Stop calling RvR end game!

[Balbor]

I wish people would stop calling RvR the end game of DAoC. End Game = end of the game, ie when you have finished it, and unless you have leveled up all classes on all realms to L50 RR10, defeaded every dragon, epic mob, DF bosses, finished every quest, raided every dungeon, raided every relic keep and collected all the L51 epic armours (ie caer sidi drops), you still have a way to go befor you can claim you have finished DAOC.

RvR can start at L15, long before you get to L50, and theres a lot more to the game than RvR. Too many people just want the counter strike experiance with an RPG and i think if mythic had wanted that you wouldn't need to level up. If you play DAoC to RvR they stay that, don't just say its the end game. Maybe if people hadn't of PL and BB there 16 characters to L50 and instead PLAYED the game, maybe they would find the game more enjoyable.

 

[old.moriath]

yay

Too true

RvR is just part of the game

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Balbor you don't half set yourself up for it mate.

You should have inc very soon.

 

[klavrynd]

imo exping is boring as fuck and most people play the game for rvr, which seems to be one of the best developed pvp systems on the mmorpg market nowadays. If you fancy seeing much monsters, tons of zones and the loads of other pve fun, everquest might be your game a bit more


as for non 50 rvr, the game only starts at 50 , you can't compare abermenai, thid or any bg to "normal rvr"

 

[~Mobius~]

Originally posted by klavrynd
imo exping is boring as fuck and most people play the game for rvr, which seems to be one of the best developed pvp systems on the mmorpg market nowadays. If you fancy seeing much monsters, tons of zones and the loads of other pve fun, everquest might be your game a bit more


as for non 50 rvr, the game only starts at 50 , you can't compare abermenai, thid or any bg to "normal rvr"

What he said.

 

[ssera]

I remember the time when I took out my lvl 15 SB out to emain (long before any bgs popped up or even DF for that matter..) Also remember my first solo RvR kill against an org Elf, ah the good old days.

I'm positive that Mythic said somewhere right at the start of the game "the frontier zones are extremely dangerous areas and you should only consider exploring them when you reach level 15 minimum." lol, if you see a lvl15 out in RvR, you'll prolly think it's a spy now =/


Anyway, I agree with the poster, RvR is not all there is to the game (but a damn big portion of it might I add )

 

[old.Tzeentch]

Originally posted by Balbor
I wish people would stop calling RvR the end game of DAoC. End Game = end of the game, ie when you have finished it, and unless you have leveled up all classes on all realms to L50 RR10, defeaded every dragon, epic mob, DF bosses, finished every quest, raided every dungeon, raided every relic keep and collected all the L51 epic armours (ie caer sidi drops), you still have a way to go befor you can claim you have finished DAOC.

RvR can start at L15, long before you get to L50, and theres a lot more to the game than RvR. Too many people just want the counter strike experiance with an RPG and i think if mythic had wanted that you wouldn't need to level up. If you play DAoC to RvR they stay that, don't just say its the end game. Maybe if people hadn't of PL and BB there 16 characters to L50 and instead PLAYED the game, maybe they would find the game more enjoyable.

I xp'ed the 'standard' way, make a grp of people from the /who lists, go somewhere to xp.. sometimes get lucky and leech from a guild hunt..

got to 50, and im now nearing rr10

people say im elite!
but i dont have a buffbot, im not rude to people for no reason, i dont steal loot, hoard loot, i participate in pve hunts/raids to help others, and i enjoy rvr..

yes?

RvR _is_ the end game since PvE is formulaic and repetitive.

RvR _can_ be formulaic and repetitive, but it has a large chance of not being that, which makes it better than PvE instantly, and also its against real opponents, which >>>>>>>>>>> PvE

 

[old.Kladen]

there is no end game in this. there is no end, its continous. it only ends when you feel it ends. thats just my point of view

 

[old.Tzeentch]

o
its semantics :x

'end-game' doesnt mean - 'the end of the game where yuo kill teh big baddies to get teh girlz and win'

it is the final state of the game, the pinnacle to where everyone will be playing or doing after they did all the pve

 

[old.anubis]

all mobs are dumb
most of the enemies are not

so rvr _is_ end game, not "the end" but the game itself
levelling to 50 for the first time could be _real_ game
but powerlevelling 5th twink and collecting yet another couple of plats in df for sure is not

 

[Archeon]

In my opinion RvR is the main reason to get to lvl 50, its a big portion of the DAoC 'experience'.

