United States Corrupt Twattery

[Embattle]

The board of peace:

https://edition.cnn.com/2026/01/22/world/trump-board-of-peace-explainer-intl-hnk

 

[Scouse]

Tony Blair loves it.

 

[Ormorof]

Its like the Richard Nixon architect of peace award, given out with zero self awareness

Previous winners include Henry Kissinger, both the Bush presidents...

 

[Gwadien]

Minneapolis live: Man shot dead by federal agents in Minneapolis named as US citizen Alex Pretti

The shooting follows days of protests in the city over the Trump administration's immigration enforcement operation.

www.bbc.co.uk

SA confirmed.

 

[caLLous]

Awaiting permission from @Scouse to be outraged by this literal execution of a US citizen (a nurse for the fucking VA, no less) on the streets of America by shady, masked government "agents". Or how about all the lies Trump and his bootlickers told in the immediate aftermath about how the victim was approaching the "agents" with his gun out? Can we take that seriously?

He was there because he was trying to help the woman the ICE agent had just ruthlessly shoved to the ground. They pepper-sprayed the both of them and then, as he was tending to the woman, they dragged him off and threw him to the ground. His (totally legally owned) gun was holstered until they had him on the ground, saw it and disarmed him. Then they executed him and they kept shooting him a dozen or so more times. And then they fled the scene, arresting witnesses and taking them with.

That's Donald, though, right?

 

[Gwadien]

Awaiting permission from @Scouse to be outraged by this literal execution of a US citizen (a nurse for the fucking VA, no less) on the streets of America by shady, masked government "agents". Or how about all the lies Trump and his bootlickers told in the immediate aftermath about how the victim was approaching the "agents" with his gun out? Can we take that seriously?

He was there because he was trying to help the woman the ICE agent had just ruthlessly shoved to the ground. They pepper-sprayed the both of them and then, as he was tending to the woman, they dragged him off and threw him to the ground. His (totally legally owned) gun was holstered until they had him on the ground, saw it and disarmed him. Then they executed him and they kept shooting him a dozen or so more times. And then they fled the scene, arresting witnesses and taking them with.

That's Donald, though, right?

I suspect the response will be 'Look at this great thing Trump has done!'

 

[Scouse]

Awaiting permission from @Scouse to be outraged by this literal execution of a US citizen (a nurse for the fucking VA, no less) on the streets of America by shady, masked government "agents". Or how about all the lies Trump and his bootlickers told in the immediate aftermath about how the victim was approaching the "agents" with his gun out? Can we take that seriously?

He was there because he was trying to help the woman the ICE agent had just ruthlessly shoved to the ground. They pepper-sprayed the both of them and then, as he was tending to the woman, they dragged him off and threw him to the ground. His (totally legally owned) gun was holstered until they had him on the ground, saw it and disarmed him. Then they executed him and they kept shooting him a dozen or so more times. And then they fled the scene, arresting witnesses and taking them with.

That's Donald, though, right?

Yeah. Saw that, it's awful.

It reminded me of the Jean Charles de Menezes case in the UK when they put him on the ground and put eleven bullets in his head, then lied to the world saying he was fleeing and had jumped turnstiles and everything.

But he'd done nowt. He'd just walked onto a train, been followed, was unarmed, then was brutally executed by the state. By lying cops.

This is the problem with law enforcement even in supposedly "civilised" countries. The average IQ of a US cop is 104, so just above average. People have (sometimes famously) been turned down in the US for having too high an IQ. The UK probably fares slightly better as although there's no standardised testing like in the US, we're probably hitting 105-110, which, whilst not exactly brain boxes, still puts them in the top 40%ish.

But you give people guns, then tell them to do such and such a job, then sometimes wankers will do incredibly awful things. Like execute people.

This is why I dislike plod. There's so much evidence of low (and high) level criminality in the forces and they simply get away with so much that this is an inevitability.

In the US - add in Trump's (perfectly legal) order to expel illegal immigrants from the US, and what I've just said about state enforcement, then I'm actually surprised that this hasn't happened a lot more.

It's disgusting.

 

[Deebs]

Yeah. Saw that, it's awful.

It reminded me of the Jean Charles de Menezes case in the UK when they put him on the ground and put eleven bullets in his head, then lied to the world saying he was fleeing and had jumped turnstiles and everything.

But he'd done nowt. He'd just walked onto a train, been followed, was unarmed, then was brutally executed by the state. By lying cops.

