News Teacher faces action for photos

[Imgormiel]

Facts? Check them

Charles II leaves the country, and that's where we got parliament recognised as the full representative of the country and the monarchy as its secondary figure head. Try reading up more on the political constitution that we have first ;p

 

[Gorbachioo]

As a point I reiterated earlier, I'm a teacher anyways, and I wouldn't have done what she did if I had a nice body etc, but.....

May I ask Gorb, are you defending your 'role model' point of view just because very few others in this thread are and you want some reaction?

It is unlike you to be so exceedingly naive as this. You seem to believe the view here of 'black & white' in terms of relative morality. Not one profession you have named, such as a judge, teacher OR member of the armed services deals in absolutism. Let's see:



EVERYONE should follow the law, it is just for judges to uphold it - nothing in their legal brief says they must be a paragon of virtue. Neither is it true of a soldier, the rules for their civilian life are governed by their living status (on base etc.) as much as their profession I think.

And never said that teachers should do whatever they like - he was merely talking from a point of law. Nowhere in his post did he actually condone it.



Nobody is ever expected to live beyond others' standards. To aspire to do so is one thing, but there is no expectation there because that doesn't and never will fit a job description.



Why wouldn't I want a Tesco worker to set an example, such as doing a good job? That's just being fucking snobby. Some people like, enjoy, and particularly for some acute learning diasability affected people holding down such a job is a real achievement and I look up to them for that. Your comment there is offensive although I recognise you might not have wanted it to come off as such.

Yes changing sex although in the state of the world today is considered odd and unnatural by many, but why may I ask is having a sex change not respectable? You have chosen the most obscure example compared to some lady showing off her body which is deemed reasonable by many - do people remember Melinda Messenger for getting her tits out? Not really; she's gone on to do lots of mainstream programs and events, and when people found she had tits AND a brain (having a degree etc.) it was all of a sudden ok, why not the other way round?



You said basically here that those in responsibility that people look on as a position of respect that they can't smoke, drive 'wrong' cars and should do more charity work then they shouldn't do the job? That, as I said somewhere near the top of this post (sorry it's so long folks!) is VERY naive.

You aren't allowed to speak on behalf of everyone. That's the point of a forum bud. Personal views, so don't give this shit about others not being liberal and that's why it's wrong.



Agreed Toh!

May I ask Gorb, have you ever been a Teacher, Judge or Member of the Armed Services? I'd be interested on your perspective if you have been.

Yes. Im talking on this forum because i want YOUR attention. Thats right.

Again, your talking about the law/job requirements. Im not interested in those because i know they dont say anything what im talking about here. An army officer might not be required to behave in a certain way by his employment contract but you know just as well as i do that certain things are not accepted for them. I dont know what the consequences are but a higher officer will not look kindly if an officer attends gay orgies on his free time.

From this we can come to the conclusion that yes certain people can be expected to live above the current moral standards because it is acceptable for a tesco worker to attend a gay orgy on his free time whereas it is not for an army officer. (even though his job description may not have pointed that out) Oh and btw, please dont focus on the gay orgy example. Im not here to discuss what exactly is breaking boundaries and what isnt. Just who is allowed to do so.

In a perfect world tesco workers would set an example to the rest of us but in reality you know that, while some of them might, it is in no way required of them and it shows. The sex change thing was just an example. If we start arguing is it accepted or not it'll just be a waste of time.

The smoking thing/charity etc is besides the point. Once again: i dont want to talk about what exactly is pushing the boundaries and what isnt. Im just saying that certain people should not do that. Posing for sexy pictures is pushing the boundaries and therefore teachers should not do that.

The reason why im talking on behalf of other people is that i am a moral relativist. I would not condemn her even if she had been caught fucking a horse. So obviously my moral standards can not be used in this discussion because they are not even close to the average.


And no. I have never been any of those things. I just finished school and now im studying to get in to university. Im also training to get in to special forces because i want to keep the door open to become an army officer. Im not sure will i, but as i said, i want to keep the option on the table as long as possible.

edit: probably worth reminding that finland has a conscript army. So im going to have do army time anyway.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Gorb i think many of your views and opinions shown on this forum are not good for an army officer. You should not become one.

