Politics Coronavirus

[Job]

So her co-opt and her resignation.

Yup...though I dont know what co opt is.

They were devastated because she was the first person to show interest for years.

 

[Job]

Yes, because stopping people from spreading the virus (you know, something that is passed from person to person) is such a bad idea.

Perhaps we should have done what America did! Yeah, that's working out great for them.

...and please don't bring up deaths per 100k without bringing up population density.

So please dont being up reality while Ive got some wiggle room.

 

[caLLous]

And it turns out Johnson's dad has fucked off to Greece and dearest Boris won't say a word about it. People around him obviously not giving a toss about the guidelines and yet he still expects the public to do what they're bloody well told.

 

[Scouse]

Lockdowns probably saved three million lives in Europe

Coronavirus: Lockdowns in Europe saved millions of lives

The researchers say the death toll would have been "huge" without a lockdown.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Scouse]

The multiple studies from different countries saying the same thing are optimistic @Yoni?

Got an alternative evidence-based narrative you can share?

 

[Yoni]

Did you actually read he article in Nature? I do not think you did - you read the BBC article which actually has no data at all. If you were to read the article you will actually see that it refers to only two european countries France and Italy not really representational of Europe.

 

[Deebs]

Just popped out for some bread and milk, local hairdresser has at least 30 people queuing outside, decided to take a quick drive around town, any hairdresser open has queues of people.

Drove past a pub, saw a bloke on the door with a full face visor and face mask on the door.

 

[Scouse]

Did you actually read he article in Nature? I do not think you did - you read the BBC article which actually has no data at all. If you were to read the article you will actually see that it refers to only two european countries France and Italy not really representational of Europe.

1) Yes, I did:

We study the impact of major interventions across 11 European countries for the period from the start of COVID-19 until the 4th of May 2020 when lockdowns started to be lifted

2) Did you read my post - which stated "multiple studies from different countries" - not just this one.

3) Do you have the evidence-based argument that I asked for, or just your opinion?

 

[Scouse]

Just popped out for some bread and milk, local hairdresser has at least 30 people queuing outside, decided to take a quick drive around town, any hairdresser open has queues of people.

Drove past a pub, saw a bloke on the door with a full face visor and face mask on the door.

I got Tam to cut my hair with nail scissors (whilst sat under a tree in one of the fields, so we could make as much mess as we liked).

If I can convince her that's now her job then that'll save me £12 a pop

 

[Yoni]

1) Yes, I did:

2) Did you read my post - which stated "multiple studies from different countries" - not just this one.

3) Do you have an evidence-based argument that I asked for, or just your opinion?

Please provide links to the other studies because the BBC is only referencing the one I read. If you are ok with believing hyped rhetoric without actually reading the detail awesome for your but please fuck off with your holier than though GIF EVIDENCE PLIX unless you can actually live up to your own expectations of others. ie read the fucking article behind the hyped rhetoric ...

 

[Scouse]

So, you:

1) hadn't read the article you accused me of not reading, but felt fit to pass comment on how it wasn't relevant

2) haven't got an evidence-based comeback

3) are angry because you've made yourself look like a fool.

Fair enough.

 

[Scouse]

As an olive branch @Yoni - here's the linking page to the .pdf in Nature.

Estimating the effects of non-pharmaceutical interventions on COVID-19 in Europe - Nature

Modelling based on pooled data from 11 European countries indicates that non-pharmaceutical interventions—particularly lockdowns—have had a marked effect on SARS-CoV-2 transmission, driving the reproduction number of the infection below 1.

www.nature.com

 

[Yoni]

So, you:

1) hadn't read the article but felt fit to pass comment on how it wasn't relevant

2) haven't got an evidence-based comeback

3) are angry because you've made yourself look like a fool.

Fair enough.

Dear boy I am far from angry - not sure how many times I have asked you not to assume how I feel on these forums . As you have not read the article your original post as adhering to your own personal rhetoric and not based upon scientific evidence so as i stated optimistic.

According to the scientific sources you adhere to for example Sweden's death count should have been over 70k should they continue as they did - their deathcount although high is nowhere near the levels expected.

I have read the pdf Scouse which was my point - I doubt you have.

 

[Job]

There is a bigger issue, because our science struggles with virus, we have very little to kill them in the body and the only real approach is to ready the immune system; and thats a constant juggling act that often ends up in more deaths than covid.

Lockdown isolates us from them , but as a species we are getting weaker and weaker in the fight, historically they came along and took out the people too weak or genetically prone.
We are the result of that natural selection, but now there is an ever increasing list of virus that can take out an increasing chunk of humanity that pass on their vulnerabilities, either directly or through genetic disposition to health problems.

So letting it burn through is out obviously, because even 0.1% death rate looks real bad in the papers , we need to spend big bucks on an actual treatment for virus of any mutation.

Why less than 25% of the world’s population is likely to get Covid-19

SARS-CoV-2 is a novel, i.e. new coronavirus. However, after over six months (this virus arguably started in China in November 2019), there is now sufficient data to suggest that it is neither as lethal as...

