What is so good about NF?

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

What is so good about NF that wasn't already better with OF ?

My view on NF is that it's shit and that Mythic tryed to fix something that was not broke.

They made NF alot larger then OF but then added instant portal wich in the end only clustered people up.

They took away the travel aspect of the game with that and imo made the game "smaller", not routes to camp etc.

Discuss

 

[Theseus]

I think that hibs still need to do plenty off traveling tbh

 

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

I think that hibs still need to do plenty off traveling tbh

Yah, true in a way, but sitting in a baot doesnt bring rps (fun fights ) - atleast in old emain ppl would camp near giant, bolg keep, and etnrace of emain hills, 3 or 4 places u could pick a fight at. Now its just port/take boat run agramon or go keep fight - either way you will face superior nummbers since its such small areas fights r being conducted. imo.

 

[Kagato]

At least hibs though have their main coastal keep docks actually on their island, within guard aggro range at DC

Mids and Albs actually have to cross the river and away from the keep safety to reach their dock for Beno or Bled.


NF is the worse thing to happen to the game and the main reason why the 'classic' server is utterly pointless. NF destroyed the game, ToA only made things worse.

Give us an OF server and i'd be there in an instant.

 

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

At least hibs though have their main coastal keep docks actually on their island, within guard aggro range at DC

Mids and Albs actually have to cross the river and away from the keep safety to reach their dock for Beno or Bled.


NF is the worse thing to happen to the game and the main reason why the 'classic' server is utterly pointless. NF destroyed the game, ToA only made things worse.

Give us an OF server and i'd be there in an instant.

Tell me, why exactely did NF destroy it - what changed in the game mechanics in ur opinion? What did the lead game designers do wrong, and what would u fix if u could? More details!

 

[youngbaba]

Agree. Give a an OF/BB/ToA server and the game wouldn't be half as bad as it is. Would need to fix the old keeps to stop AE through wall ofc

 

[Andrilyn]

OF was shit from a casual player point of view, 3 hours waiting on the PK hill then when deciding to go out getting insta killed by a SB assist train and having to release and wait 10 minutes for port, upon comming back going of the PK hill again getting insta killed by a FG mids who were always patrolling APK > AMG.
Sure if you always ran OP groups it would be fun zerging and killing all randoms who had no place to dodge a fight with the OPted groups.
Atleast now as random you can look on the map and see if theres a fight going on somewhere (tower/keep) and join it without being insta killed by an OPted group.

I for one am glad those days are over and the only bad thing about NF is that they added razing tower etc.

 

[Puppet]

At least hibs though have their main coastal keep docks actually on their island, within guard aggro range at DC

Which means Hibs *NEED* to travel for fights (again) tho. Because nobody camps Crauchon because of this. I wouldnt mind Hibs having same 'layout' as Mids and Albs tbh. Give more fights near DC !

 

[ebenezer]

cant realy see how it destroyed the game tbh. They gave us a bigger area and more toys to play with.
Then its up to the players to zerg crau bridge for 3 months and then suddenly choose to zerg something else...nothing the designers could really have forseen. I think players are a bit hasty to point fingers at all times instead of actually try and adjust or be a bit more objective.
People in this game also listens to much to other players instead of being more of an individual and try out something new like a new strategy or so.Instead they choose to listen to what al else say or so and just follow the stream^^.
Ow well
over and out...

 

[Kagato]

Tell me, why exactely did NF destroy it - what changed in the game mechanics in ur opinion? What did the lead game designers do wrong, and what would u fix if u could? More details!

Simple, first of all they destroyed the RA system. Which ruined Alb FG RvR for a start, there hasn't been 1 good alb GG since NF that could compete on any level with mid groups without the OF RA advantage.

Secondly, travel, there are no casual encouters now or suprise fights when roaming, people just zerg a tower or fight around it, running for the cross swords. No one will ever run around the map like before trying to avoid towers etc to reach a destination to hunt because they know full well the enemy will just teleport to the location they want to go and bypass you.