Also you can't talk on behalf of other people. You can say what you feel is right, but you are not the voice of majority.

That's like me saying "i speak on behalf of the muslim majority 'cause i relate to them".

 

[Gorbachioo]

Gorb i think many of your views and opinions shown on this forum are not good for an army officer. You should not become one.

Also you can't talk on behalf of other people. You can say what you feel is right, but you are not the voice of majority.

That's like me saying "i speak on behalf of the muslim majority 'cause i relate to them".

Oh look. Tohtori has a bitter comment to share. Shocking!

If ones capabilities are measured by what he writes anonymously on internet forums then i think its justified to say that you're not even qualified to pick up my garbage.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Oh look. Tohtori has a bitter comment to share. Shocking!

If ones capabilities are measured by what he writes anonymously on internet forums then i think its justified to say that you're not even qualified to pick up my garbage.

It's not bitter.

You judge the teacher and tell she's not fit for work as such due to semi-naked photos.

I say you're not fit to be an officer due to your opinions.

Same difference i believe, or do you want to change your view?

And no, i'm not qualified to pick up your garbage as i don't work in nuclear waste disposal and your underwear is consider atleast level 4.

 

[Fuggz]

A number of my family are teachers. Not me as I can't stand bloody kids a lot of the time. Anyways that is beside the point. A teacher's role doesn't stop when the home bell rings. It is a massive responsibility and a teacher's character and behaviour both in school grounds and out of it are always under scrutiny. Don't forget a teacher has responsibilities not just to the school governer but to children's parents - social workers etc. They must set an example and appearing in dodgy model shots is very questionable as it shows a lack of understanding and concern for her pupils. Young men at around 14 and above are full of testosterone and get sexually exited at the slightest thing. Hell if I had seen them shots when I was in school I wouldn't be able to do bugger all bar for fantasize about them all day. A teacher's first and foremost concern should be for the pupils.

Lots of teachers have other means of making dosh but to appear in dodgy modelling shots or similar isn't really acceptable in the UK. As we all know dodgy modelling shots is but a slight step from much more revealing shots. Nothing but a titillation. Who knows where she will take it?

Is there a box I can stand on somewhere?

 

[kiliarien]

Yes. Im talking on this forum because i want YOUR attention. Thats right.

Again, your talking about the law/job requirements. Im not interested in those because i know they dont say anything what im talking about here. An army officer might not be required to behave in a certain way by his employment contract but you know just as well as i do that certain things are not accepted for them. I dont know what the consequences are but a higher officer will not look kindly if an officer attends gay orgies on his free time.

From this we can come to the conclusion that yes certain people can be expected to live above the current moral standards because it is acceptable for a tesco worker to attend a gay orgy on his free time whereas it is not for an army officer. (even though his job description may not have pointed that out) Oh and btw, please dont focus on the gay orgy example. Im not here to discuss what exactly is breaking boundaries and what isnt. Just who is allowed to do so.

In a perfect world tesco workers would set an example to the rest of us but in reality you know that, while some of them might, it is in no way required of them and it shows. The sex change thing was just an example. If we start arguing is it accepted or not it'll just be a waste of time.

The smoking thing/charity etc is besides the point. Once again: i dont want to talk about what exactly is pushing the boundaries and what isnt. Im just saying that certain people should not do that. Posing for sexy pictures is pushing the boundaries and therefore teachers should not do that.

The reason why im talking on behalf of other people is that i am a moral relativist. I would not condemn her even if she had been caught fucking a horse. So obviously my moral standards can not be used in this discussion because they are not even close to the average.

And no. I have never been any of those things. I just finished school and now im studying to get in to university. Im also training to get in to special forces because i want to keep the door open to become an army officer. Im not sure will i, but as i said, i want to keep the option on the table as long as possible.

edit: probably worth reminding that finland has a conscript army. So im going to have do army time anyway.

