Skills in daoc?

[inuyasha]

Now what is skills in this game?

I keep hearing about the leetest of the leetest and the best of the best and alot of people get a reputation to be great players and extremly skillfull...

Where does this come from? I respect that most people is good players of course for reasons like beeing friendly and help and of course know they way around in rvr and know their char..

But is it really THAT much skill that is needed to be learned in this game? This game is definitly of the easiest mmorpg games around. If your a tank, you majorly hit people, if your a mage, you blast. All the skills needed is to be able to get to the right places and keep yourself or your groupies alive, while you kill the right targets. You dont have a huge arsenal of things to choose from, and to know what class to kill first is not really that much of a deal to learn. More or less whatever class you are, your options is so limited it dont demand a lot of skill to master them completly.

I make an clear excpetion for messers and mutliclasses (like: minstrels, bards, healers and maby a few more) which DO have quite alot of different things to choose from, and to be totaly fair, most fights is totaly based on the result of their activities. To switch between runsong and end song while messing and army and lull a running minstrel as well as dodging a backstabber at the same time, demands alot more skill then smack a messed or unmessed albion mage with 7feet spear.

That is mainly why so many claim LA for instance, is really skilled players. I am not saying they dont master what they do, but its not that hard is it? When you have all you need in team, making stuns last for 4 seconds, messes always group purged and resists skyhigh, its not much left for you to do then kill what is of enemies or die from simple outnumberance. This dont demand high skill, it demands a perfect group setup and alot of REALLY active members. LA got both, and are not likely to loose to any one or two groups which miss for instance group purge. Most players who play alot, no matter if they have ever played a mmorgp before at all, would master to take any tank or mages job in one of this teams and do it very well within a short time. (my theory, flame at will but i take any challenge gladly, i have a friend who has not even started yet who would gladly take the challenge)
Again, this would not go for bards and possibly not druids or stealthers either, but as far as i know you dont really use alot of stealthers in your teams?

You start playing, you play a char THAT long, then you know it about as well as you can. Thats my cents, now prove me wrong =)

 

[Wuren]

Im not gonna go deep in to this beacuse it will turn it to a GP whine sooner or later anyway,

but from having playing both a hero and a bard in rvr i can tell you it beats me how fame avoids dying each fight.

 

[inuyasha]

hehe yeah

Originally posted by Wuren
Im not gonna go deep in to this beacuse it will turn it to a GP whine sooner or later anyway,

but from having playing both a hero and a bard in rvr i can tell you it beats me how fame avoids dying each fight.

Having played everything, i really respect those darn musicans, both bards and minchers =) to keep in tag off all those buttons, mess first AND stay alive = /salute

 

[tankster]

(well if a tank would just hit random things .. he would cause alot of problems.. )

best skill in this game is ENJOY !!!

if u can have fun and dont bother other people .. then u are a great player

 

[Fame]

Originally posted by Wuren
Im not gonna go deep in to this beacuse it will turn it to a GP whine sooner or later anyway,

but from having playing both a hero and a bard in rvr i can tell you it beats me how fame avoids dying each fight.

leet skills, that's all.

 

[inuyasha]

yah =)

Originally posted by tankster
(well if a tank would just hit random things .. he would cause alot of problems.. )

best skill in this game is ENJOY !!!

if u can have fun and dont bother other people .. then u are a great player

Agree on first, targeting who you kill was written down as one of the few skills tanks had to learn before they had mastered it =)
Like playing slam the sorc on the poor messed albs

Agree on the enjoy part, that is why i wonder why everyone call LA and alot of other guilds any more leet then the rest =)

 

[inuyasha]

hehe

Originally posted by Fame


leet skills, that's all.

You are one of the few not replaceable people in the LA team from my theory =)

Be overjoyed!

rofl

And...
I need to learn that one day =)
To bad i doubt i will ever bother with any char to get the experience that is demanded to be a bard who have mastered their class =)

 

[AbPoon]

I take it your the same Point who set his chain nuking pet on tanks 10 lvl's higher then him then boasted like feck about it after getting a couple of kills?

Aye Skills in daoc ^^

Anyway skill in tanking? comes down to judging what you can see then picking your target, knowing what to peel and knowing when to support one of your support classes.

In general Hib's could do this fine as with end song going the supports could sprint around none stop giving the tanks time to take the attackers down.
Mids support classes can generally take a beating and could insta themselves so you could afford to finish off the caster your on before supporting.
Albs in general dont protect their support as they think they die too quick.

 

[sorusi]

who to attack, when to attack, what spells to use, what attacks to use,knowing what the nmy will do next, doing it fast... hard to explain tho

 

[scoutguy]

id say alot of it comes down to experiance in RvR this cant be leant overnight really for example class recognition is the very 1st thing you need to get
then from exp in the game you learn who to kill 1st then 2nd then 3rd ect
and funny enough in time you kinda get a good idea what your enemies may do and can counter it a bit if your lucky but like my previous poster says its hard to explain really poon comes pretty close

 

[Garnet]

Originally posted by Fame


leet skills, that's all.

probably hanging near the enchanters so hes protected by the pbaoe

 

[alithiel50]

Originally posted by Wuren
Im not gonna go deep in to this beacuse it will turn it to a GP whine sooner or later anyway,

but from having playing both a hero and a bard in rvr i can tell you it beats me how fame avoids dying each fight.