NF is Mythics way of trying to force a player base into large scale warfare that many of us do not want. They tried to appease this with agramon then fucked it up again by leaving milegates and bridges on it.

OF would of been fine if they took the damn milegates out.


If I could change anything, firstly i'd remove all teleport, or at least only allow teleport to the main coast keep (DC, Beno , Bled) and make that the same for enemies, only allow enemies to port into those keeps in enemy lands if they take them.

Add perminent hastners to all keeps like OF.

Secondly, bring back the Uber relic guards and keep guards and tie them in with the towers.

Same principle as before, but tied to the towers, each tower for a keep represents a couple of uber guards, the level of the tower adding to the level of the guard above normal as before.
This means enemies will want to take all towers before tackling a keep, and will give defenders a reason to take back the furthest towers away as a viable defense method. It may also help the early morning full group keep raids.

That done, i'd then over haul the RA system again but that takes far to much typing I really cannot be bothered to do.

 

[Zeratuhl]

Give more fights near DC !

DC area is nice, before cluster when albs and mids had bolg/crim, was prolly the best action

 

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

Simple, first of all they destroyed the RA system. Which ruined Alb FG RvR for a start, there hasn't been 1 good alb GG since NF that could compete on any level with mid groups without the OF RA advantage.

Secondly, travel, there are no casual encouters now or suprise fights when roaming, people just zerg a tower or fight around it, running for the cross swords. No one will ever run around the map like before trying to avoid towers etc to reach a destination to hunt because they know full well the enemy will just teleport to the location they want to go and bypass you.


NF is Mythics way of trying to force a player base into large scale warfare that many of us do not want. They tried to appease this with agramon then fucked it up again by leaving milegates and bridges on it.

Agree to almost everything u said here Kagato, but wouldn't milagates be a must? Since how would you else be able to camp a route when noone is actually going anywhere except randomly roaming around?

I think it was a good idea that they put 2 milegates / side on agramon - if u search FH i asked for this a year back in time. The problem is that Agramon is to close to the main keeps and the bridges and the passage between it is only trafficatd by FGs that will kill any soloer, duoer etc that gets near.

When in OF i didn't find this FG killing soloers as mutch of a problem, and more like a rarity tbh. What has changed from that time except NF, could be the community decreased in average age and the implementation of no skill grief classes. I'm not sure, but something has changed.

As a solo nightshade in OF i often started my journy from DL, i walked destealthed some parts and a few i stealthed, on avergage i would get 2-3 fights on the way to emain, nowdays u get 2-3 solo fights / day with NF. When i got to emain i would either check the milegates, or roam around in bowl or camp a tele portal keep. And alot of solo visuals would come out and play, won some lost some.

Then we had Odins, wich was unofficially a solo/small grp ground. I think alot of visuals had a blast there since they could actually solo there without mutch grief from enemy full groups steaming them at speed 6.

And with NF all this dissapeared imo the game got alot worse for both "1337" and the casual 2h/day players. I can't see why ppl didn't like OF was nothing wrong with it.

To the ppl that claimed they sat down @ APK for 2-3 hours waiting to build a group. The situation is the same nowdays, a minstrel won't get invites to groups very easily, necros won't etc. And still the "casual groups" have nochance vs the rr9-11 groups! -can agree that alot of classes now have gotten fluff that makes em desireable in 8-man groups - thats good. But mythic could have brought those changes to the game without changing anything else. - agree or disagree?

Conlusion, is that mythic imo changed the game in a negative way - trying to enforce a "scenario" or gametype on players that wasn't wanted by everyone, and in the end making everyone miserable - todays rvr is only zergs, adds, solo archers leeching on fg fights since they cant solo without getting steamed by fgs or groups of other stealthers that are tired of dying to fgs.

Maybe a wise thing of mythic to do would be to look into the community and ask what THEY desire from the game, i think a OF server á la patch 1.60-1.65 would be appriciated by proberly a whole server ( in whole Europe ).

Discuss!

