ok

[old.chesnor]

I played a Healer to 46, thats a zero offense Middy Healer. Tranquil can tell me nothing about mezzing, when to mezz, mezz breaking yadda yadda yadda. Whut can tell me nothing about buffing, when to buff, who not to buff. I've been there, done that got the T-Shirt. I have 46 levels of healing, mezzing and buffing.

Don't blame the healers you fool, here is a simple guide to buffs :-
If someone buffs you, and you don't want that buff, remove it yourself or ask the buffer to remove it. (its a bit buggy atm so removing one buff may remove them all)

If you want a specific buff or DO not want a specific buff, tell the buffer.

Healers are only responsible for giving the buffs. Everyone else is responsible for taking them.

Do NOT ever, under ANY circumstance, take buffs, fight mobs, die, then turn around to the healer and say, "it's your fault I died becuase you buffed me" EVER!


Blaming healers for rogues dying because they overbuff, now I've heard it all.

 

[old.Whut]

Originally posted by chesnor
I played a Healer to 46, thats a zero offense Middy Healer. Tranquil can tell me nothing about mezzing, when to mezz, mezz breaking yadda yadda yadda. Whut can tell me nothing about buffing, when to buff, who not to buff. I've been there, done that got the T-Shirt. I have 46 levels of healing, mezzing and buffing.

Don't blame the healers you fool, here is a simple guide to buffs :-
If someone buffs you, and you don't want that buff, remove it yourself or ask the buffer to remove it. (its a bit buggy atm so removing one buff may remove them all)

If you want a specific buff or DO not want a specific buff, tell the buffer.

Healers are only responsible for giving the buffs. Everyone else is responsible for taking them.

Do NOT ever, under ANY circumstance, take buffs, fight mobs, die, then turn around to the healer and say, "it's your fault I died becuase you buffed me" EVER!


Blaming healers for rogues dying because they overbuff, now I've heard it all.

Yawns :sleeping:

You obviously, very obviously, never even thought of it. Just go back to sleep.

 

[infozwerg]

oh, and @ whut: if you think what i think you think, you are cool.

let me rephrase that: you dont know what you are talking about.

i admit i dont buff rogues a lot. just str or dex and thats it. defensive buffs go on tanks, if a rogue gets aggro, he has to deal with it, its a patented "not my problem". Youd be amazed at how fast rogues learn not to take aggro if they dont get af and con buff and no heals.


ciao,
Estat

 

[old.Grymshadow]

Originally posted by infozwerg


let me rephrase that: you dont know what you are talking about.

i admit i dont buff rogues a lot. just str or dex and thats it. defensive buffs go on tanks, if a rogue gets aggro, he has to deal with it, its a patented "not my problem". Youd be amazed at how fast rogues learn not to take aggro if they dont get af and con buff and no heals.

Thats good of you, you buff up Dex/Str which increases their dmg output, and then basically say "screw you" when they get aggro.
Why not rather buff Af/Con instead and give em more chance to de-taunt before dying to your no-heals-for-rogues policy?

 

[Smartypants]

Wow, this subject really got people all excited...

First: Of course a scout or infil is NOT a tank, so of course they suck at it, compared to a real tank. But they are useful anyway. Yesterday I was in a group with only one tank, a lvl 18 armsman, and then me and and infil. I'm at lvl 19, and I was repeatedly taking the aggro off of the armsman, by mistake, simply because I hit harder and/or faster. This was when I used my styles.

Actually I'm starting to think that all this talk about 42 in shield is a load of BS. Specially if it's gonna be points taken from thrust. My longbow did a lot of damage yesterday in the group, that's for sure, but the damn thing is so slow that when I charged in to melee, I hit so much faster and didn't miss so much, that the over all difference was noticable... With the styles in thrust, it actually seemed to me that I could easily outdamage my own bow... Not sure about it, but that's the impression I got. So I really don't understand all this about scouts being so useless in melee.