However, at the same time to call it 'end game' is fairly stupid. As you said its not really end untill you hit RR10, and there are some PvE aspects of the game which are just as enjoyable as RvR if you keep an open mind (there are plenty of people that have an 'its new, i fear it, thus its stupid' attitude when it comes to certain things)

Overall - to say RvR isn't part of the end game is just plain stupid. Its the reason people level up. Its the reason there is a level cap, its the reason people go hunt in PvE areas (to get good items to RvR in). but at the same time to say that its only RvR that makes end game is also stupid. You can't have one without the other. if the game were nothing but RvR it would just be another game, if the game were just PvE people would get bored and play somthing else. Try to keep the balance between the two and do what you enjoy (myself - i'm more of a PvE person, but that doesn't mean i don't want to enjoy RvR on occasion)

 

[old.m0000]

RVR is the driving force for most people to put up with killing mindless AI (SNORE) for hours on end. If you did not have rvr at 50 then why bother? - go play EQ

 

[Solid]

I think you completely missed the meaning of the phrase "End Game".

Its not the end as in the completion, finish, done, clocked, nothing left to do part of the game.

End game = poitn where all the boring preparatory part of the game is finished.

In DAoC's case the End game starts at Level 50 with a Spellcrafted or otherwise tinkered Suit, some may even argue at RR5 and Level 50.

That is imo the end game, ie a point where you are on a par with the MAJORITY of other players in the game, on a level to COMPETE in RvR.

 

[svartmetall]

Originally posted by klavrynd
imo exping is boring as fuck and most people play the game for rvr

IMO endless zerging is boring as fuck too, and that's what RvR can be a lot of the time. One of the things I like most about DAOC is how open-ended it is (in the same way that "Elite" was open-ended), you can do what you want and go where you want - I find the idea that the "point" of levelling is to then go and do RvR gives a very narrow view of such a wide-ranging game.

And to blithely claim that "most people" play the game for RvR is just plain wrong, I know lots of people - lvl 50 and other wise - who actively dislike RvR and avoid it.

 

[tildson]

PvE was fun

*before SC was implemented
*before all SI-quests came
*when glowing weapons and 90% qual was enough
*when you actually could combine exping and item-farming

RvR was most fun

*In beta, in retail

---------------------

In other words, game was a blast in the beginning

 

[old.Gombur Glodson]

Originally posted by tildson


In other words, game was a blast in the beginning

Amen.

 

[Sharma]

Originally posted by tildson

In other words, game was a blast in the beginning

Aye, sad but true

 

[cHodAX]

Originally posted by Solid

In DAoC's case the End game starts at Level 50 with a Spellcrafted or otherwise tinkered Suit, some may even argue at RR5 and Level 50.

That is imo the end game, ie a point where you are on a par with the MAJORITY of other players in the game, on a level to COMPETE in RvR.

agreed

 

[granny]

I thought the term "end game " came from chess where it refers to the closing stage of the game - once the majority of pieces are gone and you're into the last, possibly most difficult part of the game.

That doesn't mean that the rest of the game is worthless or uninteresting or not enjoyable, far from it, it's just a descriptive term that implies that the preparation for the deciding part of the game is done.

In daoc this follows too - in xp'ing & early rvr you're defining your character; the specs you train in, the RA's you get early on, the gear you use. The "end-game" is when your character is relatively completed and you play to test your character's skills & equipment against others. It means neither "game-over" or "game just beginning".

IMO. k?

 

[Flimgoblin]

Originally posted by sharma
Aye, sad but true

such is the nature of all games - I remember when killing filidhs in north black mountains was new and exciting.

No matter how hard you try that will never come back.

The biggest part of the "end-game" for me, is bouncing around Gothwaite harbor (or occasionally Diogel after a Krondon raid) talking to my friends.

Emain? that's not RvR at least not to me. To some it is - fair do's. Nottmoor sieges, that moment the mids breached the gates and we all thought we were dead (half our force released thinking that's it over) and we pulled it back from the brink - that's RvR.

That's the end game.

That or Sidi raids with 30 people, Krondon raids that just can't quite beat Orylle. Whatever is fun after a year of playing is end game.

Those that think it involves sneering at people of lower level/realm rank/whatever have lost something along the way.

 

[iziz]

Originally posted by Balbor
I wish people would stop calling RvR the end game of DAoC. End Game = end of the game, ie when you have finished it

But when you reach level 50 you have finished the game...

Think about it. When you level your character, you are the person who is in control, you decide how your character develops and how he or she does it. You exp, you quest, you solo, you group.

But what happens when you reach 50? You lose that control. You have experienced everything the game has to offer you. It is the point (although previously you do get to dabble in it at various stages like the bgs) where everything changes from that static environment to a dynamic one. You no longer handle mobs or quests in a predictable manner. There is no rule that the enemy realm will come in singles if you are solo, or baf if you're in a group. You cannot take a keep by yourself. You find yourself in a relatively empty area with basic rules. It is from that point on that you make your own game.

