TOA and L33t!sts killed DAOC

[Lethul]

i have to agree with asha, most of the "l337 crowd" falls in the the old skool catergory aswell. and scouts are overpowered :[

 

[[NO]Subedai]

I think the mentality of many players in this game, with regard to ToA and why they don't like it, can be summed up with the folloing "player types". While these are only a bit of fun, I'm pretty sure everyone can associate with one of them and recognise people from the others :

1. The "Old Skool". These guys have been with the game since the start, or pretty damn close to it. They spent about 6 months getting their first level 50, and then have probably leveled 3-4 more the old fashioned way. After 2+ yrs of doing a lot of PvE, they're now getting a little fed up of it, and RvR is now their past-time of choice. With the arrival of ToA came excitement at something new, but the novelty has now worn off, and leveling all those artifacts is beginning to get tiresome. Still, the xp-grind is nothing new to these players, and although they may not enjoy doing it, they'll grit their teeth and get the job done so that they can enjoy the benefits in RvR.

2. The l337 crowd. These boys joined the game 1-2 years after the rest of us, but despite this, they claim to know everything about it. They have no interest in PvE, and only care about wtfpwning in RvR - they see it as an extension to their manhood. This means they can't be bothered spending time leveling their characters, so they either buy one off eBay, or pay/beg to be powerleveled. The next step is then to get a buffbot, either by powerleveling one, or purchasing it off eBay. As soon as their current class starts to lose in RvR, or gets nerfed, they will switch to whatever is the latest FOTM. Despite this change in class, however, victory is not 100%, so they search the internet for any cheats which might help them gain an advantage - I have no doubt that 9/10 radar users fall into this category. In between pwning in emain, they like to come to FreddysHouse and use the phrases, "n00b", "qq", "pwned", "nerf", "zerg" as much as they can. On rare occasions they will also think up very witty threads to post, such as "wtf nerf scout damage" and then get all their IRC buddies to post replies backing them up - this then makes them look popular and clever.

3. The RPG fan. These players love the whole RPG idea, and love doing quests, grouping up with people, and generally having fun. They prefer to PvE rather than RvR, and as such, ToA has been a big success for them bringing lots of new things for them to do and explore. As they don't RvR that much, xping artifacts isn't that important to them, but they still enjoy doing ML's, and the actual artifact encounters.

4. The "New Skool". This group joined the game later on, and have been playing for anything from 1-18 months. They play the game as it was intended, xping in groups, and doing quests along the way while making friends and getting to know how the game works. They're pretty much the same as the "Old Skool" players, in that they don't mind PvE that much, but would sooner be playing in RvR - even though most times they will find themselves eating dirt. Despite this though, the game is still relatively new to them, and they enjoy their time playing it.

that is a complete load of shit. most the high rr people in gank grps ahve actaully palyed the game from the beginning. and thats such a shit generelisation.

 

[Tay]

Since the issue seems black and white to you, i will tell you what the real problem here is.
Effort should be rewarded and it has been, problem is that now the rewards to the people who have the opportunity and the will to play the game using all of their freetime has widened the gap where a fg that just has right items and ML's can kill 2-4 random fg's with ease.
And since your attitude to the matter is that if you don't like the game, quit, i will let you in to another secret.
People might just dislike parts of the game, not the whole game.

Just something to think about.

If you had even bothered to read anything I have typed in this thread you'll know I agree, when you quote out of context parts of a post thats what happens.

I stand by what I said, If you dont like the game quit..this is not a life and death situation, I honestly do not see why people put up with this game if its so terrible..if people feel so strongly that they must tell others to stop playing or to not join then the issue is with thier perception of the game not mine.

I would recommend this game to anybody that fancied givining it a try, why? becasue I'm old enough to know that my opinion is just that, its mine, nobody elses, mine.

I am also old enough to understand that kneejerk reactions are misplaced in most cases and highly inappropriate in others.

Remember the old adage, "you can't please all the people all the time".

If this game needs to change take it to the TL's, jesus report it to Mythic.

 

[Tay]

I think the mentality of many players in this game, with regard to ToA and why they don't like it, can be summed up with the folloing "player types". While these are only a bit of fun, I'm pretty sure everyone can associate with one of them and recognise people from the others :

lol

I think I know people that fall into all catagories

 

[Tootz]

that is a complete load of shit. most the high rr people in gank grps ahve actaully palyed the game from the beginning. and thats such a shit generelisation.

