Minstrel, why?

[Balbor]

does anyone know how Minstral and other stealth classes fair in NF, after all the main stealth camping spots are gone?

Its not like stealther group are able to effectifly take on standard balenced Full Groups, they normally just add during fights or ganks small groups. Stalds and Bards can team up to make effective small gankers able to take out 2+ times there numbers, why not Mincers. I've often seen a Bard and Chanter outside CS killing groups of 5-6. I don't think a Mincer with a Infi or scout could managed that.

I'm sure minstrals hate the fact there realm is the only one that cannot drop another group out of speed instently at 1500 range.

 

[atos]

Still think the stealther population is way to large. Roll non stealthers for NF 4tehwin.

 

[Ilum]

Still think the stealther population is way to large. Roll non stealthers for NF 4tehwin.

Agreed, way to many people playing DaoC. Makes RvR a bit dull when it could be nice action instead there's 30 people walking around blind of eachother ever so often stumbling across or adding onto someone mashing some melee styles Need more Trollums in RvR tbh!

 

[Kreig]

stealth on minstel is stupid they should just remove it instead of these shitty attempts from mythic to 'nerf' it so people dont want to play it anymore (common mythic tactic if they want to get rid of a certain class)

so each realm has, assassin/archer, assassin/archer, and then theres alb! assassin/archer/tank-cc-hybrid!!

oopsie they made a little mistake there not realising that it could have a big impact on the game in the long run, not only does the stealth minstrel unbalance the stealtherwars, but they get the regular group minstrels nerfed aswell!

So according to u that means that savages should be nerfed to infinaty (Alb Merc/Arms Hib Hero/BM Mid Warrior/Zerk/Savage), the game ISNT designed so all realms are suppost 2 be equal, would be rather boring tbh if it was.

would trade stealth for any other benefit.... 14 second insta stun would be a good one, or how about dw? or 2handed? or base damage increase? or perhaps a self damage buff?

or give them a AE insta stun or mez... i mean the mids and hibs who have it claim its useless anyway so....

So basically a Skald then?

Not everything is suppost to be clear cut black or white, as with everything there is always the grey area.

 

[Morchaoron]

So according to u that means that savages should be nerfed to infinaty (Alb Merc/Arms Hib Hero/BM Mid Warrior/Zerk/Savage), the game ISNT designed so all realms are suppost 2 be equal, would be rather boring tbh if it was.

dont be silly, theres a difference between all realms being equal and all realms having equal CHANCES, and everyone can see that in stealther vs stealther wars the tank/cc hybrid greatly increases the effectiveness vs the mid and hib stealthers, they simply have nothing like it, they dont have a stealther who can CC

how would like like to have it then? the way it is now?
hib = caster realm
mid = melee realm
alb = stealther realm

So basically a Skald then?

Not everything is suppost to be clear cut black or white, as with everything there is always the grey area.

the perfect grey area for me would be to exchange stealth for a 14 second stun, stealther problem solved and a bit stronger in groups, god deal...
or give mid and hib a new magic stealther in the catacombs expansion...

it would be black/white to think that somehow we are supposed to have a extra class that gives a unfair advantage to the stealther wars only because "not all realms should be equal"

and the last thing we need is to start spreading minstrel abilities to other classes, alb has more classes then the other realms which is actually a disadvantage since skills are more spread out

really this stealthing will get the minstrels, a core group class, nerfed someday if not already in frontiers...

and i dont mind how large the stealther population is, thats up to the players, just give them equal chances NOT equal classes...

 

[Totyn]

What about those minstrels that dont walk around in stealther groups and only mez on keeps then? Going to make keep takes even harder for albion if we remove stealth.

 

[Morchaoron]

What about those minstrels that dont walk around in stealther groups and only mez on keeps then? Going to make keep takes even harder for albion if we remove stealth.

others cant do that either, and alb has the strongest assassin support on keeps already...

besides frontiers is gonna change that kind of stuff anyway, no more casting stuff through doors and walls which will make every realm a bit more equal keep-raid wise...

