Formula 1 The F1 jibber jabber thread.

[Corran]

Mclaren announcement not before 1st december = lol.

Thing is, that last race, without jensen they would have lost tens of millions of ££££££££'s. Jenson's position in the race secured their constructor position and without it they would have dropped down a bit. That alone proves they need him and that Kevin isn't up to the task. Sure alonso can do the job button has, but they wont want to linger where they are currently, they got to look to improve. They should contract Kevin but ship him out to race elsewhere next year. Give Button a 1yr contract and shake hands at the end of that.

 

[ECA]

One of the issues is that Eric Boullier - team principal - also happens to be Kevin Magnussens manager - so if Kmags is fired, he loses hundreds of thousands of pounds - no wonder he wants JB out in favour of KM.

 

[DaGaffer]

Mclaren announcement not before 1st december = lol.

Thing is, that last race, without jensen they would have lost tens of millions of ££££££££'s. Jenson's position in the race secured their constructor position and without it they would have dropped down a bit. That alone proves they need him and that Kevin isn't up to the task. Sure alonso can do the job button has, but they wont want to linger where they are currently, they got to look to improve. They should contract Kevin but ship him out to race elsewhere next year. Give Button a 1yr contract and shake hands at the end of that.

Alonso is a better driver than Button, simple as that. Don't get me wrong, I think Button is an excellent driver, but if McLaren can only afford one top flight driver next year, Alonso is the better bet. Not nice for Button, but F1 isn't a nice business. In a couple of years, McLaren might be able to go back to having two top tier drivers again, but next year they'll be developing the Honda package and may not be competing anywhere near the top, so Button loses out.

 

[caLLous]

Common sense prevails. No more standing safety car restarts, no more double-points and no restrictions on what can be said over the radio.

 

[Corran]

Alonso is a better driver than Button, simple as that. Don't get me wrong, I think Button is an excellent driver, but if McLaren can only afford one top flight driver next year, Alonso is the better bet. Not nice for Button, but F1 isn't a nice business. In a couple of years, McLaren might be able to go back to having two top tier drivers again, but next year they'll be developing the Honda package and may not be competing anywhere near the top, so Button loses out.

Alonso is definately the better driver, but to be Kevin aint gonna get them a lot of points unless they have a car that is much better then the others. He has shown this season that he doesn't quite have that ability level for one the top teams. It really does depend what they looking to get out of it currently, just bide time till they manage to get a good car or just scrape by in the best of the rest with 1 top driver. Unfortunately I think it will be the later, lets just be the best of the rest as we can't stand up to Mercedes (and possibly Redbull/ferrari).

I actually kinda think at this point Button will tell them to stuff any offer up their ass if they come to him now as this has been ridiculous.

 

[Bodhi]

Common sense prevails. No more standing safety car restarts, no more double-points and no restrictions on what can be said over the radio.

Excellent. Now they just need to bring back refuelling (drivers going on economy runs is about as tedious as it gets), ditch the awful engines, make tyres that can last more than 3 laps and get some drivers with some semblance of a personality (apart from Kimi and JB, the rest are drones), and it might be worth watching again. As it is, I still haven't made it all the way through a race this season as it's got so fucking dull.

 

[Scouse]

Excellent. Now they just need to bring back refuelling (drivers going on economy runs is about as tedious as it gets), ditch the awful engines, make tyres that can last more than 3 laps and get some drivers with some semblance of a personality (apart from Kimi and JB, the rest are drones), and it might be worth watching again. As it is, I still haven't made it all the way through a race this season as it's got so fucking dull.

Yeah. Stopped watching seriously a few years back.

It's proper nerfed F1 nowadays. The fact that the pre-race program is more interesting than the race itself says it all.

 

[Olgaline]

He has shown this season that he doesn't quite have that ability level for one the top teams. .

