[TL] LA-Damage logs!!!1

[Arnor]

soruzi got a pic of her hitting for 800ish w/o crit, its POSSIBLE

 

[Jenna.]

I can hit people for 1000+ without a crit FYI!

 

[SilverHood]

Heh those logs... makes my thane look good

 

[old.Elrond]

As a shadowblade I hit SC'd casters with decent slash resist for approx 180 mainhand (with doublefrost unbuffed)..should that be nerfed? (and yes I can post logs/screenshots if you like) that figure drops again and again as the armour type gets heavier and heavier so I feel pretty hard done by getting nerfed as people whined about zerkers for so long (when the real problem was rat mode not general damage) And I also feel pretty put out that Perforate Artory now seems to be hitting tanks for under 200, and casters for only approx 300-350. Hardly a big opener anymore :|

 

[Damon_D]

Aye SB's are getting even worse shafted than the Berzerkers.. and they are getting hit bad

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by old.LandShark
Hehe, when did minstrels become better 1 vs 1 hybrids than palas and friars? Pull the other one...

Um the person in question plays friar...

 

[ghaladriel]

 

[the_fnord]

Originally posted by 1234Taz
erm no look here he breaks 300 damage three using Axe styles. Now look here

Ok I've looked at ur links m8!
Now look at mine:
Lookie here!

 

[Balbor]

ok not sure what all the fuss is about so can someone help me a bit.

I only really know about Albs duel weapon users, mercs and Infs who have to spec a weapon type as specing DW only gives styles and and extra % to hit with second weapon when NOT using a style of any sort. I think a lot of Infs don't even bother specing the DW line except with leftovers as they put points into there weapon style (usally Thrust).

How does LA and CD work? is it the same or do they also increase the damage of off hand attakcs with both styles or extra hits made when styles aren't used?

I'm guess SB will be nerfed because they will have to change over to the INF and NS style of specing but they get less spec points per level as Infs.

I think the fact albs have to effectifly spec twice for there advanced weapon (Poleweapons two handed weapons) while the other realms don't is a bigger imbalence. Mids have the ability to switch form defence to offencive without the need to spec twice while hibs that chose CS or LW can put a lot more points into perry to improve there defence.

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by Balbor
I only really know about Albs duel weapon users, mercs and Infs who have to spec a weapon type as specing DW only gives styles and and extra % to hit with second weapon when NOT using a style of any sort. I think a lot of Infs don't even bother specing the DW line except with leftovers as they put points into there weapon style (usally Thrust).

Hmm, couple of points.
Most infs have at least 25 DW, some have much more.
DW spec bonus for offhand hits works regardless of whether you are styling or not, saying it only works unstyled is factually inaccurate.

Originally posted by Balbor
How does LA and CD work? is it the same or do they also increase the damage of off hand attakcs with both styles or extra hits made when styles aren't used?

CD works the same as DW, LA works differently. With LA base damage is halved at 1 spec LA, speccing more LA increases base damage (this reduction only occurs when wielding two axes). I think full spec LA gives around 85% base damage.

Originally posted by Balbor
I'm guess SB will be nerfed because they will have to change over to the INF and NS style of specing but they get less spec points per level as Infs.

Speccing isn;t that different for the 3 assassin classes, SBs tended to go LA heavy because they needed the base damage and because it's styles were so effective. I'm not sure what effect this change will have on SB speccing.

Originally posted by Balbor
I think the fact albs have to effectifly spec twice for there advanced weapon (Poleweapons two handed weapons) while the other realms don't is a bigger imbalence. Mids have the ability to switch form defence to offencive without the need to spec twice while hibs that chose CS or LW can put a lot more points into perry to improve there defence.

On the other hand, albs get better variance with two-handers and the choice of two-handed weaponry in 3 damage types, midgard only gets crush and slash 2-handers. Regardless that has very little to do with this thread so I'm not really sure why you brought it up here.

 

[Danya]

Originally posted by Arnor2
Only me finding it odd that he caps out on every single hit? and that his cap is low like a mofo?

He's not neccessarily capping given how huge those resists are...

 

[thorungla]

Originally posted by Balbor
ok not sure what all the fuss is about so can someone help me a bit.

I only really know about Albs duel weapon users, mercs and Infs who have to spec a weapon type as specing DW only gives styles and and extra % to hit with second weapon when NOT using a style of any sort. I think a lot of Infs don't even bother specing the DW line except with leftovers as they put points into there weapon style (usally Thrust).