And as stated in the post, its not meant to be a serious analysis, just a fun way to look at the types of people in the game. So take it easy No. 2 and don't get so worked up

 

[Tay]

my patience is running low for this debate and the entire PvE-ToA-is-great community. Ofc it's great if you highfive your m8s for killing a MLboss or what-ever-boss "only 4 ppl when an entire grp was required". oOh :worthy:
I really hope you enjoy PvE, the direction we are going atm, PvE might be the only thing for you to do soon.
Ppl with a little more intelectual capacity tend to get bored after killing the same low-AI-whatever-mob(s) over and over and over again. But not you guys....STLONG! If you don't see the problem in todays daoc, you are stupid! Nothing more for me to say about this. Have fun with whatever...

oh, btw..
make sure to jump WoW when it comes out...there you can start all over with the uberfun PvE and convince yourself it's not the same shit in different package.

lol you still dont get it do you?

Answer my questions, without saying the old " Oh this tires me, I'm off" what a load of crap, defend your posts or dont bother posting, this is one of the reason I think your a member of the bat and ball brigade, if you dont like the way its going off ya go with ya ball...

My post about doing something with 4 players or whatever is because it gives some degree of accomplishment, as I stated this is about my fun, and that IS enjoyable to me.

As for PVE is the way to go it worked for a million EQ players.. oh a game without fixed end game of Realm vs Realm warfare, surely not. I would go for that than listen to the tossers that say "OMG you must have cheated cuz you wtfpwned me" and maybe I will, but its my choice.

You dont know me, nor will you ever know me, do not even attempt to estimate my intelectual capacity, you have proved this theory already, your a hit and run type of person, you lost you were always going to lose because you stated an opinion and suggested it was what the whole server thought. Wrong.

Good riddence to you too, as for jumping ship to WoW, which bit of "I've been playing this for nearly 2.5 years" did you not understand? If brains were foreskins you would be jewish.

Hopefully you are a man/boy of your word and you dont respond. But you know what, I kinder think you cant resist another hit and run post.

 

[Tay]

And as stated in the post, its not meant to be a serious analysis, just a fun way to look at the types of people in the game. So take it easy No. 2 and don't get so worked up

<giggle>

I think the humour might be lost there..

 

[Jaapi]

I stand by what I said, If you dont like the game quit..this is not a life and death situation, I honestly do not see why people put up with this game if its so terrible...

And since your attitude to the matter is that if you don't like the game, quit, i will let you in to another secret.
People might just dislike parts of the game, not the whole game.

Gonna give it another try.

 

[Tay]

Gonna give it another try.

You mean you gonna give the game another go?

Context means a great deal when nothing else is posted....

And yes I'm being pedantic.

 

[vintervargen]

LOL so, so owned.

IS THIS WRITING IN CAPITAL LETTERS? NO IT AINT DUMBFUCKS.

 

[[e]]

simply put, so you understand, Tay I think you are an idiot and would appreciate if you just stfu. Please! Go kill your mobs if it makes you happy, but enough with your stupid ass opinion, you just piss me off. It's like explaining math to a monkey, no point. Have fun with PvE.

 

[Gordonax]

IS THIS WRITING IN CAPITAL LETTERS? NO IT AINT DUMBFUCKS.

Er... yes, it is.

Please, for your own sake, stop making yourself look stupid eh?

 

[Flimgoblin]

I thought it was sanskrit - silly me.

 

[Tay]

simply put, so you understand, Tay I think you are an idiot and would appreciate if you just stfu. Please! Go kill your mobs if it makes you happy, but enough with your stupid ass opinion, you just piss me off. It's like explaining math to a monkey, no point. Have fun with PvE.

I think I rather made my point...

Unfortunatly you cant just make me stfu, and what you think of me is irrelevent, and as for my stupid ass opinion, at least I have one and make an effort to justify my position, you simply express an opinion that you would like everybody to think is the gospel truth, when they challenge your point of view you call them low on intellect, idiots and the list goes on.

Are you going to throw more toys out of the pram now? or is "this" the last time you will speak on the matter?.

Oh and btw you dont need to speak simply, I fully comprehend what you are saying but disagree with it totally.

 

[[e]]

no this is not the last I speak of the matter, tomorrow I will write my point of view idiot proof to shut you the fuck up.

 

[rezzi rezzzalot]

Freppe the sorcs you name in your thread are nowhere near the only active mindsorcs in Albion. Try and do a duskwave check every now and again and see which sorcs were in the last weeks top 20. Some are rising and upcoming.
In addition to the ones you name i think of Sollers, Acei, Rushed, Gogol and myself ofcourse as good ones and im sure there are alot more if you actually take the risk of trying them out one time. Granted some will have their guild or as obligations but dont say that only the ones you named are active cos thats a aload of bull.
Beats sitting on your butt for a couple of hours at the atk anyway.

 

[judas]

 

[Xsorus-Merlin]

Heh

Don't worry Casual noob

New frontiers is here to drown out any skill involved in the game..

It will allow you to port around like a mindless zombie noob and zerg everyone down for 10 arpee's

God forbid you actually have to know how to play your class.