Did I say you just wanted my attention? Stop being petty and attempting to divert the topic - that's on a par with 'your mum' jokes.

Your precepts are flawed in ways. You argue you speak for the majority because that's what 'they' would say - that's not relativism, that's absolutism; you are defining what others find acceptable. Which isn't your right.

Secondly you don't want to define the boundaries of acceptability just say that people in certain employment shouldn't break them?? How for fucks sake, can you comment on the breaking of boundaries if you yourself cannot determine them and make your own argument? You have clearly stated that they shouldn't break boundaries - but why not? Sometimes changing those cultural positions isn't entirely bad. In this case, can't she be a woman with a great body AND educated? Oh no, she's either an educator OR something to be lusted after. The line is dubious I grant you and I wouldn't have done what she did, but that doesn't mean she can't or shouldn't do it.

Stick to your guns and fight your point that you found it wrong, don't fanny about with backtracking and sidestepping.

Your weird ass idea of army/officer respect is a little skewed - like most developed nations you'll find now more apathy and despair than respect in such thankless professions (including teachers, police etc.) unless you can get the press to frenzy up some support.

Good luck if you indeed go into the army btw - and have a blast at Uni ofc

 

[old.Tohtori]

Good luck if you indeed go into the army btw - and have a blast at Uni ofc

Those two lines have a very very funny joke in them in that order

 

[Mey]

Charles II leaves the country, and that's where we got parliament recognised as the full representative of the country and the monarchy as its secondary figure head. Try reading up more on the political constitution that we have first ;p

but you admit, I was right, right?!

 

[kiliarien]

Those two lines have a very very funny joke in them in that order

I'm glad someone got it - they get missed too often on here.

 

[Gorbachioo]

Did I say you just wanted my attention? Stop being petty and attempting to divert the topic - that's on a par with 'your mum' jokes.

Your precepts are flawed in ways. You argue you speak for the majority because that's what 'they' would say - that's not relativism, that's absolutism; you are defining what others find acceptable. Which isn't your right.

Secondly you don't want to define the boundaries of acceptability just say that people in certain employment shouldn't break them?? How for fucks sake, can you comment on the breaking of boundaries if you yourself cannot determine them and make your own argument? You have clearly stated that they shouldn't break boundaries - but why not? Sometimes changing those cultural positions isn't entirely bad. In this case, can't she be a woman with a great body AND educated? Oh no, she's either an educator OR something to be lusted after. The line is dubious I grant you and I wouldn't have done what she did, but that doesn't mean she can't or shouldn't do it.

Stick to your guns and fight your point that you found it wrong, don't fanny about with backtracking and sidestepping.

Your weird ass idea of army/officer respect is a little skewed - like most developed nations you'll find now more apathy and despair than respect in such thankless professions (including teachers, police etc.) unless you can get the press to frenzy up some support.

Good luck if you indeed go into the army btw - and have a blast at Uni ofc

My "petty" comment was a response to your retarded comment. You dont get to mock me for that.

Why is it wrong for me to say what the majority of people find acceptable or not? I dont get it.

I see no reason to define the boundaries of acceptability because all cultures have their own and they change trough time. Whats forbidden now might very well be acceptable in 10 years. Those boundaries need to pushed constantly but it should not be done by people who need to be respected because more often than not pushing those boundaries is met with contempt.

The reason why such professions as police officers, teachers and army officers arent respected anymore (they all used to be) is probably mostly because their pay check is so small, but im absolutely confident that the lack of self respect has played a big part in it too. Because members of these professions dont respect their own profession they dont demand enough from themselves which then makes the professions even less respected. Being an officer used to something to be proud of and they acted like it. Now its just another job among others so they dont demand as much from themselves as they should. Obviously the same applies to teachers.

Its a shame. These days we have no one to look up to and it shows. Thats why kids are such ignorant pricks who only respect even dummer celebrities. We just dont demand anything from ourselves anymore.

 

[kiliarien]

My "petty" comment was a response to your retarded comment. You dont get to mock me for that.

