[Rant] Western Society

[Jeros]

Is western society doomed?

I really dont see how it can survive in its current form

People either cant be botherd to work so goverments give out handouts

Or they work hard and barely get by.

The middle class do well but so often walk a fine line between a nice lifestyle and a total pit of debt and oblivion

More people are turning to crime as they feel its lucrative

In short

Im sick of people telling me they cant be assed to work, im sick of seeing people who work hard struggle just to eat, im sick of not feeling safe walking the streets in broad daylight.

Ya it all seems to be going to hell

Oh yes and i forgot to add, banks, large companys and even goverments acting in ways they are about "money right here and now" or "keep people happy no matter the costs" and are tottaly screwing themselves for the furture, but its ok! cos "its the next partys problem" or "like i care about the fate of the company! ill be sunning myself in hawaii by the time this little lot comes crashing down"

Makes me think of my old bosses in estate agency, the housing market crashed so they thought it would be a good idea to go on a 10grand bender to las vegas on the company, oh sure, THAT made us feel safe about our jobs

 

[old.Tohtori]

Add to that, people who are honestly out of work and can't find any, are criticized and get barely enough cash to live by.

While government officials get billion dollar loans forgiven, normal people have to live with half a pay to pay theirs.

And so forth.

We're not doomed though, even if...*listens*...i think i hear him coming.

 

[Chronictank]

Add to that, people who are honestly out of work and can't find any, are criticized and get barely enough cash to live by.

There is a big difference between no job and not willing to do a job because of x (what's involved, money, etc..)

 

[old.Tohtori]

There is a big difference between no job and not willing to do a job because of x (what's involved, money, etc..)

Ofcourse, but also you do get critisized(criticized?) for being honestly out of work. Can't find any, people aren't hiring etc.

 

[Sparx]

People constantly live on the belief that things were better years ago, it wasnt. Crime and debt isnt a new thing, crime has been there since the first man thought "oh i like his stick more" probably much before then.

Things always looked better when you were young cause you parents sheilded you from the bad things, now your grown up you have to deal with it all yourself. And it only gets worse as you get older.

 

[Chronictank]

Ofcourse, but also you do get critisized(criticized?) for being honestly out of work. Can't find any, people aren't hiring etc.

Well the reality is there is *almost* always work, thats why they get critisised
It isn't people can't find the work its just that the work available is not the work they want to do

So saying people aren't hiring isnt exactly accurate


@sparx i think its more that violent crime is more common, which is generally more shocking than say having your wallet stolen
It is based on no statistical information just my personal experiences when out and about

 

[Sparx]

Well the reality is there is *almost* always work, thats why they get critisised
It isn't people can't find the work its just that the work available is not the work they want to do

So saying people aren't hiring isnt exactly accurate

I disagree there. My mate worked in recruitment, just made redundant unfortunately cause no companies are hiring at the moment, most are letting people off and dont want to take anyone on, hence sever lack of jobs

Yes there are places like burger king, but with the hours working there you cant look for a real job and after tax you cant pay your rent or bills, but if you are on income support you have rent paid for, its not really a hard choice. Work every hour god sends and still not afford my rent on £5 an hour or be safe knowing my rent is being paid while i try sort the rest of my life out

 

[old.Tohtori]

Well the reality is there is *almost* always work, thats why they get critisised
It isn't people can't find the work its just that the work available is not the work they want to do

So saying people aren't hiring isnt exactly accurate

I could give a few examples, but let's not get hung up on that.

From personal experience, i can say that it's not always a lack of want.

Even some jobs like MacD isnt' available as those jobs are rather given to younger people and people who need "student jobs".

 

[Sparx]

@sparx i think its more that violent crime is more common, which is generally more shocking than say having your wallet stolen
It is based on no statistical information just my personal experiences when out and about

Not at all, knife and gun crime was much more sever in the 70's there just was no stats to show it or Media to advertise it to its death

 

[Uara]

Wheres Gorb when you need him


EDIT: Oh and relating to jobs, I kno some friends who are trying their damndest (sp) to get a job but no matter where they go they're not getting any luck, they've tried all the crappy jobs like cleaners,fast food etc there is just nothing going around here!

 

[ford prefect]

I'm not convinced that it is so easy for everyone to find a job.

I'm very lucky in that I have a job which pays well and is 100% secure. Having said that my wife has a BA and an MA, and it took her five years to find work. I should mention also that she is in a wheel chair. During that five year period she was attending three or four job interviews every month. The work she does now, she is woefully over qualified to do, and it pays less than 23k per year (most of the people she went to uni with are in jobs paying at least twice that), and the cliche is complete in that she ended up working in a disability related job, working with other disabled people.

