Albs are so bad and they suck etc.

[froler-mid]

Originally posted by silverblast


RR10s that get killed in 3 dds ....

yea, casters.......C A S T E R S , not tanks ;F

 

[silverblast]

Well I'm a C A S T E R... and it takes an RR10 fire wizzy to bolt me twice and a few more dds over that just to kill me ..

 

[silverblast]

I do admit though.. those bolts are so quickly casted that they fly behind each other.

 

[froler-mid]

Originally posted by silverblast
Well I'm a C A S T E R... and it takes an RR10 fire wizzy to bolt me twice and a few more dds over that just to kill me ..

sounds like your a hib caster~~

 

[silverblast]

*smiles*

 

[mele]

Give DET to all the tanks?

 

[Zoldot]

Remove det form all the tanks imo

 

[Kallio]

Originally posted by silverblast
respect the rr5 thane imo...

vaz?

BTW, compared playing in a savage group caster group is soooo much fun... but Baod ruins it all

a tank group can survive BoF but a caster group against baod is like hoping that I would past a test with A. (which happens but is rare)

 

[gwal]

Originally posted by tazzke
yes it is...name 1 class that does more melee dmg than a savage in the same amount of time....

k next one ....



PS: i shall take screenies of every quad-triple hit that kills me ok?
anyone got A LOT of webspace somewhere?

hate to break it to u.. but mid is the melee realm - ie, they are kinda supposed to do more melee dmg than any others... or am I just way way off here?..

not saying savages aint too strong a class or anything, but u kinda need another argument than just say they do more dmg than any others

 

[Kallio]

Hi Gwalmar

 

[Pandemic]

Originally posted by Zoldot
Remove det form all the tanks imo

heh heh back to the bad old days when us tanks was just mere cannon fodder for the casters to power lvl their realm ranks

 

[tazzke]

more damage doesn't mean ripping even tanks to pieces...or is it?

and i'm only talking savages...not other mid classes when i say melee dmg/time...
Midgard = melee, Hib = caster power, Alb = euhm...??? still haven't found it out...


pls don't talk to me like i'm a 12 year old...who just bought this game etc...i played since beta...so i've seen the evolution it made...and savages are a class that needs some more work...that's all

and like i said...det gone from savage = fixed as far as i'm concerned

 

[BF_Iggy]

First, this turned into another Nerf Savage thread, useless for everybody

Second, nerf determination for all tanks, improve Thanes, make Savages hybrids (coz that what they are, obviously) and remove gay instas from game and it will be quite good (tbh i would enjoy game lots with only the savage fix)

Third, if savages quit when fix comes they r retards... i mean, u farm lots of rps while u are overpowered, therefore mid players will have higher RR even when fix comes, which will make mid more powerful than the other realms still. Is like shelve a rr9 zerker just because suddenly he hits like a merc/BM = balanced character; thats stupid imo (give rr9 to this poor merc)

 

[gwal]

Originally posted by Kallio
Hi Gwalmar

/hug

and tazzke, I didnt mean it like that.. I just mean, that saying they do 10 x more dmg than any other class, and then ask ppl to find another class that outdamages them in melee..

ye, they do more dmg, but 10x .. ?
and u know there aint another class that can outdmg mid, nor should there be, ever.

wasnt ment in any disrespectfull way, I know u been around for a while. but as u have probably noticed in all the bw threads, excaggeating things aint helping any1 really

 

[Kallio]

Originally posted by tazzke
det gone from savage = fixed as far as i'm concerned

Pretty much solves the class, though before it will be done we will hear more crying than ever. By mids, and annoying comments from albs and hibs so mids will be even more bitter.

That´s actually what has cause this whole "they nerf midgard again /cry" thing. ALbs and hibs cant shut up, so they even create more and more whining, whine creates whine... or somthing

Savages could have Det, altough they would be fixed better if quadhits woudl be more scarce, triples also so they would be a dual wielding light tank scoring good damage, (okay, tune it down a bit) rarely. 360 evade is also *kinda* too good when the evade is better or equal to assasins.

Problems with savage:

1) Hitting so annoyingly bloody fast
2) Quads, savages arent that SUPAH if you dont scorea a quad which happens quite often on high RRs.
3)the mentioned 360 degree evade, like people say reaching 50% or even over.

To some albs and hibs, those for who´s attention this is you know who you are, I am not generalizing I know exactly who I mean:

Dont doom a middish player cause he plays a savage. Most of people actually tried savage cause it was something new and liked the class. Easy to like cause it´s good that is also true, but there are players that would continue playing savage even after a "NERF" or a "FIX". Like some zerks did, and some didnt.