Your comment WAS petty - you claimed my argument had undertones saying you were posting solely for me. Which is just shit - you claim my entire post is retarded? Oh dear, you really are just a little boy aren't you?

I see no reason to define the boundaries of acceptability because all cultures have their own and they change trough time. Whats forbidden now might very well be acceptable in 10 years. Those boundaries need to pushed constantly but it should not be done by people who need to be respected because more often than not pushing those boundaries is met with contempt.

If anyone should push boundaries it SHOULD be the people who are respected - else status quo occurs, which generally isn't good.

The reason why such professions as police officers, teachers and army officers arent respected anymore (they all used to be) is probably mostly because their pay check is so small, but im absolutely confident that the lack of self respect has played a big part in it too. Because members of these professions dont respect their own profession they dont demand enough from themselves which then makes the professions even less respected. Being an officer used to something to be proud of and they acted like it. Now its just another job among others so they dont demand as much from themselves as they should. Obviously the same applies to teachers.

This is entriely offensive - you insult those of ALL four of these professions because they aren't paid as much as others? You claim they have a lack of self respect in their jobs and you go even further by saying they aren't demanding enough of themselves and so, by inference, are doing a poor job?

Where is your experience on these matters? Have you ever been a member of any of these professions to which you can claim a sensible point of view from being within that profession? No, so kindly stfu.

I don't often go this far, but here we go - you my friend are an inexperienced, self-righteous and clearly pretentious twat.

 

[Access Denied]

Why is it wrong for me to say what the majority of people find acceptable or not? I dont get it.

Clearly you are an idiot. It's wrong for you to say what the majority of people find acceptable because unless you can read the mind of every single person on this planet, you haven't got the first fucking clue what the majority of people think.

You don't find it acceptable so you try to make out that everyone else shares your opnions. Grow up.

 

[Gorbachioo]

Your comment WAS petty - you claimed my argument had undertones saying you were posting solely for me. Which is just shit - you claim my entire post is retarded? Oh dear, you really are just a little boy aren't you?

If anyone should push boundaries it SHOULD be the people who are respected - else status quo occurs, which generally isn't good.

This is entriely offensive - you insult those of ALL four of these professions because they aren't paid as much as others? You claim they have a lack of self respect in their jobs and you go even further by saying they aren't demanding enough of themselves and so, by inference, are doing a poor job?

Where is your experience on these matters? Have you ever been a member of any of these professions to which you can claim a sensible point of view from being within that profession? No, so kindly stfu.

I don't often go this far, but here we go - you my friend are an inexperienced, self-righteous and clearly pretentious twat.

"May I ask Gorb, are you defending your 'role model' point of view just because very few others in this thread are and you want some reaction?"

I was responding to this. How was my response not justified? And why the hell did you even start with the insults?

Sometimes boundaries need to pushed by everyone. In my opinion this is not one of those cases. It is not a responsibility of teachers to make posing for sexy pics acceptable. Let the soft porn models worry about that.

In todays society professions are valued more if they earn more money. Thats just how it is. And they do have a lack of self respect. This is exactly what you said earlier:

"like most developed nations you'll find now more apathy and despair than respect in such thankless professions (including teachers, police etc.) unless you can get the press to frenzy up some support."

Just to make this clear: im not saying that teachers/cops arent working hard enough. Im saying that they dont demand enough from themselves as people. Which is why many of them dont even deserve the respect they used to have. It wasnt about working hard, it was about being the examples. And again, i havent been any of these things. But i have attended school for 12 years. That should give some experience about teachers dont you think?

I never start with the insults if no one else does but since you did: You need to man up.

Clearly you are an idiot. It's wrong for you to say what the majority of people find acceptable because unless you can read the mind of every single person on this planet, you haven't got the first fucking clue what the majority of people think.

You don't find it acceptable so you try to make out that everyone else shares your opnions. Grow up.

Im sure this news to you but you can find out other peoples opinions without being able to read their minds. Its called communication. As i said i dont give a flying fuck but i understand the reality. And that is that many people do.