Based on what???
It's his rookie season and he still managed to qualify ahead of button in most races, he's provided the top result for Mclarens season (2'nd) and has for the most part finished
fairly close to Button, again in his rookie season and ahead of f.eks Kimi Räikkönen.(wanna argue that he dosent have what it takes?) add to that the number of questinable penalties he's been handed during the season (likely due to being a rookie)
As for Button? He racked in 12 pts in his first year in F1.

Dont get me wrong, I get why a british person would prefer to see Button in the second seat, and that's ok
but what a load of moronic bullSh*! that was! You kinda remind me of a notoriouse BoxingNews24.com "reporter" Scott Gilfoid

 

[Jupitus]

Based on what???
<snip> and has for the most part finished fairly close to Button <snip>

Sorry, but that 126 points vs 55. I understand where you are coming from, but I don't think it is fair to say Kmag has challenged JB this season.

 

[Moriath]

Excellent. Now they just need to bring back refuelling (drivers going on economy runs is about as tedious as it gets), ditch the awful engines, make tyres that can last more than 3 laps and get some drivers with some semblance of a personality (apart from Kimi and JB, the rest are drones), and it might be worth watching again. As it is, I still haven't made it all the way through a race this season as it's got so fucking dull.

Actually the engines this year have made it interesting racing. Lots of overtaking etc and the under cutting etc on tyre strats was quite good. I think they should be able to use more than 100kg of fuel tho.

 

[Olgaline]

Sorry, but that 126 points vs 55. I understand where you are coming from, but I don't think it is fair to say Kmag has challenged JB this season.

Well, Yes and No tbh...
Looking back at some of the penalties he has recived during the season, then it might well have looked a lot different, add to that some bad luck here and there, well.......
Now on the other hand, it's clear that some of that bad luck is due to inexperience, and situations that an experienced driver (f.exp. Button) wont allow themselves to end up in, would be a fair argument.

So yes, Button was better this season, but the point difference alone dosent nessersarily show the true scale of difference between the two. (as in Kmag could very easily have racked in a lot more points than he ended up with)

And tbh, I find it highly unlikely that anyone would be saying that Kmag cant cut it, or that he had a bad season if it wasn't for that little fact, that Buttons seat was taken by Alonso.

Oh and that last race the team screwed him over pulling him despite having good tires.

 

[Olgaline]

I'd actually be more inclined to ask Why Alonso? Sure he's good, might also be slighly better than Button,
but NOT by the margin of pay that they seem willing to throw after him. (if the rumors are true) and age wise they are more or less at the same stage..
especially concidering that both Button and Mag seem happy with eachother.

 

[Jupitus]

I actually think Kmag has had a decent season, and has done well for a newcomer, but for me it's not so much about that. For McClaren to get right back up there, signing Alonso is a great move as he is most certainly one of the top 3/4 drivers in the sport. My point though is that JB is still very fit, very motivated and a very good driver. He has experience both with dealing with Honda and assessing a car's relative performance to give the team guidance. He would be a better driver as the team migrates to Honda power and would keep Alonso more 'honest'.

Again, it's nothing against Kmag

 

[Olgaline]

Indeed, I wont argue with that, but beeing danish and all, I hope Kmag stays

 

[Jupitus]

Superb from Team Lotus:

http://www.lotusf1team.com/news-archive/if-the-e22-could-tweet/

 

[caLLous]

Yay Button.

 

[ECA]

Whoop Whoop.

 

[Embattle]

Yay Button.

Agreed but the whole process sucked.

 

[CorNokZ]

No doubt they did the right thing choosing Button. He is the right choice and KMag is for the future

 

[CorNokZ]

Why'd you disagree @Olgaline ? Button has been better throughout the season with better Qs and more points.. If they can afford him, of course they should stick with Button.

I'd much rather have KMag in the seat but he's 22 or something. His time will come

 

[caLLous]

Because Danish.

 

[Olgaline]

Why'd you disagree @Olgaline ? Button has been better throughout the season with better Qs and more points.. If they can afford him, of course they should stick with Button.