 

[Totyn]

others cant do that either, and alb has the strongest assassin support on keeps already...

Then lets just let every realm make all classes so the whiners will be happy.

 

[Kreig]

dont be silly, theres a difference between all realms being equal and all realms having equal CHANCES, and everyone can see that in stealther vs stealther wars the tank/cc hybrid greatly increases the effectiveness vs the mid and hib stealthers, they simply have nothing like it, they dont have a stealther who can CC

how would like like to have it then? the way it is now?
hib = caster realm
mid = melee realm
alb = stealther realm




the perfect grey area for me would be to exchange stealth for a 14 second stun, stealther problem solved and a bit stronger in groups, god deal...
or give mid and hib a new magic stealther in the catacombs expansion...

it would be black/white to think that somehow we are supposed to have a extra class that gives a unfair advantage to the stealther wars only because "not all realms should be equal"

and the last thing we need is to start spreading minstrel abilities to other classes, alb has more classes then the other realms which is actually a disadvantage since skills are more spread out

really this stealthing will get the minstrels, a core group class, nerfed someday if not already in frontiers...

and i dont mind how large the stealther population is, thats up to the players, just give them equal chances NOT equal classes...

Yes i agree with some of that, but the game is interesting because of most classes unique traits/skills gimped or overpowered. Just seems that any alternative would = losing the identity of an already tricky class, my mincer isnt speced stealth cos i cba with that lame stealth zerg crap and opted for a more dmg dealing output for grp RvR 50 Ins 44 Slash.

Perhaps DW would be more fitting for a Minstrel as they are after all a "Rogue", but if that were the case to be effective they would have to have a spec point boast also else the dmg gained from offhand would hardly be worth it.

I can hear the whines of that now.

 

[Carnalito]

they are without a doubt (anyone who posts any kind of arguement against this needs slapped, a lot) the most rediculous class in the game.

in normal fg v fg, zerg v zerg sure they are fine. when the class makes it so easy for people like rains, arauddry etc etc to just line up PA, with 0 challenge is just rediculous, then of course if u have purge up and use it on their mez, they hit the insta we win stun button.

i dont mind most classes in this game, i dont mind overpowered chanters, animists, infils, theurgs blah blah whatever people whine about. minstrels need to loose either stealth, or mez and insta stun.

AMEN!

 

[Carnalito]

gifv stealth to skalds and insta stunn insted of insta mezz

and pets ae mezz sos abla etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc ... etc

 

[Derric]

Just a little thing, name 10 minstrels on this server that on a daily basis use highlevel pets to wtfpwn with. ;o

 

[Tuppe]

Still think the stealther population is way to large. Roll non stealthers for NF 4tehwin.

many probably roll st because its only way to these persons play rvr, they dont belong to some "uber" guild?, play wierd times?, dont wanna join to random groups (running around whit shammys end reg 1 and whit 1 healer, rest whatever) and get steamrolled million time in 1 hour.

offcourse there is still many who roll st because its simply "sexy" and fotm class, atleast in albs, needed say that

 

[Equendil]

and pets ae mezz sos abla etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc etc ... etc

And lose parry, 2h, insta snare, insta mez, damage add, and whatever better stats from being a fighter class. Hello instruments as well ...

Edit: btw, skalds get same SoS as minstrels in NF, kinda pointless to keep whining about that.

 

[Tuppe]

well, there is allready whine going healers free rl5 ability what come in nf.
personally dont yet give jack about nf, when you are waiting that arrive to eu servers? not this year, happy if before -05 summer.

 

[Garok]

Probably arrive sooner than you think due to alot less translation (by which i mean it wont contain 300 quests that all have to be translated) which is what keeps the euro releases back.

Which is why they should do direct ports of the US version for the english servers !!!!!

 

[Azathrim]

and whatever better stats from being a fighter class.

Actually Minstrels and Skalds are on the excact same damage/weaponskill table.