It's because he runs away if things aren't going his groups way....

And besides, he doesn't always manage to avoid dying...
I know I got him at least once last night in Odin's... Prevent Flight is a fantastic RA!

 

[inuyasha]

heh

Originally posted by AbPoon
I take it your the same Point who set his chain nuking pet on tanks 10 lvl's higher then him then boasted like feck about it after getting a couple of kills?

Aye Skills in daoc ^^

Anyway skill in tanking? comes down to judging what you can see then picking your target, knowing what to peel and knowing when to support one of your support classes.

In general Hib's could do this fine as with end song going the supports could sprint around none stop giving the tanks time to take the attackers down.
Mids support classes can generally take a beating and could insta themselves so you could afford to finish off the caster your on before supporting.
Albs in general dont protect their support as they think they die too quick.

not bragging of it =) (and it was 18 levels, not 10!!! lol)
as you can see, my new enchanter (number 9 yeah ) is named: petkillnoskill mustbechanter...go figure =P
Noob enchanters would not have managed it, but once you know:
Put pet on stay, do not get hit, be able to put pet on passive when your supposed to....thats it for solo encounters with meleers. Tried to solo a 50 healer once....damn he must have had fun =) When he just walked away i was rooted and pet was messed and he had sat around for what, three instant heals and such while /laughing at me, lol

All classes in this game is able to take at least one other class sort easy, enchanters have pure meleers, not much skill involved in that, but darn fun anyways

I was mainly talking about group rvr though, who wins a one on one is basicly decided long before the fight starts by what class they are =)

Anyways, i agree with the list of support classes, to have decent armor and three instaheals DO help alot, and albs do get slaughtered quite a lot as well (do any sorcs ever survive a battle? lol. STOP wearing epic sorcs, they shine out "kill me!" =)

Anyways..
Im not saying this game is really easy
BUT im saying its not THAT hard to learn to master, and no matter how much you play, you dont get ALOT better then the experienced tank or mage next to you =) RR4 or RR9 dont matter much this way =)

 

[Kobold]

There are some skills in DAoC for sure, but it's far from like quake3 etc...like if you leading a group around in RvR it's important that you are able to look around you all the time, and get an overwiev (sp?) of where the enemies are/can be. And if you're group meet another group, everyones desition of what to do count when you tell who win the fight. First off...the mezzing, often the group that manage to mez other group first win, and allso how good the druid is to time GP, minstr SoS etc. And then everyong picking theire targets to blast/hit first, and allso where to stand in the fight...so it sure are lots of skills that matters in DAoC. But it's not that hard, and the most important things don't take so long to learn.


I'm still amazed by Daighs mezzing skills in the early times of DAoC. Where he just ran on his own in emain and served all the albs mezzed to the rest of us....one here and one there all the way from amg to apk. /salute :hat:

 

[Apathy]

Re: heh

Originally posted by inuyasha
do any sorcs ever survive a battle? lol. STOP wearing epic sorcs, they shine out "kill me!" =)

Oh lol shut lol up lol sorcerer lol epic lol is lol the lol same lol as lol wizard lol epic lol

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL!

a.
*

 

[AquArius]

I agree, it's not a game that requires a large skill element, but...

I have played with guys who I consider to be 'good', and guys who I consider to be not so 'good', and believe me, there is a HUGE difference in their play styles - draw ur own conclusions.

I'll give one example of how u could rapidly increase skill levels as far as tanking goes, and that is take away /stick in RvR.
Interesting ?

 

[Apathy]

That would only result in lots of tanks standing with their weapons drawn.

a.
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[stabba4]

dont think anyone above RR3 (90% of RvR ppl?)dont recognise every class, well wardens are abit annoying , thats from mid pov tho our race/class setup prolly makes it slightly harder in other realms :/.
The true skill in daoc is getting people to do what you tell them or do what you are told, altho its pretty much the same in Q3/HL/SC/WC3 or any game thats teambased the main difference is that clans in these games are alot more organised than RvR:ing with random ppl (I mean who whould ever consider TP on a public CS server, or even on a custom WC3/random SC?). Now besides that if you compare the micro/macro aspect of these games and daoc youll see that the skill hardcap is alot lower in daoc, it's obvious that a low hardcap whould attract and make casual gamers stay for a longer period of time since they whould always stand a chance against the powergamers who play 1000h/day and farm all the good stuff, not to mention learning the game alot better. This isnt very surprising either, daoc isnt made to be god's gift to gamers, its ment to make money. I have serious doubts that such things will change until WoW comes, seeing their previous game history and reading interviews with their lead designer im pretty confident that if you want skill this will be your best bet .

