Not only Necros...

[Cap'n Sissyfoo]

Hmm...apologies for mis-reading the account. Even so, still shocked.

I would have thought that BSII followed by Thigh Cut would be the best approach on a BD as BSII seems to stun your target for a few seconds which gives you the chance to follow up with a few more chains. If you are quick enough you should be able to take him out before he has the chance to /face and life tap you...well, so far I have been.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Be careful, tactics you work out for BG may not work at lvl50.

At lvl24 a bonedancer will have at most 1 healing pet.
At lvl50 a bonedancer can have 3 healing pets.

Each pet heals for 15% health each heal regardless of level of pet, so an approach which works in BG might not be as successful against a bonedancer lvl45+ (lvl45 is when they get final minion).

This means that unless you choose your attack style carefully or unless you kill very quickly, the bonedancer will be healed for 45% health within 4 seconds of your first attack. Though buggy as hell, at least minions are never AFK

 

[Cap'n Sissyfoo]

That's true. Trouble is I don't think I will be taking my infi to level 50 anytime soon. Having too much fun stalking people and waiting till they sit down before I strike. ~evil laugh~

The trouble with Bone Dancers is that very few people have found an effective way to get rid of them in one on one combat. When people have finally figured out the trick then posts like this will become obsolete...I hope.

Has anyone tried confuse spells on the BD's pets? When faced with a large number of mobs I tend to chuck a confuse spell on a couple of them to get them attacking eachother while I nuke them to death. I know player pets are completely different to NPC mobs but with their buggy AI it *might* just be crazy enough to work. ...maybe.

 

[Arnor]

Originally posted by The Real Redi
Arnor, seriously, that has GOT to be a biased view of a mid :lol:

easy answer to this - Two people shouldn't be able to open a keeps doors <shrugs> that simple. The fact that the pair in particular are VERY good at playing their class, it doesnt change the fact that they are a little overpowered as a class.

I agree with Falcon - longer cast/recast times, or slightly less effective heals, maybe?

and bd's do this how often?

is this really a problem?


so you think its ok that necros can solo as easy as they can?


why should I be biased about bd's? they are crap in groups, and I dont have one.



and honestly, if you see the guardspam starting to reach 10+, why dont you send someone to 'ave a peek?

guess you must be alb and dont care bout keeps etc

 

[The Real Redi]

oh arnor, calm it! i started this thread with a point that we KNOW necros and anamists are bugged to hell, and anything that can solo reds to 50 in two days is needing a whacking. My point was, that my first encounter with Boners was the Blakbyrd fella, and he has got a fantastic setup, and plays it well.

I didnt say thwey break into keeps often, i said it had happened and shouldnt be able to.

I didnt... know what... i dont care anymore... Boners, Animists shrooms and Necros are all too powerful - it was probably done to sell SI to the masses, and hopefully in 1.60 the LoS bug will be fixed, and the boners will have been figured out by one and all, or will be well on the way to being...

:bore:

 

[Cap'n Sissyfoo]

Necros can solo reds to 50? Pah, my necro can *just* about solo an orange with the amount of resists I keep getting.

 

[dozigden]

"Traditional Tactics" will never work against a supp BD. As i play one i can think of several things happening that would give me cause to think i was going to lose a 1v1 fight after the opening moves.

Also as with all casters resists are extremely dangerous.

Urgats description of hit caster/hit commander/hit healer should give any infs out there cause to think - none of those will work - so come up with something different.

People here in general are missing several key points about supp BDs that would help them generate tactics against them - Having played one to 50 im fairly sure if i was a good inf i could have a damn good shot at taking one down - though ive never been much of a combat player.

(BTW if your waiting for me to tell you what i think those things are your gonna be waiting a long time)

However, in fear of invoking "Dark Roo" i must correct Roo about the healers - they DONT all heal the same. Summon one lvl 18 healer tell him to stay on the svasud pad and jump from the top - repeat with one lvl42/lvl48 (depending on spec) healer. You wont even need to time them, the difference is huge.

 

[dwindimir]

Necro vs. Red Mob

Necro: Manatap
Mob:Resists manatap, Turns and starts running to Necro
Necro:Manatap
Mob:Resists Manatap, Still running
Necro:Manatap
Mob:Resists Manatap, Still running
Necro:Manatap
Mobamaged for XXX
Pet:Melee mode
Necro:FP,Regeneration
Pet:Melee mode, FP activates (usually it doesnt)
Necro:Manatap,Lifedrain
Pet:Casts the Manatap (If you get lucky)
Mob:Resists Manatap, Resists Lifedrain
Necro:Lifedrain
Pet:Melee mode
Mob:Resists Lifedrain

Necro continues casting lifedrain and regeneration, but is killed after 20sec, due to 95% resistance from the Mob.

It's annoying to be almost killed sometimes by an orange Mob that you have killed hundreds before, but this time it resists everything.

 

[The Real Redi]

Originally posted by dwindimir
It's annoying to be almost killed sometimes by an orange Mob that you have killed hundreds before, but this time it resists everything.

This comes back down to that luck theory a thread dealt with a while back; when your hunting a mob and all of a sudden, you from 50% health and it needing one hit to be killed, you begin missing time after time after time, until it kills you.

It's something we all go through, i have days where i can drop any red eyed fellwood that comes near me, then again, i picked on Tepok for my 43rd epic (yellow eyed to me) the Savant down there joined in (aggroed through a wall ffs) and even though i did beat Tepok, he took me to within 5% of my health from missing about 10 in a row, and the savant finished me off <shrugs> another day, i couldve taken on three yellow eyed rocots and killed them all without dropping below 25%...

