Politics Coronavirus

[Scouse]

Well one things for sure, looks like our elderly are the guinea pigs for the western world.

No.

The guinea pigs were the tens of thousands of people who took part in a series of well-conducted safety trials.

The vaccine has been passed as safe. Rapidly accelerated? Yes. We put tens of billions of pounds into it.

But it went through all the trials vaccines normally go through.

Guinea pigging has been done. We're on to rollout of a safe vaccine.

 

[Job]

Safety trials and mass rollout are two seperate thing, thats why we normally wait to follow up on triallist progress.

This is an emergency validation.

From Washington post....
In the United States, the FDA reviews all aspects of the data submitted with a vaccine application, including manufacturing and individual patient-level data. The British Medicines and Healthcare Products Regulatory Agency instead relied largely on summary data submitted by Pfizer and BioNTech, according to experts.

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And British authorities did not hold a public meeting involving the Pfizer application, though it did confer with an independent expert panel on the medical assessment and conditions of authorization. The FDA, by contrast, committed months ago in the name of transparency to convene a public meeting of its vaccine advisory committee to solicit its recommendations on an emergency authorization and to make public the data that was submitted by the manufacturer.

Robert Califf, who was FDA commissioner during the Obama administration, said it was important for the U.S. regulators to have a “public airing” of the Pfizer application and data, given the level of anti-vaccine sentiment in the United States, even if it takes a little more time.

“We have a lot of skepticism and a need to follow public procedures to provide transparency,” he said.

 

[Scouse]

That basically says the US is pandeting to anti-vaxxers where the UK isn't.

That's a good thing. There are significantly less knuckleheaded morons in the UK and making a special song and dance about a vaccine is unwarranted and would just give rise that anti-vaxxers fears are valid reasons to delay rollout.

They're not. They're fears, not facts.

 

[Bodhi]

Personally I'm not the slightest bit bothered about appeasing the "Teh vaccine means Bill Gates is going to reset my brain with 5G" or whatever other nonsense the utter loons are coming out with - however there does look to be a sizeable portion of the population who are in no way anti-vaxx, but do have genuine concerns about taking these current quickly developed vaccines. If we want high take up of the vaccine then this is portion of the population we'll have to work on, however I'm pretty sure once the vaccines are out there and no real adverse reactions are seen, they will quickly come round.

Believe it or not one of the trickiest parts of the population to vaccinate may well be the NHS. Given large amounts are likely to have been already exposed (and hence have antibodies), and memories of Pandremix are likely to be quite fresh still, we may be surprised by the number of health care professionals who refuse it.

 

[Scouse]

Believe it or not one of the trickiest parts of the population to vaccinate may well be the NHS. Given large amounts are likely to have been already exposed (and hence have antibodies), and memories of Pandremix are likely to be quite fresh still, we may be surprised by the number of health care professionals who refuse it.

What leads you to think that?

The pandremix thing hasn't been getting any traction outside of FH as far as I can tell. And you'd expect nurses to understand the benefits and risks of vaccination (and not getting vaccinated) better than almost everyone. So I'd be gobsmacked if you had a load of reluctant people in the NHS.

So, in terms of believing it - I'm on the "not" side at the moment

 

[Bodhi]

What leads you to think that?

The pandremix thing hasn't been getting any traction outside of FH as far as I can tell. And you'd expect nurses to understand the benefits and risks of vaccination (and not getting vaccinated) better than almost everyone. So I'd be gobsmacked if you had a load of reluctant people in the NHS.

So, in terms of believing it - I'm on the "not" side at the moment

It's a well developed hunch at this point, based upon chatting to a couple of family members who work there and interactions on other forums.

 

[Aoami]

My Mother in Law is a GP's nurse and can't wait for it. We were talking about it last night, and she thinks anti-vaxxers are spanners. However, she also thinks all black people are criminals so I don't really know what to think.

 

[Raven]

Tories

Coronavirus: UK got vaccine first because it's 'a better country', says Gavin Williamson

The EU says vaccines are not a "football competition" after Education Secretary Gavin Williamson's comment.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Moriath]

What leads you to think that?

The pandremix thing hasn't been getting any traction outside of FH as far as I can tell. And you'd expect nurses to understand the benefits and risks of vaccination (and not getting vaccinated) better than almost everyone. So I'd be gobsmacked if you had a load of reluctant people in the NHS.

So, in terms of believing it - I'm on the "not" side at the moment

I seen lots of posts about Pandremix on twitter.

also had the pregnant questions answered

no pregnant or likely to be pregnant person in the next 3 months will be given the vaccine.

 

[Scouse]

no pregnant or likely to be pregnant person in the next 3 months will be given the vaccine.

Government said that?

I bet that's standard practice now.

 

[dysfunction]

Government said that?

I bet that's standard practice now.

Prof Jonathan Van-Tam said that on TV

How will the vulnerable be protected from Covid? And other questions

The government has announced the end of all Covid restrictions in England.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Moriath]

Government said that?

I bet that's standard practice now.

Yes.

 

[Scouse]

So. Risks being managed sensibly, no?

 

[Moriath]

Yes.

Will not be. Not will be for in the next three months.

 

[Moriath]

So. Risks being managed sensibly, no?