Seems everytime Devs listen to Casual players

The game starts reward sucking more then reward being actually good at it.

 

[Klonk]

DAOC do not face strong competition at the moment, lets face it the majority of people that have left publically have done so to get on with thier lives, not to go to another game.

Most students of competition would agree that if the cost of doing something (daoc) is time (leisure time) then real life is a competitor, not just other games

You misunderstand me as does [e], Mythic are not ignoring the opinions of thier customers, it is ignoring some of them, but remember this is about perceptual balance its about the majority not the minority, as long as the majority are reasonably happy then they can throw tid bits at the minority to keep them coming back.

Agree, but is the majority of ppl satisfied with TOA?

I would love to see 90% of daoc player base agree on what type of air to breath

Fresh air??

 

[Klonk]

no this is not the last I speak of the matter, tomorrow I will write my point of view idiot proof to shut you the fuck up.

Proof? Lol, this is a matter of taste and preferance tbh

 

[Tay]

no this is not the last I speak of the matter, tomorrow I will write my point of view idiot proof to shut you the fuck up.

If you present it in a decent clear way then perhaps I'll read more of your ramblings, but to be quite honest I have wiped more favourable materials off my shoe than the crap you spout.

Unless you conduct a survey of every DAOC server in the world or even show me some kind of evidence that the daoc world thinks as you do then I'll disgrard it as more of your inane diatribe.

 

[Klonk]

You said you wanted to be able to do MOST MLs with 2FG - fact is you can. 4 steps out of 90 that cant be done with those numbers is hardly unreasonable.

Ok, first of all, there are more than 4 steps of 90 (100?) that cannot be done by 2fg. Unless that is 2fg of pve-tweaked high rr pet-spamming ppl - which is not the definition of my friends ingame. Have you tried that Lord-dude on ML8 with the big 2h sword with 2fg? It was very very hard and took 30 minutes with 3-4 fg on Arnor's last raid here in Mid. Maybe you do it better in pve in Alb, I dunno.

Secondly, I wish again to emphasize(sp?) that you won't get credit for ML4 if you haven't done 4.2, and thus you haven't done ML4. Yeah, some steps on some MLs demand zerging, not many steps maybe, but enough to make you NOT get credit for that ML. If I were to go thru all the ML steps with 2 fg, what Master Level would my char be? Probably ML1 or 2, because I would not have credit for 2.10/3.10/4.2/4.10/etc. Which is my point.

It doesnt have to be organised via forums etc: thats just one way people tend to find convenient.

So how would you communicate to gather 4fg + in short time, all agreeing on the same goal? Maybe your /as works better than ours

As for artifacts theres at most a handful of them that cant be done by "1FG-ish" so I dont see the problem there. There are many problems with the way artifacts work but the numbers required to get most of them are fairly reasonable.(maybe I should add "at least in albion" to that. Since Mid has no petspam class I appreciate some encounters might need more people)

I agree, and this was hardly my most important point about artifacts. I said I hate the way the mobs spawn/despawn/are camped/don't drop 100% of the time, that their scrolls are too hard to get and that leveling artifacts is a silly idea (all IMO).

 

[Tay]

Most students of competition would agree that if the cost of doing something (daoc) is time (leisure time) then real life is a competitor, not just other games



Agree, but is the majority of ppl satisfied with TOA?



Fresh air??

1. Dont get serious on me.
2. I honestly cannot speak for the whole DAOC world, therefore I do not know.
3. Ah, on the contrary I prefer canned purified air. (50/50 so far) not quite a overwhelming response

 

[Klonk]

1. Dont get serious on me.

Sorry. Won't happen again.


My hovercraft is full of eels!!1 Drop your panties, Sir William, I cannot wait till lunch time!!


Better?

So you think Mythic/GOA only cares about those customers who leave daoc for other computer games, not those who leave daoc for rl reasons? I think not, which was what I tried to say.

 

[Tay]

Sorry. Won't happen again.


My hovercraft is full of eels!!1 Drop your panties, Sir William, I cannot wait till lunch time!!


Better?

So you think Mythic/GOA only cares about those customers who leave daoc for other computer games, not those who leave daoc for rl reasons? I think not, which was what I tried to say.

I'm not even going to try an pshchoanalyse the hovercraft thing.

I personally think Mythic want to keep everybody in daoc forever, simple as that, frankly if they keep it enjoyable they will get that, the enjoyable factor means differant things for differant people. I dont think that even mythic can offer better than real life as a unique selling point.

 

[Klonk]

I'm not even going to try an pshchoanalyse the hovercraft thing.

I personally think Mythic want to keep everybody in daoc forever, simple as that, frankly if they keep it enjoyable they will get that, the enjoyable factor means differant things for differant people. I dont think that even mythic can offer better than real life as a unique selling point.

