Politics Coronavirus

[Bodhi]

In data: the rise of non-Covid deaths | The Spectator

Paywall, but anyone with half a brain should be able to figure out getting round it.

The worrying thing about the ONS data, is the spike in non-COVID related deaths, suggesting locdowns have consequences as well.

 

[dysfunction]

or misdiagnosed and should be classified as Covid-19

 

[~Yuckfou~]

or misdiagnosed and should be classified as Covid-19

As an example there was an old guy back in my home town, gets CV, in hospital in a coma, has a heart attack and dies.
Now is that CV or "natural causes"?

 

[Scouse]

As an example there was an old guy back in my home town, gets CV, in hospital in a coma, has a heart attack and dies.
Now is that CV or "natural causes"?

Did CV put him in that coma? You're much more likely to have secondary issues if your body is under stress of fighting off infection - so CV would definitely be counted as contributory to that.

That's why they do the "excess deaths" thing. Helps them to analyse that because it's not simple.

Either way - our excess death is going through the roof - (which is criminal tbh) - despite the lockdown

 

[~Yuckfou~]

Yup the coma was a CV induced jobbie.

 

[Yoni]

As an example there was an old guy back in my home town, gets CV, in hospital in a coma, has a heart attack and dies.
Now is that CV or "natural causes"?

In Sweden it is included in the figures regardless of whether it is caused or whether it is a contributing factor - in many other countries it is not... (I believe this includes sof of our closest neighbours which will not close the gap due to the old peoples home screw up but may explain more of the gap).

 

[~Yuckfou~]

I'm just sitting here marvelling at the countryside and contemplating.
I hope that when there's a next time that the world is ready. There will be no room for excuses after this.
Personally we will have in stock latex gloves and the best masks available.

 

[Job]

So the press are doing their utmost to destroy Brazils right wing leader for his anti lockdown approach.

Brazils deaths so far 5000
Brazils population 205m

Hmmmmmm

 

[Scouse]

I hope that when there's a next time that the world is ready. There will be no room for excuses after this.

Like they're prepared for the devestation of the natural world (caused by overconsumption) that scientists have been screaming about since the 1950's?

 

[Scouse]

So the press are doing their utmost to destroy Brazils right wing leader for his anti lockdown approach.

Brazils deaths so far 5000
Brazils population 205m

Hmmmmmm

1) The governors ignored him and locked down - inclusing closing schools
2) They're still on an upward trend - they are a month behind us since their first case (and a month of "oh shit! it's real! going through the mind of everyone but el presidente)
3) Testing
4) Unreported deaths in remote areas
5) They locked down and called him an asshat - because he is.


There's a lot of excess death despite a draconian lockdown @Job. How do you think your graph would look if we hadn't closed schools, enforced distancing, made everyone work from home and banned public spaces?

These are extreme measures. How would things look without them?

Don't be glib when you answer. And I'll give you something else to think about before you do - the scientists have been pretty good with their projections based on the currently enacted policies - so you can expect the same to hold true with their other projections.

Serious question.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

Like they're prepared for the devestation of the natural world (caused by overconsumption) that scientists have been screaming about since the 1950's?

I hope/QUOTE]

 

[Job]

Unless theres frickin 10s thousands , theyre doing pretty well for a country with a sizeable slum population

 

[Job]

The fatility rates from cebm.net

Well theyre all over the fucking place, but Qatar would seem to be the most likely as they have the most confirmed against the lowest deaths.

The bottom countries of the graph..unless they are fibbing about deaths...likely...probably going to end up 0.1 to 0.3 ballpark

 

[Scouse]

Yawn. Again, zero real engagement and zero real understanding.

As per.

 

[Job]

1) The governors ignored him and locked down - inclusing closing schools
2) They're still on an upward trend - they are a month behind us since their first case (and a month of "oh shit! it's real! going through the mind of everyone but el presidente)
3) Testing
4) Unreported deaths in remote areas
5) They locked down and called him an asshat - because he is.