 

[ebenezer]

NF is Mythics way of trying to force a player base into large scale warfare that many of us do not want. They tried to appease this with agramon then fucked it up again by leaving milegates and bridges on it.

OF would of been fine if they took the damn milegates out.

Im not disagreeing or agreeing to what you wrote in whole really, as everyone have the right to think exactly what they like about it.
But i must say i dont think they are trying to force anyone into anything.
I read somewhere a post that was answered directly by mythic themself.
There they stated their design and theme for this game, and that was about fullscale warfare...all addons...patches etc goes in same direction since that has been there vision since the beginning. Ofc you can do what you want in that area of warfare though...try solo..zerg....fg action.whatever you like. Its not desinged to hinder you do anything.
There are like a thousend views on every single thing they produce in this game. So i doubt they gonna listen and try to please everyone of those views. Especially views about changing their vision and idea of this game.
I feel a bit sorry for the players that dont enjoy it...or cant adjust. But i think you should accept what this game is like...cause ur just giving urself headache by playing something you dont actually enjoy...and i cant see no point in that. I can imagine you stay on in some desperate hope that they are suddenly gonna change their vision and make a completely different game, but i think thats a bit naive to think. Sure there are many people(but prolly more that not) like the fg vs fg action only. But i still doubt they will hear that and change their line for daoc....and if they do, i think that will be in the end of the daoc days..were they are just trying to hold on to the very few left to get the last bit of cash they can from it. Then warhammer will take over...and they will cancel daoc. Thats what i think.
over and out....

 

[Afran]

Give OF with two milegates/realm ke.

 

[Bracken]

OF Odin's was ok, the rest was crap - especially after TOA. If you didn't have a fully optimised group you weren't going to make it past the mg, and keep taking was very dull. NF gives the average casual player more options to have meaningful action in the frontiers. It ain't perfect by any stretch, but for the majority of players NF rvr is more enjoyable than what they found in OF.

 

[Kaun_IA]

first when NF came out i thought it sucked ass. badly. worst thing that has happened to the game and so on, but when i think what we have now more deeply. i see that NF is better than OF. ofc if they would revert back to OF id be happy.

positive side of NF: lots more to do. keep takes more fun, more area.
negative side of NF: new RAs, bridges

Positive side of OF: you knew where to find solo ppl and ppl where solo more back then, RA system. cooler landscape.
Negative side of OF: waiting to port, milegates (for some it was the best place)


funny thing whit milegates in OF was that acctually they where designed to keep away intruders, but acctually they worked the other way around, traping the ppl inside

well thats what i had to say...........

 

[Calo]

Conlusion, is that mythic imo changed the game in a negative way - trying to enforce a "scenario" or gametype on players that wasn't wanted by everyone, and in the end making everyone miserable - todays rvr is only zergs, adds, solo archers leeching on fg fights since they cant solo without getting steamed by fgs or groups of other stealthers that are tired of dying to fgs.

Maybe a wise thing of mythic to do would be to look into the community and ask what THEY desire from the game, i think a OF server á la patch 1.60-1.65 would be appriciated by proberly a whole server ( in whole Europe ).

you do know that not everybody likes playing solo? There are ppl who play a massive roleplaying game to.. well play with others?
and if its miserable for everyone(cool that you decide that for everyone, you must be god i think) its pretty odd that still many ppl play this game.

 

[Ame]

What is so good about NF that wasn't already better with OF ?

My view on NF is that it's shit and that Mythic tryed to fix something that was not broke.

They made NF alot larger then OF but then added instant portal wich in the end only clustered people up.

They took away the travel aspect of the game with that and imo made the game "smaller", not routes to camp etc.

Discuss

Then Agramon was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.

 

[Bistrup666]

Well Imo it was ToA that ruined the game along with new RA's not nf.

NF just made a bad situation worse.

ToA force U to do days of /played PvE wich many people finde very boring.

And soloing is dead anyways except early or around bold sometimes, and with same vamps running there that really ain't an option.

