Class balance

[Gef]

You referring to this?

I'd say that's a boost.

But it wont crit in the same way, because its now classed as a spell.. It takes about 100int for 1% chance to crit on a spell. It takes a fraction of the agility for melee crit chance. Also, spells crit for 150% damage, while melee crits are 200%.

From what I can gather, Paladins dont really go all out on +int items really..

Hence, nerf

 

[Bone_Idle]

I think ALL melee classes should have some sort of taunt. Especially Pallys because im always pulling the mob from a pally using my warlock

 

[Darksword]

Warrior has:

Piercing Howl - AoE, Causes all nearby enemies to be dazed for 6 sec, instant cast, 10 Rage

Intimidating Shout - AoE, Causes all nearby enemies to flee in fear the targetted enemy will stay and fight (roots targetted), lasts 8 sec, instant cast, 25 Rage

Hamstring - Targetted, Causes 45 damage and slows the enemy's movement to 60% of normal speed for 15 sec, instant cast, 15 Rage

If you cant escape with all those tools at your disposal your doing something very wrong.. Your never going to escape in PvP however, unless your fighting someone without any kind of speed. Once you hit 40 however you'll get a mount anyway and legging it will become easier..

however i reffered 2 piercing howl in my original post just couldnt remember the name, my point was something more base - like a normal style not a talent

altho i didnt know about intimidating shout - thats the sort of thing i ment thank u hopefully thats a style and not a talent?

 

[Ormorof]

however i reffered 2 piercing howl in my original post just couldnt remember the name, my point was something more base - like a normal style not a talent

altho i didnt know about intimidating shout - thats the sort of thing i ment thank u hopefully thats a style and not a talent?

yeah it is, but it costs 25 rage and doesnt fear your target, just any other mobs in the area (damn good fun in big pvp fights as a lowbie )

Hence, nerf

just one small step to reducing the "power o' pallys"?

 

[Dillinja]

Mortal Strike owns Paladins.

 

[Gef]

yeah it is, but it costs 25 rage and doesnt fear your target, just any other mobs in the area (damn good fun in big pvp fights as a lowbie )

It does actually fear your target, buts a different form of fear, it roots the target to the spot. But the root is breakable if you hit it, if your running from something hit Intimidating then untarget it, it will stay put for 8 sec..

 

[Garnet]

OK, let's see...850+ ambush, gouge, 600+ backstab. + mind numbing poison and the other poison that lowers healing rate and effects (forgot the name).
I lost again 1 warlock (the first I fought), since then, never lost again.

Maybe you've been fighting crap rogues

Yeah sure dot/dot/dot/syphons are nice. But if you've been damaged for already 1500+ damage and get your first spell interrupted (when your casting times are dramatically increased by the mind numbing poison, you will be dead before you get the third DoT off...

If you get the first jump yes.. :x

 

[Behmoth]

If you get the first jump yes.. :x

as a rouge you pick the fights if you are smart which always mean stealth which should mean the rouge SHOULD win

 

[Aada]

Il just put soul link on and laugh as im on half hps when your dead always funny that i can just imagine the guy sat behind the comp with his popping out of his head shouting ''wtf!??!?!! hacks!!!!'' lol

 

[Turamber]

'cept the earliest you can expect to have soul-link is level 40 Mr Level 32 Warlock

 

[Aada]

exactly but i had a 40 warlock on the us servers

 

[Lakashnik]

Rogues, in my experience have far to many stuns and interupts...
although maybe its just me.
Most rogues i have fought near my lvl i have easily beaton. (lvl44 shadow priest)
but there are a few who have beaton me without me more than scratching them. im not sure if its talent specs or them just knowing how to play the class, but i shall illustrate 1 case.
a nice lvl 40undead rogue runs upto me bows runs off.. ok i shall carry on lvling. as im about to pull blam(dont know the moves but hey) he smacks me and im stunned for a good 5seconds as he starts slashing away. so now im saying OW so i hit psychic scream... damn clever undead rogue must have used his immune ability knowing i was a priest. (damn them) ok i think shield self dot him then heal abit.... blam im stunned again... ok this isnt going to well.... ok i shall shield then heal when im not stunned. PoP yay for shield now to heal... kick. damn it damn it ok get bck up and will heal.. by time im up again my shield is down... ok this is looking bad i dont have much hp left. *ding* (lightblub) human priest self insta heal bck to 3/4hps. dot him yay finnaly hes getting hurt... ok a quick flash heal as my hps are dropping rather fast again..... and im really low on mana... hmm ok pop a mana pot getting me about 5-600 mana bck.. start casting a mind blast.. bam im stunned again.... ok now im seriously boned and annoyed.
this is of jist of the 3or so times i have lost a fight with a rogue with a close lvl and incase ur wondering this is about a 20second long fight in which i spend most of it stunned or interupted..
now can any1 tell me how many interupts/stun moves rogues get and how often they can be used? cos im finding it seriously annoying. even tho the majority of rogues i meet i own... esp the undead who dont use their fear immunity, he he.