There's a lot of excess death despite a draconian lockdown @Job. How do you think your graph would look if we hadn't closed schools, enforced distancing, made everyone work from home and banned public spaces?

These are extreme measures. How would things look without them?

Don't be glib when you answer. And I'll give you something else to think about before you do - the scientists have been pretty good with their projections based on the currently enacted policies - so you can expect the same to hold true with their other projections.

Serious question.

Its not about reducing deaths..its about saving the nhs...flattening the curve, without a vaccine it will eventually kill who it will kill.
We cant hide from it for ever.

 

[Job]

Yawn. Again, zero real engagement and zero real understanding.

As per.

Well what do you deduce as the likely fatility outcome from obviously wildly mis/unreported data.

 

[Yoni]

Job you can’t use that analysis to tell you anything- testing strategy is far too different across the different countries. Using M pop is better but still will not be comparable due to how different countries measure what is a Covid 19 death.

 

[~Yuckfou~]

Job you can’t use that analysis to tell you anything- testing strategy is far too different across the different countries. Using M pop is better but still will not be comparable due to how different countries measure what is a Covid 19 death.

You might as well be talking to a goat.

 

[Scouse]

Meh. I'll try again - as it's a pertinent question. If he gets this, maybe he'll "get" it?

The UK has a lot of excess death despite a draconian lockdown @Job. How do you think your graph would look if we hadn't closed schools, enforced distancing, made everyone work from home and banned public spaces?

i.e. We've got all these deaths on our hands with a lockdown. How many do you think we'd be looking at without locking down? Does that not make you think it's a bit different from the flu, which we don't lock the entire planet down for?

We lose about 17,000 people a year to complications related to the flu - but with no lockdown. We've fully locked down and we're at 30,000+ with just coronavirus.

Go on. Have a go at a straightforward straight-shooting answer, in your own words.

 

[Embattle]

@Scouse You're wasting your time, I've mentioned exponential growth before and he just keeps ignoring it.

 

[Scouse]

@Scouse You're wasting your time, I've mentioned exponential growth before and he just keeps ignoring it.

I like to think the best of people.

 

[Job]

Well tell me what the lockdown is for.

Is it to protect the NHS
Or save lives?

It was put in place to flatten the curve, lockdowns also paint you into a corner, without a vaccine we are all going to be exposed eventually.

The lockdown was to stop people dying untreated in hospital carparks.

 

[Job]

Job you can’t use that analysis to tell you anything- testing strategy is far too different across the different countries. Using M pop is better but still will not be comparable due to how different countries measure what is a Covid 19 death.

Thats was exactly my point, all predictions are pointless given seriously incomplete data, even though that was the theme on here for the first few weeks...10%...were all gonna die!

Im simply guessing at 0.3%ish, because these things tend to end up there.

 

[dysfunction]

Thats was exactly my point, all predictions are pointless given seriously incomplete data, even though that was the theme on here for the first few weeks...10%...were all gonna die!

Im simply guessing at 0.3%ish, because these things tend to end up there.

Your guesses are shite

 

[Job]

We shall see.

 

[Job]

Isnt the US doing well.

 

[Job]

Thats not nice, youre not Italian are you?

 

[Job]

If Germanys figure is correct, which if any country could pull it off they could I suppose...its now a millstone around their neck, theyll have to lockdown till vaccine and the first attempt to ease up showed that.
They could easily triple that in a second wave.

 

[Jupitus]

Isnt the US doing well.

View attachment 41490

Since when is that info? It says 'UK new measures' - when and what is that... context you stupid cunt!

 

[Moriath]

Since when is that info? It says 'UK new measures' - when and what is that... context you stupid cunt!

Uk new measures means the added death figures with the all sources deaths not just hospital deaths. Which many of the other countries are unclear about. And i doubt usa’s numbers are that low. I am sure there are loads of people die who couldnt afford health care that are never registered as a cv death. Not to mention all the illegals in new york.