Quite rightly, she didn't go for jobs that pay anything below 20k because she would have been financially worse off, because her benefits are affected by work.

I think there are many people out there that want to work, but simply can't find anything suitable or financially viable.

When you consider that 1 in 11 people in the UK suffer from some kind of physical disability, and the fact that discrimination is still very previlant in the work place (the Disability Discrimination Act, basically being a manual on how to discriminate without getting into trouble), you have a large amount of the population that simply cannot find work.

 

[Chronictank]

Not at all, knife and gun crime was much more sever in the 70's there just was no stats to show it or Media to advertise it to its death

Not really talking about knife crime and such specifically more the levels of agression in general
for example you probably know more than me considering your line of work but would you really go to clubs with no fee at the door out of choice nowdays?

Particularly in london people seem alot more willing to kick off, nowdays i almost exclusively go to house parties and such simply because i cba to deal with some random moron

 

[Raven]

There is a big difference between those that are out of work and are really trying to find work and those that just cant be arsed. We need to come up with a way of separating them, the current job seekers allowance is not fit for purpose.

Those that are trying their hardest to find work should be supported by the state. Those that can't be arsed should be left to starve to death, they should not get any help at all, no house, no money, nothing. If they turn to crime then they should be jailed or deported and no I don't care where they come from, or where they go I just don't want bone idle scroungers in my country.

No society can survive with hangers on, in any place in the world in any species, to be part of a society each individual has to contribute, if they refuse to then they should not be part of that society and not expect that society to support them. On the other hand that is what separates us from the other animals, we look after our weak and old, which we should do. My only problem with it all is that we also look after our lazy.

 

[Ormorof]

I disagree there. My mate worked in recruitment, just made redundant unfortunately cause no companies are hiring at the moment, most are letting people off and dont want to take anyone on, hence sever lack of jobs

Yes there are places like burger king, but with the hours working there you cant look for a real job and after tax you cant pay your rent or bills, but if you are on income support you have rent paid for, its not really a hard choice. Work every hour god sends and still not afford my rent on £5 an hour or be safe knowing my rent is being paid while i try sort the rest of my life out

yep i was made redundant while working in a recruitment company, they went bust cos no one was hiring anyone

so things were better say 2-3 years ago, for example unemployment in hull was only about 25% rather than the 35-40% it is now!

 

[Sparx]

Not really talking about knife crime and such specifically more the levels of agression in general
for example you probably know more than me considering your line of work but would you really go to clubs with no fee at the door out of choice nowdays?

Particularly in london people seem alot more willing to kick off, nowdays i almost exclusively go to house parties and such simply because i cba to deal with some random moron

Its all about house parties now, you tend to get less problems in clubs you have to pay to enter than ones where any lout can get in

 

[gohan]

I'm not convinced that it is so easy for everyone to find a job.

I'm very lucky in that I have a job which pays well and is 100% secure. Having said that my wife has a BA and an MA, and it took her five years to find work. I should mention also that she is in a wheel chair. During that five year period she was attending three or four job interviews every month. The work she does now, she is woefully over qualified to do, and it pays less than 23k per year (most of the people she went to uni with are in jobs paying at least twice that), and the cliche is complete in that she ended up working in a disability related job, working with other disabled people.

Quite rightly, she didn't go for jobs that pay anything below 20k because she would have been financially worse off, because her benefits are affected by work.

I think there are many people out there that want to work, but simply can't find anything suitable or financially viable.

When you consider that 1 in 11 people in the UK suffer from some kind of physical disability, and the fact that discrimination is still very previlant in the work place (the Disability Discrimination Act, basically being a manual on how to discriminate without getting into trouble), you have a large amount of the population that simply cannot find work.

but at the same time the discrimination act does my nut in...... how could u possilbe give some1 in a wheelchair the job of being lets say a waiter? just so your can say your not discriminating.......... its rediculas, if you arent able to do the job as it is the company that is "choosing" to employ you has to pay out to get everything changed so you can do it???


ofc the flip side is that in say an office job where your sat down 95% of the time anyway thiers absolutly no reason to discriminate as the job will get done to the same degree

 

[Ormorof]

problems with western society? RBS crashes and burns, bailed out by government, what happens to the guy in charge? generally you would think life of poverty ala 1930's stock market crash? nope £16 million "slap on the wrist"

 

[ford prefect]

but at the same time the discrimination act does my nut in...... how could u possilbe give some1 in a wheelchair the job of being lets say a waiter? just so your can say your not discriminating.......... its rediculas, if you arent able to do the job as it is the company that is "choosing" to employ you has to pay out to get everything changed so you can do it???


ofc the flip side is that in say an office job where your sat down 95% of the time anyway thiers absolutly no reason to discriminate as the job will get done to the same degree

Firstly, yes there are jobs that someone in a wheel chair can't do, obviously, fireman of paramedic for example.

