second time lucky n00bs?

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Belomar

Guest
Originally posted by Chenuba
What's getting more and more ridiculous in this whine is the talking about morale and "primetime". How come all the whiners can't accept that in a 24/7 game where people actually PAY to be able to log in and play, things can happen at any time and anywhere.
Why should people, who can only play at times outside "primetime", not be doing the same stuff as all the other PAYING players do ???????
Please give me a plausible answer. Please justify to me why people playing OFF "primetime" shouldn't have the same rights to play the game as "primetime" players do. (same price, remember ?).
Well you can't, cause in the end this whining is all about selfrightousness and and selfpity loosing some relics not being able to do shit about it. Life is tough ehhh ? .
All right, let me try and respond, even though I am not Hibernian nor particularly unhappy about them losing two of their power relics. ;)

The thing here was of course not that people who normally play outside of prime time nicked a relic, it was that a whole bunch of Mids set alarm clocks to get up early and get it (i.e. people who usually don't play outside of prime time). While this is perfectly acceptable according to the game mechanics, it's not a particularly fair thing to do. While "fairness" may mean nothing to you, Chenuba, I think it does to a lot of people playing this game. After all, this is a computer game (even though I don't like the "it's just a game" argument), why does it then have to be as cold and "tough" as the rest of our world? :)

People who play outside of prime time are perfectly welcome to grab a relic, IMHO. However, this is a self-regulating thing, as the amount of people in the various realms who plays at this hour should be about equal, so the defending realm should have enough people online in order to be able to raise the alarm and rush to the relic keep whenever an attacking realm has enough to indeed mount a relic raid.
 
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Novo

Guest
A Relic Raid USED to be one of the major challenges a realm had left in game (much like each Realms Dragon). Bringing the majority of a Realm together, in secret and staging an attack involved a lot of skill and in some case a little luck. Planning, marshalling, communication, leadership, timing and speed of execution all totally necessary for even a small chance of success.

To be part of a raid USED to be highly exciting and fully adrenal pumping experience. Just like the first week or so of RvR. Whether successful or not, it WAS a thing of pride for each realm to attack and try their skills against their enemy. For the defenders it also was a thing of pride to counter attack and try and defend against. When a Relic Raid is in progress, the alliance chat is filled with commands and reports, groups drop everything and suddenly the game comes alive for a few hours. A sense of loss if you fail or jubilation if you succeed, Fantastic stuff!

NOW it seems to me some people are trying to make one of the last great things of this game insignificant. There is no honour, skill, challenge or pride to set your alarm clock to 6am and attack a sleeping enemy. To justify it with weak replies of its 24/7 game or its WAR. Are passable excuses but even in WAR people are asked to act with decency and respect. Yes you can attack at 6am as it is a 24/7 game. But expect laughs and mild amusement at your pathetic attempt, highlighting the weakness of your realm and the lack of pride you have in it.

Relic’s are trophies that a realm can hold with pride, for meeting what WAS a significant challenge and a great form of FUN. Please don’t degrade it into an another insignificant and meaningless part of the game, as so much else has become. I what challenges to remain in the game, otherwise there is no point in playing.
 
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Chenuba

Guest
How many late night raids has there been in total on this server ?
NOTHING can justify why people playing on a certain time shouldn't go relic raiding if they were in one of the RARE positions to do it.
About fairness, 1) when has war ever been fair ? (yes I know it's a game, a roleplaying war-game), 2) What's fair in keeping those playing in early hours from relicraiding ?.

None of all those "horrorvisions" all you whiners present every time you lose someway where people outsmarts you (YES, they got the relics), has come true yet.

It's rather nice having the balance thrown a little around now and then. Just makes it all more challenging.
It seems to me like hibs was getting to used to "überspelldamage/effect". So now it's gone, they have to make everyone admit that a dirty trick was pulled on them and will infact be the end of DaoC.
 
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old.Tzeentch

Guest
Originally posted by Chenuba
blah blah i know what you guys are saying as valid arguments, but instead of talking about that, let me present my own personal opinion and say all your opinions suck

quality.
 
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Chenuba

Guest
Originally posted by old.Tzeentch


quality.

Not seen any valid argument yet to why RR should be taking place in specific hours. Only seen some selfpitying whiners keep on TRYING to make their argument valid, without paying any attention to that they've joined a 24/7 game and not all play the same way or want the same from the game and yes I'm an ignorant pain in the ass when people starts to justify themselves beyond stupidity instead of just accept the way things are.

Make GOA make some rules about it if you feel so damned about it.

FACT: As it is now, late night/early morning raids can be done. This are not for discussion as it's possible and not a cheat/break of CoC or other guidelines how to play and behave in DaoC-euroservers
 
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old.Tzeentch

Guest
right, and did you conveniently happy to miss out the bit where i pointed out the very real risk of this sort of stuff killing off the server?

and did you manage to miss out the reasons given as to why, even though it is a 24/7 game, that raids should be kept to prime time?

you appear not to have followed the real discussion at all and want everyone to start all over for you.

how about countering some of the stuff already on the table, cus you haven't really added anything but a +1 to your post count.
 
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Chenuba

Guest
Originally posted by old.Tzeentch
right, and did you conveniently happy to miss out the bit where i pointed out the very real risk of this sort of stuff killing off the server?

and did you manage to miss out the reasons given as to why, even though it is a 24/7 game, that raids should be kept to prime time?

you appear not to have followed the real discussion at all and want everyone to start all over for you.

how about countering some of the stuff already on the table, cus you haven't really added anything but a +1 to your post count.

