The more I think about it, the more it bugs me

[Gear]

OK, there are some susspensions we all know about. Fine, but way too lenient. When I was doing some teaching, if I was finding out that someone cheated his/her way through an exam or an essay I wouldn't let him/her keep the grade awarded. In a similar spirit, I would also want to see the RPs of the people that have cheated to get them stripped. Don't flag em, I don't really care, but they got what they have through cheating, so why should they keep them?

 

[Fana]

Agree, goa should suspend them for 2 weeks like now but also revert them to rr1L0 - now that would hurt them^^

 

[Gear]

We obviously mean that their RAs should get stripped as well. However now what happens is that people will be able to relog after a couple of weeks and still enjoy what they have acquired through intentional cheating. In effect that means they get the last laugh. This is not a bug abouse that someone thought they might get away with, it is not a pve abuse that only helped them leveling without any harm done to another player, we are talking about people that were frustrating others along with their gameplay intentionaly.

Anyway, your call but I do believe it's way to lenient.

Edit: funny, my reply should be actually below req's as I'm replying to him!

 

[IainC]

Agree, goa should suspend them for 2 weeks like now but also revert them to rr1L0 - now that would hurt them^^

Much as I'd like to, it's not as easy as that. Simply reducing their RPs to 0 and setting them back to RR1L0 would actually make them more powerful in the long run as they'd end up with more realm skill points than someone who had never cheated. We'd have to strip all their RAs and unspent realm skill points as well as removing the skill bonuses for realm rank - which can be done but is fiddly and time consuming even for just one character. Multiply that for all the characters on an account (possibly across multiple servers too) and the number of accounts involved and it's not really a productive use of GM time.

As it stands the first wave of people caught are being suspended for two weeks as a general warning to all cheaters. After this, anyone caught using radar will be permanently banned even if they've never been caught before.

 

[Gamah]

A slighty tougher line than mythic, when you consider GOA is a business, it does make good business sence to warn people and not insta ban them..then people hell bent on cheating are banned.

However when you consider people have been insta banned for macro crafting with no warning..and radar abusers just get a 2 week ban its not really fair is it requiel?

 

[carrot]

hmm Requiel it does look a bit time consuming tell you what just delete the chrs instead let em make new ones.

Or failing that publish the list of chars and let the player community shun them .

Most of us dont like cheets especialy RvR ones whilst suspending them for 2 weks over the christmass holls is a better punishment than suspending them at some other time I think most of us feel its not punishment inough.

If you had the time Id recomend adding the words (radar using cheet) to all there names so everyone can see who they are.

 

[IainC]

A slighty tougher line than mythic, when you consider GOA is a business, it does make good business sence to warn people and not insta ban them..then people hell bent on cheating are banned.

However when you consider people have been insta banned for macro crafting with no warning..and radar abusers just get a 2 week ban its not really fair is it requiel?

Our normal line is that using any third party program to gain an unfair advantage will get you permanently banned. This particular episode is a one off warning. After this it's back to the insta-ban with no more warnings for anyone. Get caught using radar/macro crafting etc and you will lose your account.

 

[Ovi1]

I guess one reason for suspension rather than banning is the "everyone else use it so I had to ...." people, they have now been warned, and they now know it is no excuse.

Personally I would Hang, Draw & Quarter all the cheats, but my guess is GoA might not be able to get away with that

 

[Boni]

As it stands the first wave of people caught are being suspended for two weeks as a general warning to all cheaters. After this, anyone caught using radar will be permanently banned even if they've never been caught before.

Just ban them outright please. Why are you gonna let off people with a warning to start with? Using radar is cheating, people know its wrong, people know that radar detection is comming, that softness just lets people abuse radar till they recieve such a mail.

Perma ban them, dont be so soft on cheaters, I can only conclude you value their subscription higher than actualy getting rid of people who knowingly cheat. Less tolerence of cheating please for the sake of those who have and always will play this game without cheating.

 

[Jpeg[LOD]]

Just ban them outright please. Why are you gonna let off people with a warning to start with? Using radar is cheating, people know its wrong, people know that radar detection is comming, that softness just lets people abuse radar till they recieve such a mail.

Perma ban them, dont be so soft on cheaters, I can only conclude you value their subscription higher than actualy getting rid of people who knowingly cheat. Less tolerence of cheating please for the sake of those who have and always will play this game without cheating.

well said. couldnt of said it better myself.... execpt for . i wish all cheaters would f*** off and get banned named and shamed

 

[Shafu]

I say morph all cheaters to little pigs or something. GoA has done it before with pets on halloween etc, so it should be possible

 

[Poon]

With EQ2 out and WOW coming i doubt GOA can really afford to insta ban anyone

 

[nick]

Money. They have probably come to the conclusion, just like they did with buffbots, that removing them completely would have a worse effect on their income than leaving them in.