unless this is ofc me not knowing how to play my class.. but i dunno it does seem rogues are the only class giving me grief atm as i can pretty easily take on casters (cept maybe warlocks chain fear)
paladins out last on me on hps to is kinnd of annoying.

as for not many high priests... i can understand y not. as i found it really hard to solo with my priest untill about lvl 35ish. tis fine now i got shadowform and vampiric embrace tho. can chain about 2-3mobs 2lvls +

 

[Yoni]

I must play in the gimped group of all time if I read peoples comments above......

My usual group consists of either 3 warriors / 1 hunter / 1 shadow priest or 2 warriors/ 1 paladin / 1 hunter / 1 shadow priest.

I love the groups I play with and I get to use some damage as well as mash the heal button.

My warriors and paladin (deliberate term of endearment) have no issue with getting agro off me even if i am norty and decide to mind blast. Personally I think it is down to knowing extreamly well the people you are playing with. The people I group with in WoW are the people I have grouped with in other games over the last 4 years, we are very aware of each others strengths and weaknesses and for me this makes all the difference.

As for being able to play solo, I have no issues with mobs +3 from me and I rarely leave shadowform to heal either .

 

[Yoni]

Ohhh i forgot to add rogue aren't that over balanced. It has more to do with the type of person playing them, you know the ones I mean, they lurk in a lowbie quest area and use their element of surprise to take out everyone they see.....

No real skill in the above..... especially if the rogues are 20+ levels higher than their prey.

You can't really call for a class which attracts that kind of personality to be nerfed but you can have a KOS policy for all rogues no matter what level

 

[Acercerak]

Ohhh i forgot to add rogue aren't that over balanced. It has more to do with the type of person playing them, you know the ones I mean, they lurk in a lowbie quest area and use their element of surprise to take out everyone they see.....

No real skill in the above..... especially if the rogues are 20+ levels higher than their prey.

You can't really call for a class which attracts that kind of personality to be nerfed but you can have a KOS policy for all rogues no matter what level

/cynical mode on

So according to you, I'm a rogue, so I'm automatically a Ganker?
If you see that much ganking by rogues, you're on a PvP server anyway, which you come to play on a server that is mostly populated by gankers and jerks...
So if you got ganked, and are pissed of by that, it's your own fault, I'm afraid. But don't generalise on rogues for that

/cynical mode off

 

[SilverHood]

/cynical mode on

So according to you, I'm a rogue, so I'm automatically a Ganker?
If you see that much ganking by rogues, you're on a PvP server anyway, which you come to play on a server that is mostly populated by gankers and jerks...
So if you got ganked, and are pissed of by that, it's your own fault, I'm afraid. But don't generalise on rogues for that

/cynical mode off

Is it wrong to generalise rogues as gankers, on the basis of more than 51% of rogues are gankers?

 

[Acercerak]

Is it wrong to generalise rogues as gankers, on the basis of more than 51% of rogues are gankers?

If you play on a PvP server, yes they probably are...
Then again, about 70% of the PvP server population are gankers, so I don't think the rogues are necessarily a gank class.

Note: I assume the poster I answered too, plays on a PvP server. don't see how else it could be that these rogues would constantly be killing peeps in a lowbie area.
And I do get sick of people generalizing a class on bad experiences they had...

 

[Fana]

If you play on a PvP server, yes they probably are...
Then again, about 70% of the PvP server population are gankers, so I don't think the rogues are necessarily a gank class.

Note: I assume the poster I answered too, plays on a PvP server. don't see how else it could be that these rogues would constantly be killing peeps in a lowbie area.
And I do get sick of people generalizing a class on bad experiences they had...