This is the problem with law enforcement even in supposedly "civilised" countries. The average IQ of a US cop is 104, so just above average. People have (sometimes famously) been turned down in the US for having too high an IQ. The UK probably fares slightly better as although there's no standardised testing like in the US, we're probably hitting 105-110, which, whilst not exactly brain boxes, still puts them in the top 40%ish.

But you give people guns, then tell them to do such and such a job, then sometimes wankers will do incredibly awful things. Like execute people.

This is why I dislike plod. There's so much evidence of low (and high) level criminality in the forces and they simply get away with so much that this is an inevitability.

In the US - add in Trump's (perfectly legal) order to expel illegal immigrants from the US, and what I've just said about state enforcement, then I'm actually surprised that this hasn't happened a lot more.

It's disgusting.

Fucksake, who broke FreddysHouse? Someone has installed an add-on as this cannot be real?

/me goes to check the logs and control panels for an intrusion..... (no not that kind)

 

[Scouse]

I suspect the response will be 'Look at this great thing Trump has done!'

How many times do I have to say I hate Trump before it sticks in your mind.

Get your professionally outraged, incredibly partisan, china-loving stick out of your arse and start using the very good brain you once had.

 

[Scouse]

Fucksake, who broke FreddysHouse? Someone has installed an add-on as this cannot be real?

The bit where's I'm disgusted, outaged even, by law enforcement executing innocents?

I've complained about racist, rapist, hobnail booted plod for years. They're horrible people, by and large. Regularly get facepalmed by Embattle for posting links about what murderous bunch of nasty arseholes the pigs are...

??

 

[Deebs]

The bit where's I'm disgusted, outaged even, by law enforcement executing innocents?

I've complained about racist, rapist, hobnailed booted plod for years. They're horrible people, by and large. Regularly get facepalmed by Embattle for posting links about what murderous bunch of nasty arseholes the pigs are...

??

Just got in from a lovely roast dinner with my children and grandchildren, am utterly fucked, I was just trying to bring a bit of humor, soz

 

[Scouse]

Just got in from a lovely roast dinner with my children and grandchildren, am utterly fucked, I was just trying to bring a bit of humor, soz

I've been on a 5 day water fast so I'm as dumb as a box of frogs today. Looking forwards to my first proper meal tonight so my ability to spot humour is somewhat curtailed, sorry

But having said that, people do need to chill the fuck out. The idea that I'd support execution of citizens simply because I'm not as rabidly anti-Trump as some other denizens on here has, I suspect, actually passed some people's minds.

It feels like some people are picking news items (or social media feeds) to feed their outrage and have totally left the arena of dispassionate thought. Stuck in partisan echo chambers. And they're judging people in some sort of competition on how performatively anti-Trump people are. If you don't make the bar (which I clearly don't) the you get (stupidly) put in a pro-Trump box. If you're not sufficiently critical of everything the GOP is doing then you're clearly one of THEM. This is so they don't have to engage intellectually and can dismiss any argument they don't like out of hand.

It's like this:

Spoiler

HE'S NOT SUFFICIENTLY ANTI-TRUMP - GET HIM!!!!!


*love that film btw

 

[Gwadien]

How many times do I have to say I hate Trump before it sticks in your mind.

Get your professionally outraged, incredibly partisan, china-loving stick out of your arse and start using the very good brain you once had.

china loving? haha

Trying to equate ICE with your standard police is pretty daft.

They're ideologically, politically and financially motivated, they're not loyal to the state, they're loyal to Trump and what Trump says. That's why it matters what Trump says.

Have you seen the bazillions of videos where they're facing up with protestors? They're fucking loving it.

 

[Scouse]

So they're extra shooty and a bit less rapey is what you're saying @Gwadien?

They're two sides of the same coin. Plenty of people shot by police in the states each year, unless you've already forgotten that black lives matter?

Your argument is weak old man.

 

[Scouse]

They're ideologically, politically and financially motivated, they're not loyal to the state, they're loyal to Trump and what Trump says. That's why it matters what Trump says.

They're brutal violent thugs that will do whatever the state says. The Dems wouldn't give the order (it's not in their voting interest and runs contrary to their (failed) economic model).

But if they did, these guys would sign right up. Like you said - they love it.

But I digress. Of course no black people or immigrants were ever gunned down under democratic rule. And furthermore, when some orange asshat gives contentious (albeit plainly campaigned-on and voted-for) orders to remove illegal immigrants the shit that was always going to kick off was never going to lead to these bovver boys doing exactly what they've been doing ever since the concept of state enforcement was created.