 

[Vindicator]

Got to agree with Boni and others. They go on and on about how they are tough line when dealing with cheaters and there have been some ppl out right banned for macro's / speed hacks and what not but then when it comes to radar they give them a warning. You can only draw a certain conculsion, in my opinion of course, from this:

- There were so many people using radar that they would lose a huge amount of money, when of course factoring in that your typical radar user has at least one buff bot / pl bot so infact when you ban 1 radar user you are getting rid of 2-4 accounts and pleasing 1 account holder at a time. When you add them up it one can only speculate that the gross of the cheaters and the gross of the regular users was not profitable enough to perma ban.

So they went soft and fired a warning shot off the port bow so to speak ;>. Lets see how many retards run full speed into it thinking that mythic / Goa are bluffing because at the end of the day there playnig hard play while your playing with your self. Hopefully lots get stung

 

[Chesnox]

With EQ2 out and WOW coming i doubt GOA can really afford to insta ban anyone

I would say they can't afford not to doit. I think Blizzards zero tolerance stand against cheaters and eBay sellers is attracting people from games like DaoC, whereas both Mythic an GoA seem to be pretty reluctant to do the same.

Money. They have probably come to the conclusion, just like they did with buffbots, that removing them completely would have a worse effect on their income than leaving them in.

Its backfired imho. Short term decisions to promote buffbots (and they did, see ToA boats that need 2 ppl to move) meant a huge increase in subs for Mythic, but ultimately led to those opposed or unable to run a bb account leaving. Thus when they are just left with people running 2+ accts, for each player they lose they lose 2+ subs. Go read the VN boards, whinefest I know, but BBs and their impact on the game today dominate, and for good reason.

 

[Escape]

I can't believe I didn't use radar. Three years of easy-mode for a 2 week ban.

 

[Siftwind]

Although I agree with all the anti-cheat sentiments, I think GOA are going about this in the right way. The first wave of suspensions is a wake up call. The next is account deletion. GOA get to keep the players, and hence the subcriptions, that stop cheating. If you were running a business where players equal money, what would you do? Besides, think about the realm balance. If GOA insta-banned all the cheaters right away then Mids would get the underpopulated realm bonus <-- (cheeky wink, in a jovial manner, not serious, joking)

Regards,
Sift.

 

[Naffets]

I guess one reason for suspension rather than banning is the "everyone else use it so I had to ...." people, they have now been warned, and they now know it is no excuse.

Personally I would Hang, Draw & Quarter all the cheats, but my guess is GoA might not be able to get away with that

Send in the reavers to do it

 

[Gear]

I can't believe I didn't use radar. Three years of easy-mode for a 2 week ban.

I completely agree! I won't be playing much those days anyway with holidays family etc, I guess even those hours I play I could have let em go FOR ALL THIS TIME FARMING PEOPLE!!!!! Give me the amount of RPs I didn't get cause I couldn't find someone, cause I died as a FG approached while I was fighting etc, and then I'll take it. Perma ban them, or it's just the rest of us being completely stupid for not having used radar.

PS. I can settle for my A/cer and SCer being Legendary

Cheaters get the best out of the deal imo uke:

 

[Gesta]

and for all those that have been suspended can one of the GMs make a sticky thread naming them,

thx in advance

 

[tolshock]

I thought Mythic's first wave of 2-week suspensions when NF came was just a way to point out to the cheaters that Mythic can and will ban them...

We on the euro servers have known they can trace and ban cheaters ever since they got the NF patch on the US servers, so there's no real need for a 2-week "now you know we can find you, cheater"-suspension. GOA should have skipped that and insta-banned the cheaters right away.

 

[Belorfyn]

I can't believe I didn't use radar. Three years of easy-mode for a 2 week ban.

Well said, that pretty much sums up my thoughts about this.

 

[IainC]

I can't believe I didn't use radar. Three years of easy-mode for a 2 week ban.

If you had and we'd caught you before this wave, you'd have lost your account. If you do and we catch you after this wave you will lose your account. This is a one-time only warning to all cheaters.

 

[tolshock]

This is a one-time only warning to all cheaters.

Did you really need a one-time only warning in the first place? As if the cheaters didn't know the anti-cheat thingy would be implemented in the same patch as the US servers got it? I'm sure 99% of the euro server population knew that this would come.

Nice to see you (GOA) take actions against the cheaters anyhow.

 

[Vindicator]

If you had and we'd caught you before this wave, you'd have lost your account. If you do and we catch you after this wave you will lose your account. This is a one-time only warning to all cheaters.

If he had of used radar he would have got a 2 week ban. Why else are 2 week bans only been handed out now for radar use then ;>? Why would you say your going to be dealing with cheaters very toughly, by perma banning them etc and then turn around and say

" Ohhh, well a perma ban is a bit extereme for cheating so lets say 2 weeks and promise you wont do whats obviously in your nature to do, cheat, Again".