 

[Matriarch|Sneakers]

you do know that not everybody likes playing solo? There are ppl who play a massive roleplaying game to.. well play with others?
and if its miserable for everyone(cool that you decide that for everyone, you must be god i think) its pretty odd that still many ppl play this game.

Mate, if xx sbs aint happy with thier class in solo encounters, then they will group out making me unhappy since i cant kill 3 vs 1 sbs. This making me have to group up and roll 3-4 NS/rangers. This the sbs cant kill and make them angry and frustrated, and so forth. If I'm not happy with he game situation ill make other unhappy. Simpel logic, 1337 ppl can go out 8 ppl and farm, the newbies cant compete and zerg, thus making the 8v8 ppl QQ and log or just zerg aswell making eveyone miserable. That my point.

OF was working very well imo. All u had to do to compete was get SC, get 8 ppl together and play a while so u functioned as a group then go out and rvr. If u cant compete then, i guess u need more practice. Hibs could make compeable groups so could albs do and ofc mids could.

All OF needed was maybe copy paste the gfx to make it larger, add 2-3 milegates in each frontiers and then it was enough.

Anyone agree? disagree? why?

 

[swifteagle]

Old OF was a nightmare for me as a solo and unbuffed scout getting to Amg was bad enough getting through was almost impossible with the stealth zergs that sat there most of the day.

I started off as a theurg but rolled a scout to play simply because during the day 90% of the time mids outnumbered everyone and sat at amg then ran to apk in 3-4fg wiping out any soloers and fgs on the way then albs built up managed to get past Amg split up into single FGs got rolled over rinse and repeat.

Yes sometimes we outnumbered mids ,sometimes, but in general thats what happened day in day out in emain in daytime RvR.
i'm sure everyone had this kind of experience at their MG at sometime or another MGs were just bottlenecks and frustrated alot more than found them fun.

Hadrians Wall was a virtual ghost town most of the time but you could pick up the odd solo fight and Odins was ok until the stealth zergs setup there as well.
Never been to Agramon and probably never will from most of the posts about it its just another version of old emain with bottlenecks etc.

 

[Bracken]

OF was working very well imo. All u had to do to compete was get SC, get 8 ppl together and play a while so u functioned as a group then go out and rvr. If u cant compete then, i guess u need more practice. Hibs could make compeable groups so could albs do and ofc mids could.

All OF needed was maybe copy paste the gfx to make it larger, add 2-3 milegates in each frontiers and then it was enough.

Anyone agree? disagree? why?

The problem came if you had more than 8 friends/guildmates who wanted to rvr or your friends enjoyed playing chars in this game that did't fit into an optimised group.

"Sorry Dave, I know we've been friends for 2 years but I don't want to rvr with you because you won't be on 5 nights a week for the next month in our practice sessions and your necro, which you love to play, doesn't fit into our optimised group."

So you see, people play this game for different reasons - and believe it or not the majority don't have the inclination to form 8 player set ups. OF was fine for those who did, but crap for those who didn't. NF has changed that so that everyone has the opportunity to enjoy their form of rvr. And if you think that OF didn't have exactly the same whines about adds and zergs then you have a very limited memory

 

[elbeek]

OF was shit. Perma camped milegates etc. Odins was the only place you could get a half decent fight,oh and HW when Tali roamed there.

Seems to me that so many people here forget that this is a mmorpg. If the game is so "shit" feel free to fuck off to CS but coming here qqing about the same old thing aint gonna change jack.

The game, as it stands, is the best mmorpg currently available. It has beaten off the opposition without breaking into a sweat. In my books this means the game coders have got summat right.

 

[remi]

why is everyone so fukin retrohorny? Agramon and NF both r0x

 

[Deadnala]

IMO NF is verry cool. the only bad thing is that we have 13 zones and only 1 zone is used so its not mythic who screw frontiers but the people who play in it. Delete agramon i'd say. Allso for albies start running 8ppl groups instead of 16+ so you allso get a challenge. i guess thats wy albs dont like NF 8 vs 16+ they dont have a challenge like we do

 

[Calo]

OF was shit. Perma camped milegates etc. Odins was the only place you could get a half decent fight,oh and HW when Tali roamed there.