Hovercraft thing = Monty Python's Flying Circus, sketch called Dirty Hungarian Phrasebook iirc

Me too thinks Mythic wants to avoid loosing players - whether to ppl who want to free up time for RL activities, or ppl who want to free up time for other games... and for some people, in some situations in their lives etc, I think some will prefer daoc over rl, especially for ppl with "bad" rl. But this is kinda besides the point, I agree.

 

[[e]]

first,
"I will write my point of view idiot proof" means I will present my opinion in a way that even an idiot can understand it.
NOT that I will bother getting "proof" like in a survey =) You really are an idiot, grats! However forget this statement - I know now this is impossible.

You want proof, read forums both here and in the US. Talk you your friends, guild etc etc and most important: THINK!
There are too many anti-ToA post for this not to be a problem - only an idiot can deny it. Tay, this is not about you or me, who is right or wrong - it's about how to make ToA better for as many as possible.

Many different ppl have many different opinions and definition of what "fun" is. However the majority of ppl that I know and talked to are mainly interested in the endgame-daoc. If you think about it, every road leads
eventually here. After a while you MUST get bored/tired/have all the items ingame etc etc. What will you do then? Quit?
(Tay, don't answer, "goldfish")

ToA introduced many things you "must do", rather then "choose to do". I think this is wrong. Note: this is my personal opinion. However the problems I mention below should, partly or in whole, be recognized by most of you.
If you don't understand what im trying to say, you better stick with PvE only - the low AI PvE mobs in daoc don't require much to be dominated.

----------------------------
These are the 3 main problem grps I think needs to be reviewed and "adjusted":

(1) Balance:

(a) General: Realm vs. Realm
(b) Player: casual vs. powergamer

(1a) This might lead to an evil spiral where one realm don't RvR because the get tired of getting pawned. The other realms view this as less RvR activity in general and reduce their own activity = soon you have "ghost-towns", and ppl will quit.
(1b) the gap is huge, need balancing - possibly with changes in the (3) PvE section. PvE should be fun enough to do without causing great inbalance with time invested <-> reward returned.

(2) New Players:

(a) lvl 50, MLs, get artifacts + scroll, lvl artifacts
(b) ingame economy

(2a) the journey is too long, frankly speaking, repetitive = gets boring.

Also to consider, the problem for new ppl to get lvling grps since the game is old and most ppl are past the lowlvl areas. The new "PL" trend is a huge problem - but this problem started before ToA.

(2b) prices are insane for newcomers - even for some veterans. If newcomers lvl the normal way and buy some equipment, they have rougly 3-5 plat in cash when lvl 50? This amout is nothing in todays daoc. New players are highly dependent on the goodwill of veterans/guilds etc.
This is wrong. I personally wouldnt want to start a game by being somebodys bitch, or by getting 2 accounts and making the "tools" nessecary in order to eventually be able to support the character I would like to play. Mythic need to figure out something to make this game more "available" for newcomers.

(3) PvE:

(a) artifact leveling
(b) respawntime on encounters
(c) ML:s
(d) Droprate on scrolls (and some artis)
((e) Greed and attitudes in general) - something I personally think!

(3a) too long, repetitive, boring
(3b) too long, boring
(3c) make them all possible to do with 2 fgs. Remove all the idiotic "downtime" parts and speed up game progress.
(3d) increase droprate on scrolls (also, 1 dead artimob should = 1 arti, always)
((3e) MINE MINE MINE! If above changes are made, overall climate and attitudes would be better. I think everybody should have the items
they want/need. But ofc, the leet-wannabe-wankers might wake up one day and see that they are not so l337. Equal conditions might bite them in the ass!)
----------------------------

What I have said so far, should be considered a problem by almost everybody. If not, you play a different game then the rest of us.
Try to see the big picture, the good of the community and long term effects.

psst, Tay, I will let you in on a little "secret"... If the ppl who are here mostly for RVR would quit, you might as well go back playing Baldurs gate. This MMORPG wont be so "massive" anymore.

 

[duact]

if anything killed daoc rvr, its you and the **** nukenin.

actually i have to disagree. it was actually quite fun to kill zoyster and nukeninzergs.

 

[Tazock]

In my opinion casual players should atleast in items catch up with everybody.

So an idea is that new additions to the game should after six months be patched to be 5 times easier to let the casual player get by. It will give the powergamers 6 months of ubertime in rvr and in their own words they will wtfpawn random groups who are ml10 toaéd even when they got none. of that.

So in that scenario everybody wins and just repeat that every addition so the whole population has a chance to get by, for myself I got some toa, some ml but I spent my time way inefficient to get all to the max. I rather pursue me own silly things as keepraids and exping alts in new ways. (as matter cab on tanglers, never done it before and it's fun

 

[Clipse]

what the hell have u2 done to my thread ?

Make your point, then leave plz, non of this bitching!