Help Panic!

[Ctuchik]

ok so my newly bought PC has started acting up.

in the last week its been randomly turning itself off "just like that" no overheat warning or anything popping up when i turn it on again. but today it shut off once right in the startup process so now i'm getting slightly worried.

anything in particular i should search for?

/edit: tho everything isnt completly new, heres my spec.


Operating System: Windows XP Professional (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2 (2600.xpsp_sp2_gdr.070227-2254)
Language: Swedish (Regional Setting: Swedish)
System Manufacturer: Gigabyte Technology Co., Ltd.
System Model: M61P-S3
BIOS: Award Modular BIOS v6.00PG
Processor: AMD Athlon(tm) 64 X2 Dual Core Processor 4400+, MMX, 3DNow (2 CPUs), ~2.3GHz
Memory: 2048MB RAM
Page File: 600MB used, 3339MB available

Card name: NVIDIA GeForce 8600 GT
Manufacturer: NVIDIA
Chip type: GeForce 8600 GT
DAC type: Integrated RAMDAC
Device Key: Enum\PCI\VEN_10DE&DEV_0402&SUBSYS_34551458&REV_A1
Display Memory: 512.0 MB
Current Mode: 1024 x 768 (32 bit) (60Hz

 

[inactionman]

Any error messages? If not I'd say it's a hardware problem, probably psu or mobo.

 

[Ctuchik]

no, no error messages. working fine and dandy up until it shuts off. and then it starts normally (exception is this one last time).

/edit: crap, anything i can do to find out if it IS the psu or mobo thats acting up on me?

 

[inactionman]

What PSU do you have? Best to look there before the mobo, as the only way to troubleshoot that kind of thing is to replace and see if it works. Do you have a friend nearby with similar bits? If so, swap bits and see if things work.

To check if it's a software problem (unlikely, but worth checking) download a linux livecd and see if that works. They also often have memtest on them, so you can check if it's a memory problem (also unlikely).

 

[Ctuchik]

PSU is a Hiper (yes Hiper) Type M 530W

/edit: anyway, after fiddling around a tad with other games (forgot to mention that the PC only seems to shut down when i play a game) it only shuts down when i play 1 game. (frontlines that i play via Metaboli)

i've tried a few other memory heavy games such as AoC and Vanguard and the PC isn't shutting down then.

so maybe there's something wrong with Metabolis version of Frontline?

 

[Kryten]

Possible. If it's hard shutting down it's not going to be the game causing it (unless it's riddled with some very nasty virus of course) - but it may be using a part of the system, most likely your graphics card that other games don't use, or just stresses a certain part more, causing it to panic and shut down.
Hardware-wise, graphics card is most likely, memory second and psu a close third. Memtest86 may be an idea here.

Have you checked your event logs for any messages or anything?

 

[Ctuchik]

*cough* event log?

*tries to hide his utter noclue*

/edit: and i doubt its a virus. using Avast and its updating a few times a day.

 

[Kryten]

That's alright, such a nasty virus is rather rare thankfully.

Event log : go to control panel and adminstrative tools.
You'll find Event Logs in there, you'll find a few sections like "applications, system, security" if my memory serves me correctly. Under system you'll find everything that records a log on startup or shutdown or during a failure. Lines with a warning or error have a yellow exclamation mark or red cross, respectively.
Scroll down to the last known time of one of those erronous shutdowns and see what it says - it may (or may not, of course) provide you a clue as to what's going on.
If you're not sure what it means, find a copy/paste thing, copy some in here or feel free to email me/upload a log of the entire eventlog.

 

[Ctuchik]

not sure giving you the log will help. its in swedish :/

/edit: bah, cant add .evt files to the attachment system here

/edit 2: lots and lots of red X in that event log tho

source says disc and atapi

/edit3: heres one of the errors.

Händelsetyp: Fel
Händelsens källa: atapi
Händelsekategori: Ingen
Händelse-ID: 5
Datum: 2008-07-04
Tid: 22:13:13
Användare: Saknas
Dator: DP31HP
Beskrivning:
Ett paritetsfel uppstod på \Device\Ide\IdePort0.