Or maybe Trump should just step aside, stop carrying out the policy he explicitly campaigned on and was voted in for, and let Sleepy Joe (remember him?) or Kamala Harris back in so they can continue doing fuck all for the working classes apart from calling them all privileged and racist and get on with the important work of repealing the second amendment, right?

I mean. Despite all evidence to the contrary Europe was still going to massively ramp up our defence spending with the Dem's in charge so we could stand on our own two feet instead of offering literally zero on the international stage on our own. We didn't need a severe beating from daddy and a bunch of (largely hollow) threats to pull ourselves out of our intransigent, freeloading, politically-banal stupor.

He should just fuck off. And everyone who voted for him. The only reason Trump came to power is legions of racist white privileged arseholes, not the years of economic destitution combined with a powerful cultural marxism that people were uttely sick of.

I mean, economics first. But strongmen always come to power throughout history when people are economically comfortable and feel free, right?

 

[Gwadien]

Actually incredible

 

[Scouse]

Actually incredible

Got actual arguments that rebuff my points?

Or would you just like to ban those ideas?

 

[DaGaffer]

Or maybe Trump should just step aside, stop carrying out the policy he explicitly campaigned on and was voted in for, and let Sleepy Joe (remember him?) or Kamala Harris back in so they can continue doing fuck all for the working classes apart from calling them all privileged and racist and get on with the important work of repealing the second amendment, right?

I must have missed the campaign promise where he promised to have masked unqualified thugs shoot American citizens and than absolve them of due process. Silly me.

 

[DaGaffer]

My Father-in-Law pointed it out me today; these guys:

...are these guys:

 

[Scouse]

I must have missed the campaign promise where he promised to have masked unqualified thugs shoot American citizens and than absolve them of due process. Silly me.

I thought this'd be the comeback (and I'm glad you appeared )

My counter is - what did you (and frankly the American people) think was going to happen? That he'd ask illegal immigrants to nicely put their hands up and that they'd all duly comply and exit quietly?

It was always going to be force. It was always going to be very very fucking ugly.

We spoke about it before the election. We always knew it wasn't going to be nice. And I've quite obviously pinned my colours to the mast about the people that were going to carry out the policy and the inevitable results (like the outrageous execution of this guy).

But unless you've got a better way to execute the mandate given to him by a plain-view vote, with nothing hidden, I don't see it working out any other way.

Repeat, I don't like it.

But don't pin it all on Trump. He's just the result of decades of political neglect. From both sides, but especially "the left".

Just like Reform is probably going to be.

 

[DaGaffer]

I thought this'd be the comeback (and I'm glad you appeared )

My counter is - what did you (and frankly the American people) think was going to happen? That he'd ask illegal immigrants to nicely put their hands up and that they'd all duly comply and exit quietly?

It was always going to be force. It was always going to be very very fucking ugly.

We spoke about it before the election. We always knew it wasn't going to be nice. And I've quite obviously pinned my colours to the mast about the people that were going to carry out the policy and the inevitable results (like the outrageous execution of this guy).

But unless you've got a better way to execute the mandate given to him by a plain-view vote, with nothing hidden, I don't see it working out any other way.

Repeat, I don't like it.

But don't pin it all on Trump. He's just the result of decades of political neglect. From both sides, but especially "the left".

Just like Reform is probably going to be.

You haven't responded to my point. At all. I don't think even MAGA thought there would be Death Squads and that they would effectively be beyond the law. In fact given that one of the tenets of the typical MAGA is that the Feds have too much power that should belong to the States, this is actually their worst nightmare, which might explain why Trump's poll numbers are in free fall across the board.

 

[Scouse]

I'm not absolving Trump there btw. Clearly. He knew what was going to happen, even if some of the voters fooled themselves it was going to be nice.

Edit: Didn't see your above before I posted.

 

[Scouse]

You haven't responded to my point. At all. I don't think even MAGA thought there would be Death Squads and that they would effectively be beyond the law. In fact given that one of the tenets of the typical MAGA is that the Feds have too much power that should belong to the States, this is actually their worst nightmare, which might explain why Trump's poll numbers are in free fall across the board.

1) I have.

2) Death Squads is overly hyperbolic political rhetoric.

You can draw similarities and parallels but they're absolutely not that. Their mandate is deportation, not execution, and they're not secretive or unofficial, they've a legal mandate and their target isn't political opponents but illegal immigrants.

I absolutely accept the accusations of militarised tactics, lack of due process, the veneer of federal immunity and the humanitarian issues around all of this.