The difference however is, that minstrels usually spec lower in their weapon and use one-handers, while skalds usually spec high (40+) weapon and use two-handers.

 

[Morchaoron]

Actually Minstrels and Skalds are on the excact same damage/weaponskill table.

from the test results ive seen that they were not...

minstrel is in league with the rogues while a skald is one step above...

 

[Equendil]

Which is why they should do direct ports of the US version for the english servers !!!!!

Think of those smelly french players who would be playing on english servers if those were patched first !

Besides you wouldn't want 'colour' spelled 'color', would you ?

 

[Azathrim]

from the test results ive seen that they were not...

minstrel is in league with the rogues while a skald is one step above...

You're right Morchaoron. The difference however is marginal (A few %).

Its on the same table as Paladins, Reavers, Hunters and Champion.

As an example (I know this is unrealistic as most doesn't take this spec, nor have those stats:

Skald: 1478
RR5, 300Strength, 50+11 weapon.
Minstrel: 1400
RR5, 300Str/Qui, 50+11 Trust.

So, not that huge a difference, but granted... its there!

 

[Morchaoron]

yeah well skalds can also make full use of that weaponskill with 2handed weapons, we have to do with a crappy unspecable small shield

 

[Kreig]

You're right Morchaoron. The difference however is marginal (A few %).

Its on the same table as Paladins, Reavers, Hunters and Champion.

As an example (I know this is unrealistic as most doesn't take this spec, nor have those stats:

Skald: 1478
RR5, 300Strength, 50+11 weapon.
Minstrel: 1400
RR5, 300Str/Qui, 50+11 Trust.

So, not that huge a difference, but granted... its there!

Quickness is capped at 250 still.
Dont know any Mincers who 50 Weapon spec?
Skalds on Hybrid hp/ws/dmg table, Mincers on rogue hp/ws/dmg table.

 

[Sycho]

You're right Morchaoron. The difference however is marginal (A few %).

Its on the same table as Paladins, Reavers, Hunters and Champion.

As an example (I know this is unrealistic as most doesn't take this spec, nor have those stats:

Skald: 1478
RR5, 300Strength, 50+11 weapon.
Minstrel: 1400
RR5, 300Str/Qui, 50+11 Trust.

So, not that huge a difference, but granted... its there!

As far as i know tivook had 1800s weaponskill buffed and some skalds usually get 1700s(?)

 

[Azathrim]

As far as i know tivook had 1800s weaponskill buffed and some skalds usually get 1700s(?)

Notice the relatively low strength. Add 40-50 more strength and you get those numbers.

 

[Morchaoron]

As far as i know tivook had 1800s weaponskill buffed and some skalds usually get 1700s(?)

true! they have trolls

 

[Sycho]

Ok just asked steveirwin on msn here's what he has:

1427 ws 325str 42+17slash

I was wrong xE but maybe a norse skald can post their ws here and how much weapon they have aswell as str.

 

[Azathrim]

Ok just asked steveirwin on msn here's what he has:

1427 ws 325str 42+17slash

I was wrong xE but maybe a norse skald can post their ws here and how much weapon they have aswell as str.

Aye, those stats seems correct. In comparision a skald would have 1506 with the same RR/Spec/Strength.

Thats a 5.5% difference.

 

[Morchaoron]

Aye, those stats seems correct. In comparision a skald would have 1506 with the same RR/Spec/Strength.

Thats a 5.5% difference.

but most skalds are trolls

 

[xenia-]

50 norse skald, 43+14 axe, ~345 str buffed, gives me iirc close to 1600 WS (but not above).

Steveirwin still kicks my ass though

Xen

 

[Azathrim]

50 norse skald, 43+14 axe, ~345 str buffed, gives me iirc close to 1600 WS (but not above).

Steveirwin still kicks my ass though

Xen

1551 with 345 strength for you Xenja, it fits?

And yeah, Xenja .. Steveirwin mezz too on top of the DD's. And your possible higher melee damage is negated by his ablatives.

Overpowered Mincers. Remove their stealth, give them parry or shield spec.