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

 

[Yoni]

For once @Job you have posted something that IS being discussed heavily in the scientific community. It was picked up in Italy c. 5 weeks ago although I read recently in NYT that they do not see any mutations that substantiate what the Italian doctors were seeing.

It also for once didn't deserve a facepalm except for the conclusion you made.... you can't let it just burn out because some countries do not have the health care to cope with that situation as can be seen in Italy, Spain, New York and nearly in the UK. In the US there are hopeful signs that the increase in cases will not lead to the level of deaths seen in New York due to improved understanding (ie use of blood thinners to prevent clotting) and he effect on the drugs that have been established to help with the viurs HOWEVER as there is a significant lag between contraction and hospitalisation it is too early to be overly optimistic. (NYT)

 

[Scouse]

I have read the pdf Scouse which was my point - I doubt you have.

Yeah yeah, I'm sure you have. That's why you said "it refers to only two european countries France and Italy" rather than the eleven it explicitly and clearly refers to.

The expert opinion is that lockdowns have saved more than three million lives across Europe.

If you want to not provide an actual counter-argument and just fling the "bullshit" and "optimistic" smilies before getting angry when you're called on it then that's completely your perogative.

But I ain't falling for your transference tactic of accusing me of not reading the thing you've clearly not bothered to read yourself.


Either way - the whole point of this to-and fro is getting distracted from: European lockdowns have saved more than three million lives.

 

[Yoni]

My optimistic rainbow was about the number quoted and yes I have read it

Yeah yeah, I'm sure you have. That's why you said "it refers to only two european countries France and Italy" rather than the eleven it explicitly and clearly refers to.

The expert opinion is that lockdowns have saved more than three million lives across Europe.

If you want to not provide an actual counter-argument and just fling the "bullshit" and "optimistic" smilies before getting angry when you're called on it then that's completely your perogative.

But I ain't falling for your transference tactic of accusing me of not reading the thing you've clearly not bothered to read yourself.

the bbc links to : https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2404-8_reference.pdf

The BBC did not link to the paper you have posted which is too light to comment on - it starts with an "estimate" of infection rates .....oO

 

[Scouse]

*sigh*

As an olive branch @Yoni - here's the linking page to the .pdf in Nature.

Estimating the effects of non-pharmaceutical interventions on COVID-19 in Europe - Nature

Modelling based on pooled data from 11 European countries indicates that non-pharmaceutical interventions—particularly lockdowns—have had a marked effect on SARS-CoV-2 transmission, driving the reproduction number of the infection below 1.

www.nature.com

Hold onto that anger yons. You can't say I didn't try

When you have a study, rather than just your opinion, then we can "talk" agan.

 

[Yoni]

*sigh*
Hold onto that anger yons. You can't say I didn't try

When you have a study, rather than just your opinion, then we can "talk" agan.

oO ehum and you are ?

 

[Job]

Every single complication of Covid that the press batters us with for clickbait is the exact same list of complications from seasonal and pandemic flu.

Thats why they kill so many people.

Just look up complications of the flu virus.
If they had listed these in the front page of the Mail for the last years every one would be wearing an air fed mask and shooting people who sneeze.

 

[Bodhi]

My optimistic rainbow was about the number quoted and yes I have read it

the bbc links to : https://www.nature.com/articles/s41586-020-2404-8_reference.pdf

The BBC did not link to the paper you have posted which is too light to comment on - it starts with an "estimate" of infection rates .....oO

Is Scouse still quoting that paper was written before lockdown? How on earth can that be held up as any sort of proof that lockdown worked when it hadn't even been implemented yet?

I just can't even.

 

[Yoni]

Is Scouse still quoting that paper was written before lockdown? How on earth can that be held up as any sort of proof that lockdown worked when it hadn't even been implemented yet?

I just can't even.

I wouldn’t bother

 

[Scouse]

Is Scouse still quoting that paper was written before lockdown? How on earth can that be held up as any sort of proof that lockdown worked when it hadn't even been implemented yet?

I just can't even.

Go and read the fucking link I provided.

Published in Nature, 9th June.

We study the impact of major interventions across 11 European countries for the period from the start of COVID-19 until the 4th of May 2020

It seems that actual reading (never mind comprehension (or critical thought)) is a bug that hasn't caught on round here much. Which is funny, considering it's a forum that relies on the written word...

 

[Scouse]

I wouldn’t bother

You didn't.

 

[Job]

This us video of the police trying to break up an illegal rave and deciding to back off.
Lovely people you got down there.

View: https://streamable.com/mqt7wm

 

[BloodOmen]

 

[Moriath]

Go and read the fucking link I provided.

Published in Nature, 9th June.



It seems that actual reading (never mind comprehension (or critical thought)) is a bug that hasn't caught on round here much. Which is funny, considering it's a forum that relies on the written word...

Zzzzzzz

 

[BloodOmen]

 

[Scouse]

Looking at this it seems very strongly suggestive that poverty is the driver of increased transmission rates

Coronavirus lockdowns: Where is next after Leicester?

Trends in recent coronavirus infections suggest Leicester is very different from the rest of the UK.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Job]

Im trying to find out how they measure infection rates.
Are they just measuring how many people have it in each batch of testing or people coming in with symptoms.