Again. WHAT THE FUCK IS IT WITH THE INSULTS? for crying out loud. Grow up you goddamn immature little wankers.

 

[kiliarien]

"May I ask Gorb, are you defending your 'role model' point of view just because very few others in this thread are and you want some reaction?"

I was responding to this. How was my response not justified? And why the hell did you even start with the insults?

I was asking a question. Calm down. No insult in that.

Sometimes boundaries need to pushed by everyone. In my opinion this is not one of those cases. It is not a responsibility of teachers to make posing for sexy pics acceptable. Let the soft porn models worry about that.

Finally, it's your opinion, not everyone else's - keep to it and don't talk about relativism, social norms etc. You forgot my earlier point about a soft porn model in Britain actually gaining credibility for being a model THEN people found out she was educated - I don't see how the reverse isn't applicable.

In todays society professions are valued more if they earn more money. Thats just how it is. And they do have a lack of self respect. This is exactly what you said earlier:

"like most developed nations you'll find now more apathy and despair than respect in such thankless professions (including teachers, police etc.) unless you can get the press to frenzy up some support."?

Sorry if that sounded unclear - the apathy and despair does come from within the profession, but towards the general public rather than those who are in those professions - teachers (as this is the only frame of reference I can speak within, rather than wildy choosing others Mr 18-year-old) are upbeat and support each other very well. As I am reasonably sure are other civil professions.

Just to make this clear: im not saying that teachers/cops arent working hard enough. Im saying that they dont demand enough from themselves as people. Which is why many of them dont even deserve the respect they used to have. It wasnt about working hard, it was about being the examples. And again, i havent been any of these things. But i have attended school for 12 years. That should give some experience about teachers dont you think?

You are saying they don't try hard enough. If you are saying people in these professions don't demand enough from themselves as PEOPLE, then they don't deserve RESPECT they used to have. That is an utterly judgemental and disgusting comment. What right do you have to judge people in high pressure professions?

I never start with the insults if no one else does but since you did: You need to man up.

Im sure this news to you but you can find out other peoples opinions without being able to read their minds. Its called communication. As i said i dont give a flying fuck but i understand the reality. And that is that many people do.

Again. WHAT THE FUCK IS IT WITH THE INSULTS? for crying out loud. Grow up you goddamn immature little wankers.

You won't talk rationally, you judge everyone it seems according to your moral code, and when someone presents an argument you disagree with you throw your toys out the pram (especially when you spout on about professions you've never even been employed in). Hope you do well at Uni.

Next time I see you, I'll have fries with that.

 

[Access Denied]

Just to make this clear: im not saying that teachers/cops arent working hard enough. Im saying that they dont demand enough from themselves as people. Which is why many of them dont even deserve the respect they used to have. It wasnt about working hard, it was about being the examples.

Bollocks. Obvioulsy there are exceptions but as a whole teachers and cops are a shining fucking example to us all. These people didn't lose respect by not being examples. The lost respect because their power was taken away. Think about it, and this harks back to another thread I posted in, 30 odd years ago (Maybe more) teachers were allowed to physically discipline the kids. Now I'm talking about the cane or a ruler across the knuckles. If you were a twat the local bobby would prod you with his nighstick. They've lost respect because the fear is gone.

Now I'm not saying that fear alone if the source of respect because it isn't and it never will be but it forms a part of the base. Nowadays the most a teacher can do is give you detention and maybe shout at you. Kids these days don't give a flying fornication. It's the same with the Police, they so much as look at someone cross-eyed and they get hauled into the Independant Police Complaints Commission. (Ok maybe a bit of an exaggeration but you get the idea)

We've turned into a society that coddles kids and criminalises the good guys. So much so that kids and criminals can get away with proverbial murder. That's whay they lost respect, not because they don't demand enough of themselves but because they've lost the and yet they go into their jobs knowing the shit that will follow and they do it anyway. They're setting a very good example if you ask me.

 

[Ctuchik]

Im sure this news to you but you can find out other peoples opinions without being able to read their minds. Its called communication. As i said i dont give a flying fuck but i understand the reality. And that is that many people do.

and i suppose you have actually spoken to the majority of the ppl in question?