How does LA and CD work? is it the same or do they also increase the damage of off hand attakcs with both styles or extra hits made when styles aren't used?

I'm guess SB will be nerfed because they will have to change over to the INF and NS style of specing but they get less spec points per level as Infs.

I think the fact albs have to effectifly spec twice for there advanced weapon (Poleweapons two handed weapons) while the other realms don't is a bigger imbalence. Mids have the ability to switch form defence to offencive without the need to spec twice while hibs that chose CS or LW can put a lot more points into perry to improve there defence.

Some already been answered but I'll add a little more detail. As soon as a zerker or SB equips a left axe, their main hand does 60.5% the damage it would have if they were just using 1hand. Each spec point gives 0.5% increase to this obviously to a maximum of 85%. The la spec line provides styles and increases the % to hit of offhand with spec. The fundamental difference is that LA has to be specced high as I see it. Whereas seemingly DW and CD can just be specced to 25, the minimum for la is considered 39.

I'm not clear on how inf's and NS's specs are but most SB's spec a so called 5spec (apart from Shadowzerkers who spec pure melee and are in effect assasin hunters). The 5 spec aims to get the basic crit styles; PA + followup, BS2 + followup, as well as high poison and as previously mentioned 39la as the minimum. This usually only leaves enough points to spec weps to 36. Only the fact that midgards only 'advanced wep spec', LA did more damage than normal wepaon spec, was this style possible. With the upcoming nerf which justifiably or not was intended for Zerkers it is effectively wiping out the viability of dual wielding for SB's. I expect any SB's around after 1.62 will be forced to respec to a pure critblade. These traditionally use 2h weps as we cannot dual wield with low LA spec due to the large reduction in mainhand damage with low la spec. As has already been realised over the many months of early daoc critblades cannot compete with existing infils and NS's (this is why the 5spec and Shadowzerkers spec came from, they were a means to fight the stealther wars) so SB's will now be restricted I expect to basically kamikaze kills on casters in amongst their groups. Perhaps the worst assasin RA , SB's shadowrun, might actually be useful for those moments you spot an enemy assasin, instead of fighting we can now hit shadowrun and try to escape

As for the aspect of Albs advanced wep spec LW's, yes you spend double the points so to speak and benefit frm 140% the dmg of a 1hander. I'm not sure about Hibs advanced wep spec (celtic spear?) pretty sure it too gives 140% dmg compared to an equivalent 1hander. Now for Mid. Our advanced wep spec is actually LA, it requires as with LW and CS double the spec points or near to in order to be effective. Unfortunately after the 1.62 patch the logs show that Mids advanced wep spec does almost the same damage as normal wep specs (check the logs mentioned for more info) and so there is really no reason to spend double the spec points to increase your damage by such a small amount. The next issue unique to Mid is our generic 2handers, all wepaon spec classes can equip a 2hander that provides 115% the dmg of an equivalent 1hander.

Hope that helps you to consider all the posts about this change in 1.62.

Put simply. Zerkers were on occasion doing too much damage but this was primarily down to ratmode when thay can crit upto 100% so when combined with an advanced wep spec it could hurt alot. Mythic decided to nerf this and chose to do it by nerfing LA.

As a byproduct the nerf to LA affects nearly all SB specs and SB's were not an intended target for nerfing as on the whole the stealth wars have been pretty balanced (as long as you put aside the prolific use of buffbots, and in my opinion albs advantage of having the support of CC in a stealth group courtesy of minstrels).

 

[Glacier]

i love you all..

 

[Damon_D]

btw was it the same dude who used the havoc style
???...

because I think my lvl 40 kobi warrior hit's as hard as that with Havoc using 1h weapon

 

[Flimgoblin]

Originally posted by thorungla
Well as I see it, LA is an advanced weapon spec, you effectively spend twice as many spec points. Do you really think that for half the spec points an axe style should do the same damage?

c.f. Polearm, Two handed, Celtic Dual, Dual Wield.

Given how much damage LA does at the moment and the thought of how sick it would be if they upped these style lines to pre-1.62 LA?