I'd much rather have KMag in the seat but he's 22 or something. His time will come

It's not so much about choosing Button, as it is about choosing two "old" guys...Whích I might add neither Eric Boullier nore Ron Dennis saw as ideal (and I tend to agree). They wanted a youth/experience setup, especially R. Dennis made no effort to hide that fact, in the end it came down to politics, Honda and Mansour Ojjeh wanted something else, and they got it. - oh and as for Q's you might want to re-check that little fact and you could add in the detail that Kmag has had the best rookie season since ,well ..T. Hamilton

Kevin Magnussen 8.21 04 08 09 15 15 08 12 06 05 04 10 07 05 09 07 06 08 07 11
Jenson Button 8.47 11 10 07 12 08 12 09 12 03 11 07 10 06 11 08 04 07 05 08

 

[caLLous]

The question boiled down to whether Magnussen was the right driver to be the the youth part of the "youth/experience setup" and they evidently didn't think so. Jenson's on a one year contract, he's taken a 50% pay-cut to still be there, they will surely revisit the idea in 12 months.

And facepalm all you want but you fawn over Eriksen in the football thread in exactly the same way.

 

[Olgaline]

The question boiled down to whether Magnussen was the right driver to be the the youth part of the "youth/experience setup" and they evidently didn't think so.

Eric Boullier and Ron Dennis would disagree, and as for Fawning....comming from Mr.TeamUK.............../Meh
As for Eriksen, I've been prooven way past right, that's the simple truth of that, me being danish has had little to do with it. You being British however clearly has an impact on your views...funny how that turned out eh?

How I do love being right though

And facepalm all you want .

ok

 

[CorNokZ]

Ok, so in the Q Kevin has been just slightly better. And how has he used this advantage? Not very well seeing as Button ended up with more points than him. Button 33 iirc and a former champion. Kevin is inexperienced in F1 and has proven to still make some wrong decisions.

 

[ECA]

I'm happy it's button because we get to see Button vs Alonso in the same car, it'll be a great driver battle to watch while lewis gets WDC #3

 

[Olgaline]

Ok, so in the Q Kevin has been just slightly better. And how has he used this advantage?

He hasnt, likely due to inexperience, and also some simple old school bad luck. and yet again, lets not forget that little important fact, this was his first year in F1. MAtching and even slightly bettering a veteran, a pretty neat accomplishment imo, no?

Kevin is inexperienced in F1 and has proven to still make some wrong decisions.

Oh, definitely and I don't think anyone would argue against the fact that Button atm is a better driver...15 or is it 16 years in F1 is quite an achivement, add a Championships in 2009 to that, and you have a true legend.
But do McLaren believe that Button is still capable to competing at the top 3-5 level? I'd venture a guess that says they don't, thus why they signed with Alonso, maybe expecting Button to pullout/retire, he didnt.

That left them in abit of a pickle with Boullier and Dennis with one vision and Honda and Ojjeh with another, it fell out to the latter...is it worse?
sort term, not in the slightest, just different, maybe even abit stronger, in the long run? who knows...

 

[caLLous]

He didn't match or better him though, that was already covered. Qualifying doesn't get you points and points don't get your manufacturer any money. Like @ECA says, Alonso vs Button is going to be something special. Don't write Button off, I can see that battle being a lot closer than you seem to think it will be. Certainly a lot closer than Alonso vs Magnussen would be, and that will net the team more points. It's a no-brainer really.

You don't have to be butthurt because your countryman was rejected, he is a quality driver and he will feature in F1 in the future.

 

[Olgaline]

My opinion, they would have been better off with Alonso or Button in one seat and Kmag or another youngster in the other, but thats a matter of opinion, and thus why I disageed with your post

 

[caLLous]

"Kmag or another youngster" Yeah, right. That's the first I've heard of "or another youngster".