Second: Scouts and infils are very useful in RvR, yes. So if you agree with that, you should maybe consider supporting them, by letting them group with you? I would never turn down an infiltrator or a scout, if they wanted to group. Eh, come to think of it, I would not turn down anyone, regardsless of their class. I don't really care about their class, I care about their attitude...

 

[Olgark]

Originally posted by Smart
Wow, this subject really got people all excited...

First: Of course a scout or infil is NOT a tank, so of course they suck at it, compared to a real tank. But they are useful anyway. Yesterday I was in a group with only one tank, a lvl 18 armsman, and then me and and infil. I'm at lvl 19, and I was repeatedly taking the aggro off of the armsman, by mistake, simply because I hit harder and/or faster. This was when I used my styles.

Actually I'm starting to think that all this talk about 42 in shield is a load of BS. Specially if it's gonna be points taken from thrust. My longbow did a lot of damage yesterday in the group, that's for sure, but the damn thing is so slow that when I charged in to melee, I hit so much faster and didn't miss so much, that the over all difference was noticable... With the styles in thrust, it actually seemed to me that I could easily outdamage my own bow... Not sure about it, but that's the impression I got. So I really don't understand all this about scouts being so useless in melee.

Second: Scouts and infils are very useful in RvR, yes. So if you agree with that, you should maybe consider supporting them, by letting them group with you? I would never turn down an infiltrator or a scout, if they wanted to group. Eh, come to think of it, I would not turn down anyone, regardsless of their class. I don't really care about their class, I care about their attitude...

Well said best post yet on this matter.

 

[Arthwyr]

No shield on the scout ...

Scout - Shoot someone - that guy charges you reaches you with 50% health maybe - Slam (he is stunned) - regular shot - regular shot - Guy dead

Or guy charges you - you slam - run - restealth

42 shield and slam are essential to any scout.

 

[old.Niljindil]

Originally posted by chesnor
And to ElDiablo, so a shield spec Scout doesn't spec weapon ? Might I ask what possible use a Scout without any adequate weapon spec brings to PvE when not firing thier longbow.....just guard ??!?!?! lol.

Sorry for jumping in but i was under the impression that you can attack with your shield, silly me

 

[infozwerg]

maybe its fair to mention at this point that you can also attack with a non specced weapon and do damage while guarding.

 

[Tranquil-]

"Actually I'm starting to think that all this talk about 42 in shield is a load of BS. Specially if it's gonna be points taken from thrust. My longbow did a lot of damage yesterday in the group, that's for sure, but the damn thing is so slow that when I charged in to melee, I hit so much faster and didn't miss so much, that the over all difference was noticable... With the styles in thrust, it actually seemed to me that I could easily outdamage my own bow... Not sure about it, but that's the impression I got. So I really don't understand all this about scouts being so useless in melee."

-- Smart, that's on purple con mobs, try that on closer-to-you-con-mobs If that was on closer-to-you-con-mobs, I would start specc that bow or keep meleespecc lower than bow Oh, and you could also see if you want a huntingbow, much better if you feel you are shooting too slow for the group, you do a bit less damage per shot, but you get a much better overall damage if you tend to miss some(or if the group kills too fast ). Maybe you'll get less aggro too, who knows

"Even the best mezzer at times (and I wasn't the best, or the worst) will fail to mezz first time. Or mezz will break and there will be a time when 2 mobs are on the tank(s) (like when one mob is almost dead, you may choose not to re-mezz the add). You know this as well as I do."

-- Chesnor, I am not trying to teach you anything about mezzing, you should know the stuff I wrote already. The reason I wrote that was because you described the role of a passive CCer, and I think that a CCer should play an active role in the group, but you already know that the CCer shouldn't sleep. However, it seems to me that you are accepting that the mez broke in that fictional example and just leaves it, why not try to re-mez the mob, to prevent another killmessage. Don't save the insta's or whatever for another time when it is needed now. That CCer should be active and ready to take a decision at any time during a fight and do what he/she can to prevent that tgw/single death whatever.