Yep

 

[klavrynd]

polearm and 2handed users get to wear plate so they're not light tanks and therefor need to do shit damage ( cfr mythic)

 

[Tigerius]

Originally posted by thorungla

IAs for the aspect of Albs advanced wep spec LW's, yes you spend double the points so to speak and benefit frm 140% the dmg of a 1hander. I'm not sure about Hibs advanced wep spec (celtic spear?) pretty sure it too gives 140% dmg compared to an equivalent 1hander. Now for Mid. Our advanced wep spec is actually LA, it requires as with LW and CS double the spec points or near to in order to be effective. Unfortunately after the 1.62 patch the logs show that Mids advanced wep spec does almost the same damage as normal wep specs (check the logs mentioned for more info) and so there is really no reason to spend double the spec points to increase your damage by such a small amount. The next issue unique to Mid is our generic 2handers, all wepaon spec classes can equip a 2hander that provides 115% the dmg of an equivalent 1hander.

These are bullshit numbers, stated once and taken to heart forever. Not accurate.

 

[old.Cyric]

Originally posted by Tigerius
These are bullshit numbers, stated once and taken to heart forever. Not accurate.

Does anyone have any real ones?

I mean... I'm certain that my warrior hits harder than 115% of one handed when not styling, with a two hander... even with factoring in the speed of the weapon... I mean... I think I'm sure...

Anyone have any numbers for 1h vs. 2h mid? I cba to read 45 pages of logs, I mean... average damage percentages

 

[mordia]

Wow how much people can be arsed to type in defend of their lovely LA.

 

[Balbor]

ok, SB can spec to be assassin killers by going LA and not CS (like infs do) but could Infs and NS also spec to be as effective in that role. If the answer is no then we have a case of either uber or gimp, by changing just one line they have turned the best Assassin class into the worst.

I guess its hard to make each of the 3 realm assassin classes unique while making them balenced.

 

[old.Kal]

Well as I see it, LA is an advanced weapon spec, you effectively spend twice as many spec points. Do you really think that for half the spec points an axe style should do the same damage?

Omg welcome to alb !

 

[Validus]

even if they do too much damage, which i doubt, the studded armor makes up for it

 

[old.tuppe]

dont belong here but say afterall

all 2h weapon have same base dmg, means middies free 2h, and albs pole + hibs 2h.
where differences come is style dmg.
middies use same styles for 1h and 2h weapons, alb/hib have unique styles for own 2h weapons, simply.
dont have links or any proofs, but go dig vn viking forum and find it there, somewhere.

inf/ns if spec high dw, mercinf or something?
can do allmost same as sz.
where the problem lays inf/ns can dw soending 0 points it, both weapons swing, sooner or later -> 2 poisons land.
if sb wanna do same? he needs spec laxe atleast over 34 -> thin in dmg output.

sb have same spec points as ns, but ns dont need spec dw for 2 poisons, instead sb need spec it atleast to 34 and over!
think now how much after this sb have points to use other lines?

if! sb dont spec laxe what options there is?
2h axe and cs?
how much loosing in sc? because laxe is out?

laxe is alott different thing what dw, you need spec for it to get full benefit, dw in other realms are just place where dump leftover

edit.

BM dmg comparison

edit more.

dw in other realms can benefit same haste effect what bers!
it works when both weapons swing, speccing dw hig you get better change swing + dualist reflext, nice ratio for swings.
so equip once slowest weapon in mainhand and fastes other, go try.
what is many comparison wrong, many dw use only fast weapons, and same time compare sb/bers who use 99% time slow mainhand and fast offhand.
small copy from dmg


[06:02:27] You perform your Ice Storm perfectly. (+129)
[06:02:27] You attack Iorri with your mace and hit for 230 (-65) damage!
[06:02:27] You miss!

[06:02:30] You perform your Tempest perfectly. (+147)
[06:02:30] You attack Iorri with your mace and hit for 259 (-35) damage!
[06:02:30] Iorri is bleeding!
[06:02:30] You hit Iorri for 5 damage!
[06:02:30] You attack Iorri with your hammer and hit for 96 (-27) damage!

[06:02:33] You perform your Supernova perfectly. (+206)
[06:02:33] You attack Iorri with your mace and hit for 302 (-85) damage!
[06:02:33] Iorri cannot seem to move!
[06:02:33] You attack Iorri with your hammer and hit for 102 (-29) damage!
[06:02:33] You critical hit for an additional 12 damage!
[06:02:34] Iorri is bleeding!
[06:02:34] You hit Iorri for 4 damage!