American to European Servers

[Flimgoblin]

Too right, Most of europe speaks english aswell as their native tongue. I say bollock off 4 of the german servers, 3 of the french, let them have 1 each, and put up 4 more English servers for all to use.

furthermore on the translation thing, I was under the impression that translating from English to German is alot harder than converting to french. is this true?

oh, and while we're at it, make the test server English

if the german and french players wanted to play on an english language server then prydwen and excalibur would be mobbed.

They don't - which is why there are 5 german servers and 4 french ones.

Pretty simple supply and demand.

 

[kparton]

if the german and french players wanted to play on an english language server then prydwen and excalibur would be mobbed.

They don't - which is why there are 5 german servers and 4 french ones.

Pretty simple supply and demand.

In away, your right, but until all bots are removed; server population numbers & Demand dont mean sh*t

 

[Draylor]

The English and Camlann 'translations' aren't language translations but technical ones as the international version of DAoC is different to the US version operated by Mythic.

Sure, minor changes will be required, to allow for your configurations being different etc. But this should by this stage be fully automated taking a insignificant amount of time. If it isnt someone needs a good slap - youve done it 10+ times by now.

As for the rest of it: doesnt come close to justifying taking 3 months: which is typically the time between US patch going live and it being patched to GOA servers.

 

[Kaj]

This issue has been discussed so many times, and always end up the same: No one cares, and nothing will be done.

It's all about money. There are enough German/French people with demand to pay GOA for 4 and 3 servers, so why not.

If there were enough Swedish/Greek/Danish, whatever, to make a profit GOA would launch a server for them aswell.

 

[Flimgoblin]

In away, your right, but until all bots are removed; server population numbers & Demand dont mean sh*t

umm? if the percentage of BBs is the same across the servers it still means that there's a heck of a lot more demand for the french/german language servers.

Or are you trying to say that buffbots don't work when translated??? I don't get your point at all here.

Yes! but as long as I can buy cheese from my local supplier it's just not going to matter.

 

[lacroix]

such lies ... there's a BIG difference between fluent english and german/austrian school-english ... I experienced the difference when I moved over to England 4 years ago ...

There might be some difference on the level of spoken fluency, but tbh, "gaming English" is not really much of a challenge, is it?!

Anyway, I bet there are far more Germans (not sure about French) on the "English Servers" than some you guys would like to know ...

Personally speaking, I couldn't care less if they got servers in German, French, Esperanto or Suaheli ... I would still be on the English speaking ones ... that would include the US servers for me but cba to start lvlling the hard way again

 

[Belomar]

After many years of DAOC'ing - im actualy pretty happy we are one or two patches behind the USA now, its clear archers are going to be usefull and fun to play in NF, and we are able to level one before the patch hits.

Yeah, thanks a lot for that; go to Emain and hope to have a nice FG vs FG fight and you end up a pincushion from lowbie archers desperately climbing over each other to leech from your RPs in preparation for NF. That's one piece of information we could have lived without, actually.

 

[Corran]

erm, Goa is a french company, DAOC is Mythics game, they are not french.

And your comment is just proving my point about how messed up the European arm of DAOC is.

What is your point about Daoc being Mythics game? You think they care that it takes so long for GoA to patch for us? Cause I dont think they do, they get the same money of GoA for the rights to supply the game in europe no matter which patch we on. If it forces players to their servers then they are happier as well as that more income for them above and beyond what they would have. Anyways, it only due to Mythic insisting upon there being English servers that we have them.

Also i wouldnt be surprised if the contract in which they have with GoA states that patches have to have a certain amount of time on Mythic servers before they can be released by GoA. It good buisness practice to do so as it means they have a monopoly for a short time on the "improved" version.

And believe me, i know how messed up Daoc Europe is. And it will always be that way unless mythic take the rights to supply the game to us directly which i doubt is cost effective in their minds.

 

[Daedalus]

It basically boils down to this; Mythic does care, but not overly much. GoA does the best it can.

 

[cHodAX]

Leave the German's alone, they are alright. The French on the other hand..... grrrrr....

 

[Ning]

The whole debate about what is the rank of each language in the world is stupid. English is the first (or second) language. So it imply that every DAOC European server should be in English ? That's a total BS IMO. As soon as there are enough customers to fill 5 german servers and 4 french servers, there will always be a company to conquer these important markets. See Korea. Almost nobody talks their language in the world except them. But they are hardcore gamers so they get MMORPGs translated in Korean.
That's why Everquest2 is translated (including the VoiceOver) in german and french (it's already translated in the beta test). That's why WoW is translated in french and german. That's why AC2 is translated in german and french.
Moreover lancalisation doesn't only include translation but also customer support, phone center in my language (for WoW) and the most important of all : RL Events in my country (see EQ2 Events in Paris and Berlin).