Mer information finns i Hjälp- och supportcenter på sidan Events and Errors Message Center: Basic Search.
Data:
0000: 0f 00 50 00 01 00 a4 00 ..P...¤.
0008: 00 00 00 00 05 00 04 c0 .......À
0010: 03 00 00 80 00 00 00 00 ...€....
0018: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0020: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0028: 06 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0030: 00 00 00 00 07 00 00 00 ........
0038: 40 00 00 8f 02 00 01 00 @......
0040: 00 20 0a 12 40 03 20 40 . ..@. @
0048: 00 00 00 00 0a 00 00 00 ........
0050: 00 00 00 00 60 e6 a9 89 ....`橉
0058: 00 00 00 00 f8 6a 6d 89 ....øjm‰
0060: 02 00 00 00 5f 00 00 00 ...._...
0068: 28 00 00 00 00 5f 00 00 (...._..
0070: 08 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........


here's the other.

Händelsetyp: Fel
Händelsens källa: Disk
Händelsekategori: Ingen
Händelse-ID: 11
Datum: 2008-07-04
Tid: 22:13:13
Användare: Saknas
Dator: DP31HP
Beskrivning:
Drivrutinen hittade ett styrenhetsfel på \Device\Harddisk1\D.

Mer information finns i Hjälp- och supportcenter på sidan Events and Errors Message Center: Basic Search.
Data:
0000: 03 00 68 00 01 00 b6 00 ..h...¶.
0008: 00 00 00 00 0b 00 04 c0 .......À
0010: 01 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0018: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0020: 00 be 00 00 00 00 00 00 .¾......
0028: 74 06 00 00 00 00 00 00 t.......
0030: ff ff ff ff 03 00 00 00 ÿÿÿÿ....
0038: 40 00 00 8f 02 00 01 00 @......
0040: 00 20 0a 12 40 03 20 40 . ..@. @
0048: 00 00 00 00 0a 00 00 00 ........
0050: 00 00 00 00 60 e6 a9 89 ....`橉
0058: 00 00 00 00 f8 6a 6d 89 ....øjm‰
0060: 02 00 00 00 5f 00 00 00 ...._...
0068: 28 00 00 00 00 5f 00 00 (...._..
0070: 08 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........
0078: f0 00 04 00 00 00 00 0b ð.......
0080: 00 00 00 00 08 03 00 00 ........
0088: 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 ........

 

[Kryten]

DVD/CD drive playing silly buggers? or maybe that game disc is failing/scratched or the likes?

Might be worth updating motherboard/chipset drivers, specifically the IDE/SATA ones. Also possibly borrowing another drive. It's not uncommon for drives to fail intermittantly and cause system instability like this.

You're still quite free to c&p some examples in Swedish, I can read a little of it.

If it is the drive then you can consider yourself lucky, probably the cheapest part of the whole system


Edit: from that last copy & paste, it's citing both ATAPI and the hdd controllers. Therefore very possibly an issue with the drivers as I said.
Also, do you have any virtual drive software installed? Alcohol 120%, Daemon tools or the sort?

 

[Ctuchik]

ok so what drive are we talking about here? HD or dvd?

and the game i'm playing dont use a CD (its partially streamed from metaboli)

bah you edited when i asked lol.

yeah i have demon tools. will disable that and try again.

 

[Kryten]

The errors point to both. Atapi is very specifically the subsystem that controls optical drives, the latter is quite clearly a hard drive.

Get your onboard IDE controller drivers/motherboard chipset drivers updated.



Interested to see what happens with DT disabled (may need to actually uninstall it.)
Looking at the errors again, the ATAPI error is pointing at the primary IDE interface - if you've an IDE hard drive there, daemon tools would be the first suspect I think. It would also not suprise me if it's overzealous copy protection software - StarForce rings some nasty bells here if you've anything like TrackMania installed.

 

[Ctuchik]

ok so its possible that its even my HD thats starting to fail? coz its a few years old and have probably been abused quite alot. rare and far between my scandisks and defrags :/

/edit: but the wierd thing is that it only seems to happen when i play that particular game.

at first i started to suspect a memory failure but after playing AoC for hours on end that cant be it.

/edit 2. and i'd love to update my motherboard and chipset drivers but i'm to much of a noob to be quite comfortable doing that. i'm terrified i'l just make things worse by using the wrong drivers :/

 

[Kryten]

Possible. Defrag it overnight, give it a scandisk beforehand and afterwards.
Download the relevant diagnostic tools for it too (seatools if its a seagate or maxtor, DLG Diag if its a WD etc) and run those - but make sure everything important is backed up first. Even if it says the drive's healthy it gives peace of mind.