I have yet to see a server die from an early RR now and then.

Your "primetime" argument isn't valid as you can't tell people what to do just because you got an opinion about it.

As said earlier, it's you who keep on having this selfpitying attitiude and not accepting facts. I got my facts straightened out.

If people are having fun taking relics in the middle of the night, fine for me. Guess I just respect peoples right to play what they payed for when they want.
 
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old.Tzeentch

Guest
Originally posted by Chenuba


I have yet to see a server die from an early RR now and then.

Your "primetime" argument isn't valid as you can't tell people what to do just because you got an opinion about things.

As said earlier, it's you who keep on having this selfpitying attitiude and not accepting facts. I got my facts straightened out.

If people are having fun taking relics in the middle of the night, fine for me. Guess I just respect peoples right to play what they payed for when they want.

You see, this is what you're missing, I'm not saying 'now and then', if early RRs become the norm, and then the only way, the server is fucked, pure and simple, except for RP farming and perhaps PvE.

In terms of relics and their significance, they will be seriously devalued due to the ease at which they can be gained using early RRs.

I'm not 'telling' people what to do, I'm saying consider this, if you want the server to die, sure, go ahead, but I sure as hell don't, so I feel entirely within my rights to point out this risk to the longevity of the game on this server.

I'm don't pity myself or whatever you would have me believe, and what facts have I not to accept?

As to your last point, sure, I respect that also, but the people you are referring to should also respect that it could very well screw up the entire aspect of relics, and seeing as this entire server is a community, they should respect that perhaps other people would like to take part, via defense or whatever.

However they have given their reasons, and some of them I do find valid and acceptable.. I simply do not condone this so it does not become the norm.. in fear of this becoming a precedent.

<edited to take into account your edit>
 
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Belomar

Guest
Originally posted by Chenuba
Not seen any valid argument yet to why RR should be taking place in specific hours.
That's your opinion. You seem to be outnumbered.
FACT: As it is now, late night/early morning raids can be done. This are not for discussion as it's possible and not a cheat/break of CoC or other guidelines how to play and behave in DaoC-euroservers
Agreed, and I can sympathize with it if it is about getting some motivation back into an underdog realm. However, this thread, which one could have expected you to read before posting, is not about whether it's allowed or not according to the game mechanics and the code of conduct, it's about the morals of an early relic raid and how to keep the realm war interesting.

For instance, which of the statements in my post at the top of page 9 (this is certainly a long thread! :)) would you disagree with? Your random flames amount to nil if you don't address what others say.

I agree with Tzeentch that you seem to have joined this discussion late, can't be bothered to read all the previous replies, and now charges in all riled up to flog dead horses. Do your homework, please, read the thread first before you start flaming like this.
 
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Runolaz

Guest
Originally posted by Belomar


For instance, which of the statements in my post at the top of page 9 (this is certainly a long thread! :)) would you disagree with? Your random flames amount to nil if you don't address what others say.


You mean threads :) I don't think we estimated this amount of posts. I guess if we had "raped" Excalibur on Sunday...BW would have crashed...lol
 
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Chenuba

Guest
Belomar

Reading all those posts about people talking, fairplay, morale, primetime when raiding relics, made me make that post. No matter what you think I'm missing, it's facts.

If anyone thinks that they can make rules about where and when to raid, because of so called valid arguments as, morale, pride etc. they're pretty naive imo.
How many players from Excalibur server does even read this forum ?.

I can't understand why anyone find those BIG "primetimeraids" so funny, I personally think it sux, even though I got a PC that can handle it in a decent way.
Imo, best time for raids isn't primetime, that's way to laggy with 400 attackers+300 defenders. Better to do raids where there's only a limited number on each side, much more playability and less lag, LDs, frustration about 1 fps getting you killed not knowing wtf hit you.

You attack your enemy when you can, not when they say you can !

It's the whining I'm reacting to and as I said earlier, seen no valid arguments for rules about times of raids.
Stop whining and get over it.
 
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old.Nol

Guest
by definition that post could be perceived as a whine mate.
 
T

Tranquil-

Guest
By your definition, any point made against you can be seen as whine. Which probably holds true for a whole lot of people.. Not just you.

People hopefully play this for fun. If anyones day is ruined because of a lost relic, _I_ personally think they aren't treating this game as what it is, a game. But by all means, let them.. They all decide what they think is fun. I have no right telling them what is fun and what's not.

People have all kinds of different opinions, which opinion that is right should be up to each and everyone of you to decide, for yourself. People don't need help in deciding what they feel is right to do. And will in most cases not let you anyway.

The best way I can describe what is going on here is by this.
Imagine an infant, happily gurgling and chewing his toy. Then suddenly someone rips that toy out of his mouth. He begins to cry and is very upset. Give him the toy back, and he's as happy as nothing has happened.

The point is, you don't like it because you felt it was unfair. If I could make a fair guess on everyone's age here, I would say it's not a very low average. So in this case, the 'baby' won't forget, and is still angry. Because someone took its toy.

Don't take everything so seriously in this game. Goes to everyone, I'll try to follow it myself, as hard as it can be some times. If something upsets or annoys you in this game, log off, watch a movie, eat some good food, take a walk. If possible do this with someone else, talk to friends irl. Or you can always read a book.

Play only to be happy.
 

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