Oh and it has nothing to do with the language skills in English. 100% of the french under the age of 25 have learnt English at school for at last 8 years. Including me . 90% for the germans according to this thread. . Ich also spreche Deutsch! Wunderbar!
But if I have the choice between a good MMORPG in english and another good MMORPG in French (and English), I will chose the good MMORPG in french (if the translation isn't too bad). If I hadn't the choice, I would still play MMORPGs, but I have this choice. The best is of course MMORPGs that let you make char on french, english and german servers. Like DAOC. Or Wow. Or EQ2... When I'm bored with french community, I make a char on an english server. When I'm bored with english community, I make a char on a german server.

Same thing for movies on tv. I have the choice. I just have to press on a button to switch from the french version to the english version if I want.

BTW expect to see servers translated in Spanish and Polish in the next 10 years.

 

[Quinlan]

This is how patching and testing works.
Mythic finish a patch and it goes live on their servers. They watch it for a few days in case there are crippling bugs that didn't get spotted in testing. They then send us the final version (including the fixes for any crippling bugs that got through). We translate it for four different server types (English, French, German and Camlann). The English and Camlann 'translations' aren't language translations but technical ones as the international version of DAoC is different to the US version operated by Mythic. We test the various versions and if we find problems we refer them back to Mythic for fixing. We then test the fixed version and rinse and repeat until we get a version that works properly in all four versions. Then it goes live on our servers.
The time between getting the patch delivered to us and getting it live on our servers is therefore dependant on many things - the amount of translation reqired (language and code), the numbr of problems found and the speed that Mythic can resolve them.

You left out the part of the contractual agreement where it is stated Europe always has to be one patch behind the US so you have to wait till Mythic patches the servers with the next patch. For competition purposes ofcourse

 

[Dorin]

I just have to press on a button to switch from the french version to the english version if I want.

Should be like that in DAOC aswell so english players with 1 account could also enjoy having a server for each realm. I wouldnt mind if you still had to speak the server's language in main - broadchat etc, i would turn them off and talk in guild/grp only.

 

[Awarkle]

i dont mind being a few patches behind the americans it gives us a chance to get to grips with very damaging patch changes.

Also as a graduate of games software engineering the chances are that even a small patch requires a lot of translating as well as testing we all know that goa have released patches that have accidentaly broke somthing. Seems to me that mythic release patches that JUST barely do the job they intend, not robust programmers the americans and as such when goa do the translating not only to a different language but to the server code which we run on (which is also different) then we end up with these delays.

IF goa was basically running a cookie cutter service IE we got exactly the same as the americans and the french and german got the patches run through babel fish every time a new patch would come out then it would seriously effect their level of game play and as they have far more servers than the english players then if i was the goa managing director then it would be a case of "lets cater for the larger audience" so yes we get the patches later but for good reason.


Knowing what you do about patches from america would you really want to be nerfed and changed and have to deal with new content as soon as it hit the americans while the french and german servers were able to change and addapt before it hit ?

Like artifacts would you like your artifact nerfed as soon as a new patch hits or be aware of it so you can get a new artifact ready in 2 or 3 months ?

and as for language who gives a flying monkeys we all know the game so well it wouldnt matter what language it was played in we can still play on the french and german servers it doesnt mean we can talk to them but at least as english people we should be learning languages properly not the gheto lessons we get. IF i want to play in a german environment then i may even dig out a phrase book so at least i can get by if not just by saying "sorry i solo" or "sorry i dont speak german" in their own language. Its only being polite and not being an "ignorant english pig dog".

You wouldnt go to france and germany and expect them all to understand english likewise you wouldnt go to the himalayas and expect them to speak english. IF your on the server with a specific language requirment then you should speak that language. I think people are just upset because gorre has atracted a few german and french players who dont respect this and happily spam in foreign

anyways if peeps want to pick an albion realm to start of an english guild on one of the french/german servers then i dont mind playing there the odd day a week

stop being xenophobic peeps and start hug spamming

 

[izikiel]

from camlann experience

most french/german players speak very bad english or dont even bother

wich makes it more fun imo

Always fun to get tells in the very mysterious "germanenglish/frenchenglish" language!

Probably the dubbing instead of subbing issue

anyways

Im not saying every german/french player sucks at english

 

[Tio McShire]

So, to clear things up in my own mind....

It would appear that it is the French and German translation issues that are slowing the release of an English programmed game in England ?

Conspiracy theories aside, is there any really valid reason why the English version, written in English, for English speaking people cannot be released at the same time as the bloody English colonials who wrote the game in the first place?

Or is reasoning with a French telecomunications company out of the question, seeing as we are only English ?

 

[Awarkle]

ok then.


1. the server software and the client software are different to that of america if only subtly to support 3 languages instead of 1

2. if the english servers got patched before french and german than whats the point of playing an out of date french / german server.

3. why should the english get somthing before the french and german just because the americans program in english ? if mythic was written by a french company and marketted in france would you still be prepared to wait for a translation ?

4. who cares ?

 

[Tio McShire]

ok then.


1. the server software and the client software are different to that of america if only subtly to support 3 languages instead of 1

2. if the english servers got patched before french and german than whats the point of playing an out of date french / german server.

