1.81c aka Tank love

[Frozodo]

holy shit.

hehe Heros will pwn now start wubbing me luwi silleh elph ... +druid and warden resists! u would have more than 78

 

[MaCaBr3]

While a player is shape changed to a lion when summoning a guild banner, the guild banner will no longer appear to come out of the lion's mouth.

While I was reading this I was really hoping this line was gonna end with the word "ass".

 

[Vilje]

Lets be honest, no heavy tank will ever spec AoM 5. And yes casters will have a harder time getting heavy tanks down, thats exactly the point .
Heavy tanks will still go easily down when the rest of his group lays dead on the ground. And yes for casters without brains it might take awhile to find out that they shouldnt target heavy tanks first anymore ...or as said before pull him out of range like its done alot these days...

Yes, but remember that I did not state my personal opinion yet I just pointed out how much they could get.

But if you want my personal opinion, here it is: I play a dark spiritmaster. If my target has no resists and I get a good crit I can hit for around 750damage. Normal dmg on a target with good resists is ~490 dmg. Damage on a target with resistbuffs and good resists is around 350 with no crit. If the new patch goes live like this, it means an average grouped hero with no AoM will still run around with 57.5% resists. 71.5% with AoM 5. My nukes would then hit for around 120ish dmg with no crit, and if the tank has 2500 hp, it would take around 20 seconds to nuke him down, if he does not get healed and I don't get interupted -Which will happen. And if I moc (which I don't personally use atm) ...well, he wouldnt even notice me.

Now, who wouldnt be tempted of 71.5% magic dmg resists at the least?

In addition, both heavy tanks and dw'ers often hit me for lots of more dmg than I can deal to them. Especially if grouped (resist buffs). I think this luri one hero smacked me for 900 dmg the other day. Note that I have a good template, and capped melee resists and Im pretty sure my shields were up. So if tanks can 3-4 hit casters, and they can't really be cc'ed, and if you are unlucky they in addition resists more than 70% of the damage casters deal to them .. Why keep casters in group? I mean, why not just stack the group with light tanks and heavy tanks? Of course you can run a caster 2 man debuff-assist train, but thats pretty hard to do in the heat of battle, with lots of interupts. Mostly you wont get to debuff+assist.

I think that casters will have a "harder" timer killing heavy tanks is an understatement. But of course thats only my current pov. Maybe this turn out to be all balanced

 

[Eradicate]

Well I can assure you that no group will walk around with multiple heavy tanks. When they do that and they are up against a caster group then they will be totally useless when they get grappled, light tanks are still able to interupt with ml abilities.

And ofc the dmg of a heavy tank on a caster is very high, 2h weapons are slow and therefore show high dmg. Dont be fooled though, because the dmg output of a lighttank is quite abit better. (concidering the dmg output ratio with the time aspect) And a hit of 900 must have been a crit for sure.

I agree with the fact that heavy tanks will go down alot slower, but in my opinion it still has to be seen if it's really 'overpowered'. remember that a heavy tank does not have charge, just kite heavy tanks when they go offensive ..pull them out of range or grapple them because they have absolutely nothing to defend themselves in that case. And in meanwhile kill support of the heavy tank/ or other light tanks.

But I guess we will find out soon enough if it is so overpowered as some think it is. we can notice it in 2 ways:
1. a future patch in US has reverted or decreased some of the heavy tank abilities.
2. once the heavy tank love patch gets live in EU one will notice that with proper playing it isnt so overpowered at all.

Don't think in matters of how difficult it will be for casters to get heavy tanks down. But rather think in how relatively easy it is to keep the heavy tank busy while you kill all his groupmembers.

 

[Void959]

"- Level 30 Shout - Bolstering Roar: PBAE 250 radius attack that breaks root, breakable snares and mesmerization effects on group members. If the tank is CC'd (other than root) they will have to purge themselves or wait for CC to wear off, then fire this. Re-usable every 10 minutes."

Anyone gonna spec purge3 for this? seems pretty damn nice

 

[Ballard]

"- Level 30 Shout - Bolstering Roar: PBAE 250 radius attack that breaks root, breakable snares and mesmerization effects on group members. If the tank is CC'd (other than root) they will have to purge themselves or wait for CC to wear off, then fire this. Re-usable every 10 minutes."

Anyone gonna spec purge3 for this? seems pretty damn nice

Purge 3?? Why? with det and stoicsm the hero will be fine to use it any way.

250 radius.. might be able to free 1 or 2 party members/pets no more. Its nice enough but very situational and has a reuse of 10minutes.

 

[Puppet]

But if you want my personal opinion, here it is: I play a dark spiritmaster. If my target has no resists and I get a good crit I can hit for around 750damage. Normal dmg on a target with good resists is ~490 dmg.

Now get a good crit on that 490~ damage, say 490+ 220 crit and we're looking at 710 damage.

In addition, both heavy tanks and dw'ers often hit me for lots of more dmg than I can deal to them. Especially if grouped (resist buffs). I think this luri one hero smacked me for 900 dmg the other day.