Again. WHAT THE FUCK IS IT WITH THE INSULTS? for crying out loud. Grow up you goddamn immature little wankers.

you mean like that?

 

[Dreamor]

/vote close thread, started ok but the insults are kind of pointless...

Fact is, she is being singled out for something in her private life... shock horror, it happens to everyone. Lots of company's give warnings to people now for the stuff they do outside of work, heck just this week we all got emails to say NOT to use Facebook at all because whatever we put its seen as the Company putting it down. Working for a school is like working for any 'company' - she represents the company at all times and she made a silly mistake. Had a teacher at my Secondary school years ago was found out to be a male stripper, was hilarious but the guy took it as a joke and nothing was said at the time. I'd imagine he would be nailed to the cross given the way the papers are.

Saying all that, what the school is doing is not right, what people do outside of work is 100% there business. The headmaster made a bad decision, he should have said take some time off or tried to do a better job of covering it up... no, he stands outside with his arms crossed the school getting pictures for the papers/media. Nobby

 

[old.Tohtori]

Why is it wrong for me to say what the majority of people find acceptable or not? I dont get it.

I kind of answered this;

It would be the same as me talking on behalf of the muslim community.

You are as much in a stance to talk about "moral values of the masses" when you have none(according to your post about beastiality), as i do about talking of the muslim way of life as i'm not one.

 

[Gorbachioo]

"May I ask Gorb, are you defending your 'role model' point of view just because very few others in this thread are and you want some reaction?"

I was responding to this. How was my response not justified? And why the hell did you even start with the insults?

I was asking a question. Calm down. No insult in that.

Finally, it's your opinion, not everyone else's - keep to it and don't talk about relativism, social norms etc. You forgot my earlier point about a soft porn model in Britain actually gaining credibility for being a model THEN people found out she was educated - I don't see how the reverse isn't applicable.

Sorry if that sounded unclear - the apathy and despair does come from within the profession, but towards the general public rather than those who are in those professions - teachers (as this is the only frame of reference I can speak within, rather than wildy choosing others Mr 18-year-old) are upbeat and support each other very well. As I am reasonably sure are other civil professions.

You are saying they don't try hard enough. If you are saying people in these professions don't demand enough from themselves as PEOPLE, then they don't deserve RESPECT they used to have. That is an utterly judgemental and disgusting comment. What right do you have to judge people in high pressure professions?

You won't talk rationally, you judge everyone it seems according to your moral code, and when someone presents an argument you disagree with you throw your toys out the pram (especially when you spout on about professions you've never even been employed in). Hope you do well at Uni.

Next time I see you, I'll have fries with that.

Im wondering do you understand what im talking about here when i say self respect..

A well paid businessman considers him to be "above" the masses because of what he is and therefore expects certain things from himself like being a respectable person in general. A truck driver doesnt think like this. He might, and he should, ask more from himself but he doesnt feel the need to do simply because of his profession. My point is that teachers used to be like the rich businessmen of today. They used to think that because of their profession certain things were required of them and they acted like it. But now they are like the truck drivers i mentioned. They no longer see their profession as something that demands more from them as people.

And yes. It is MY opinion that making sexy pics more acceptable is not a teachers responsibility. If thats the only thing we disagree on then we can end this discussion. (And i'll join you when you march the streets for your right to wear nothing but a thong in public)

 

[old.Tohtori]

Im wondering do you understand what im talking about here when i say self respect..

A well paid businessman considers him to be "above" the masses because of what he is and therefore expects certain things from himself like being a respectable person in general. A truck driver doesnt think like this. He might, and he should, ask more from himself but he doesnt feel the need to do simply because of his profession. My point is that teachers used to be like the rich businessmen of today. They used to think that because of their profession certain things were required of them and they acted like it. But now they are like the truck drivers i mentioned. They no longer see their profession as something that demands more from them as people.

That actually makes you sound like YOU think truck drivers have no self respect because their job is "less" then a business mans.

