Savage - overpowered?

[Lothandar]

Well yeah without armor you can get hit for 700+ dmg ><.

No savage hit my cleric for 700+ dmg when I had her, the prenerf zavage hits were more problematic for me because of them being quad hits over and over, not the actual dmg of a single hit. Like 400+300+200+200*3 and etc, not 793 on the first claw.

 

[Lothandar]

And tbh you're dead-wrong, the first pic includes dmg done on a SHAMAN (which is prolly Cougars bot, judging from it's nick).

And we all know bots are zzzzz.

Edit: amagawd ZZZZZZ

 

[tookha]

the 1st ss isnt a rr9 savage thats dmg done on a rr9 savage by another savage who is a much lower rr

Nope ...

Damage done by rr9 savage on his buffbot.

Get it?

 

[Herjulf]

Hmm, that log must be bugged....and there is nothing wrong with savage, would be nice with some useful ml's though :d

its not bugged at all.
he suspected it, since he never saw the text with "you hit." ever ever.

Next time we went he brought his supp sm + pet and we took down the same salamander faster ^^. he hit the damn thing like 20% hitratio with a SM hitting it with a staff.

 

[Herjulf]

And also the thread has gone kinda out of hand, noone at their right mind can say that that is working as intended.

A healer/sm/bd/rm/shaman outdamaging a "tank" vs a mob in PvE.

And a 100% missratio.

the fight have been refought and refought again against several higher lvl mobs, and same results.

 

[noaim]

the 1st ss isnt a rr9 savage thats dmg done on a rr9 savage by another savage who is a much lower rr

Herbal dont let your brain shine, it gets so dark in here.

 

[SethNaket]

And also the thread has gone kinda out of hand, noone at their right mind can say that that is working as intended.

A healer/sm/bd/rm/shaman outdamaging a "tank" vs a mob in PvE.

And a 100% missratio.

the fight have been refought and refought again against several higher lvl mobs, and same results.

Tell him to go get his weapons enchanted then. Killed sally plenty of times with warrior+savage and usually hit 3 out of 4 styles on him when chaining sidestyles. Throughout the fight savage usually does 2-3 times the dmg the warrior does. If he gets outdamaged by a caster swinging a staff the problem is not with savages as a class, but with the player.

 

[Herjulf]

Tell him to go get his weapons enchanted then. Killed sally plenty of times with warrior+savage and usually hit 3 out of 4 styles on him when chaining sidestyles. Throughout the fight savage usually does 2-3 times the dmg the warrior does. If he gets outdamaged by a caster swinging a staff the problem is not with savages as a class, but with the player.

Realmrank on savage?

Race?

Spec?

Weapon type?

And btw, the guy started the game when i started, on launch ^^
I am quite 100% shure the weapons are enchanted.

 

[Herjulf]

Worth mentioning is that the savage i mentioned, except being capped with 50 hth +11skill + rr3.

MOA3 buffs + TOA (+buff), confirmed enchanted weps.

Tests show that the "odd behaviour" starts at lvl65+ mobs.
lvl65 mobs an occasional hits get in, lvl70 none noticed hits, lvl75 confirmed 100% missratio.

Note on the screenshot from waldo, over 800 wields in total, and 0 hits.

Gonna do some fun tests now and make a post on the vnboards i think ^^.

Gonna compare my buffbot to savage and demand a shaman dmg nerf.

 

[Ulkez]

Maybe you ran into some rare highlvl salamander
Last time i checked he was doable with 1 tank and 2seers+powfont..

 

[yaruar]

but they are talking rvr here tho.. everyone knows thanes are good in pve and just as useless as any other hybrid tank in rvr

Yeah but in static battles and zergs the ranged damage pwns... Yeah we can't cast like a runie and hit like a warrior, but I've been consistantly been doing 200 to 350 damage ranged every 2 odd seconds which ain't too shabby. Combined with some survivability, certainly helps when confronted by a necro or bodyguarded casters which should cause headached for straight up tanks....

 

[Chosen]

Having a level 47 thane can hardly be "playing a thane" - in the means of gimpness. As Thane's do pretty well in PvE.

To even think about rolling a Thane is gimpy.

 

[vintervargen]

im not sure if any tank can hit a lvl75 mob solo.. you know there's something called tohit bonus.

 

[rvn]

ofc they can

 

[judas]

even a cleric can :>

 

[vintervargen]

yeah ok, checked some different mobs too see levels..

wheres the limit then, can a pure tank, high rr etc, hit cyrek (lvl 80) or kratos (lvl 85)?
df prices are lvl75, and since 2 pallys can kill them, i guess 1 tank can hit those.. but above 75?

 

[Tzeentch]

i thought it was common knowledge that hth savages had a lower weapon skill

?

wasnt that the reason (cant remember who) one of midgards fotm'est made a svg (from zerk) 2h before 2h got nerfed because of the increase in ws.

 

[Herjulf]

im not sure if any tank can hit a lvl75 mob solo.. you know there's something called tohit bonus.

well my kobold shaman buffbot with only afbuff have a 15-20% hitratio against this very mob.
and 91% 15.6dps wep. it is like the magic mob level limit is lvl65-70, we tried wing dive arti mob, same thing there.
And last night we went and did ml 1.7 harpy 100% missratio.

 

[Puppet]

I remember a movie where a certain group of Mids farmed the Dragon pre-nerf Majestic Will.