Generalizing and insulting in every thread where someone mentions the word savage is just outrageous, every mid is being condemned and flamed as a "FOTMNOOB" or "PLAYIGN ON THE EASY MODE". I´ve got my share as example of "Lol, stick and put end on and shut up and let the savages kill" cant remember by who though.

 

[Puppetmistress]

Originally posted by Kallio

That´s actually what has cause this whole "they nerf midgard again /cry" thing. ALbs and hibs cant shut up, so they even create more and more whining, whine creates whine... or somthing

Just curious. I hear this all the time. However how exactly is Midgard 'being constantly nerfed' ?

We had this LeftAxe nerf which was more a fix, like the necromancer LOS-fix. This LA thing happened to Shadowblades too.

For the rest I dont remember major Midgard-nerfs. The way how resists, immunities and CC work nowadays in DAOC is not a bigger nerf to Midgard then to Hibernia (or Albion). If one looks closely Midgard is always more 'melee-focussed' so this is no nerf directly to Midgard.

Where is this constant nerfing of Midgard? Can you name some examples of recent Midgard-nerfs?

// EDIT: Yes, I made this post earlier. But I see alot of people say 'Midgard is constantly being nerfed, OMG again Mid nerfed' etc etc.. But I cant recall so many Midgard-nerfs.

 

[TunFiskeMad]

Did any of u read the first post ?

 

[tildson]

Damn NP for choosing midgard ! How could you know Savages would be invented 2years later xD

 

[Driwen]

Originally posted by Kallio

Savages could have Det, altough they would be fixed better if quadhits woudl be more scarce, triples also so they would be a dual wielding light tank scoring good damage, (okay, tune it down a bit) rarely. 360 evade is also *kinda* too good when the evade is better or equal to assasins.

at the moment the average swing rate of a savage is the same of a dualwielding tank of similar spec (50 h2h vs 50 DW). So allthough quads should be downtoned, triples and doubles should be increased and singles downtoned aswell. At the moment all logs i have seen proven that this is true, all be it all logs were supplied by savages of course.

Problems with savage:
1) Hitting so annoyingly bloody fast

uhm mercenary's/bm's and assassins hit fast aswell, they sacrifice frontloaded damage also to do that. So its annoying but not a real prob

2) Quads, savages arent that SUPAH if you dont scorea a quad which happens quite often on high RRs.

you talking about problems from savage point of view or from albs/hibs here. Besides I find it stupid that mythic created quad hits, as it does sound fun. However nerf calls will always arrise when a class hits on average for the same, but sometimes for 3 times as much and often for less.

3)the mentioned 360 degree evade, like people say reaching 50% or even over.

well most tests of savages prove this wrong (think carlos got something about it in his sig and otherwise I saw it somewhere in the 5 nerf savage threads of this week).

btw puppetmistress the moral effect of the los fix and the la fix, is not the same. Necros on usa most likely knew that it was wrong and from the start, so when it got changed they might not have liked it. However they always knew that a nerf of it was coming, with LA it was damage which was not on par. So the zerkers and SB's got used to their class not knowing that their class was bugged, until mythic nerfed it big time.
Its the part where the fix for LA came more out of the blue then for necros. As necros knew it from the start it was a bugg and LA users didnt.

But about nerfing thing, dont know its the same stuff about mythic always making sure midgard has 1 good tank. First zerkers than before they got nerfed they gave them savages. I think its both bull, but nobody can prove it.

 

[Treniel-]

the fact of the matter is 90% of albs (thats 9,000 of the 10,000 players) wouldn't/don't have a clue what to do in rvr they just run arround like headless sheep being rp food for guilds like CF VGN LA IG JH NP RG BC n all the other RvR/Bigger/Better guilds in the other realms. There are guilds though like BF GoL TB HB and yes even FC on occasions who will put up a fight and have sorcs who know how to mess, players who know how to assist, and clerics who know what to do etc etc.

imho alb is the worst of realm and mythic will continuosly try to fix it with either A) RAs (BoF SoS for example) or B) by trying to fix support when tbh both are pretty much fine as they are atm, possibly with a slight fix to clerics to give them sumthing else other than healing to do

However whats needed is really a boost to dmg dealers....now hib have its casters (which are lets face it best in the game as Domain and Garb proove nightly vs Outlaw and Zoyster) and mid have its tanks, warriors savages and even zerkers are still/are uber classes to play and the dmg dealing/utility is extreme compared to alb counterparts.