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Originally posted by dozigden
Summon one lvl 18 healer tell him to stay on the svasud pad and jump from the top - repeat with one lvl42/lvl48 (depending on spec) healer. You wont even need to time them, the difference is huge.

lol impressive test technique. There are too many people though that would like me to jump off somewhere tall for me to try that one.

I'd be interested to get some confirmation on this though. Anyone got any official sources? Also, if this is true, do the higher level ones heal more than 15%? If they do then eek, thats a lot of healing. All my usage of the healer pets has been in combat situations, so I'm kinda busy at the time as am usually solo and the lifetap messes up any observations too.

Got to say though I respecced sup, I didn't like having to do it as I wanted bone army, just the pets were utterly mental.

 

[Roo Stercogburn]

Something just occured to me: is it perhaps that the healer regen from the pet is different? I haven't looked at this yet.

 

[old.tuppe]

i live that impression healer pets htp rise whit lvl:s but every heal pet heal same %?
need check it when get good variance forp pets.

disease, cut half heals, so if caster is diseased, healer pet heals only effect 50%, but! LT still take that same 80% healt back from dmg.

when bone was under beta, they changed LT to castable, put longer cast time, result was class didnt survive anymore.

supp bone is ment to play different way what ordinary caster.
caster self need keep agro!
green/blue commander cannot keep! healer pet get immediatly agro if even think commander need heal.
if we figh against too high mob and LT get resisted, healerpet get agro -> start run around collecting agro happend once to me in varulv, there is some new mobs btw

supp bone´s only weapon sadly is LT, dont count baseline dd and dot, what is weak, any weapon.

what i read debuff in darkness line is debuff for LT.

well, bone´s primary enemies is, archers/bolts, ae dots/ae mezz.
ae dot and pets go cracy, mezz, and healer pet stay one plaze, + one huge hit.
remember cloth wearing, low htp caster.

 

[scartooth]

Mythic dont promise anything to be honest. They already patched LOS issuses (partly ) in US , want to moan ? complain to GOA who are draggin heals trying to translate engish to french to german to english..as usual.

 

[old.Belorfyn]

Hello,

I'm not sure which incident in Snowdonia you, Redi, are referring to. Personally, I remember only one where we were jumped by two non-50 infils. I might be wrong on this one though.
We were at hill near the BK, looking out for albs. Yellow (yet not 50 I thiink) infiltrator PA's me, savage, from stealth and we start fighting. After few seconds, blue con infiltrator PA's Morgyn but at this point the earlier infil was already dead or almost dead.
Maybe this wasn't the one you were talking about since it was quite different from what you described, or perhaps you thought the other infil had PA'ed Morgyn but hadn't ?

I'm not sure what to think about BD's, at first they seem overpowered etc. but there are ways to take them down as some people have mentioned. Having dueled some with Morgyn, I gotta admit it's pretty much impossible for a pure tank to take BD out, but then again, so are almost all caster classes.
Often, I think, the situation where BD (or some other class) kills for example group of 3 enemies, makes everyone think they're overpowered but I've seen that often it's because enemies just go for the BD which is wrong approach because what you really gotta do in that situation is to take out the commander pet (unless you deal loads and loads of damage or got ae mez), after killing the commander taking BD out is easy. I've had time to observe these since I'm usually lying dead and looking at Morgyn fighting
Suppression specced BD's haven't got much more than one trick, their insta lifetap. The pets aren't much good as damage dealers, all 3 healers have to be up for else there is too little healing and they don't hit at all and the commander himself is level 41 or 42 (spiritmaster and other pets are 44). Also, suppression doesn't give buffs for pets besides the absorbion buff. Using the lifetap, they go out of power quite fast and after that they can just staff 'em. Insta DD itself is quite low damage and beside the staff that's about only damage they can do.
While they have the base dot, it's not much good if you don't spec bone army.
So besides the lifetap, they got root and few debuffs but that's it. They can use the base DD from darkness but without speccing darkness, it eats huge amounts of power, gets resisted and damage is quite sad.
There's probably some things that could be done to make BD's bit less effective but I don't know what it'd be, I hope mythic can figure out something that'd do that but wouldn't make them "gimped". They can be taken down by right tactics and if mythic makes them killable by just attacking normally in melee, they'd die too easy, considering they can't deal big amounts of dmage while alive. After all, many classes need different approaches to win them.

 

[PJS]

bg1 - me lvl 24 NS with SC loadout vs standing yellow BD, PA + 1 poison tick + 1 bleed tick + insta dd + offhand hit? maybe, dead BD
bonedancers arent overpowered in bg vs stealth, necros hold that distinction

melee - run or/and die

caster vs BD - if you dont have >1500 range damage or area mezz then run or/and die basically, if bd is in insta range and unstunned then you have already lost

solution - range on insta needs to come down, this has no effect on pve whatsoever, say 700 ish like many other classes instas, what it has no right being (at 4s recast) is standard cast range

 

[Olgark]

Originally posted by Brannor McThife
"Du'h, me stand here. Wait for enemy."
<someone attacks the bonedancer>
<bonedancer selects target>
"Du'h, me press button 1 for debuff, den me press button 2 over and over."
"Me win! I pwn! \o/"



And they said Enchanters have it easy? Enchanter has to (a) stun, (b) Debuff (c) cast (d) keep out of melee range.

Supp BD's have to... (a) debuff IFFFF they feel like it. (b) press 1 button repeatedly.

-G

Hey I press button 4 repeatedly but I also whack away with a staff why let a damage add go to waste while you lifetap a sucker to death