To be honest there arent really *that* many gankers on my pvp server. Of course they will be more than on a pve server for obvious reasons, but most of the people i encounter behave in a reasonably honorable way - ive actually had more alliance help me than try to kill me when ie gotten swarmed by mobs etc, and for myself i never attack unprovoked. I think many are playing pvp servers just for the thrill that they *might* get killed or get an unexpected fight now and then, and otherwise treat people from the other faction with caution but not with hostility.

I guess this will change once "honor" (pffttt...) is in the game :/

 

[Ormorof]

If you play on a PvP server, yes they probably are...
Then again, about 70% of the PvP server population are gankers, so I don't think the rogues are necessarily a gank class.

Note: I assume the poster I answered too, plays on a PvP server. don't see how else it could be that these rogues would constantly be killing peeps in a lowbie area.
And I do get sick of people generalizing a class on bad experiences they had...

not just one experience i bet

kinda curious about the average rogue pop of the pvp servers too

what i do know is ganking is bad in 2 main areas (from my experience)

hillsbrad and arathi, those are the two worst places ive enountered so far anyway

 

[Vintersorg]

not just one experience i bet

kinda curious about the average rogue pop of the pvp servers too

what i do know is ganking is bad in 2 main areas (from my experience)

hillsbrad and arathi, those are the two worst places ive enountered so far anyway

Rogues are of course idead characters for pvp, and as such are popular on PvP servers.
And PvP-servers=> gankfest

 

[Yoni]

Yes the server I play on is PVP, however for the majority except for a pathetic guild called bloodpact and in particular undead rogues all other people I meet have played the game with honour.


My policy of KoS for all rogues still stands regardless of their level.

 

[Vintersorg]

My policy of KoS for all rogues still stands regardless of their level.

Thus proving my point about PvP servers.
People get ganked so often that they start doing it themselves, and hide themselves behind such so called KoS policies so that they can morally explain in a way such as: "well, yes, I killed a defenseless person...but it's not ganking because he is a <insert class here>, and if we can keep them from leveling, they won't be able to gank."

But what if you gank rogues who aren't gankers themselves?

With your KoS policy on rogues, you will disgust some totally honorable players from the game.

And how can you still have the guts to state that you play the game with honour, if you admit to kill grey con players that can't defend themselves? You've managed to contradict yourself in this post, pal

 

[Nedo]

And PvP-servers=> gankfest

*icemancough*

 

[Gef]

But what if you gank rogues who aren't gankers themselves?

Rogues in their very nature are complete aholes, thats what they were designed to do. Sneak up and backstab your healer before you can react, then run off and get away with it, thats why they are so hated. I think Yoni, as a Priest on a PvP server (respect) has every right to gank as many Rogues as she can find, its always the Priest that gets in in the ass first.

Rogues on PvP servers are so FOTM its not even funny any more, when you hear people yelling 'LFM Gnomeregan, Healer, NO MORE ROGUES' around Ironforge you know theres some issues

 

[Vintersorg]

Rogues in their very nature are complete aholes, thats what they were designed to do. Sneak up and backstab your healer before you can react, then run off and get away with it, thats why they are so hated. I think Yoni, as a Priest on a PvP server (respect) has every right to gank as many Rogues as she can find, its always the Priest that gets in in the ass first.

Rogues on PvP servers are so FOTM its not even funny any more, when you hear people yelling 'LFM Gnomeregan, Healer, NO MORE ROGUES' around Ironforge you know theres some issues

So, I play a rogue and that makes me an ahole automatically, because I use backstabs? Talk about generalizing about people on basis of the class abilities. You guys disgust me.

Yoni has no right to gank anyone, be they rogue or whatever. Ganking is just not done. And if she ganks these rogues and has a KoS policy on them, well then she should stop complaining about rogues.

 

[Tasslehoff]

If you do not play on a PvP server why do you care this much... Why do you care this much even though you do not play on a PvP server, if people don't like your class then fine, why does it matter?

Most of us have been ganked by rogues, I still do not have a KoS-policy on rogues, but I do respect people that does have. Saying that you're disgusted with them is overreacting totally, in my opinion of course.

 

[`mongoose]

So, I play a rogue and that makes me an ahole automatically, because I use backstabs? Talk about generalizing about people on basis of the class abilities. You guys disgust me.