Bull shit, I'm sorry. I know your just on here trying to defend or more accurately explain the actions taken by GOA and thats fine but hehe nobody likes being feed BS. If you declare that you intend to ban cheaters whenever third party programs are used well then you must deliever on your promise, not decide you will lose too much cash and hand out wooden spoon slaps on the wrist. The only other reason I can see for a 2 week ban as opposed to a perma ban is quite frankly, you just dont know for sure if somebody really is cheating or not. You were relying on possibly erroneous information coming back from a client that could be radar user or could be corrupted files in a .dat / etc or possibly you had somebody monitering a suspected radar user and then there's always the video evidence somebody may have sent to you on more than one occasion which both of those sources are highly dubious at best. Either way, It is either a case of uncertaintity which could lead to falsely accused accounts coming back and attacking you for wrongfully banning or you cared more for the money lost than money saved by making the general populus happy, a wise business move no doubting that but one which would make you seem soft on cheaters.

 

[Morchaoron]

lineage 2 had a zero tolerance system aswell, you could report a cheater ingame and a GM would come to check it out and ban him on the spot...

 

[IainC]

If he had of used radar he would have got a 2 week ban. Why else are 2 week bans only been handed out now for radar use then ;>? Why would you say your going to be dealing with cheaters very toughly, by perma banning them etc and then turn around and say

" Ohhh, well a perma ban is a bit extereme for cheating so lets say 2 weeks and promise you wont do whats obviously in your nature to do, cheat, Again".

Bull shit, I'm sorry. I know your just on here trying to defend or more accurately explain the actions taken by GOA and thats fine but hehe nobody likes being feed BS. If you declare that you intend to ban cheaters whenever third party programs are used well then you must deliever on your promise, not decide you will lose too much cash and hand out wooden spoon slaps on the wrist. The only other reason I can see for a 2 week ban as opposed to a perma ban is quite frankly, you just dont know for sure if somebody really is cheating or not. You were relying on possibly erroneous information coming back from a client that could be radar user or could be corrupted files in a .dat / etc or possibly you had somebody monitering a suspected radar user and then there's always the video evidence somebody may have sent to you on more than one occasion which both of those sources are highly dubious at best. Either way, It is either a case of uncertaintity which could lead to falsely accused accounts coming back and attacking you for wrongfully banning or you cared more for the money lost than money saved by making the general populus happy, a wise business move no doubting that but one which would make you seem soft on cheaters.

Not at all. Our policy on third party program abuse has always been to permanently ban. As I've said several times, this is a one-off warning. People who were caught using radar before lost their accounts permanently. People who get caught using radar in future will lose their accounts permanently. We are doing this as a 'shot across the bows' to encourage people to stop cheating. If they fail to learn this lesson then they will no longer find themselves able to play. It's nothing to do with uncertainty or not having sufficient proof. All the people who were suspended were definitely using radar, there is no room for doubt there. If we had no proof we would not act at all, we will never take action against an account unless there is conclusive evidence that the action is warranted.

We will not hesitate to ban cheats permanently, it makes no sense for us to disenfranchise the vast majority of honest and fair players by tolerating the tiny proportion of cheats. Allowing cheats to continue unchecked will eventually drive away more honest players and lose us more subs revenue than we would lose in the short term by cutting out the rot.

 

[semanon]

Not at all. Our policy on third party program abuse has always been to permanently ban. As I've said several times, this is a one-off warning. People who were caught using radar before lost their accounts permanently. People who get caught using radar in future will lose their accounts permanently. We are doing this as a 'shot across the bows' to encourage people to stop cheating. If they fail to learn this lesson then they will no longer find themselves able to play. It's nothing to do with uncertainty or not having sufficient proof. All the people who were suspended were definitely using radar, there is no room for doubt there. If we had no proof we would not act at all, we will never take action against an account unless there is conclusive evidence that the action is warranted.

We will not hesitate to ban cheats permanently, it makes no sense for us to disenfranchise the vast majority of honest and fair players by tolerating the tiny proportion of cheats. Allowing cheats to continue unchecked will eventually drive away more honest players and lose us more subs revenue than we would lose in the short term by cutting out the rot.

Name the cheaters. Then we know where we stand!

 

[Oldfaravid]

I find it fun that suddenly they just warn and suspend for a while.. this only in my eyes shows one thing.. ALOT (way more then we think) were cheating in daoc... They cant shut off 200+ people/server cause it wouldnt be good for either the economy of the co or for the game.. 1/5th cheating in daoc i dont really see as unrealistic.. if it was only a few as the gm speaks of it would be more benefical to just ban em and gain some nice reputation with its costumers.. With GoAs current reputation I for one know what I would have chosen as head of that company... or wait money > all

 

[tolshock]

I find it fun that suddenly they just warn and suspend for a while.. this only in my eyes shows one thing.. ALOT (way more then we think) were cheating in daoc...

I honestly think this is just something they do to follow Mythic's footsteps. Pretty obvious isn't it?

1. the people running the US servers got their anti-cheat thingy in the same patch as we did. they started suspending people almost at the same time after the NF release. Same 2-week ban policy.
2. Mythic added the 'bring a friend' bonus system to the US servers, we got it in the same patch.

I just guess these things are just orders from the Mythic staff to make the US and euro servers equal in all ways?

I think it's annoying that they only give out 2 week suspensions, but hey. Better to give out 2 week suspensions if they really believe they can save the servers. And it's only 2 weeks, then it'll be perma bans (I hope).....