 

[AbPoon]

Re: Re: heh

Originally posted by ApathyEndymion


Oh lol shut lol up lol sorcerer lol epic lol is lol the lol same lol as lol wizard lol epic lol

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL!

a.
*

Aye its the same but the spell effects stand out, thats what gets you killed not your epic.

And theres not much you can do about that is there

 

[Apathy]

That spell effects argument is weak. NOONE plays RvR with /effects all. HAL couldn't cope with the lag generated by AoE spells!

If anything, bards are easiest to spot. Especially with lag because the bard is the one running towards you whilst scooping dirt up from the ground...totally amnesiable! Easy.

What gets you killed is mezzing someone puts you in their target window if they don't already have a target. And all casters are regarded as easy RPs anyway.

And, of course, stupid people. Stupid people get you killed all the time.

Tank - "Fear not, Apathy! I am a polearmsman and I can take down this zerker before you die! ~whack~ Ah, it was absorbed! But fear not! The next blow shall surely kill him! Just hang on in there for another 6 seconds, wise sorcerer!"

Me - "FUCK OFF FUCK OFF FUCK OFF FUCK OFF FUCK OFF"

a.
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[Hatt]

Originally posted by ApathyEndymion
NOONE plays RvR with /effects all.

i do?

 

[Apathy]

That would change if someone kidnapped your buffbot and you had to play in a group or play a group-based class.

a.
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[stabba4]

apathy: i got a xp2400 gf3ti200 and 256 ddr at 333 mhz, i always play with effects all, dunno what HAL had tho .
And a sorc is easy to spot, at least i have never heard anyone have problems with it (?).

"Tank - "Fear not, Apathy! I am a polearmsman and I can take down this zerker before you die! ~whack~ Ah, it was absorbed! But fear not! The next blow shall surely kill him! Just hang on in there for another 6 seconds, wise sorcerer!"

Me - "FUCK OFF FUCK OFF FUCK OFF FUCK OFF FUCK OFF"
"
this is just as annoying in mid, tanks never care that they prevent all CC on whatever is bashing you. I think they do this without thinking after 50 lvls of pve , granted some tanks do slam whatever is on you and give you a chance to get away and some really ybar tanks actually whould guard you! this isnt that much of a problem as a healer tho since we can take abit more dmg than a sorc and rarely are without a pbt or 2 .

 

[tankster]

yup i play with effects all

i got windows98

 

[Novamir]

of course daoc involves skill, since there will always be people who are better at playing their char than another (even though they are both as experienced). skill is made up from timing, good prioritisation, awareness of situation and maybe leadership quality.

skill does not mean you have the most RPs. but without skill you won't earn as much as the next person. Skill + teaming(how you group) + playtime = RPs.

there's also certain players which deserve more recognition because their roles are so crucial- eg bards in hib. a good bard will stick right out because it will make or break a group in rvr. getting the combination of click enemy -> amnesia -> mez (two or three times for resists?) -> (purge/demez?) -> end song -> hit sprint -> heal (usually) is not easy

 

[oblivion_6]

I think althought the game basics are simply it takes a good player to understand certain elements.

Such as tanks being capable of handling aggro, healers knowing what lvls of heal to use to keep power high, casters understanding when to nuke and when not too.

Rvr players also introduce strategies such as using your bard to mezz and communicating to the grp not to break the mezz on all targets and for casters to take out stealthers and other mages

Trust me if you end up in a group with bad players youll realise that you can learn skills to be better than other people.

 

[dakeyras]

I mostly play with /effects all unless relic/legion/dragon raid.

As for enemy recognition...this is much easier for Hib/Mid than it is for Alb. Even after playing Mid alot it is still easy to make an initial mistake and have to switch target when fighting Mids.

Hibs are fairly easy to spot once you have rvr'd a bit (except for Wardens) but Mid classes are able to disguise their support very well. Try picking a norse skald carrying a shield from a healer..very difficult unless you know them by name unless you have seen giveaway magic effects. Same goes for troll warrior carrying a small shield standing alongside a shaman. Which do you take out first?

I think the introduction of the Inconnu might create a bit pf confusion for the enemy when facing Alb

 

[Belomar]

Gah, playing with "/effects all" is simply not possibly for us matter cabalists, AoE DoT on 10+ enemies up close is a great way to crash your system. Oops, maybe I shouldn't say something like this in a thread Apathy posts too as well...

 

[Apathy]

Then I shall alter my statement; the majority of players do not play with /effects all. I have two computers and each one has 4 times the recommended spec and 1mbit cable. I can't move around without stuttering graphics, insane lag and so on. And I sure as hell don't have time to look at the feet of casters to see what class they are.

As for skill, of COURSE the game involves skill. Most games do. That's one of the things that makes games interesting and enjoyable; knowing that you are better at something than another person. But what a lot of people consider to be skill is often attributable to a mix of reflexes, luck and game imbalance.

a.
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[Fame]

Originally posted by Novamir

skill does not mean you have the most RPs. but without skill you won't earn as much as the next person. Skill + teaming(how you group) + playtime = RPs.

could not say it any better