Seems to me that so many people here forget that this is a mmorpg. If the game is so "shit" feel free to fuck off to CS but coming here qqing about the same old thing aint gonna change jack.

The game, as it stands, is the best mmorpg currently available. It has beaten off the opposition without breaking into a sweat. In my books this means the game coders have got summat right.

erm i think wow utterly destroyed daoc if you check how many ppl play that If you look objective ofcourse.

 

[Ethild]

OF was a nightmare. Nearly all action was in Emain which only 66% of players could teleport too, leaving the other 1/3 with a 15 minute walk just to get to the 'RvR zone'.

NF was a good change, and with the addition of Agramon they have finally got it spot on. A FGvFG roaming area for those that want it, and a vast land catering for many alternative play styles.

In my opinion the RAs were also improved. OF RAs were very unbalanced (Group Purge, BAoD, PR, old BoF etc etc), sure some RR5 RAs are now better than others, but on a larger scale it's much more even. The lower recast timers are much better too. Do I want to go back to 9 sec Dragonfang and 30 min purge? No sir.

Keeps and their dynamics were also massively improved. Keeps now have more of a purpose, and fighting over them can occur in many different ways. Gone are the days where the only option was ramming 2 outer doors whilst enemies nuked you from the BMs. To me, that's a good thing.

The other point worth making is that OF Emain was small. Most of the action was fights by groups playing the MG Ping Pong so confined to a small area. There is no way that area would be suitable now the servers are clustered, it's just too small.

 

[elbeek]

OF was a nightmare. Nearly all action was in Emain which only 66% of players could teleport too, leaving the other 1/3 with a 15 minute walk just to get to the 'RvR zone'.

NF was a good change, and with the addition of Agramon they have finally got it spot on. A FGvFG roaming area for those that want it, and a vast land catering for many alternative play styles.

In my opinion the RAs were also improved. OF RAs were very unbalanced (Group Purge, BAoD, PR, old BoF etc etc), sure some RR5 RAs are now better than others, but on a larger scale it's much more even. The lower recast timers are much better too. Do I want to go back to 9 sec Dragonfang and 30 min purge? No sir.

Keeps and their dynamics were also massively improved. Keeps now have more of a purpose, and fighting over them can occur in many different ways. Gone are the days where the only option was ramming 2 outer doors whilst enemies nuked you from the BMs. To me, that's a good thing.

The other point worth making is that OF Emain was small. Most of the action was fights by groups playing the MG Ping Pong so confined to a small area. There is no way that area would be suitable now the servers are clustered, it's just too small.

Brillaint summary. Rep point for u.

 

[nOmoreCOAL]

NF was very nice. I prefer it to OF.
Insta teleport insta rvr.
Caster friently.
Map.
Solo duo friently.
But agrammon has made NF tower n keep fights absolete.

Things that should not be forgotten!!!!
Dock campers!
Scouts! 100x times
Shrooms in keeps!
Bainshees hittin through walls!
OMFG ALB ZEEEEEERG!!!!!

Main problems in DAoC is :
45 classes!!!! have they ever tested all these a 2nd time?
Support classes cant solo if they got no grp so ppl just dont roll them even if thay r so important in rvr.
Buff bots = 2 accounts = 2x fee n so many ppl ask u for buffs
TOA was the worst expansion ever :
camped arties, scrolls, bugged encounters n some arties like eriny's charm even if they r so good dont worth the trouble

IMO DAoC is beyond any patch or new server. Just w8 till DAoC2 or Warhammer if it is not canceled (again).
Till then WoW can very fun w loads of ppl, not like 1100 players in server n 400--> 500 bbs

 

[eggy]

NF destroyed the game, ToA only made things worse.

Yet you still play it?

www.counter-strike.net - de_dust will never change, I think you'll find peace there.