Yoni has no right to gank anyone, be they rogue or whatever. Ganking is just not done. And if she ganks these rogues and has a KoS policy on them, well then she should stop complaining about rogues.

Aye its funny how a couple of idiots can completely colour the perception of players towards a class.

I have noticed that rogues are generally Despised on Shadow Moon, on both sides from what I can see. Personally I have been ganked by rogues 2-3 times, predominantly in Hillsbrad (god that area sucks - packed full of 4x alliance and horde camping the two lowbie towns).

I must admit, however, I do enjoy it when muppet rogues attack my hunter. Wing Clip, Hunters Mark, pet on them and aspect of cheetah all mean the rogue's in a horrid position really. Run and I can outrun them, chase me and I can kite them whilst pet acts as a third dot. Attack the pet and I can stop and aimed shot/Scorpid or Serpent sting them/ Concussive shot and then follow up with just normal shots. Even at level 36 with a full marksmanship talent build and a nice gun I can easily take rogues down very quickly. The Crit potential that marksmanship gives you is insane.

If a good rogue is on me I am on 25% health before I get out of stun and out of melee range. At that point I run

Personally I don't judge by class, Its a pvp environment and people will choose to gank/1v1/5v5/zerg if they wish. I might not agree with their choice of play style but they paid their subscription and as long they're not breaking the coc I don't really care too much.

There's lots of zones to find, loads of quiet spots to xp if your quest is camped by gankers you can move on or just farm for items for a while if you need to.

It does surprise me how much whinging goes on in general tho. I often find myself muting it. It amazes me that people choose to play on a pvp server then moan when an enemy player kills them. They might be 2x levels higher than you but if you're in a contested zone you're fair game and the honour system is only going to reward players for killing other players.

M

(dacovale - 36 orc hunter - Shadow moon pvp)

 

[Vintersorg]

If you do not play on a PvP server why do you care this much... Why do you care this much even though you do not play on a PvP server, if people don't like your class then fine, why does it matter?

Most of us have been ganked by rogues, I still do not have a KoS-policy on rogues, but I do respect people that does have. Saying that you're disgusted with them is overreacting totally, in my opinion of course.

Don't get me wrong, I don't care about people on a PvP server (according to the descriptions I receive they're not world of Warcraft anymore, but World of Quake). They chose the server themselves, and if they get ganked, it's their problem.

It's just Yoni's hypocrisy that annoys me. she says "ooh, I hate Gankers, Ganking is bad. rogues are gankers and are bad"...and then she says "I have a KoS policy on rogues, no matter what level they are".
I mean, can this get anymore contradictory. --> I hate gankers, but I'm a ganker myself...

 

[Gef]

So, I play a rogue and that makes me an ahole automatically, because I use backstabs?

Yup, sorry about that, its just the way the class was designed, not really your fault. Rogues are designed to grief, and thats what 99% of them do, just because your playing nice doesnt mean the rest do.

If your playing on a PvE server anyway, this affects you how? You cant grief on a carebear server anyway so whats the problem? KoS policies only effect PvP servers, if you have never really experienced one then why are you getting all worked up?

 

[Ovi1]

Don't get me wrong, I don't care about people on a PvP server (according to the descriptions I receive they're not world of Warcraft anymore, but World of Quake). They chose the server themselves, and if they get ganked, it's their problem.

It's just Yoni's hypocrisy that annoys me. she says "ooh, I hate Gankers, Ganking is bad. rogues are gankers and are bad"...and then she says "I have a KoS policy on rogues, no matter what level they are".
I mean, can this get anymore contradictory. --> I hate gankers, but I'm a ganker myself...

Anyone who rolls a rogue on a PvP server knows that they are going to be fair game to most people, it comes with the class.

Unfortunately generlisations are all we usually have to work with, unless we have previous experience of an individual. If 90% of rogues are gankers, then I would rather the 10% suffer than let the 90% walk free.

I have to be honest though so far on my server I don't find Rogues any worse than others, and haven't yet stooped to the level of a kos policy.

Most of the time I am doing something for a quest and tbh I don't really want to take too long out of that to PvP, plenty of time at 60 for that

I have started a few fights though, just to test my skills etc, all against higher level people though and I usually lose... which probably annoys me more than the flyby ganking by the fg of 40+ peeps