3. why should the english get somthing before the french and german just because the americans program in english ? if mythic was written by a french company and marketted in france would you still be prepared to wait for a translation ?

4. who cares ?

well I take on what you are saying but disagree for these reasons:

1. Why do we have to wait for a game to be translated from english to.. er english ?

2. The point of playing on a german/french server is that it is in german/french ffs. Why should the English have to play an out of date server just because the French/Germans are too stubborn to play in English?

3. I would love to see a French attempt at an MMORPG and if it were any good I would indeed wait for a translation.. since it would not BE WRITTEN IN THE SAME LANGUAGE.

4. You obviously do care since you are posting here and not on 'La Maison du Freddy'

 

[Cathul]

1. Why do we have to wait for a game to be translated from english to.. er english ?

You don't have to. There are companies who sell the US-version to european customers. I know at least 4-5 companies who sell and deliver the US-version in germany to german customers (or austrian customers or customers from switzerland).
So after all it's our choice to play on GOA's server and therefor wait for them to finish the translations into german and french instead of being on the top of the DaoC development and play on US-servers.

2. The point of playing on a german/french server is that it is in german/french ffs. Why should the English have to play an out of date server just because the French/Germans are too stubborn to play in English?

Well, fact is, you can sell a lot more copies and licences of the game if you localize it. As far as i know the german and french markets are the biggest markets outside the US regarding computer games.
If you want to sell big numbers you are forced to translate MMORPG's. Even StarWars Galaxies and Horizons were translated as well as Everquest and Everquest 2.
Imho there must be a reason for the developers of those games to translate these games into languages other than the one they are primarily developed.
Imho the main reason is higher sales counts.

3. I would love to see a French attempt at an MMORPG and if it were any good I would indeed wait for a translation.. since it would not BE WRITTEN IN THE SAME LANGUAGE.

As far as i know Shadowbane was developed by a german company, but it never had success comparable to dark age of camelot.

And btw. you can take all errors in spelling and grammar for yourself, because english is not my native language.

/Cathul

 

[Corran]

well I take on what you are saying but disagree for these reasons:

1. Why do we have to wait for a game to be translated from english to.. er english ?

2. The point of playing on a german/french server is that it is in german/french ffs. Why should the English have to play an out of date server just because the French/Germans are too stubborn to play in English?

3. I would love to see a French attempt at an MMORPG and if it were any good I would indeed wait for a translation.. since it would not BE WRITTEN IN THE SAME LANGUAGE.

4. You obviously do care since you are posting here and not on 'La Maison du Freddy'

Well lets see.

1) You have to wait for it to be recoded to work on GOA servers which run differently to Mythic servers. This means that you cant have it at the same time as america. Why, because it has to be coded, tested, recoded fixes (which need to wait on mythic for) tested, fixed again, tested and finally released.

2) So a French person not knowing English is STUBBORN? yet it not stubborn if we dont know french? Typical arguement from british, Our language known by more then yours so you should speak it.

3) GoA = FRENCH company. Why would they give english (whom they werent going to supply game too originally) something that they arent giving their own country?

4) They would need to have servers working on different versions, this means that they will need to make sure that the technicians know what they can and cant do as the problem fixes will be different on each version

5) There WILL be a contractual agreement with Mythic that states under NO circumstances can GoA patch to the same version that is on Mythic servers. It is just standard business practice so that Mythic will be the front runner still.

6) What would be your view if mythic decided to focus on their MAIN player bases (French and German as you can see by the servers numbers + players on each) and translate all fixes for them whom provide the largest income and either drop the english servers or just let patches fall behind the other two in that respect. I know you be pissed off and with just reason. You pay the same company the same amount and would want equal treatment, and as such it works the other way. They will not show bias to any one server due to the fact they want to keep everyone happy. Once again, it good business practice.

7) As stated before, Mythic servers = English. If you want to be up to date on all patches just go there. Else deal with the fact GoA HAVE to have a dely on patches due to contractual obligations as well as HAVING to recode the patches INCLUDING recoding ENGLISH.

 

[Muylaetrix]

I personally think those updates come fast enough.

Imho, if you want to play up to date, go play us. I can`t be bothered playing an online game with such a big time difference. I usually play from like 20 to 24 cet. I know a few persons who play or played on us servers and all developed sleaping disorders, lol

I don`t want to stay online till 8 am to be able to finish a damn ml, lol

I know of a few us players who stopped playing on US and moved to europe, just to get rid of the time difference.

 

[Axuk]

This issue has been discussed so many times, and always end up the same: No one cares, and nothing will be done.

It's all about money. There are enough German/French people with demand to pay GOA for 4 and 3 servers, so why not.

If there were enough Swedish/Greek/Danish, whatever, to make a profit GOA would launch a server for them aswell.

And if GOA did anything to actively market or advertise the game in the UK or even ensure it is available for people to buy when they hear about it from friends... then they would have a larger British customer base....

Also it isn't in Mythic's best interests to have a rival company running the same patches.... being ahead patchwise ensures Mythic is more attractive to new subs-paying customers.