"I said about 20 posts ago that the reason I like to see a badass tank guarding another badass tank (actually, guarding each other if both shield specced) is because then you have 2 badass tanks beating down on the mob. Rather than 1 badass tank, and 1 bad tank You really can't argue with this, so please stop. "

-- Chesnor you said the above earlier too.. May I ask what prevents the second "badass" tank from being in the front line?(The only thing that is prevented in this situation is the crossguarding, but what's good with that if someone else guards better and doesn't draw aggro, cause guard doesn't draw aggro you know.) Oh, and I am arguing that.

 

[Smartypants]

Tranquil: Actually that was on closer-to-me-con-mobs... They were mostly orange and a few reds. And my bow is specced at max (19) and thrust is only about 15. It just seems that with the styles, specially chain styles, I do pretty good damage and fast. But using a hunting bow might be a good idea. I will try that.

 

[old.Zerathol]

I have been reading all these posts and I aint gonna comment them just to add my point of view. And yes I am playing scout (typing this from my vacation atm )


all I can say is that the beuty of this game is that its a "fair" game. What do I meen by that?
Best group, 8 diffrent classes.
Seriously, every class has there good and bad sides.
The only good you have of tanks at higher levels imo is there ability to take loads of damge and still be standing and laughing. (please dont take me wronw now. Without tanks no one in this game would be able to get some xp)

This scenario is the reality of some classes in the game. People dont let for example in sorscerers at lower lvls . Or theurgists. Not to mention infys and scouts and even wizzards.
What happens now? Well, around 40 people are beging sorscerers to join there groups to do tanglers and more.
Scouts DO far more dmg with there bow than tanks do, so what they cant take more than few hits, they aint suposed to get hit.

How often dont we cheer when a single scout drops the hibbie that is dancing and mooning us with loads of others standing behind him? Personally I have played several classes and I feel so sorry for the classes mentioned above. I really do. Its so HARD to get a group. No mather how many friends you got, why, because of the post above and coming from a guildmember of mine makes it actually more barable. I know that it comes due lack of knowledge. Hopefully this post made the ones who are anti-rouge/wizz/sorsc. to change there mind and understand that each class has a roll to play.

See daoc. as a highschool play where each and single of us have there important part to play.

2 weeks and I am back from vacation, dont miss me to much.

 

[Zill]

Originally posted by Sirex_85
ok i can agree mercs are ok but scouts and inf are useless in in PVE.if there is a group wiht more than 1 scouti will not join because its unbalanced and every1 will most likely die.What u want is 4 tanks 2 clerics a caster and minstrel.

So how are stealth classes suppose to level when people ignorent as yourself have any say in matters? Unfortunatly it's the same attitude with certain people in Midgard too.

 

[Olgark]

Originally posted by Zerathol
I have been reading all these posts and I aint gonna comment them just to add my point of view. And yes I am playing scout (typing this from my vacation atm )


all I can say is that the beuty of this game is that its a "fair" game. What do I meen by that?
Best group, 8 diffrent classes.
Seriously, every class has there good and bad sides.
The only good you have of tanks at higher levels imo is there ability to take loads of damge and still be standing and laughing. (please dont take me wronw now. Without tanks no one in this game would be able to get some xp)

Not exactly a true statement. Runemasters solo pretty well without tanks.

And keeping with this thread I have never turned down any class in the game from a group. And reading some of these anti class post makes me want to uke:

Every class has its weak points and strong points, it just takes a good player to bring out the strengths of his/her class.

Also a tip to all those tanks that complain about other classes, I suggest you go and play a caster , rogue ect before coming here and posting about how crap they are.
Enough said

 

[old.Sirex_85]

well after seeing the arguments i decided to start my own scout and found that they are very good agaisnt oranges,yellows, and reds.. now it is hard to lvl and costs a lot of money but he blocks more than my tank and he evades really well so im totally turned around towards scouts so any1 with scouts fair juice to u for lvlin them... hope this settles the dispute...

[Yes i am saying i was wrong]

 

[Smartypants]

Gosh, way to go, Sirex...

 

[belth]

Good for you