I've had brand new drives come to me completely nackered, and I've been fitting (older) computers with 10gb drives from late 90's that've been used in military and corporate machines 24/7 since date of manufacture with no performance issues or errors at all Very random, the lifespan of drives.

It could still be RAM: different software will call different information from different parts of the RAM, not always the first bit available. Even if they did, the crashing game may just use a bit more ram than AOC for example and hits a "bad spot". Also worth checking.

 

[Kryten]

http://europe.giga-byte.com/FileList/Driver/motherboard_driver_chipset_nvidia_mcp61_2kxp.exe

Quite safe, just like installing any other software. Click yes a bunch of times, agree to anything it asks. When it's installed, restart.
If you're really worried about it, I'll be happy to attempt a remote desktop connection and can do it for you.

 

[inactionman]

Kryt, I think you are on the right lines with starforce, or something like that. The fact that it only happens in 1 game is a bit suspicious.

Ctuchik, download & run this and see if it finds anything.

StarForce Drivers Removal

 

[Moriath]

surely if its new and its playing up send it back

 

[Kryten]

Simple, Moriath, but a very good point

Update drivers first by all means, get rid of DT and Starforce if applicable and see if it behaves.
If not, back everything up you need and get it changed


Saying that, just looked up on Metaboli : there's a lot of starforce floating around it's distributed software. Hit Inactionman's link and get rid

 

[Ctuchik]

got rid of starforce, uninstalled DT and updated the drivers you said and its still acting up :/

gonna head to my brother in law on sunday and clone my hard drive to one that he's got and see if that might help. if not i'm gonna pay the retailer a little visit.

 

[Ctuchik]

so just out of curiosity i did a better memtest today and after 25 minutes the PC shut off. so what the hell is going on here? the event log hints to a disc failure but the memtest actually shut the PC off...

 

[Kryten]

Strange, very strange.
I'd take it back, just thinking about your warranty.

If it wasn't, I'd suggest unplugging HDD's and CD drive and trying again.
Sounding rather like a dodgy motherboard, possibly power supply. At least you can rule out software issue, meaning you won't look like a prat taking it back to where you bought it.

 

[Ctuchik]

well i've been playing back and forth with the 2 ramsticks i have and the problem persists when playing a game. but i did notice my gfx card were kinda hot (read omgwtf?!?). so now i'm looking for a decent freeware heat monitor.

been trying google but i just end up downloading MBM wich hasent been updated in 4 years.


/edit: nm found one. and it isnt looking that hot from what its listing

wish i'd find one that worked with logitechs g15 as alt tabbing to check all the time isnt that accurate as the game kinda go sleep mode then.

 

[Ctuchik]

heres how it looks when the game is minimized. add 5 - 10 degrees while playing or so i guess...

http://i254.photobucket.com/albums/hh89/Thorgald/Heat.jpg

/edit: hmm, temp3 just clawed its way past 60...

and now temp2 is trying to

 

[Ctuchik]

ok i'm fairly certain its a heat related issue now. had a stroke of luck last time i minimized it was just before the pc shut off. temp 2, 3 and core were all over 60 degrees with temp 2 just breaking 70.

so its probably my PC shutting down to save itself from melting. so no games for me untill monday when i can get new fans

only thing thats bothering me is those ATAPI errors...

and why did the PC shut down during memtest. is that generating that much heat aswell?

 

[Kryten]

Memtest will certainly heat things up, it's basically pushing as much data through your RAM as possible, heating up both ram and CPU.

60 isnt *that* hot, certainly not for a graphics card. Either way, you shouldn't have to spend monies on fixing something bought from a shop, it should work outright. Don't void your warranty.

 

[Ctuchik]

well i built the PC myself 6 months ago so not sure if there still is a warranty. but either way i'm not gonna void it if there are one. i'm just trying to speed things up for them when/if i take it in.

 

[Kryten]

Ooooh I see, I was under the assumption it was a package system.

Either way 60 degrees isnt enough to make a system shut down - it will take nearly double that.

Motherboard dodgy, power supply dodgy. Starting to suspect it may be the latter.

 

[Ctuchik]

well i've been running with a table fan as an extra cooling for a while while playing a game and now it "only" locked up my entire system >.<

didnt notice any increase in playing time before it happened either :/

 

[old.Osy]

Language: Swedish (Regional Setting: Swedish)

That's your problem right there.

*runs*

 

[WiZe^]

Language: Swedish (Regional Setting: Swedish)

That's your problem right there.

*runs*

pfff