Surely the casters did the damage; but the savage was taunting his ass off and he hit the dragon numerous times with his weapons. That was with 1 tank on the dragon.

The salamander at the entrance of Typhons Reach is 'hard-to-hit' for sure in melee. You need high-chance-to-hit styles to have a better chance on landing a style on him.

If you examine the screenshot carefully you see the savage tried numerous styles on him:

Unstyled: no bonus to chance-to-hit
Kelgors Fist: medium chance to hit
Kelgors Might: no bonus to chance-to-hit
Kelgors Wrath: high bonus BUT you need to land Kelgors Fist first; which you didnt so these 'styles' where actually failed styles = unstyled = no bonus

According to the screenshot the savage had 41% evades on this mob so he should have atleast tried to style:

Totemic Fear: After evade; high chance to hit

The mob has an attack delay of 4.2 seconds and the savage in the screenshot attacks with 1,5 second delay. So surely no reason to not even try and land that style; even with backup he would have atleast fired it twice per evade-round

The opportunity to land a high-chance-to-hit style was there; the savage however didnt take that chance. It wasnt even 1 chance; it where 53 evades by a mob swinging at 4.2 sec speed. Seems to me with 56% chance the mob dont hit the savage (hi light-tank with skyhigh defenses!) he should have used different styles.

Animist and druid can solo this no problem with FoP - makes you wonder why peeps still think the animist-nerf wasnt fair

 

[PJS]

That mob is rock hard, can barely scratch it with a buffed charmed salamander :O

 

[Herjulf]

True but with a cap melee speed at 1.5secs not much time for totemic fear was given.
But shure, he "could" do that, and will do it to prove the point again.

And he used a medium to hit bonus style continuously, But then ask yourself.
What to hit bonus style did my shaman use? remember the shaman was also unbuffed. with perhaps 130str.

Savage all buffs with over 300-370 on all stats.

 

[[NO]Magmatic]

Pwned by Puppet tbh...

Complaining you cant hit a lvl 75+ mob is silly, but ok... Paladins have it easier on the same mob due to the fact that they are 99% slash, and slash has a nice style called "Amethyst Slash", the nice thing about it is that it has H+ (very high bonus) to attack... Compared to the M (medium) to attack from Kelgor's Fist...

Anyways, the SM + his pet == 2 additional attackers... The mob could have a silly check in it that it can only be hit by hybrid/casters, and not by pure melee (and if by pure melee, only when x attackers)...

Any number of reasons why you as melee couldnt hit the mob...

Funny that you didnt mention that the SM most likely never, ever, hit the mob with a spell either... Casters been complaining about that for ages, yet nothing is done...

So live with it, extreme damage in RvR (the damage by cougar wasnt on targets with no armor, been hit by him for 700+ on more then 1 occasion too), sucky in PvE... Fix the rvr part, and you have a right to complain about PvE...

 

[Tzeentch]

i thought it was common knowledge that hth savages had a lower weapon skill

?

wasnt that the reason (cant remember who) one of midgards fotm'est made a svg (from zerk) 2h before 2h got nerfed because of the increase in ws.

...

 

[Chronictank]

actually zerks will be fotm again
can match savage swing rate with more reliable hit rate (if less) with vendo as a added bonus.
Toa means both classes can reach the hard cap of attack speed, savages will be on par with zerks due to the triple/quad hits

Personally im getin my runecarver out his proverbial cuboard

 

[poky]

tbh missrates on savages are high, but its not like you miss every swing

 

[Herjulf]

tbh missrates on savages are high, but its not like you miss every swing

Thats exactly what he did ^^ 100% missrate on 800+ attacks.

 

[Puppet]

True but with a cap melee speed at 1.5secs not much time for totemic fear was given.

WTF? Its actually EASIER to doa reactionary with a higher swing speed. Simply because you can do it until the mob swings again: The mob was swinging at 4.2 speed so you should have atleast TWO chances after any given evade to try and style the evade-reactionary. Not saying thats 'stupid' but it seems to me you didnt try and land the best style on this mob in this particular case (the mob is very hard to hit so high-chance-to-hit styles are the best approach)

But shure, he "could" do that, and will do it to prove the point again.

And he used a medium to hit bonus style continuously, But then ask yourself.
What to hit bonus style did my shaman use? remember the shaman was also unbuffed. with perhaps 130str.

Savage all buffs with over 300-370 on all stats.

Yeah I admit its very strange a savage cant hit it but a shaman can. Its possible some tricky check is performed with the salamander when it comes down to landing stuff on him.

I remember 2 full group pre-FoP etc failed on him on Hib/Pryd. Simply unable to hit the bastard. I was watching and found it funny (hey shoot me) and for fun after ML5 I tried to shroom the salamander with my 50 animist and my 50 druid. Guess what: Mob dropped in 20 secs . Been farming this baby lately since he drops approx 200g worth of salvage and is easy farm rlly

So on the one hand we see a shaman with piss WS hit the salamander and the savage cant. On the other hand it doesnt explain how the savage could hit the dragon in the 1fg-wtfpwn-Mid-dragon-with-Majestic-Will fullgroup :O

 

[Belomar]

We're going to have to need extensive testing against other mobs before you can run off and scream bloody murder about Savage to-hit in PvE, I'm afraid.

 

[poky]

Thats exactly what he did ^^ 100% missrate on 800+ attacks.

thats one gimped savage then

 

[Dawn]

savages suck. delete.