Armsman can either be def or off Warior can be both
Mercs can either be compared to zerkers or savages and are probs better than savages in most cases after nerf but no where near savage.
Reavers lack determination and are therefore classes as second rate even though there dmg is good

the only good bloody tank alb has is Friars and they meant to be secondary healing.

Same goes for casters they lack debuffs + various other things that i know are missing but cba to explain although in respect mid are near enough.

anyway rant over its late think i go bed

 

[Pandemic]

Originally posted by Treniel-
and mid have its tanks, warriors savages and even zerkers are still/are uber classes to play and the dmg dealing/utility is extreme compared to alb counterparts.

i wouldnt classify my damage as extreme compared to an armsmen and as for their utility not being as good well i'm guessing most completely double spec 2h thrust or something so they can be the next uber hitter which kinda gimps them in defence but thats their choice

 

[gwal]

if only mythic had learned from the zerker

DONT make things that have a massive damage variety.....

 

[Asha]

Originally posted by Kallio
Most of albs on these boards tell allways how bad albs are, so would someone explain to me why BF does so well even against savage groups? I just cant get it?

I´m talking about a high RR mid group, one with a lot of savages... how/why and why them and not anyone else?

Cant be that they are just lucky 50% of time can it?

EDIT: Someone with nothing to say than some whining please leave your posts out... (does other than people like that exist here? )

Sure I can tell you why. First cause we almost never leave apk w/o a good set up (ok ok sometimes 3 paladins but shhh). That means the right chars with the right specs and normally sc gear... We sometimes sit there for 30-40 mins waiting for the right person. Second we normally have at least one bot, often two. Third we play together all the time so we get used to each other. Lastly, we have chuffy. We never wait at apk for RAs to come up, we are just so damn slow to leave the pk that that happens to be the case alot


Why are there more Mid/Hib groups that are balanced? My theory is that on the Hib side, they have to run from the bk to emain and who is going to do that run over and over w/o a good group? For mids... simpley that you need far less to get a good group. I have no idea why Alb guilds don't run together... there are 5 or 6 who do Hibs seem to do the most ggs

 

[Carean Black]

Albs 4tehwin!

 

[dakeyras]

Originally posted by tildson
Damn NP for choosing midgard ! How could you know Savages would be invented 2years later xD

NP chose Midgard because at the start of the game Midgard was by far the easiest realm to level in and was way overpowered in RvR i.e. the stungard era.

After a nice patch Hibernia became overpowered in RvR. And with great haste NP all rolled in Hibernia.

Then along came an Albion luv patch and it looked as though Albion would be dominant in RvR. And with great haste NP all rolled in Albion.

The Albion patch wasn't as good as was thought and NP gave up. Savages were created and soon it became clear that they were overpowered. And so NP rolled savages.

Please don't say NP picked Midgard for their interest in Norse mythology

 

[Ilur_oom]

Originally posted by zelur
albs don't need skill or tactics etc.. They can always relie on their zerg.
overpopulation for the win imo.

i strongly suggest you take a look at the server statistics then post again...

And as to zerging... it isnt alb that puts up a zerg at 4 am in the morning, and then again at 9 am... go emain more often imo

 

[alme]

Why do BF do well against mids ?

They assist better than any other alb grp, spread out better than any other alb grp. And along with 2x bof and SoS (ofc they aint up all the time) it should be win even against a fotm mid grp.

 

[- Fedaykin -]

Midgard have had only 1 BIG nerf IIRC, and this affected two classes.

Berserkers - They are now inline with BM's/Mercs and still do GOOD damage on my sorc i.e i would rather be hit by a bm than a zerker

Shadowblades - Most of them respecced to Critblade as soon as they heard a nerf was inc, so it's n wonder their level 18 (or whatever) LA styles do more damage.

Let's take a look around at other classes throughout the realms.


(NB. Duskwake is 2-3 weeks out of date, but you get the idea)

Necromancers - Useless and yes i mean USELESS at the moment in RvR

Necro Top 5
1 Restart Reborn 592,049 284 50 Herfølge Boldklub Inconnu
2 Scope That 574,422 21 50 Black Falcons Inconnu
3 Raising TheDead 563,665 0 50 The Prodigy Inconnu
4 Kalarr RuRuc 547,445 0 50 Herfølge Boldklub Inconnu
5 Jinxs Deathseeker 451,684 2,187 50 Guardians of Light Inconnu

wow some of them are making 2k rps a week!

Friars - Viewed as overpowered by many other realms, simply because they are always self buffed and we all know from experience that buffed > unbuffed. Maybe you do not know that their damage is 100% dex, yet their dexterity does not raise as a statistic? They were given a crappy dex/qui self buff to help with this - which is crap compared to a clerics enh buff. They have no determination, die real fast to crush users, if they are slammed they are dead.