You are completely wrong however when you say that a company has to pay for any changes to employ someone with a disability, that is what the "Access to work" scheme is for.

And are you seriously saying that someone in a wheel chair, by default, should be confined soley to office work?!? Ermmm wow! I'll have to mention that to my friend who teaches para-gliding, he's been in a chair 20 years and teaching 15, we must put a stop to that immediately lol

 

[Lucius]

Add to that, people who are honestly out of work and can't find any, are criticized and get barely enough cash to live by.

You'd know about that wouldn't you

There is ALWAYS a way of getting work. People who don't are just lazy, it is as simple as that. We need "do'ers" in our society to make it flourish.

 

[old.Tohtori]

You'd know about that wouldn't you

There is ALWAYS a way of getting work. People who don't are just lazy, it is as simple as that. We need "do'ers" in our society to make it flourish.

Yes, i'd actually know it. Thanks for the troll.

There isn't ALWAYS a way of getting work.

Have you been unemployed suddenly? What did you do? Did YOU get a job at MacD or as a floorcleaner? I didn't. I tried, but didn't.

I went to the employment agency and asked, and i quote, "For any job available." and it didn't pan out for a long time.

I did everything except walk from every door to door asking for any job available, which, no matter how "holier then though" you are, you wouldn't do either.

 

[Lucius]

Yes, i'd actually know it. Thanks for the troll.

There isn't ALWAYS a way of getting work.

Have you been unemployed suddenly? What did you do? Did YOU get a job at MacD or as a floorcleaner? I didn't. I tried, but didn't.

I went to the employment agency and asked, and i quote, "For any job available." and it didn't pan out for a long time.

I did everything except walk from every door to door asking for any job available, which, no matter how "holier then though" you are, you wouldn't do either.

I've been there too.

Why not volunteer? It is what I did when I couldn't get a job. I actually helped my community and although I didn't get paid it was (and still is) very fulfilling.

Perhaps I was a bit tactless with regards to you and I apologise for that, but there is ALWAYS a way.

 

[old.Tohtori]

I've been there too.

Why not volunteer? It is what I did when I couldn't get a job. I actually helped my community and although I didn't get paid it was (and still is) very fulfilling.

Perhaps I was a bit tactless with regards to you and I apologise for that, but there is ALWAYS a way.

Well volunteer work is granted, true, i could've done that but it didn't cross my mind nor did anyone suggest it. Hell, not even professional work people

Next time(knock wood) i'll be sure to do so.

And i don't take offense to people saying "i didn't try", or assuming so, so nothing to feel sorry about. Hell, it's just how things are and i myself can only know what i did/didn't do.

 

[Gorbachioo]

Tohtori in trouble again.


On topic: I would say that lazy people are one of the lesser threats to western civilization at the moment but im not going to talk about that as i dont wish to divert anyones attention from mocking tohtori.

So tohtori tell me.. how come you're always unemployed you fucking lazy bum!?

 

[Lucius]

Tohtori in trouble again.


On topic: I would say that lazy people are one of the lesser threats to western civilization at the moment but im not going to talk about that as i dont wish to divert anyones attention from mocking tohtori.

So tohtori tell me.. how come you're always unemployed you fucking lazy bum!?

I have respect for Tohtori now, so if all you are going to do is belittle him then get the fuck out.

 

[old.Tohtori]

Tohtori in trouble again.


On topic: I would say that lazy people are one of the lesser threats to western civilization at the moment but im not going to talk about that as i dont wish to divert anyones attention from mocking tohtori.

So tohtori tell me.. how come you're always unemployed you fucking lazy bum!?

I'm not actually, doesn't remove the fact that i was and know what i'm talking about.

HAve you even had a real job yet?

 

[Bugz]

You three make me laugh.

 

[Bugz]

Btw Lucius.

In Dec 08, 500,000 jobs were looking for people to fill them.

roughly 2 million unemployed.

I'll just quote you for comical reference:

There is ALWAYS a way of getting work.

 

[Gorbachioo]

I have respect for Tohtori now, so if all you are going to do is belittle him then get the fuck out.

Try spotting the irony.

 

[Lucius]

Btw Lucius.

In Dec 08, 500,000 jobs were looking for people to fill them.

roughly 2 million unemployed.

I'll just quote you for comical reference:

You idiot, then why not volunteer and actually help the community?

There is ALWAYS a way. You clueless idiot.

 

[old.Tohtori]

You three make me laugh.

Thought you stopped this kind of commenting