Now assume this Lurikeen Hero was fully TOA'ed and buffed. He has a quickness of 250 QUI, 10% TOA-haste and 20% druid haste (red haste buff). He's swinging his 2H weapon (be it LW or CS) around 2.5 seconds. You're casting, at what, 1.1 second? Dont forget he can only do this at melee-range, your pet has not to intercept (be moderate, say 50% intercept-rate) and you have no brittles up and no BT. Suddenly this 900 damage drops to about 25% on average.

 

[Darzil]

If the new patch goes live like this, it means an average grouped hero with no AoM will still run around with 57.5% resists. 71.5% with AoM 5. My nukes would then hit for around 120ish dmg with no crit, and if the tank has 2500 hp, it would take around 20 seconds to nuke him down, if he does not get healed and I don't get interupted

Well, he'd have those resists if he used the Fury shout at the same instant you started casting. It wouldn't take you 20 seconds, though, as those resists would drop down after 10 seconds, and he'd not be able to reuse Fury for 15 minutes.

Darzil

 

[Vilje]

Now get a good crit on that 490~ damage, say 490+ 220 crit and we're looking at 710 damage.

Yes, with a crit -But thats in solo action. It is very rare that I get to do that kind of damage in group action, which was what I was trying to say. In group 350 dmg is a number which comes up quite often. With crit it is a bit more of course. I don't know where you were going with this, but in its original context it was only ment to help see how much less dmg one will do on a heavy tank with max resists

Now assume this Lurikeen Hero was fully TOA'ed and buffed. He has a quickness of 250 QUI, 10% TOA-haste and 20% druid haste (red haste buff). He's swinging his 2H weapon (be it LW or CS) around 2.5 seconds. You're casting, at what, 1.1 second? Dont forget he can only do this at melee-range, your pet has not to intercept (be moderate, say 50% intercept-rate) and you have no brittles up and no BT. Suddenly this 900 damage drops to about 25% on average.

First, about the casting speed. Personally I have a little slower casting speed than the cap, which is at 1 second for the sms lifetap, due to being a norseman and unwilling to spend the points it takes to get aug dex 5(which would bing my dex on the exact cap), and rather use them on something else.

If someone hits you its a 3-4 second recovery time before you can cast again. And the sm intercept is very unpredictable, sometimes it intercepts everything, and sometimes not a single hit. Now, im not trying to say that the hero could kill a sm easy solo, when the sm has all its tools up. But in group action, its a little different. Often, your brittles will be gone due to some aoe-effect, and your pet is off chasing some poor cleric/druid. And this is the kind of situation when you don't want a LW in the back of your head.

Now, I wont bring up all the different situation where a hero can gank me, cause there is many situations where I have an advantage over the hero aswell. My point was that with this new patch, they will be more resistant to magic damage, and that the kind of damage that they have the potential(sp?) to do/does, combined with these changes could be kind of evul.

Meaning that a hero with maxed out resists on fury shout would be able to do quite alot dmg in those 10 seconds whilst he would be immune to magic dmg (50% more magic dmg resist added to the primary resists of the total 71.5% would mean immune, though im not sure how it will work) and 50% chance to deflect crowd control spells + det

Well, he'd have those resists if he used the Fury shout at the same instant you started casting. It wouldn't take you 20 seconds, though, as those resists would drop down after 10 seconds, and he'd not be able to reuse Fury for 15 minutes.

Darzil

No Darzil, he would have those resists (71.5%) not counting the Fury shout, but the 15% primary/secondary resists they will gain in this patch. If he used Fury shout in addition .. well interesting =)


I also agreed with pretty much all you said Eradicate.

 

[Raven]

Yes, with a crit -But thats in solo action. It is very rare that I get to do that kind of damage in group action, which was what I was trying to say. In group 350 dmg is a number which comes up quite often. With crit it is a bit more of course. I don't know where you were going with this, but in its original context it was only ment to help see how much less dmg one will do on a heavy tank with max resists

with good weapon choice vs enemy

heavy tanks still do good damage and can still perform, its just half the heavy tank community would rather complain than get on with it.

 

[ElemenT]

The Thane is next one the 'to fix list' right? Really, I don't understand Mythic... Hey! Let's give a tank some dumb abilities like climb walls etc and let's leave a class that has been having REAL issues for years standing there in a dark corner of the room.

Yes, I know more people play tank classes but that doesn't mean you shouldn't fix classes that need more balancing then superiour classes that already do more then well in RvR.

(No, I haven't read the whole thread... only the the opening post.)

 

[Eradicate]

with good weapon choice vs enemy

heavy tanks still do good damage and can still perform, its just half the heavy tank community would rather complain than get on with it.

-18 resists it not the average resist though
Ofc heavy tanks can do pretty decent dmg, but at this point people rather take light tanks then heavy tanks for offence, and warden/friar for defence because of resist (can't blaim them for that).

And tbh I havent seen much complaining by heavy tanks, while they deffinately lost their advantages (slam for defence --> retaliation with tendrils en brittles + pbt can slow down offensive heavy tanks alot in contrary to their light tank opposite. And their HP advantage over other classes is lost due to TOA bonus) I'm not complaining, im just stating the facts