Friar Top 5
1 Quicksilver IKnowKungFu 6,885,117 150,124 50 First Cohort Briton
2 Jiggs PvE 2,029,009 12,556 50 Black Falcons Briton
3 Cabo Retry 1,216,073 1,171 50 First Cohort Briton
4 Arezina Calyptra 1,192,644 21,887 50 The Brethren Briton
5 Gamblor Pepeshero 1,045,739 7,349 50 Shadowlords Society Briton

hmmmm Jiggs stopped playing in RvR - so... there are about 5 friars above rr6, wow clearly a great RvR class.

Sorcerer's

The class with the least surviveability in Emain WITHOUT question. Many sorcs are known to die 2-5 times a fight, when rezzed they have no shields = dead in 2-3 hits from ANY tank. They have caster hps, caster armour and do ubr damag like 167(-250) on most targets (even less with BAOD)

Sorcerer Top 5
1 Grymulv Wilk 4,627,476 38,287 50 Covenant of Zak Briton
2 Veeshan Sedai 3,294,323 1,108 50 ASq Briton
3 Dreams BuffabitFasterPlz 1,983,291 28,341 50 Guardians of Light Saracen
4 Tinaydien BlackFalcon 1,684,121 15,467 50 Black Falcons Avalonian
5 Fedaykin OVERMIND 1,625,176 125,617 50 First Cohort Avalonian

Grymulv is body spec and plays his cleric/armsman, Veeshan's account has had more players than men Gunnerr has "entertained" men

there are about 6-7 sorcs throughout all albion who know how to play well, and most of them have numerous alt chars. Sorcs don't have a chance in most fights without the rest of the perfect group to support them.

Clerics

Not saying clerics are THAT bad, but lets compare them to a midgard healer. They have a better enhance line than healers, both have a healing line.. but healers get the pacification line and many more tools to keep themselves alive. I don't thinkhere is a cleric in the world who wouldn't swap smite for the pac line. What cleric has time to smite in RvR?

Cleric Top 5
1 Therg 4,503,753 98,544 50 Crusaders of Albion Briton
2 Pitonisa 4,099,220 178,051 50 Black Falcons Briton
3 Caletha 2,618,640 78,035 50 The Brethren Briton
4 Herbal FoTMSavagesUseNoSkill 2,501,363 99,992 50 Guardians of Light Highlander
5 Noretn Suri 2,302,514 134,558 50 First Cohort Highlander

Healer Top 5
1 Stubbe 5,574,551 171,718 50 Nolby Pride Dwarf
2 Tidal Tete 4,845,023 84,606 50 Nolby Pride Dwarf
3 Xuth 4,405,562 126,223 50 Nolby Pride Norseman
4 Natha Nero 3,908,632 218,469 50 Black Company Norseman
5 Xanatea Slan 3,201,687 114,007 50 Nolby Pride Norseman

Druid Top 5
1 Infernos TerribleFire 4,585,281 64,197 50 Llaw Arian Firbolg
2 Ola 3,758,514 35,999 50 Vengeance Celt
3 Angara Cheeseboy 3,205,042 181,922 50 Vengeance Celt
4 Kiukku CurrentlyRetired 2,990,756 427 50 Vengeance Celt
5 Gilead EdSpear 2,876,881 138,597 50 Vengeance Celt

i could keep going on about albions for a while but that would be a little biased. So lets travel to the land of ice and snow

Thanes - Apparantly gimped in RvR, may people are unwilling to play them because of this - I agree to some extent that Thanes are gimped, their stormcalling needs sorting (which is being done if u read the TL's reports) and they should be helped with some additional self buffs. Of course many prefer a warrior/zerker/savage over a Thane at the moment, and this probably will not change because Midgard seems unwilling to try new group formations, without straying from the norm i havn't seen a Thane in RvR for months - But at the moment a Thane > any (albion) caster in RvR.

Thane Top 5
1 Montarloo 3,566,558 18,493 50 Red Guard Troll
2 Rolf Erikson 3,358,130 87,925 50 Cutting Edge Norseman
3 Bengaard Zeuz 1,116,084 1,570 50 Red Guard Norseman
4 Bjaadi Aeger 819,318 10,345 50 Bannana Bunnies Troll
5 Kallio FrostBlade 817,883 1,348 50 Tiwaz's Emissaries Troll

ok i admit, pretty dire

Prydwen Top 5 Thanes
1 Divious BlackDragoon 4,605,998 5,924 50 Bad Omen Norseman
2 Grivne Kelmorian 1,328,532 28,195 50 Sons of Nidhug Troll
3 Mhael 1,245,996 22,814 50 Svea Ulvar Troll
4 Max TexasRanger 1,105,853 338 50 Onslaught Norseman
5 Blejsarus 1,074,422 0 50 Bad Omen Troll

not much better, but in an apparantly underpopulated RvR realm and climate a rr9/10 Thane looks petty good.