That again comes to personal opinion.

 

[Gorbachioo]

Bollocks. Obvioulsy there are exceptions but as a whole teachers and cops are a shining fucking example to us all. These people didn't lose respect by not being examples. The lost respect because their power was taken away. Think about it, and this harks back to another thread I posted in, 30 odd years ago (Maybe more) teachers were allowed to physically discipline the kids. Now I'm talking about the cane or a ruler across the knuckles. If you were a twat the local bobby would prod you with his nighstick. They've lost respect because the fear is gone.

Now I'm not saying that fear alone if the source of respect because it isn't and it never will be but it forms a part of the base. Nowadays the most a teacher can do is give you detention and maybe shout at you. Kids these days don't give a flying fornication. It's the same with the Police, they so much as look at someone cross-eyed and they get hauled into the Independant Police Complaints Commission. (Ok maybe a bit of an exaggeration but you get the idea)

We've turned into a society that coddles kids and criminalises the good guys. So much so that kids and criminals can get away with proverbial murder. That's whay they lost respect, not because they don't demand enough of themselves but because they've lost the and yet they go into their jobs knowing the shit that will follow and they do it anyway. They're setting a very good example if you ask me.

I completely agree with you. Only it is not the only reason. Surely you agree that there are other reasons aswell?

Again, when i say "lack of self respect" and "dont demand enough from themselves" try to understand what i really mean by that. Ive explained it.

and i suppose you have actually spoken to the majority of the ppl in question?

you mean like that?

No i have not talked to the majority of man kind. Obviously.. -,- Ive talked to enough people to have a clear idea what their moral standards are.

If you dont feel qualified to say what other people think about things like this then you need to get out more. You obviously havent talked to a lot of people.

I kind of answered this;

It would be the same as me talking on behalf of the muslim community.

You are as much in a stance to talk about "moral values of the masses" when you have none(according to your post about beastiality), as i do about talking of the muslim way of life as i'm not one.

Why the hell would it be the same? Im talking on behalf of MY community. not the Muslim community. Obviously i know what my community thinks about things better than what the muslim community does.

And i dont need to share their moral values to know and understand them. Why would i?

 

[old.Tohtori]

Why the hell would it be the same? Im talking on behalf of MY community. not the Muslim community. Obviously i know what my community thinks about things better than what the muslim community does.

And i dont need to share their moral values to know and understand them. Why would i?

You can't speak on behalf of a community that you don't share ideals and morals with.

If you're going to talk on behalf of someone, you need to be part of them. Otherwise you're guessing on behalf of them.

Not to mention, most people on THIS community for example accept that a teacher can do whatever the f*ck she wants on her free time. So you saying "community doesn't like it" is wrong to begin with.

 

[Gorbachioo]

That actually makes you sound like YOU think truck drivers have no self respect because their job is "less" then a business mans.

That again comes to personal opinion.

Do you misunderstand me on purpose..? -,-

Im not saying truck drivers have no self respect. Im saying that their profession is not the source of it. And yes. it is MY opinion that truck drivers are one of those people who do not consider their job to important enough that it would demand something from them as people. We dont have to talk about it though because it was just an example. You can replace that with any low paying little respected job. (Unless ofcourse you're arguing that all work is considered equal, in which case we can end this debate)

 

[old.Tohtori]

Do you misunderstand me on purpose..? -,-

Im not saying truck drivers have no self respect. Im saying that their profession is not the source of it. And yes. it is MY opinion that truck drivers are one of those people who do not consider their job to important enough that it would demand something from them as people. We dont have to talk about it though because it was just an example. You can replace that with any low paying little respected job. (Unless ofcourse you're arguing that all work is considered equal, in which case we can end this debate)

I am actually saying every job is equal considering the whole community.

Without thesh*tdrivers, we would have stinky apartments. Without the burgerflippers, we wouldn't have burger joints. Without the waiters the business man would eat on a full table of paltes and without the "monkey" in the back doing the dishes, he'd be doing it with sh*t covered cutlery.