Yes there are high level encounters, but they are no different to what you experience as you level, albeit you have to rely on other people too now. RvR is the end of the game whether you like it or not, it is the only non-predictable element of it because it is the only bit that the game does not define.

 

[Whoodoo_RD]

Dunno about you lot, but the only time I will call end game is when there is no one left to make freinds with.

TBH i couldnt give a damn about RvR or PvE compared to having a laff with my m8s, chewing the fat about your weekends adventures in RLworld or just having a laff in general.

Yeah, its a chat room with gfx and a lil game play for me, I like all aspects of the game, hence so many alts, RvR is part of the game, so is PvE, crafting, questing and farming, but it means little without my m8s.

 

[)nick(]

Ok.

End game is RVR!

 

[Jonaldo]

Originally posted by klavrynd
imo exping is boring as fuck and most people play the game for rvr, which seems to be one of the best developed pvp systems on the mmorpg market nowadays. If you fancy seeing much monsters, tons of zones and the loads of other pve fun, everquest might be your game a bit more


as for non 50 rvr, the game only starts at 50 , you can't compare abermenai, thid or any bg to "normal rvr"

go play counterstrike, battlefield, quake, team fortress, unreal tournament if you just want pvp. This is a mmorpg yet so many fucktards don't realise it and play for pure pvp and ignore all adventure/roleplay/gaming aspect.

If I'd have wanted an fps with swords I wouldn't play one that I had to spend hours fighting bots first before going up against other people. Luckily I didn't, so I played an mmorpg, not brainless pvp monkey game that so many think this is.

Normally I agree with you Klav on most points but you spouted utter shit that time, go back to Counterstrike mate if you think that's all this is.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Hmm...i must be the only one who didn't even get to level 30.

Had too much fun trying out classes, doing silly quests, staying in RvR0-1 that i just didn't manage anything past 24.

I still had fun and if i had continued(net went down and so went the habbit of DAoC) i might have a level 50. I wouldn't call level 50 endgame either, or RvR endgame since not everyone tries to get there. Some enjoy the world, hell..stop and smell the flowers before they bash the ultimo dragon on the head with the mallet of overpower, some want that mallet so bad they do it in two days.

Seems this game offers enough for everyone and still leaves graving for those patches. Keeps you hanging on. All in all a good example of how MMORPG's should be done. Don't give all, give some so they stay and wait for more.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Originally posted by Omniscieous
Luckily I didn't, so I played an mmorpg, not brainless pvp monkey game that so many think this is.

Sorry for the doublepost but these things get buried with edits.

Omni, even if this is off-topic, i want to tell that making a point on MMORPG having more then FPS with telling that FPS is brainless isn't the way to go.

Actually if you want a good team in battlefield(my experience), Tribes or even CS you need a good, thinking, working team...just like in MMORPGS. You need that driver, that heavy tank, light assaults and snipers as much as you need a skald, tank, pbaoe'r and such.

Just giving a little defense to the "nobrain" community here.

 

[oldtimer]

>go play counterstrike, battlefield, quake, team fortress, unreal tournament if you just want pvp. This is a mmorpg yet so many fucktards don't realise it and play for pure pvp and ignore all adventure/roleplay/gaming aspect.

Apart from the word fucktards I agree completely with this post. This game only shines when you get a mix of pve, rvr, spending time with your ingame friends etc. If you only focus on one dimension you get a rather narrow game.

 

[Shike]

Endgame for me is:

RvR ofc.

Highend PvEraids.

A successful guild which can make a difference in a realm in the keep/relic-statuses and make an example of what a guild can accomplish with a determined and focused leadership in both PvE and PvE. This is the most important part imo and it kinda surprises me that noone mentiones it tbh.

laters

 

[kr0n]

RvR is the part of the game which distinctively represents the game and separates it from other RPGs. It's just not another RPG with the ability to level up, craft and roleplay, it has RvR. Many games have had PvP but RvR is something totally different.

RvR is the thing they sell the game with. RvR is the main object of the tiresom leveling course, questing and itemhunting.

Different aspects of the game intrigue different people. Some are true crafters, some like to roleplay, some like to hang out with friends and do weird things like hunt Coruscating Mines without any armor. Some prefer RvR.

After you have quested and itemhunted, leveled, what can you do to gain more for your character? You already have the items to cap your stats, you already have level 50... Oh yeah, gain Realm Points to enhance your character, both in RvR and in PvE.

Endgame might be the wrong word for RvR in DAoC. It's more like the objective of all other things. Defending your realm from the 2 other realms.

 

[old.Hardbein]

Originally posted by kr0n
Endgame might be the wrong word for RvR in DAoC. It's more like the objective of all other things. Defending your realm from the 2 other realms.

Well said