Runemasters/Spiritmasters
No less effective than a wizard/theurgist in RvR - in fact SotH PBAOE group looked to do pretty well, the argument frommidgard is that BaoD makes these groups invalid - albions wizards/theurgists/sorcerers/cabalists face this every day as well. The fact that, again, you refuse to use them is not anyone else's fault other than your own - 1 spiritmaster in a group would not change too much, but of course why have a cloth caster when you have a tank who does more damage?

Runemaster Top 5
Doagah Lofn 3,201,656 9,555 50 Nolby Pride Kobold
2 Fly 3,116,313 5,416 50 Red Guard Kobold
3 Ardamel Svartalfsbanne 2,250,939 20,497 50 Fellowship Of Midgard Dwarf
4 Kazil Legacy 2,116,183 0 50 White Rose Dwarf
5 Release 2,102,737 0 50 Nolby Pride Kobold

Spiritmaster Top 5
1 Crazy SadoMaster 2,256,409 18,218 50 Black Company Kobold
2 Wiiwii Kamikaze 1,452,992 2,009 50 Black Company Kobold
3 Emros 1,110,400 3,708 50 Heart & Soul Norseman
4 Krom Nekromage 1,092,987 0 50 Black Company Kobold
5 Icetear 1,054,046 0 50 Black Company Kobold

Wizard Top 5
1 Zoyster RoxStar 6,399,880 162,113 50 Guardians of Light Avalonian
2 Fatalitys PlayboY 3,404,099 82,156 50 First Cohort Avalonian
3 Ghaladriel Golestandt 3,023,152 74,463 50 First Cohort Avalonian
4 Magmatic BlackIce 2,633,730 47,072 50 The Brethren Avalonian
5 Wildfire OnIce 1,918,524 3,111 50 The Brethren Avalonian

Theurgist Top 5
1 Outlaw NERD 8,343,120 154,985 50 Guardians of Light Avalonian
2 Strondor Frostmane 5,254,405 51,741 50 First Cohort Avalonian
3 Lireihuan MyGFKnowsKongFu 2,806,069 9 50 Black Falcons Avalonian
4 Taglim DeadALot 1,672,700 14,172 50 The Brethren Avalonian
5 Alox 1,415,331 28,847 50 Herfølge Boldklub Briton


Enchanter Top 5
1 Bitteliten Luribomb 5,883,564 34,525 50 Vengeance Lurikeen
2 Memeerf EmainIsBoring 4,661,650 10,785 50 Amicitiae Renatus Elf
3 Twinkies 3,570,633 188,839 50 Llaw Arian Elf
4 Nuclear 3,329,694 20,732 50 Llaw Arian Elf
5 Aeleea 3,214,448 134,431 50 Vengeance Elf

Eldritch Top 5
1 Garbannoch Nox 6,434,384 135,711 50 Celtic Fist Elf
2 Domain Egea 5,739,432 285,021 50 Tuatha de Mag Mor Elf
3 Ella 1,941,891 99,636 50 Tuatha de Mag Mor Lurikeen
4 Xanthian Z 1,903,049 47,250 50 Vengeance Elf
5 Quela Fade 1,659,275 8,578 50 Vengeance Lurikeen


Hib>Alb>Mid caster wise according to RPs

but then again only hib and alb choose to use casters


anyway CBA writing more...

 

[old.krane]

I like the BF rocking myth recently

(we lost gunnz tough :/ nerf moving...)

 

[old.Ramas]

alb and mid are almost balanced imho.

But only because it's still a measely 50% of rvr mids that play a savage.

And some people still insist on using Thanes, which brings the average uberness down quite a bit.

Give it a few weeks....

Midgard have had only 1 BIG nerf IIRC, and this affected two classes.

2 nerfs imo.

The first one was when cc was made less ludicrous (immunity timers and aoe droppoff).

1 Pac Healer + 1 other mid > 325426432 albs or hibs at the start of daoc.

Bear in mind that at one time aoe stun/mez/root had no drop off, no immunity timer, no cure, and magic resistances did not affect it or the aoe dds that followed it up.

Yet the class people were whining about at the time was clerics

It affected mid far more than alb/hib because no-one has or ever had cc to touch a pac healer.