But again, A) they're not Death Squads and B) what the fuck did anyone, actually, really, expect?

I'd trot out the line that you can't make an omlette without breaking eggs, but I very much doubt we'll have a palettable omlette when this all quietens down.

The problem here has an economic base. The Dems welcomed immigrants with open arms and did nothing about illegal immigration. It suited them. Their model didn't help the poorest and dumbest of indigenous Americans. When you've decades of worsening economic hardship in any country you open yourself up to the othering of immigrants and a voter base willing to kick 'em.

This, unfortunately, is the result of that, and an intransigent runaway economic system that doesn't distribute it's enormous productivity fairly. It's ugly. It's violent. But they're not rounding immigrants up and gassing them.

They are flash-banging them and dragging them out of their beds, deranged, early morning. Throwing them in the back of the van and treating them poorly.

You could make an argument that if they weren't using violent militarised scare tactics this well-armed population might put up more of a fight rather than being cowed into submission.

But this is what it was always going to look like.

I'll ask again - what's the other way Gaff? One that gets immigrants on the backs of lorries? (Bearing in mind both sides have had decades to fix the economic problem, but have done dick about it).

We can argue the effectiveness of ICE tbh. I think it'd take 'em 20 years to get through the, what, 14 million undocumented migrants? I think half of the tactic (in the face of that) is to scare migrants witless so they decide to leave before ICE show up - and the administration is offering a grand per person if they voluntarily leave. I think there's even an app for it.

 

[DaGaffer]

1) I have.

2) Death Squads is overly hyperbolic political rhetoric.

You can draw similarities and parallels but they're absolutely not that. Their mandate is deportation, not execution, and they're not secretive or unofficial, they've a legal mandate and their target isn't political opponents but illegal immigrants.

Plenty of Latin American Death Squads were not secretive or unofficial and none of them were callled "Death Squads"! Most of them also didn't start out as Death Squads, but ended up that way (not all by any means; Duarte's goons in the Philippines were death squads from day 1). What they were/are is extra-judicial and given state protection even when committing criminal acts. Which is what's happening with ICE.

There's a reason for my picture above. The Black & Tans were recruited as "police auxiliaries" and sent to Ireland with the approval of the UK public to sort out the lawlessness in Ireland. Then they started murdering people and British public support evaporated. For the "British public", read "Republicans". And just like ICE, the Black & Tans were wholly untrained for the job they were supposed to do, and protected by the state when they were committing their crimes. "Death Squad" isn't hyperbole, it's a direction of travel.

I absolutely accept the accusations of militarised tactics, lack of due process, the veneer of federal immunity and the humanitarian issues around all of this.

But again, A) they're not Death Squads and B) what the fuck did anyone, actually, really, expect?

Not murdering American citizens.

I'll ask again - what's the other way Gaff? One that gets immigrants on the backs of lorries? (Bearing in mind both sides have had decades to fix the economic problem, but have done dick about it).

Nothing. It's 4% of the population and they commit less crimes than Americans. Secure the border if you want to cap the numbers, but the United States is not full, and the people who exploit undocumented migrants for their labour aren't Democrats. This is the same political theatre as the UK; "look how tough we are" with one hand, while employing them in their factories with the other! Donald fucking Trump famously employed illegals in the building of Trump Tower!

We can argue the effectiveness of ICE tbh. I think it'd take 'em 20 years to get through the, what, 14 million undocumented migrants? I think half of the tactic (in the face of that) is to scare migrants witless so they decide to leave before ICE show up - and the administration is offering a grand per person if they voluntarily leave. I think there's even an app for it.

And here it is. The way they're doing it is only to impress MAGA voters and to cow blue states, because as a strategy for actually reducing the population it's completely fucking useless! The problem is while it works for the macho fringe (see "Department of War" etc.), many Americans with an IQ over room temperature aren't buying it.

 

[Scouse]

"Death Squad" isn't hyperbole, it's a direction of travel.

We'll see.

Not murdering American citizens.

Agree. But ICE agents have (had to) go from what, 12,000 to 22,000 or something? The bovver boys that are signing up are like Reform Councillors - arseholes. So, given what I spoke about state enforcement earlier some of this was inevitable.

They're clearly not setting out to murder American citizens. This demand for perfection is a false argument.

Nothing. It's 4% of the population

Nope. This isn't an answer, it's a cop out. It's democrat policy and NOT what was voted for. You challenge me on not answering your questions so back at ya.

