky the camera vans are. You might think the first one is obvious, but that could easily be just another motorway maintenance van, an ambulance, even people would think that's the RAC. How can they expect someone to automatically think that it's a speed camera van?

Fantastic post. Says all the things that were in my brain regarding this subject.

 

[dysfunction]

I do believe a lot of cameras are there just to make money especially the "portable" ones that are shown here http://www.speedcam.co.uk/spot_the_trap.swf (From Skylers Post). And I think that is a disgrace and should not be allowed at all.

There are some though which need to be there. They just put up a speed camera on the A40 where I cross the street everyday. More than 80% of people at that point accelerate to get through the lights....usually after its changed to red already! I have seen a few people just about to step out into the road to cross and they nearly get taken out by some idiotic motorist.

Since the camera has been put it has reduced this mad dash for the lights by a very large degree.

 

[Tom]

He has not denied doing the speed limit so you cannot say otherwise.

Since in this country we're presumed innocent until proven guilty, I can.

Unless you're talking about the S172 offence, in which case its the other way around - until the European court of Human Rights chuck it out next year that is.

 

[SheepCow]

I find it rude when they stick speed cameras at the bottom of hills. The bottom of the hill (before you get on the hill) is 30mph, the hill itself is 40mph, loads of people get caught doing 35-40mph as they get onto the hill. Just rude.

 

[SheepCow]

Since in this country we're presumed innocent until proven guilty

Not tecnically true.

 

[Skyler]

<3 Trem