Like i said, it's your presonal stance that other jobs are "better" in the eyes of the respect level.

Like i said, you think truckdrivers think of themselves as "haulers of crap" whos only job is to scratch their arse and talk about boobs. they actually have quite a good pride in their job, know it's important and do a lot more for the community then is credited to them.

 

[Gorbachioo]

You can't speak on behalf of a community that you don't share ideals and morals with.

If you're going to talk on behalf of someone, you need to be part of them. Otherwise you're guessing on behalf of them.

Why? Explain this to me, im dying to hear it. Why cant i speak on behalf of a community if i know what they think? And why am i not able to know what they think if i dont share their views? For example, i dont hate gay people but i know that some people do. Why cant i speak on behalf of these people?

Not to mention, most people on THIS community for example accept that a teacher can do whatever the f*ck she wants on her free time. So you saying "community doesn't like it" is wrong to begin with.

Thats true. Either this is a very liberal forum or then many here arent being honest about this because they've been taught that everything that concerns sexuality should be tolerated. Im absolutely confident that 99% of us have no problem with sexy pictures but im also confident that many, if not most, of the people here would have a problem with seeing a soft porn model as an authority. And this goes for me too. I said im a moral relativist and i mean it, but tolerance is different than respect. And even though on a conscious level i know this should not affect my thinking, it does.

By saying this i just destroyed any hope of ever reaching an understanding because from now on you'll just focus on the last line of what i said. But im finally starting to realise that people on this forum arent that interested in learning new ideas, they just want to win debates. So go on, make the most of it. Tell us how liberal and open minded you are how you sooo disapprove such narrow mindedness that ive shown!

 

[old.Tohtori]

Why? Explain this to me, im dying to hear it. Why cant i speak on behalf of a community if i know what they think? And why am i not able to know what they think if i dont share their views? For example, i dont hate gay people but i know that some people do. Why cant i speak on behalf of these people?

BEcause you are not part of those people.

You can guess how they feel, you can guess how they are, but you can't talk on behalf of them.

You can talk for them, guess for them, imagine how they are, but you can't use it as a standpoint.

Thats true. Either this is a very liberal forum or then many here arent being honest about this because they've been taught that everything that concerns sexuality should be tolerated. Im absolutely confident that 99% of us have no problem with sexy pictures but im also confident that many, if not most, of the people here would have a problem with seeing a soft porn model as an authority. And this goes for me too. I said im a moral relativist and i mean it, but tolerance is different than respect. And even though on a conscious level i know this should not affect my thinking, it does.

So what you're saying is that you don't actually know what you feel? Interesting way to discuss something and even more interesting that you claim you can talk on behalf of all the people in our society, when you yourself don't have control over your thoughts.

You're now talking on behalf of THIS community too, even with the community being right here.

You're giving way too much credit to yourself.

By saying this i just destroyed any hope of ever reaching an understanding because from now on you'll just focus on the last line of what i said. But im finally starting to realise that people on this forum arent that interested in learning new ideas, they just want to win debates. So go on, make the most of it. Tell us how liberal and open minded you are how you sooo disapprove such narrow mindedness that ive shown!

I focus on the issue, i suggest you dot he same.

The bold part in your text is called "being a hypocrite" as that's all you ever do.

I don't need to insult you or even insinuate what you are, you show it yourself.

 

[Gorbachioo]

Im not even going to bother replying that. Where would it get me? Thats right. Back to square one!

 

[old.Tohtori]

Im not even going to bother replying that. Where would it get me? Thats right. Back to square one!

If you don't want to discuss the matter, fair enough.

 

[Cerb]

have only read some of the arguments but from what ive seen i kind of have to agree with Gorb.....all her pupils see her on the web with her Baps out then come in the next day and treat her the same? BOLLOX they would tear her to shreds/the classroom would be too rowdy to actully teach them and i think thats what gorb means....if im getting what hes saying right thats the problem....i dont think its fair or illegal but its the way it is.....she shouldnt be legaly be allowed to be punnished but she shouldnt have done this either