Yes in that respect

 

[Scouse]

Yes in that respect

OK. What other respects is it not being managed sensibly? Or was it not your intention to imply that?

 

[Moriath]

Top teacher wins $1m and gives half away

An Indian village school teacher wins the Global Teacher Prize and shares the award with runners-up.

www.bbc.co.uk

nice guy

 

[Moriath]

OK. What other respects is it not being managed sensibly? Or was it not your intention to imply that?

Just looking at fauci and the eu statements saying the uk wasnt as careful or fastidious in approving the jab as it could have been. Obviously we dont know if they have or not. But it casts a bit of doubt.

Fauci apologises for saying UK 'rushed' vaccine

After apparent criticism from the US expert, the UK defended the safety and efficacy of the vaccine.

www.bbc.co.uk

Coronavirus: UK got vaccine first because it's 'a better country', says Gavin Williamson

The EU says vaccines are not a "football competition" after Education Secretary Gavin Williamson's comment.

www.bbc.co.uk

just seems a bit like have we been competing with others to get it approved first when its not a competition?

 

[Job]

I think its quite likely history might repeat itself, what the thousands of hypochondriac forums out there thesedays.

The fiasco of the 1976 ‘swine flu affair’

With a pandemic looming, the US president announced a warp-speed effort to vaccinate every man, woman and child in the country. The mistakes that followed hold lessons for today.

www.bbc.com

 

[Job]

I'm not so sure this rollout would survive 3 deaths like that given the internets.

SWINE FLU PROGRAM IS HALTED IN 9 STATES AS 3 DIE AFTER SHOTS (Published 1976)

Swine flu vaccination programs in 9 states and in Pittsburgh and suburbs are suspended after deaths of 3 elderly persons who recd vaccine at Pittsburgh clinic; Fed and Pa health officials say there is no evidence that deaths resulted from vaccinations; all 3 patients were known to have had heart...

www.nytimes.com

 

[Yoni]

I will have a flu shot next week - but I will wait until after the summer to have a cv19 vaccination - we are not planning to travel until October next year earlierst.

 

[Job]

I see the government are trying a new tack of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
US chief medical officer saying we rushed the decision, the EU backing that , idiotic cheering of superiority completely devoid of anyone suggesting it, and now a total Uturn on nhs staff.

NHS staff no longer at front of queue for Covid vaccine after rethink

Change to priority list for next few weeks likely to worry and disappoint health workers

www.theguardian.com

So the steep curved graph of people who wont get it plus people who wont now take it, soldiers on.

 

[Yoni]

Why would a health worker want a vaccine that is not properly tested?

 

[Gwadien]

I see the government are trying a new tack of snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.
US chief medical officer saying we rushed the decision, the EU backing that , idiotic cheering of superiority completely devoid of anyone suggesting it, and now a total Uturn on nhs staff.

NHS staff no longer at front of queue for Covid vaccine after rethink

Change to priority list for next few weeks likely to worry and disappoint health workers

www.theguardian.com

So the steep curved graph of people who wont get it plus people who wont now take it, soldiers on.

Wait, so now Fauci (the captain of the liberal elite science) and the EU are critical of the vaccine you now think its a good idea?

 

[Job]

Well the mail are trying to spin him as a Trump lacky, which he has never been.
Its the only way to get out of lockdown because it will simply change peoples perception, deaths will start to be worded more skeptically by the media, loads of feel good stories around the vaccine.
They could be injecting you with mineral water, all they have to do us spin the already falling cases as a result.
Its safer than your trip to the doctors to get it, but somehow its become some dick waving contest.

 

[MYstIC G]

I don't agree with Job but I see no reason for Fauci to comment on anything other than the US process.

 

[Gwadien]

Well the mail are trying to spin him as a Trump lacky, which he has never been.
Its the only way to get out of lockdown because it will simply change peoples perception, deaths will start to be worded more skeptically by the media, loads of feel good stories around the vaccine.
They could be injecting you with mineral water, all they have to do us spin the already falling cases as a result.
Its safer than your trip to the doctors to get it, but somehow its become some dick waving contest.

Lol, we started the dick waving contest by saying 'we're the best'.

I don't agree with Job but I see no reason for Fauci to comment on anything other than the US process.

And that's why he made such comments, I'm sure the fuller context is that the media has asked him why isn't the US rolling out the vaccine when the UK is.

The Government is doing whatever it can to get ahead of the pack so that we get a head start for when Brexit hits.

Time will tell I guess, if shit hits the fan, the damage will be unprecedented to the UK's democracy.

 

[Scouse]

Why would a health worker want a vaccine that is not properly tested?

It's been properly tested. As your beloved EU will sign off on at the end of the month.

Asshat point scoring politicians notwithstanding.

 

[MYstIC G]

And that's why he made such comments, I'm sure the fuller context is that the media has asked him why isn't the US rolling out the vaccine when the UK is.

Meh, so don't be goaded by the media. It would be just as simple for him to say that the US is following their own protocols without passing judgement.

 

[Gwadien]

Meh, so don't be goaded by the media. It would be just as simple for him to say that the US is following their own protocols without passing judgement.

I think it's a fairly acceptable question to ask and he answered it rather diplomatically, he could have shit talked us to death, but no, we just have a different system.