The American public (rightly or wrongly) clearly voted for the removal of illegal immigrants. How do you get them on the back of vans if not this way?

 

[DaGaffer]

They're clearly not setting out to murder American citizens. This demand for perfection is a false argument.

No it isn't; because no-one is asking for perfection (nice straw man there) but accountability.

Nope. This isn't an answer, it's a cop out. It's democrat policy and NOT what was voted for. You challenge me on not answering your questions so back at ya.

Yes, it's an answer. You just don't like it because it runs counter to your feelings about the UK.

The American public (rightly or wrongly) clearly voted for the removal of illegal immigrants. How do you get them on the back of vans if not this way?

And yet the removal of illegal immigrants is happening in states far away from the people who voted for the removal of immigrants. Odd that.

I'll say it again, this has nothing to do with numbers and everything to do with political theatre.

 

[Scouse]

And here it is. The way they're doing it is only to impress MAGA voters and to cow blue states, because as a strategy for actually reducing the population it's completely fucking useless!

I don't know who to believe on effectiveness. The GOP is claiming something like 3 million with 1 million deportations via ICE (2 million voluntarily leaving). ICE figures are showing ~675k (which is lower than under the Dems, but lets not speak about that).

The Democrats are saying it's all fantasy and nobody is leaving - yet on the flipside they're also complaing of "major labour shortages that are reducing GDP by between 1% and 3%". So which is it you cunts? Is it not working, or are illegal migrants no longer working, illegally, in construction and agriculture (driving wages down and excluding legal Americans from those industries).

The Dem's are also whining that the migrant exodus (that isn't happening) is driving up the cost of living. Even though they're not leaving.

At least it's good to see the Blues still are wanting to rely on low-cost, off-book, mistreated, abused migrant labour. A call to the old, almost slavery-based status-quo from that shower of illiberal fucktards, eh?

 

[Scouse]

No it isn't; because no-one is asking for perfection (nice straw man there) but accountability.

I'm all for accountability. No problems with it.

You forget yourself - I don't like the action.

Yes, it's an answer. You just don't like it because it runs counter to your feelings about the UK.

Nope, on three fronts:

1) I don't particularly care about migration in the UK. I certainly don't care about migrants in boats. But mass legal immigration it's absolutely not economically beneficial to the bottom half of UK society and it absolutely comes with cultural issues.

None of those things keep me up at night or make a noticeable difference to my day-to-day. But I'm not going to lie about the facts on the ground.

Like in the US, half the public have their heads in the sand (or up their arses) and would rather demonise the lower echelons than listen to their cries and make serious, meaningful reform. So we've got Brexit and we're likely getting Reform.

Even that level of idiocy hasn't changed the minds of the people who literally give zero fucks about the bottom half. So we're getting what we deserve. Just like the USA.

2) There are economic and social parallels between the US and the UK so I'm arguing along those lines. So far so normal. But you are repeatedly making the same assumption:

You seem to think I want to deport migrants or sympathise with the actions being taken. But I don't.

3) You haven't answered the fekking question. Clearly. Be honest and just say either you can't or don't want to. But don't bullshit.

And yet the removal of illegal immigrants is happening in states far away from the people who voted for the removal of immigrants. Odd that.

I'll say it again, this has nothing to do with numbers and everything to do with political theatre.

This is crap. 1 in 4 ICE deportations is happening in Texas. The southern Red states are massively more effective at removals because state statutes demand the local po-po cooperate with ICE. But in the Blue states it's not happening - so ICE raids are the tool du jour.

You're right on one thing. It is theatre. It's also manufactured. But I'd point the finger across the aisle.

Again. I don't agree with the policy. If I was president I'd offer an amnesty and get illegals off the shadows and into the system so they can benefit from the protections that legals get. The American public want no more immigraton - and that's been delivered. Border crossings are down 95% on when the Dems were in charge. Net migration is negative into the US for the first time in 50 years.

Meh. You seem to think I'm a person I'm not. See the body snatchers post above.

 

[Gwadien]

US to send ICE agents to Winter Olympics, prompting Italian anger

The US federal agency says it will not play an immigration role at February's event in Milan-Cortina.

www.bbc.co.uk

Wat

 

[Deebs]

US to send ICE agents to Winter Olympics, prompting Italian anger

The US federal agency says it will not play an immigration role at February's event in Milan-Cortina.

www.bbc.co.uk

Wat

Yeh they have no reason to be there, leave it to the local Police forces or send other services other than ICE.